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KevTheOptimist
18-12-2006, 05:09 PM
Above where STOG?

saul1664
18-12-2006, 05:09 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
How do you get players of hands. This just happened

0.50/1.00

QK raise 4, 3 callers flop QK 2 (2 hearts)

small stacks with me call all in, other folds, he turns over 10 A

J River

No pot odds, no pair, no flush and only 4 cards in deck yet still pushes all in

Got it back. Left the table $35 up. Annoying thing is that two callers had folded to my full house earlier, and I couldn't play a set as hard as I would have like due to nasty board.

1st hand new table KK, limpers everywhere, raise to $4, flop Q junk junk, he then keeps betting into me, which I flat call, trying what to work out what he has that beats me. Don't put on AA as only flat called mid pos, so when another Q hits the board, I think I may be in trouble but have two pair. He continues to bet $20 turn, $20 river, so flat call, until he turns over 99 :clown:

SamTheOldGoat
18-12-2006, 05:11 PM
Few posts above Kev....

Was that right Oz, exactly 17%? was off the top of my head :)

saul1664
18-12-2006, 05:12 PM
just made straight on river so no more moaning from me today :p

KevTheOptimist
18-12-2006, 05:12 PM
I got it. I'm sure I played it and had to withdraw by cheque? Have you withdrawn less than your deposit STOG is that why you can withdraw to your switch?

If not I'll defo check it out tonight and see the deals.

Can I ask what you think of the cash play and 'beats' - I know this is a stupid idea for scaremongers but I do think certain sites (LADBROKES THE WANKERS) do beat me up more than they should do.

KevTheOptimist
18-12-2006, 05:13 PM
Saul, do you know if betfair has a hand history yet?

oz_da II
18-12-2006, 05:14 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
Few posts above Kev....

Was that right Oz, exactly 17%? was off the top of my head :)

16.5% ;)

KevTheOptimist
18-12-2006, 05:15 PM
P.S. would love to have a live game with you lot (Oz people excluded).

Something small maybe a tenner or 20. Has this been done in the past or anyone interested in trying to arrange?

SamTheOldGoat
18-12-2006, 05:16 PM
tbh, I left betfair because I felt it wasn't 'fair', but obv that was just me and I used it as an excuse to move sites, and they use RNG's but moved to Stars and everything is fine.

My housemate also plays on Stars and for his first time he withdrew, they also sent a cheque, but since then it has been withdrawals to his account ONLY.....

After 48 hours you can withdraw less than your deposit or the full amount etc

SamTheOldGoat
18-12-2006, 05:18 PM
Originally posted by oz_da II
16.5% ;)

Not bad, not bad ;)

SamTheOldGoat
18-12-2006, 05:20 PM
Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
P.S. would love to have a live game with you lot (Oz people excluded).

Something small maybe a tenner or 20. Has this been done in the past or anyone interested in trying to arrange?

Sounds a good idea to me, over the Christmas period I'm back in Sussex and family in Beckenham so I would make the trip up if someone wanted to host a game etc... I would but you guys wouldn't want to make the trip down near Haywards Heath/Brighton!

saul1664
18-12-2006, 05:20 PM
Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
Saul, do you know if betfair has a hand history yet?

Don't know. Left after being outdrawn about 18 consecutive times and haven't been back since.

KevTheOptimist
18-12-2006, 06:08 PM
OK so that's 2 people. 3 if you include me that think Betfair is a little harsh with it's beats then.

A matey of mine stopped playing it as well with the same opinion which he based on the software being used not fully tested for random algorythems and all manner of other technical bollocks

Gav The Hamster
18-12-2006, 06:30 PM
Kev, i'm sure you ve got a big enough house to host a game ? If so count me in, I'll see if i can make myself available to make the long journey to yours !

KevTheOptimist
18-12-2006, 06:31 PM
Lol. as you well know, I live in a shoe box.....

Yours on the other hand....

SamTheOldGoat
18-12-2006, 06:45 PM
anyone........?

Gav The Hamster
18-12-2006, 07:24 PM
not only would mummy tell me in the politest terms to "f*ck off", it is also against my religion to have a poker table full of palace fans under my roof. I can just about stomach having you pop round every now and again !

saul1664
18-12-2006, 10:01 PM
This happens a lot too. Wonder what the odds for this are.

$25 tourney. Nothing all game, getting blinded out, push in with 10 10 (1 min before break always happens) called 99, hit trips on flop, 4 consecutive spades complete an unlikely flush for the lower pair. What's the % on that.

Gav The Hamster
18-12-2006, 10:12 PM
its a conspiracy i tell thee

saul1664
18-12-2006, 10:27 PM
no not really, don't think there needs to be a massive conspiracy to get people to lose at poker

oz_da II
18-12-2006, 10:48 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
This happens a lot too. Wonder what the odds for this are.

$25 tourney. Nothing all game, getting blinded out, push in with 10 10 (1 min before break always happens) called 99, hit trips on flop, 4 consecutive spades complete an unlikely flush for the lower pair. What's the % on that.

You'd be a low 90% (say 93%) favourite after the flop.

So this honestly happens a lot?

saul1664
18-12-2006, 11:04 PM
Enough times to be noticeable, both in my hands and seen hands.

saul1664
18-12-2006, 11:06 PM
Saw a big all in, in my game the other day.

KK vs JJ

flop QQQ

you know whats coming next

turn a

river a

DANCOO
18-12-2006, 11:25 PM
Laddies servers all screwed up!

Playing in a Daddy buy-in sattelite. Top 15 get paid.
I'm around 24/40
Suddenly everyone is folding.
Only three of us active in a 10 seat table.
Table bigstack kept raising almost every hand and stealing all the blinds, but the rest of us managed to get a few in aswell.
Got down to last 15 (15th gets $200), and the bloke on our table raises again. One of the active players calls, and pushes on the flop with TPTK. Bigstack says 'sorry', and calls with trips, sending the other player out with $200.
Personally, I think the bloke should have folded and not been a twat, but there you go.

Within 60 seconds of getting my place, my own modem re-sets, and I have to re-boot. Now I can't get onto the other tourney I was playing in (where there were only four of us active on a 10 seat table). Still, that tourney is going to take AGES, as it's split between people playing hands, and people folding. It's taken over two hours already, and there's still around half the players in!

Another email to Laddies me thinks.

DANCOO
18-12-2006, 11:27 PM
Anyone know of the s/w you can download which improves connections by searching out different server routes?

saul1664
19-12-2006, 12:25 AM
Happened again. 10 A hits 10 A on flop, He raises on a draw and hits the Q to make his straight. That's two 83% pots in a row then. Two hours of profits destroyed.

And while I'm writing this.

A 10 again, raise and called in he has A 3 on a board with A 2 4 on it, any guesses what hits the river?

DANCOO
19-12-2006, 12:35 AM
Originally posted by saul1664

And while I'm writing this.

A 10 again, raise and called in he has A 3 on a board with A 2 4 on it, any guesses what hits the river?

a 10 comes on the river, you take down the pot, and the curse is broken?

saul1664
19-12-2006, 12:50 AM
no a five completes unlikely straight and more spondoolicks gone

saul1664
19-12-2006, 12:51 AM
And have just ruthlessly destroyed a $30 STT. Truly bizarre evening.

DANCOO
19-12-2006, 01:03 AM
Originally posted by DANCOO


Carlito_1 shows 8,7,6,3,A for Low
sune73 shows 8,7,5,3,2 for Low
sune73 wins $4.05 with low 8,7,5,3,2

:confused: :(


> BIGGRA16 wins $34.57 with a Straight, Six high
> BIGGRA16 wins $30.04 with low 6,5,4,3,2
> pommer65 wins $4.51 with low 6,5,4,2,A


Now I'm really confused.

pommer65 only had $2, so he won with his low hand.

:confused: :confused: :confused:

lanepe
19-12-2006, 01:30 AM
I havent read 202 pages so excuse me if it has been covered in depth but where do you guys play?

Currently on Party Poker. Like it but sometimes the play is a bit 'jumpy' and you have connection probs.

oz_da II
19-12-2006, 01:45 AM
Originally posted by DANCOO
> BIGGRA16 wins $34.57 with a Straight, Six high
> BIGGRA16 wins $30.04 with low 6,5,4,3,2
> pommer65 wins $4.51 with low 6,5,4,2,A


Now I'm really confused.

pommer65 only had $2, so he won with his low hand.

:confused: :confused: :confused:

pommer's 2 is lower than BIGGRA's 3.

DANCOO
19-12-2006, 09:32 AM
Originally posted by lanepe
I havent read 202 pages so excuse me if it has been covered in depth but where do you guys play?

Currently on Party Poker. Like it but sometimes the play is a bit 'jumpy' and you have connection probs.

First played on William Hill, but not a great variety of games. Play exclusively on Laddies now but did try BET365 a few months back - wasn't too keen.
Laddies are generally ok as far as general connections go (doesn't do those annoying numerous disconnects every two minutes (not with me anyway)), but when they do go down, they REALLY go down and sometimes you can't get on for a couple of hours - probably happens to me once every couple of weeks - very annoying when in a tourney.

DANCOO
19-12-2006, 09:36 AM
Originally posted by oz_da II
pommer's 2 is lower than BIGGRA's 3.

Ah, I think I get it now, so you work backwards from the high card?

I thought it had something to do with high and low part of the low, not whoever has the first lower card in the low hand working from the high end down.:)

SamTheOldGoat
19-12-2006, 11:01 AM
Indeed Dan, it's THE lowest card, so Pommers starts with A, which is obviously lower than Biggras 2, so he wins low pot by won card, hth.

Lanepe=a few others and I play exclusively on PokerStars. Used to play party up until very recently but the lack of American fish (PP is now banned in USA) has made the games harder and the money is easier at Stars

RichieG
19-12-2006, 11:39 AM
STOG - Is PS significantly softer than Laddies? Am considering a change if/when I need to deposit just because PS has so many players and a better range of tourneys. Also what's the s/w like?

DANCOO
19-12-2006, 11:43 AM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
Indeed Dan, it's THE lowest card, so Pommers starts with A, which is obviously lower than Biggras 2, so he wins low pot by won card, hth.


I don't think that's right STOG. Look at the two following hands :

Carlito_1 shows 8,7,6,3,A for Low
sune73 shows 8,7,5,3,2 for Low
sune73 wins $4.05 with low 8,7,5,3,2

You can see on my hand in the first instance, I lost, even though I had the lowest card (A)

BIGGRA16 wins $34.57 with a Straight, Six high
BIGGRA16 wins $30.04 with low 6,5,4,3,2
pommer65 wins $4.51 with low 6,5,4,2,A

In this hand pommer65 won, in this instance he had the lowest card (A).

I believe from what oz_da was saying, is that you count back from the high end of the low.
So in my case it was 876 v 875 - the 875 hand won, as the 5 is lower than the 6.
In pommer65's hand it was 6543 v 6542 - the 6542 hand won, as the 2 is lower than the 3.

RichieG
19-12-2006, 12:07 PM
Low hands work back from the highest card as oz_da said, so what you're saying in your final para is right.

Check out this months PokerPlayer mag for a strategy article on Omaha HiLo which has a handy rules summary including this very issue!

Billyd
19-12-2006, 12:46 PM
PokerStars Game #7509593125: Hold'em No Limit ($0.05/$0.10) - 2006/12/19 - 07:42:14 (ET)
Table 'Thoas V' 9-max Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: Cdated ($9.70 in chips)
Seat 2: leonidas3 ($9.75 in chips)
Seat 3: vinniehls ($8.05 in chips)
Seat 4: Hohlehupe ($7.30 in chips)
Seat 5: lychee_nl ($2.60 in chips)
Seat 6: Taudinho ($9.65 in chips)
Seat 7: dondarko66 ($10.40 in chips)
Seat 8: Gulu74 ($10 in chips)
Seat 9: billyd77 ($10.15 in chips)
leonidas3: posts small blind $0.05
vinniehls: posts big blind $0.10
Gulu74: posts big blind $0.10
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to billyd77 [Qc Qd]
Hohlehupe: folds
lychee_nl: folds
Taudinho: folds
dondarko66: calls $0.10
Gulu74: checks
billyd77: raises $0.90 to $1
Cdated: folds
leonidas3: folds
vinniehls: folds
dondarko66: folds
Gulu74: calls $0.90
*** FLOP *** [9h 3s 8s]
Gulu74: checks
billyd77: bets $1.50
Gulu74: calls $1.50
*** TURN *** [9h 3s 8s] [8h]
Gulu74: bets $0.50
billyd77: raises $7.15 to $7.65 and is all-in
Gulu74: calls $7 and is all-in
*** RIVER *** [9h 3s 8s 8h] [3h]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Gulu74: shows [Kh 3c] (a full house, Threes full of Eights)
billyd77: mucks hand
Gulu74 collected $19.25 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $20.25 | Rake $1
Board [9h 3s 8s 8h 3h]
Seat 1: Cdated (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: leonidas3 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: vinniehls (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 4: Hohlehupe folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: lychee_nl folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: Taudinho folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: dondarko66 folded before Flop
Seat 8: Gulu74 showed [Kh 3c] and won ($19.25) with a full house, Threes full of Eights
Seat 9: billyd77 mucked [Qc Qd]

Billyd
19-12-2006, 12:47 PM
i mean whats he thinking

Billyd
19-12-2006, 12:52 PM
this next one is sick

Billyd
19-12-2006, 12:53 PM
PokerStars Game #7509614676: Hold'em No Limit ($0.10/$0.25) - 2006/12/19 - 07:50:21 (ET)
Table 'Theotes' 9-max Seat #8 is the button
Seat 1: peconi ($23.05 in chips)
Seat 2: Digger83 ($5 in chips)
Seat 3: ZeroCool16 ($12.20 in chips)
Seat 4: bauxiteb ($5.75 in chips)
Seat 5: crisparis75 ($18.85 in chips)
Seat 6: solocap ($30.65 in chips)
Seat 7: billyd77 ($31.10 in chips)
Seat 8: Alexlarssa ($6.20 in chips)
Seat 9: eiwynn ($4.75 in chips)
eiwynn: posts small blind $0.10
peconi: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to billyd77 [5s Qs]
Digger83: folds
ZeroCool16: folds
bauxiteb: folds
crisparis75: calls $0.25
solocap: folds
billyd77: calls $0.25
Alexlarssa: calls $0.25
eiwynn: folds
peconi: checks
*** FLOP *** [5d 5c Qh]
peconi: checks
crisparis75: checks
billyd77: checks
Alexlarssa: checks
*** TURN *** [5d 5c Qh] [7s]
peconi: checks
crisparis75: bets $0.25
billyd77: calls $0.25
Alexlarssa: raises $1.25 to $1.50
peconi: folds
crisparis75: calls $1.25
billyd77: raises $2 to $3.50
Alexlarssa: raises $2.45 to $5.95 and is all-in
crisparis75: raises $12.65 to $18.60 and is all-in
billyd77: calls $15.10
*** RIVER *** [5d 5c Qh 7s] [Th]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
crisparis75: shows [7h 7c] (a full house, Sevens full of Fives)
billyd77: mucks hand
crisparis75 collected $24 from side pot
Alexlarssa: shows [5h Ac] (three of a kind, Fives)
crisparis75 collected $18.05 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $44.25 Main pot $18.05. Side pot $24. | Rake $2.20
Board [5d 5c Qh 7s Th]
Seat 1: peconi (big blind) folded on the Turn
Seat 2: Digger83 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: ZeroCool16 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: bauxiteb folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: crisparis75 showed [7h 7c] and won ($42.05) with a full house, Sevens full of Fives
Seat 6: solocap folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: billyd77 mucked [5s Qs]
Seat 8: Alexlarssa (button) showed [5h Ac] and lost with three of a kind, Fives
Seat 9: eiwynn (small blind) folded before Flop

Billyd
19-12-2006, 12:53 PM
i had queen 5 full house. sick

Billyd
19-12-2006, 12:59 PM
the 2nd one i dont mind so much as the player didnt do anything wrong, but the first one calling all in with k3. i mean wtf

Micky Droy
19-12-2006, 01:05 PM
I was analysing the play of a very good tourney player on Laddies.

It was interesting - he played about 20% of all flops (fairly normal ratio).

He only very rarely folded before the flop on a blind.

If his blinds were attacked he tended to reraise big.

He did very little else the rest of the time.

Oh, and you saw what he had rarely, barely ever.

Of course, there's no chance for those bad beat stories if no one ever sees your cards...

Strathclyde Eagle
19-12-2006, 02:34 PM
Trust me, you have no idea how many times I watch an opponent's time running out and think "Fold, fold, fold..." :D

DANCOO
19-12-2006, 02:54 PM
Originally posted by Strathclyde Eagle
Trust me, you have no idea how many times I watch an opponent's time running out and think "Fold, fold, fold..." :D

Too true.

And part of you knows that what they are doing is exactly what you would do yourself - if they're gonna steal from me, the least I'm gonna do is make them sweat a bit.:D

DANCOO
19-12-2006, 02:59 PM
Originally posted by Micky Droy
I was analysing the play of a very good tourney player on Laddies.

It was interesting - he played about 20% of all flops (fairly normal ratio).

He only very rarely folded before the flop on a blind.

If his blinds were attacked he tended to reraise big.

He did very little else the rest of the time.

Oh, and you saw what he had rarely, barely ever.

Of course, there's no chance for those bad beat stories if no one ever sees your cards...

Defending my blinds is something I have started to do a lot more of myself. If I have anything close to a couple of playable cards, I will call. (Almost) regardless what comes on the flop, I will have already decided on whether or not I will check raise, or just fold to a bet, depending on what type of player he is.
Out of interest M_D, who was it? If he's rated, he may be in the Daddy tonight, always handy to have a bit of extra info.;)

Funk Butter
19-12-2006, 03:16 PM
Originally posted by DANCOO
I don't think that's right STOG. Look at the two following hands :

Carlito_1 shows 8,7,6,3,A for Low
sune73 shows 8,7,5,3,2 for Low
sune73 wins $4.05 with low 8,7,5,3,2

You can see on my hand in the first instance, I lost, even though I had the lowest card (A)

BIGGRA16 wins $34.57 with a Straight, Six high
BIGGRA16 wins $30.04 with low 6,5,4,3,2
pommer65 wins $4.51 with low 6,5,4,2,A

In this hand pommer65 won, in this instance he had the lowest card (A).

I believe from what oz_da was saying, is that you count back from the high end of the low.
So in my case it was 876 v 875 - the 875 hand won, as the 5 is lower than the 6.
In pommer65's hand it was 6543 v 6542 - the 6542 hand won, as the 2 is lower than the 3.

The best low hand is determined first by looking at the highest qualifying low card in each players qualifying hand. Someone with A2358 would say he had an "eight low." His opponent meanwhile has A2357. He has a "seven low" and wins the low side of the pot, since his seven is lower than the first player's 8. If the players have qualifying low cards of the same rank, we simply move down the chain of cards until one player's card is lower than the other. Example: A2368 beats A2378. Player one would note that he has an eight-six low, while the loser holds an eight-seven. It's not often to have two players who hold identical low hands, but it happens, and this results in a split of the low side of the pot.
It get tricky.

DANCOO
19-12-2006, 03:20 PM
It's not often to have two players who hold identical low hands, but it happens, and this results in a split of the low side of the pot.

Wanna bet!:hmph: :D

DANCOO
19-12-2006, 03:23 PM
Actually, I had the nut low the other day in a cash game. First to play pushes all-in, I call all-in (with the nut low), the third player had the discipline to fold his nut low as he knew he would lose money.

Funk Butter
19-12-2006, 03:29 PM
Originally posted by DANCOO
Actually, I had the nut low the other day in a cash game. First to play pushes all-in, I call all-in (with the nut low), the third player had the discipline to fold his nut low as he knew he would lose money.
Not sure about that. Depends on the betting in the other stages and how many people were playing. A lot of times I know I'm splitting the low, and have to watch as the idiot with the other low raises and reraises on the river. But I've got enough in the pot on the flop and turn, that I will about break even. There's no way I'm gonna let that dude take the whole low, when I can lose a little bit more and then berate him mercilessly for his stupidity.

DANCOO
19-12-2006, 04:17 PM
Originally posted by Funk Butter
Not sure about that. Depends on the betting in the other stages and how many people were playing. A lot of times I know I'm splitting the low, and have to watch as the idiot with the other low raises and reraises on the river. But I've got enough in the pot on the flop and turn, that I will about break even. There's no way I'm gonna let that dude take the whole low, when I can lose a little bit more and then berate him mercilessly for his stupidity.

If I had a 100% definite read, and I was set to lose money if I call, I would like to think I could fold.
Saying that, I've been in four way pots where the low has been split between three of us.

saul1664
19-12-2006, 10:43 PM
Think I'm cursed in the $4000 guaranteed rebuy. Nothing again for 40 minutes. AK suited, half my stack gone, one raiser, call all in, he has QK, flop QK. Doh.

DANCOO
20-12-2006, 01:55 AM
Well, after 5 hours 50 mins of play, I got knocked out of the 'Who's The Daddy'.
Playing well, but becoming a crapshoot.
I was table short stack and pushed with 33, and get beat by AK when a K hits the river to go out in 8th - not bad for only my second attempt at the Daddy, but I was confident going into this of doing well, and to be honest, I'm a little dissapointed.
Had I won that hand, I would have been upto about 4th and confident of a very big payout.
Anyway, I was paid $1,717.50 for my efforts, so I suppose I musn't grumble too much - fortunate, as my account was down to it's last $55.

Goodnight.:S:

SamTheOldGoat
20-12-2006, 11:44 AM
Again, good score Dan, well done :)

I'm back home now, so will not be posting as many 'winning hands' etc as Mother isn't keen on me sitting at 2 computer screens with tables flying up over the place and me yelling (she's a councillor for those with addictions :D), but will be playing live most nights and will play online a bit including each of the Sunday Millions on Stars.

Ps, last night was playing a £5r@Grosvenor Brighton, I have 66 and htis is the rebuy period, I've blasted 30 sheets at it and got sucked out and lost every race so I literally just want chips and most hands are all in. I get up from my seat as the hand is played out between two others and watch from rail as I'm about to head to the cash machine, I see the final 3 to come down to give me the straight and ask them to send it to my corner, some fcuking plum, I'm not joking, TRUELY THE MOST DISGUSTING PERSON YOU'VE EVER MET pipes up that I wasn't in my seat for the whole duration, and I was ruled against, even though I was watching the whole hand being played out.

You see WSOP, players leaving their seats when they can't bear to watch what's goign on etc adn when they hit runner runner, the pot is scooped to them, so obviously you can possibly see where I'm coming from?!?!

Strathclyde Eagle
20-12-2006, 11:59 AM
And people worry about the integrity of online poker. :eek:

Why did they think you had to be at the table? It isn't Snooker for crying out loud!

DANCOO
20-12-2006, 12:15 PM
Originally posted by Strathclyde Eagle
And people worry about the integrity of online poker. :eek:

Why did they think you had to be at the table? It isn't Snooker for crying out loud!

Agreed.

It would be interesting to know exactly what the rules are of the establishment regarding this.

STOG - Were any other people standing up etc...during hands?

oz_da II
20-12-2006, 12:20 PM
You wonder what kind of prick does those sort of things...

KevTheOptimist
20-12-2006, 12:33 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
Again, good score Dan, well done :)

I'm back home now, so will not be posting as many 'winning hands' etc as Mother isn't keen on me sitting at 2 computer screens with tables flying up over the place and me yelling (she's a councillor for those with addictions :D), but will be playing live most nights and will play online a bit including each of the Sunday Millions on Stars.

Ps, last night was playing a £5r@Grosvenor Brighton, I have 66 and htis is the rebuy period, I've blasted 30 sheets at it and got sucked out and lost every race so I literally just want chips and most hands are all in. I get up from my seat as the hand is played out between two others and watch from rail as I'm about to head to the cash machine, I see the final 3 to come down to give me the straight and ask them to send it to my corner, some fcuking plum, I'm not joking, TRUELY THE MOST DISGUSTING PERSON YOU'VE EVER MET pipes up that I wasn't in my seat for the whole duration, and I was ruled against, even though I was watching the whole hand being played out.

You see WSOP, players leaving their seats when they can't bear to watch what's goign on etc adn when they hit runner runner, the pot is scooped to them, so obviously you can possibly see where I'm coming from?!?!

I'd of made him eat every chip that you would have won.

RichieG
20-12-2006, 04:33 PM
That really surprises me Sam - get down to the Rendevous at the Marina, I've only played there 3 or 4 times, but it's been really friendly. £10 rebuy on a Friday is mayhem for the first 90 mins, but good fun.

Just can't believe that the Casino would uphold such blatantly unsporting behaviour!

SamTheOldGoat
20-12-2006, 07:26 PM
I know guys, I seriously couldn't believe it, walk to cash machine, walk back and there in front of me is 800 chips ready for a rebuy, WTF, FFS!

Oh, another story and this true. 2 friends caught the cardroom supervisor selling more chips than he should, i.e. double add-on but only to a couple of 'well known' locals. How the •••• can one do that, it completely puts one at a disadvantage immediately after the break?!?!!?

Just shows, you literally can't trust anyone in poker, they are all (most ;)) out to shaft you.

It only paid £400 or so last night, but if that had happend on a £100 F/O or £30r which I also play, I would have been blooding spewing!

Grrrrrrrrrrrr-Sorry about rant, at least it's not a bad beat, and instead quite interesting ;)

SamTheOldGoat
20-12-2006, 07:28 PM
Originally posted by DANCOO
Agreed.



STOG - Were any other people standing up etc...during hands?

TBH, I wasn't really concentrating, I sort of get in the zone and don't really pay attention to whats around, but when I've been HU in these comps, I will often leave my seat, maybe it's because I was 'outside the cardroom' on the rail>!?!?!?!?

PoolKing
20-12-2006, 09:48 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
2 friends caught the cardroom supervisor selling more chips than he should, i.e. double add-on but only to a couple of 'well known' locals.

Regarding the identity of these 2 individuals was one a tallish, big bloke with black hair aged around 50 and the other his skinnier, slightly shorter son about 30 years of age?

DANCOO
20-12-2006, 10:19 PM
Funk, question.

Hi/Lo.

Two of you in the pot. You have the nut low, there are straight & flush possibilities for the hi, and all you are holding is a pair of 3's. Do you bet it, foresaking the rake, or do you automatically not even think about it and check it down?

I ask, because I was in a pot with another player where I had the above hand. I checked it down and he had the nut low also, but I picked up the entire hi with my 33.
He probably would have called had I bet, but I figured he must have 33 beat.
For the amount of rake it would have cost, is it ALWAYS worth betting in these very marginal situations?

Funk Butter
20-12-2006, 10:31 PM
Originally posted by DANCOO
Funk, question.

Hi/Lo.

Two of you in the pot. You have the nut low, there are straight & flush possibilities for the hi, and all you are holding is a pair of 3's. Do you bet it, foresaking the rake, or do you automatically not even think about it and check it down?

I ask, because I was in a pot with another player where I had the above hand. I checked it down and he had the nut low also, but I picked up the entire hi with my 33.
He probably would have called had I bet, but I figured he must have 33 beat.
For the amount of rake it would have cost, is it ALWAYS worth betting in these very marginal situations?
I guess its different because I am playing tourneys, but I would be hard pressed to bet out holding just the low. You have to assume that your 33 is beat. I don't know how the betting went on the flop and turn, so I'm not sure what to put him on. But I have found that its actually possible to bluff in tourneys with flush draws on board (not so much with straights), so it might be worth a shot if You think he'll fold. (I've also bluffed at pots with a mish mash of cards appearing on the board and have had some decent luck) Otherwise, I usually like to play it safe with the low. But if he hasn't been betting or anything, than maybe he has less than you. Its really just the situation.

SamTheOldGoat
20-12-2006, 10:31 PM
I will bet it in the hope of getting him off the hand, but as you said, he had the nut low, so that's not happening, as you say you could LOSE money with the rake but maybe worth that often being able to take it down....so you split low and won high correct Dan?

Pool King, drop me a PM mate......

DANCOO
20-12-2006, 10:43 PM
Originally posted by Funk Butter
I guess its different because I am playing tourneys, but I would be hard pressed to bet out holding just the low. You have to assume that your 33 is beat. I don't know how the betting went on the flop and turn, so I'm not sure what to put him on. But I have found that its actually possible to bluff in tourneys with flush draws on board (not so much with straights), so it might be worth a shot if You think he'll fold. (I've also bluffed at pots with a mish mash of cards appearing on the board and have had some decent luck) Otherwise, I usually like to play it safe with the low. But if he hasn't been betting or anything, than maybe he has less than you. Its really just the situation.

He had already called two pot sized bets.

DANCOO
20-12-2006, 10:44 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
I will bet it in the hope of getting him off the hand, but as you said, he had the nut low, so that's not happening, as you say you could LOSE money with the rake but maybe worth that often being able to take it down....so you split low and won high correct Dan?


Yeah.

SamTheOldGoat
20-12-2006, 10:48 PM
Check river and obv call any bet, how did it play out>?

saul1664
21-12-2006, 12:55 AM
This is good for top muppet call. And win.

I have JA and raise 4 x BB. One caller, raggy flop. Flat call a bet of $6, he then checks the turn, so i go in for 2/3rds pot which is about $15 he calls, river Q, turns over Q5? How could he seriously call that on turn and hit???

SamTheOldGoat
21-12-2006, 10:39 AM
I'm not sure, but this is the internet and the reason I love playing, because I make money off these idiots! Only feelings on the hand or how I would play different which I'm obviously not saying is perfect, but I would have limped into the pot, imo AJ=SH1T, and DEFO not called the $6 bet on the flop....

DANCOO
21-12-2006, 11:09 AM
Saul, what you have to remember though, is that he may well have been setting up a play, but without knowing any history about the player, I don't know.
It's not something I do often, but I have in the past called a post-flop bet with absolutely nothing, and planning on making a move on the turn or river, only to then hit my high card and take the pot down anyway.

SamTheOldGoat
21-12-2006, 11:12 AM
^^^ Indeed, many times, or often Min raise or 1 and a half times raise their bet on flop, only to lead out the betting on turn and large bet on riv......

KevTheOptimist
21-12-2006, 12:40 PM
Can I ask a stupid question. In Omaha, you choose 2 of your hole cards to play the hand right? So does that mean you can choose 2 different sets of 2 hole cards to play the Hi and Low?

So in the hand Dancoo says above, could he have held say A 3 3 2 in his hand and won the high with his 33 holding and the low using his A 2 holding?

KevTheOptimist
21-12-2006, 12:40 PM
I played a bit of free play omaha last night on a cash table. started with 1000 and came of with over 24000. Will this happen in a trues cash game!!

:-)

DANCOO
21-12-2006, 12:51 PM
Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
Can I ask a stupid question. In Omaha, you choose 2 of your hole cards to play the hand right? So does that mean you can choose 2 different sets of 2 hole cards to play the Hi and Low?

So in the hand Dancoo says above, could he have held say A 3 3 2 in his hand and won the high with his 33 holding and the low using his A 2 holding?

Not sure what hand you're referring to, but yes, you can use different combinations of cards for the hi and lo.

eg: I'm holding AA23

Flop/turn/river comes down A45AK

I use the my AA to make quads for the nut hi, and I use my 23 to make my nut low straight.

SamTheOldGoat
21-12-2006, 01:11 PM
^^^ As above....

Kev, were you playing omaha or hi lo?

KevTheOptimist
21-12-2006, 02:05 PM
I was playing hi I think. Not both. I didn't know what I was doing and basically went all in every hand and won.

Great game.

SamTheOldGoat
21-12-2006, 02:07 PM
LOL, just high is a SUPERB game as well, if you have a home game, see if you can get it as dealers choice, these days we play Razz, Stud, Omaha, Omaha hi-lo, Pl, Nl, FL Hold'em, makes it SO much more interesting!

KevTheOptimist
21-12-2006, 04:29 PM
Well I say I didn't know what I was doing, I was all in pre flop every hand and it was so quick I couldn't work out who had what and half the time was using 4 cards from my holding to make some of the best hands ever that simply didn't exist.

Classic

DANCOO
21-12-2006, 04:43 PM
The first, and only previous, time I played Omaha (about 9 months ago), I also thought I could use all four cards in my hands.
I won one biggesh pot when pushing hard with three 10's in my hand, only to river another 10 and get trips (me thinking it was quads).
Someone then commented 'lol, trips, what a joke'.:D

SamTheOldGoat
21-12-2006, 04:46 PM
LMFAO & @ Kev's POST! SUPERB

se1eagle
22-12-2006, 02:30 PM
Gah, just got done royally with AA:-

> Dealing Hole Cards(Ad Ah )
> byno left the table
> joep1978 raised for $1.20
> Strider_78 folded
> Haunted called for $0.90
> Dealing the Flop(Kd 5s 5c )
> Haunted bet for $1.22
> joep1978 raised for $6.21
> Haunted raised for $9.98
> joep1978 went all-in for $4.09
> Extra chips returned to Haunted, $0.90
> Dealing the turn(Ac )
> Dealing the river(5h )
> joep1978 shows a Full House, Aces full of Fives
(Ac Ad Ah 5s 5c )
> Haunted shows Four of a Kind, Fives
(5s 5c 5h 5d Ac )
> Haunted wins $22.15 with Four of a Kind, Fives

Strathclyde Eagle
22-12-2006, 02:41 PM
So if I'm reading that correctly... rivered by a one-outer. Ouch. What was his other hole card?

SamTheOldGoat
22-12-2006, 03:03 PM
Literally 3%, lol

se1eagle
22-12-2006, 03:32 PM
he had j5 offsuit - and ive now gone on tilt :sob: i know i was actually losing when i went all-in, but he called a bloody 1.20 raise with j5 offsuit

Son of Selhurst
22-12-2006, 03:40 PM
Move up then. Low-stakes call and win with anything

David Amsalem
22-12-2006, 03:46 PM
Originally posted by oz_da II
Why not try to avoid so many 50-50 situations?

I find your first sentence hard to believe.

It's sound advice and I do my best to avoid the 50-50s. I only play them if I'm in a financial position (chip leader). But when I did, I kept losing them. At slightly favourite odds, you would certainly hope to win every other one. I had lost many all in a row.

Re: my first sentence. I stand corrected. What it would have been better for me to say is that "at the moment, I'm not losing because I'm being outplayed, I'm losing by being outdrawn by weaker hands".

Anyway, another point is that if you continue playing in the correct manner, you will put the beats behind you. I withdrew another healthy amount that will help with all this Eve's coming up. I'm winning when I should be, and keeping losing to a minimum with smart reads.

David Amsalem
22-12-2006, 03:52 PM
Originally posted by se1eagle
Gah, just got done royally with AA:-

> Dealing Hole Cards(Ad Ah )
> byno left the table
> joep1978 raised for $1.20
> Strider_78 folded
> Haunted called for $0.90
> Dealing the Flop(Kd 5s 5c )
> Haunted bet for $1.22
> joep1978 raised for $6.21
> Haunted raised for $9.98
> joep1978 went all-in for $4.09
> Extra chips returned to Haunted, $0.90
> Dealing the turn(Ac )
> Dealing the river(5h )
> joep1978 shows a Full House, Aces full of Fives
(Ac Ad Ah 5s 5c )
> Haunted shows Four of a Kind, Fives
(5s 5c 5h 5d Ac )
> Haunted wins $22.15 with Four of a Kind, Fives

Ouch, unlucky.

My JJ hit Trips on an 3, A, J flop. Turn was an another Ace. As I raised pre-flop I knew somebody would have an Ace and hit Trips not knowing it gave me a Full House. Then the River was a Jack which gave me Four of a Kind and gave him a Full House which doubled up an already impressive stack.

se1eagle
22-12-2006, 04:03 PM
Originally posted by Son of Selhurst
Move up then. Low-stakes call and win with anything

What do you recommend as the lowest stake that will avoid that kind of fishing? I've only started playing the cash tables in the last couple of weeks - so far I seem to actually be profitable, but I don't want to risk lots of money playing poker hence me playing the 15c/30c tables

David Amsalem
22-12-2006, 04:14 PM
Originally posted by se1eagle
What do you recommend as the lowest stake that will avoid that kind of fishing? I've only started playing the cash tables in the last couple of weeks - so far I seem to actually be profitable, but I don't want to risk lots of money playing poker hence me playing the 15c/30c tables

You sound like you're in the same situation as me. Having just left uni, I cannot justify risking high stake money playing poker. I'm also interested in the answer to your question.

SamTheOldGoat
22-12-2006, 06:11 PM
Originally posted by se1eagle
What do you recommend as the lowest stake that will avoid that kind of fishing? I've only started playing the cash tables in the last couple of weeks - so far I seem to actually be profitable, but I don't want to risk lots of money playing poker hence me playing the 15c/30c tables

2/4

Strathclyde Eagle
22-12-2006, 09:00 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
2/4
For which (if you're playing limit, anyway) you should have a bankroll of $1200. And good luck to you if you run into a player like a Negreanu/Hansen who can play any two cards and make good reads on the flop.

I haven't even watched those kinds of levels, but I'd guess the players there make better reads and know about implied odds when they hit monster hands with junk. Just because the stakes are higher doesn't mean you won't ever be outdrawn I wouldn't have thought.

oz_da II
22-12-2006, 09:09 PM
Originally posted by se1eagle
What do you recommend as the lowest stake that will avoid that kind of fishing? I've only started playing the cash tables in the last couple of weeks - so far I seem to actually be profitable, but I don't want to risk lots of money playing poker hence me playing the 15c/30c tables

I don't know about you but I want people who don't respect my raises and call with hands like J5o, you get the occassional bad beat but you make money in the long run.

saul1664
23-12-2006, 06:08 PM
This is sick

early stages tourney Q9 suited, one raise 4 x BB, BB only 20

flop QQ, minimal calls from rest of board, K hits river, oppo only calls 100, I raise 600 he puts me all in and turns over KK, K on river gave him full house, he was beaten flop and turn, now have 55 chips. 2nd hand in I think.

quick edit: out now K on river makes oppos straight, lasted 11 minutes astounding

SamTheOldGoat
23-12-2006, 07:32 PM
Off to France for a few days for Christmas festivities, all the best in the next 4 days at the tables chaps :)

Strathclyde Eagle
24-12-2006, 12:11 AM
You know the feeling when someone raises you big on the river, and you're trying to work out if you have the nuts or not, and then you realise that you do, and then they call your all-in. I love that feeling. :cool:

Gav The Hamster
24-12-2006, 12:32 AM
Originally posted by saul1664
This is sick

early stages tourney Q9 suited, one raise 4 x BB, BB only 20

flop QQ, minimal calls from rest of board, K hits river, oppo only calls 100, I raise 600 he puts me all in and turns over KK, K on river gave him full house, he was beaten flop and turn, now have 55 chips. 2nd hand in I think.

quick edit: out now K on river makes oppos straight, lasted 11 minutes astounding

whats sick ? you called a 4 x bb with Q9 suited ? lol, no doubt if you had the KK and had lost you would have complained about someone calling the initial big raise ?!

oz_da II
24-12-2006, 03:07 AM
Originally posted by saul1664
This is sick

early stages tourney Q9 suited, one raise 4 x BB, BB only 20

flop QQ, minimal calls from rest of board, K hits river, oppo only calls 100, I raise 600 he puts me all in and turns over KK, K on river gave him full house, he was beaten flop and turn, now have 55 chips. 2nd hand in I think.

quick edit: out now K on river makes oppos straight, lasted 11 minutes astounding

You do realize (depending on how many players are involved pre-flop) somewhere between 10%-17% favourite to win the hand pre-flop?

Do you frequently cold call big raises pre-flop with marginal hands?

DANCOO
24-12-2006, 09:39 AM
Originally posted by oz_da II
You do realize (depending on how many players are involved pre-flop) somewhere between 10%-17% favourite to win the hand pre-flop?

Do you frequently cold call big raises pre-flop with marginal hands?

This really is the point, and where I constantly see people getting in trouble.
Just because the blinds were 'only' at 20 chips, 4 x BB is still a standard raise for a big hand.
Yes you were unlucky to get outdrawn post flop, but at the end of the day, the best hand won.
The only time I'm calling a raise with Q9s is when I'm BB much later in a tourney, when people stealing your blinds becomes a big factor, or I'm limping into a pot (probably on the button), with lots of other limpers also - and even then it will still be fairly late on in a tourney.

saul1664
24-12-2006, 02:00 PM
Well firstly, yes its a big starting hand, and yes, you generally do respect a 4 x BB raise pre flop, but early tournament blinds of 10/20, people will raise 4 to 7 x BB with average hands, suited connectors, non suited connectors, you tend to get at least one of these per round, so are you saying you never call this, so when do you actually make a bet, wait for KK AA? Or wait until you can steal the blinds (if you have a stack left by them with any fold equity). My 4 x BB raise with AJ was called and dominated by Q5 the other day when Q hit the river, so people will and do call with anything. Thought it was worth the call yesterday, unfortunately couldn't get away from the hand. I was never significantly raised at any stage of the hand, so it would have been extremely hard to put him on what he had.

oz_da II
24-12-2006, 02:11 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
so are you saying you never call this

yes

DANCOO
24-12-2006, 03:35 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
Well firstly, yes its a big starting hand, and yes, you generally do respect a 4 x BB raise pre flop, but early tournament blinds of 10/20, people will raise 4 to 7 x BB with average hands, suited connectors, non suited connectors, you tend to get at least one of these per round, so are you saying you never call this, so when do you actually make a bet, wait for KK AA? Or wait until you can steal the blinds (if you have a stack left by them with any fold equity). My 4 x BB raise with AJ was called and dominated by Q5 the other day when Q hit the river, so people will and do call with anything. Thought it was worth the call yesterday, unfortunately couldn't get away from the hand. I was never significantly raised at any stage of the hand, so it would have been extremely hard to put him on what he had.

I suppose it just depends on your style of play.
Early on in tournaments, I tend to try and limp into pots for the minimum amount, rather than calling raises, regardless how small the blinds are.

Zola's Chin
24-12-2006, 04:07 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
so when do you actually make a bet, wait for KK AA? Or wait until you can steal the blinds (if you have a stack left by them with any fold equity). My 4 x BB raise with AJ was called and dominated by Q5 the other day when Q hit the river, so people will and do call with anything. Thought it was worth the call yesterday, unfortunately couldn't get away from the hand. I was never significantly raised at any stage of the hand, so it would have been extremely hard to put him on what he had.

In general...

Q9s or similar, I'd only ever call a significant raise with this hand, if I was heads up at the end of a tournament.

At the start of a tournament (when blinds are still low) or at a cash table with 5 or more players I'd be prepared to call the big blind with such a hand, hoping to see a cheap flop. If I was on the big blind, I might call a minimum raise. If the blinds are a significant percentage of my stack, I'm throwing it away regardless.

I normally only call raises (or re-raise) with pocket pairs 9 or above & AK or AQ.

If no-one has raised before me, I'm prepared to raise with AJ & KQ.

oz_da II
24-12-2006, 04:14 PM
With no prior history on who is at your table there is nothing much wrong with that, Z_C.

saul1664
24-12-2006, 04:23 PM
Just had someone at STT, who was all in every single hand, he went out in 4th, cracking a good few hands on the way. Kept saying merry xmas every time he went all in.

oz_da II
24-12-2006, 04:32 PM
Pick your moments and hit him hard, I had that on a cash table a few weeks ago, seemed keen on getting rid of his bankroll. Just waited for a good hand and went to town.

Strathclyde Eagle
24-12-2006, 08:56 PM
I wouldn't mind a call with Q9-suited in late position, perhaps. Early on (i.e. first time round the table) in tournaments I only tend to play hands I would want to go all-in with, so should a maniac go all-in pre-flop I'm not wasting chips folding a marginal hand.

This is the part I don't understand:
Originally posted by saul1664
I was never significantly raised at any stage of the hand, so it would have been extremely hard to put him on what he had.
I've just the hand through an odds calculator (http://twodimes.net/h/?z=2265349). After the flop you're a 91% favourite to win, so why aren't you re-raising and asking him the question?

SamTheOldGoat
25-12-2006, 09:44 AM
Agree,managed to get wireless at family home in france so will still be playing! If I flop trips to a raise I am reraising big to ask the question. If villain has raised with kq, aq or even jq I will expect to get raised back and if he is even half a good player, he will lay the KK down post flop: That is my understanding at least and pretty sure a few players on the BBS will agree with me............; pls excuse typing; FRENCH KEYBOARD!

SamTheOldGoat
26-12-2006, 01:41 AM
Here you go for a lovely little 3 outer, me and my brother are CL of 180 man $20+2 SNG, about 30 left, don't you love a suck out!

Anyway, went downt to $2k, back up to $10k, hopefully a nice $1k Christmast present coming up :)

PokerStars Game #7605216544: Tournament #38901812, $20+$2 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (200/400) - 2006/12/25 - 20:27:31 (ET)
Table '38901812 16' 9-max Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: Hot Fry (8851 in chips)
Seat 3: arq_msw (5140 in chips)
Seat 4: /-/4rris (18245 in chips)
Seat 6: Mntnman (11119 in chips)
Seat 7: funky pay'z (21005 in chips)
Seat 8: Honeyweiss (3431 in chips)
Hot Fry: posts the ante 25
arq_msw: posts the ante 25
/-/4rris: posts the ante 25
Mntnman: posts the ante 25
funky pay'z: posts the ante 25
Honeyweiss: posts the ante 25
arq_msw: posts small blind 200
/-/4rris: posts big blind 400
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to /-/4rris [5h 7s]
arq_msw said, "FOLDED JJ"
arq_msw said, "YEAH BABAY"
Mntnman: calls 400
funky pay'z: folds
Honeyweiss: folds
Hot Fry: folds
arq_msw: calls 200
/-/4rris: checks
*** FLOP *** [6c 3c 4h]
arq_msw: checks
/-/4rris: checks
Mntnman: bets 1400
ceeberg is connected
arq_msw: calls 1400
/-/4rris: raises 1800 to 3200
Mntnman: folds
arq_msw: raises 1515 to 4715 and is all-in
/-/4rris: calls 1515
*** TURN *** [6c 3c 4h] [7h]
*** RIVER *** [6c 3c 4h 7h] [Qh]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
arq_msw: shows [8d 5d] (a straight, Four to Eight)
/-/4rris: shows [5h 7s] (a straight, Three to Seven)
arq_msw collected 12180 from pot
funky pay'z said, "nice fold"
/-/4rris said, "sicko??!?!?"
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 12180 | Rake 0
Board [6c 3c 4h 7h Qh]
Seat 1: Hot Fry (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: arq_msw (small blind) showed [8d 5d] and won (12180) with a straight, Four to Eight
Seat 4: /-/4rris (big blind) showed [5h 7s] and lost with a straight, Three to Seven
Seat 6: Mntnman folded on the Flop
Seat 7: funky pay'z folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: Honeyweiss folded before Flop (didn't bet)

se1eagle
26-12-2006, 04:08 AM
Help me Poker Doctors! :) This seemingly very lucky guy, FiftyTonner, just cleaned up at my cash table, taking me out twice in the process. My question to you is, were these hands bad beats, and if not, what did I do wrong? The first hand I even bet $9 into $6 to try and prevent him calling. At first I thought he was a bad player, but the way this guy seemingly lucked out consistently all evening makes me wonder if he's just very good.. Your thoughts please! Is there a big hole in my understanding of pot odds?

The first hand I had ADs and hit top pair J on the flop:-

** Dealing card to joep1978: Ace of Diamonds, Jack of Diamonds
wardy2411 folded
FiftyTonner called - $0.50
checkinchew folded
joep1978 raised - $2.00
Abberley folded
badmuthafuke folded
Telboy36 called - $2.00
pistolpete4 folded
rickybrush folded
FiftyTonner called - $2.00
** Dealing the flop: 4 of Diamonds, Jack of Hearts, 9 of Spades
FiftyTonner checked
joep1978 bet - $9.02
Telboy36 called - $9.02
FiftyTonner called - $9.02
** Dealing the turn: Queen of Hearts
FiftyTonner checked
joep1978 checked
Telboy36 checked
** Dealing the river: 3 of Diamonds
FiftyTonner bet - $7.77
joep1978 called - $7.77
Telboy36 went all-in - $3.58
FiftyTonner shows: King of Hearts, 10 of Spades
joep1978 mucks: Ace of Diamonds, Jack of Diamonds
Telboy36 mucks: Jack of Clubs, 8 of Clubs
FiftyTonner wins $42.33 from the main pot
FiftyTonner wins $50.33 from side pot 1

Next I had KK and he called me down:-

joep1978 posted the small blind - $0.25
bluearmy072 posted the big blind - $0.50
** Dealing card to joep1978: King of Spades, King of Hearts
badmuthafuke folded
stramash folded
jd-for-me folded
313 folded
wardy2411 folded
FiftyTonner raised - $1.00
twinnie777 folded
joep1978 raised - $2.75
bluearmy072 folded
FiftyTonner called - $2.75
** Dealing the flop: Jack of Hearts, 8 of Clubs, Queen of Clubs
joep1978 bet - $6.00
FiftyTonner called - $6.00
** Dealing the turn: Ace of Clubs
joep1978 bet - $8.00
FiftyTonner raised - $16.00
joep1978 went all-in - $2.82
** Dealing the river: Jack of Diamonds
joep1978 shows: King of Spades, King of Hearts
FiftyTonner shows: Ace of Spades, 10 of Diamonds
FiftyTonner wins $46.69 from the main pot
End of game 649961427

oz_da II
26-12-2006, 05:09 AM
Difficult to tell going on two hands but FiftyTonner appears to be a bit shit/a gambler. He's got no business calling post-flop on the first hand but got lucky hitting his gutshot straight.

He got lucky in the second hand as well. You didn't do much wrong on either hands.

Both his actions, in these two hands, before he luckily hits are EV-.

SamTheOldGoat
26-12-2006, 09:58 AM
As above, he obviously doesn't mind calling big on a gutshot, a risky play with 17% or whatever to hit=normally +ev for you :)

se1eagle
26-12-2006, 01:45 PM
Thanks guys, I suspected that was the case, but the way he eviscerated several of the usual best cash game players made me question my own sanity! I might add him to my buddy list and try and follow him and win my money back :o

oz_da II
26-12-2006, 02:04 PM
What site is this, se1?

He can't possibly be a winning player chasing gutshots all the time...

se1eagle
26-12-2006, 02:14 PM
Originally posted by oz_da II
What site is this, se1?

He can't possibly be a winning player chasing gutshots all the time...

This was on Ladbrokes - on the 25c/50c tables. I actually asked him how he justified the $9 call on the first hand and he said the odds were very good! However I didn't notice him making similar bad calls vs other players - just in the hands against me! :hmph:

saul1664
26-12-2006, 03:02 PM
Originally posted by oz_da II
Pick your moments and hit him hard, I had that on a cash table a few weeks ago, seemed keen on getting rid of his bankroll. Just waited for a good hand and went to town.

I hit A9 suited and called him, his Q8 off held up.

saul1664
26-12-2006, 03:09 PM
Originally posted by Strathclyde Eagle
I wouldn't mind a call with Q9-suited in late position, perhaps. Early on (i.e. first time round the table) in tournaments I only tend to play hands I would want to go all-in with, so should a maniac go all-in pre-flop I'm not wasting chips folding a marginal hand.

This is the part I don't understand:

I've just the hand through an odds calculator (http://twodimes.net/h/?z=2265349). After the flop you're a 91% favourite to win, so why aren't you re-raising and asking him the question?

I didn't put him on KK AA, possible KA, so was trying to extract as much money as possible, which is why I raised on river because thought he would have made two pair with the Kings and Queens and he would have been dominated.

If I re-raise on flop, if he flat calls, I still am not getting any information and even if he goes all in what information am I getting. AA KK maybe and I'm still well ahead. If I call all-in on the flop, he is more than likely to call with KK?

oz_da II
26-12-2006, 03:57 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
I hit A9 suited and called him, his Q8 off held up.

65% - 35%

saul1664
27-12-2006, 12:38 AM
Oh well, he should have been out before then but managed to get up to 4500 chips when his all in 47 off hit a straight against Kings. It was either all in or lose every BB and SB - not an option in latter stages of STT.

SamTheOldGoat
27-12-2006, 02:25 PM
I've said it all along, 47-nuts

Micky Droy
27-12-2006, 09:26 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
yes, you generally do respect a 4 x BB raise pre flop, but early tournament blinds of 10/20, people will raise 4 to 7 x BB with average hands, suited connectors, non suited connectors, you tend to get at least one of these per round, so are you saying you never call this

Fold.

Micky Droy
27-12-2006, 09:31 PM
I realise the biggest problem with my game - apart from the raw maths, is how I play on the turn. I am fine short or medium-short stacked in the last third of a tourney, but when big stacked I play it wrong. i need to correct that.

oz_da II
28-12-2006, 06:42 AM
re. saul's loose early call.

I don't play many tournaments (I find cash games more profitbale), except for my weekly Thursday tourney at my cricket club. Isn't the basic strategy in a tournemant to play tight at the start, loosen up in the middle and tighten up at the end.

saul1664
28-12-2006, 08:24 PM
Yes, you're right. I was doing really well with tournaments with betfair, before they changed their software. When I played where I am playing now was in a few rebuys, which was ridiculously loose, so probably playing looser than usual. Will start tightening up at early levels on next few plays.

saul1664
28-12-2006, 09:21 PM
lol first game back

A points buy in for $1000. Played tighter, folded to raises, not one decent set of cards, down $300 without playing a hand, get QQ, raised all in from similar stack who has been calling with anything, I call, he turns over KA. flop 246 turn 6, river K. Oh well.

SamTheOldGoat
28-12-2006, 11:51 PM
Standard 55/45 innit ;)

David Amsalem
28-12-2006, 11:59 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
lol first game back

A points buy in for $1000. Played tighter, folded to raises, not one decent set of cards, down $300 without playing a hand, get QQ, raised all in from similar stack who has been calling with anything, I call, he turns over KA. flop 246 turn 6, river K. Oh well.

Toss a coin to see who wins that. They're annoying when you lose a few on the bounce considering that they are 50/50s.

SamTheOldGoat
29-12-2006, 09:18 AM
Not really, pairs are ahead only just minus 22, 33 V AK, I 'think'

Strathclyde Eagle
29-12-2006, 12:28 PM
True, but you seem to have streaks of being outdrawn sometimes. It works the other way too, sooner or later.

SamTheOldGoat
29-12-2006, 02:04 PM
True, very true..... playing 6xlow limit SNG's while watching TV atm, and was 2 outered 3 times in 15 minutes, but hey, that's poker ;)

SamTheOldGoat
29-12-2006, 05:15 PM
Just taken down my first HOSE tourny, great fun and nice to take it down. Not sure if the others were too clued up about Stud?!??!?

saul1664
29-12-2006, 08:11 PM
Originally posted by David Amsalem
Toss a coin to see who wins that. They're annoying when you lose a few on the bounce considering that they are 50/50s.

Yeah I know, just a pain for it to happen on the river (and why is there always a slight delay just before the river card as well), and why do people consistently go all in with AK (his was suited so he had an extra percentage call).

Strathclyde Eagle
29-12-2006, 08:53 PM
At some point I'm going to fork out for Poker Tracker and see just how often AK wins for me. Never mind the "It's a big stick, use it as such" philosophy, it's dead meat against sets and if you don't get something on the flop in a multi-way pot you may as well check/fold if you're up against a bunch of calling stations.

Of course if the flop comes down AAK or AKK and someone in early position decides they want to represent a hand then that's an entirely different matter. :cool:

saul1664
29-12-2006, 08:55 PM
If you get an all-in call in a tournament, it is nearly always AK, which is why it can pay calling it with any pair 10 10 upwards. Think it is even more of an all-in than AA or KK (KK being vulnerable to A on flop and AA people tend to want to win more so don't always go all in).

DANCOO
29-12-2006, 09:26 PM
Originally posted by Strathclyde Eagle
At some point I'm going to fork out for Poker Tracker and see just how often AK wins for me. Never mind the "It's a big stick, use it as such" philosophy, it's dead meat against sets and if you don't get something on the flop in a multi-way pot you may as well check/fold if you're up against a bunch of calling stations.

Of course if the flop comes down AAK or AKK and someone in early position decides they want to represent a hand then that's an entirely different matter. :cool:

Empty your PM's.

saul1664
29-12-2006, 10:02 PM
Originally posted by Strathclyde Eagle
Of course if the flop comes down AAK or AKK and someone in early position decides they want to represent a hand then that's an entirely different matter. :cool:

It just did with QQ vs AK again :eek: though had no choice but to call this time.

SamTheOldGoat
29-12-2006, 11:42 PM
Listen to the man Dan=HERO

Beckenham Boy
30-12-2006, 12:23 AM
on pokerroom this evening, all very quiet and slow

oz_da II
30-12-2006, 02:44 AM
Originally posted by Beckenham Boy
on pokerroom this evening, all very quiet and slow

Use Full Tilt Poker or Poker Stars for lots of action (or any other site welcoming US customers).

SamTheOldGoat
30-12-2006, 04:41 PM
Don't EVER use PokerRoom, been reading about Pokerroom last few days on PocketFives, they have skanked a LOT of US customers et al by taking away guarantees after tournies etc, the WORST site on the net...

Playing 100k supernova freeroll tonight if any railers....

SamTheOldGoat
30-12-2006, 04:47 PM
PS, playing a home tourny with 6 others now and got cash game with a load of Brighton fans later on, weeeeeeeee

Reps AJ
30-12-2006, 05:27 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
Don't EVER use PokerRoom, been reading about Pokerroom last few days on PocketFives, they have skanked a LOT of US customers et al by taking away guarantees after tournies etc, the WORST site on the net...

Been playing pokerroom with no problems. Obviously its now illegal for them to deal with US players, so what do you mean with regard US players?

Reps AJ
30-12-2006, 05:41 PM
Ok, seen one article where they made a balls up over a tourney payout

Strathclyde Eagle
30-12-2006, 05:55 PM
Originally posted by DANCOO
Empty your PM's.
Got the e-mail, cheers. :p

saul1664
30-12-2006, 06:14 PM
trying ladbrokes new software, but curse of prima network strikes again. Fairly short stacked, down to final 200, K7 on BB, two checkers, flop K 7 6, call all-in, one caller, turns over 6 Q, turn 6 for trips. Does top pair on flop ever hold out?

DANCOO
30-12-2006, 06:40 PM
Originally posted by Strathclyde Eagle
Got the e-mail, cheers. :p

:p

oz_da II
30-12-2006, 10:22 PM
Originally posted by Reps AJ
Been playing pokerroom with no problems. Obviously its now illegal for them to deal with US players

Don't think so.

SamTheOldGoat
30-12-2006, 11:56 PM
It may be illegal in theory but it doesn't stop them playing, and many many US customers are/were STILL playing, however a boycott seems to be in action at the moment with regards to it, also note, it's part of 'pokes' the 'site' that recently 'did a runner' with $1.5m of it's customers' money!

oz_da II
31-12-2006, 12:29 AM
Originally posted by Reps AJ
Been playing pokerroom with no problems. Obviously its now illegal for them to deal with US players, so what do you mean with regard US players?

Not illegal at all. Found this on an interesting article.
A lot of poker sites completely overreacting.
http://www.cardplayer.com/poker_law/article/1446

Jurisdiction

Libraries of books have been written on the varied and complex meaning of jurisdiction. One of the simplest meanings of “jurisdiction” is legal power.

For example, a New York court doesn’t generally have jurisdiction (legal power) over a problem in Texas. A federal court doesn’t have jurisdiction over a violation of most state laws. A municipal judge doesn’t have jurisdiction over a felony trial.

Our government doesn’t have jurisdiction to make rules for a company that resides offshore. Our rules do not apply in other countries, as they have their own sets of rules.

This bill prohibits a gaming company from accepting payment that violates US gaming law. Besides the fact that no law makes online poker illegal, all the gaming sites are offshore and not subject to US laws.

A law that tries to control an offshore company is considered a law with no teeth, because it cannot be enforced. In the US, when a law is broken, a person is arrested. The government subpoenas records and a case moves forward. What it means not to have jurisdiction is that US laws do not apply offshore, nor can the US arrest a person in another country nor does our government have subpoena power to command an offshore company to turn over records. NETeller, an online money transfer service, is also an offshore company, not subject to US laws.

saul1664
31-12-2006, 10:40 PM
aggggh harsh way to go out of tourney

blinds 6000/12000, on BB get AA, raise all in

only caller QK Q on flop K on river

finished 132nd out of 5000

pants and poo

Son of Selhurst
01-01-2007, 02:48 AM
Now why would you call a pre-flop raise with 6 10 and call it down, and then leave straight after the hand?



PokerStars Game #7703768471: Hold'em Limit ($10/$20) - 2006/12/31 - 21:41:07 (ET)
Table 'Ella' 6-max Seat #4 is the button
Seat 1: ET300 ($582 in chips)
Seat 2: Ayg51 ($225 in chips)
Seat 3: Shady-k187 ($326 in chips)
Seat 4: Blartman ($165 in chips)
Seat 6: Underground ($390 in chips)
Underground: posts small blind $5
ET300: posts big blind $10
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Blartman [7c 9c]
Ayg51: folds
Shady-k187: calls $10
Blartman: raises $10 to $20
Underground: calls $15
ET300: folds
Shady-k187: calls $10
*** FLOP *** [5c 8h 6s] (Blartman flops a straight)
Underground: checks
Shady-k187: bets $10 (shady has pair of 6's)
Blartman: raises $10 to $20
Underground: folds
Shady-k187: calls $10
*** TURN *** [5c 8h 6s] [Ts] (shady has 2 pair at this stage)
Shady-k187: bets $20
Blartman: raises $20 to $40
MissWhip joins the table at seat #5
Shady-k187: raises $20 to $60
Blartman: raises $20 to $80
Betting is capped
Shady-k187: calls $20
*** RIVER *** [5c 8h 6s Ts] [6c]
Shady-k187: bets $20
Blartman: raises $20 to $40
Shady-k187: raises $20 to $60
Blartman: calls $5 and is all-in
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Shady-k187: shows [6d Td] (a full house, Sixes full of Tens)
Blartman: mucks hand
Shady-k187 collected $358 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $360 | Rake $2
Board [5c 8h 6s Ts 6c]
Seat 1: ET300 (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 2: Ayg51 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: Shady-k187 showed [6d Td] and won ($358) with a full house, Sixes full of Tens
Seat 4: Blartman (button) mucked [7c 9c]
Seat 6: Underground (small blind) folded on the Flop

oz_da II
01-01-2007, 04:01 AM
Why would you raise with 7c 9c from the cut-off with someone already in the pot?

oz_da II
01-01-2007, 04:03 AM
Originally posted by Son of Selhurst
Now why would you call a pre-flop raise with 6 10 and call it down, and then leave straight after the hand?


Call it down? He put you all in...

Son of Selhurst
01-01-2007, 04:13 AM
cock

oz_da II
01-01-2007, 04:15 AM
:hi:

saul1664
01-01-2007, 02:35 PM
Originally posted by oz_da II
Why would you raise with 7c 9c from the cut-off with someone already in the pot?

not unusual to raise a pot with suited connectors?

Zola's Chin
01-01-2007, 02:51 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
not unusual to raise a pot with suited connectors?

Since when have 79 been connectors?

But you're right, it's not unusual to raise with them. AK, KQ or maybe even QJ in certain situations.

saul1664
01-01-2007, 02:59 PM
Originally posted by Zola's Chin
Since when have 79 been connectors?

But you're right, it's not unusual to raise with them. AK, KQ or maybe even QJ in certain situations.

Think you can still class them as suited connectors with a gap missing. A lot of good players will raise with them to vary their play. Good to crack AA KK with, and hard to read, especially if you have a tight style of play.

DANCOO
01-01-2007, 03:11 PM
I don't play FL, but this is my take on it.

Firstly, he had already invested $10 and was getting 6/1 after your raise, so a reasonable pre-flop call.

He bets with middle pair and gets raised. He's now getting 10/1 to see the turn.
He calls, but if he doesn't improve, he check/folds.
He hits 2 pair.
I can only assume he put you on an overpair, but got lucky on the river.

SamTheOldGoat
01-01-2007, 03:39 PM
SOS, your limits raised consierably, didn't know you played 10/20 limit? If you go with 'Fox's' BR management to combat variance etc, your BR will be at $80k or so?!?

saul1664
02-01-2007, 12:28 AM
Another tourney, and 45th from a field of over 1500, which is nice. Got up to 35,000 chips but all went downhill from there. Any promising hand seemed to get re-raised all-in, or there were all in calls before it got to me. Eventually pushed in on K9 to get dominated by AA.

What's the best thing to do, if you are generally card dead and blinds are big, push all in any two reasonable cards (bearing in mind that there were all in shouts most hands). Think the best hand I could have played was A10, but that had already had two all ins from early position?

SamTheOldGoat
02-01-2007, 11:52 AM
Just wait until it fold round to me at cut-off or button then shove regardless, hoping it's a 60/40!

eaglesrus
02-01-2007, 12:56 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
Another tourney, and 45th from a field of over 1500, which is nice. Got up to 35,000 chips but all went downhill from there. Any promising hand seemed to get re-raised all-in, or there were all in calls before it got to me. Eventually pushed in on K9 to get dominated by AA.

What's the best thing to do, if you are generally card dead and blinds are big, push all in any two reasonable cards (bearing in mind that there were all in shouts most hands). Think the best hand I could have played was A10, but that had already had two all ins from early position?

A 10 with two early position "all ins" needs to be folded. You will most likely be dominated by AK AQ. At best you can hope to be up against two lower pairs and be slight underdog before the flop, so I think you were best not to move in.

When I am short stacked i am generally waiting for two high cards or connectors, in hopefully late position, with no raise before me and then to push the chips in. at that point in the tournament stealing the blinds and the antes will keep you afloat for a while.

also look out for a cheap limp in from any one in early position. if you hold any reasonable hand then I generally will come in strongly over the top and the limper especially if he/she is short stacked will generally be forced to fold.

Finished 2nd and 3rd in two £10 tourneys over the weekend and picked up around £500 in total. It goes some way in repaying some of the money that I have spent over Christmas!

DANCOO
02-01-2007, 01:13 PM
Originally posted by eaglesrus

also look out for a cheap limp in from any one in early position. if you hold any reasonable hand then I generally will come in strongly over the top and the limper especially if he/she is short stacked will generally be forced to fold.


IMO an early limp when there is a lot of blinds stealing going on is usually screaming out for someone to put them all-in.

AddiscombeEagle
02-01-2007, 03:05 PM
Stupid question maybe, but how do rebuys work in a tournament?

If, it says four levels of rebuys, is that unlimited rebuys through the first four levels I take it?

eaglesrus
02-01-2007, 03:14 PM
Originally posted by AddiscombeEagle
Stupid question maybe, but how do rebuys work in a tournament?

If, it says four levels of rebuys, is that unlimited rebuys through the first four levels I take it?

That is correct. Or aleternatively they will do rebuys through to the first break. Normally you will get one add on option as well.

Rebuy tourneys can become quite expensive and you are open to people calling you with a weak hand as they know they have the option to get back into the tourney.

AddiscombeEagle
02-01-2007, 03:24 PM
Thanks, just found that out and decided to bail out as I could see it would get expensive.

SamTheOldGoat
02-01-2007, 05:34 PM
Had a bit of a result last night at Grosvenor Brighton. Took down first in £10R for £520 so chuffed with that, played a good game and was in for £20 with no top up. Off for a £20R in a bit so hopefully have some success. Also first night of the league so at the top ;)

PS, Pool King, I now know who they are. Jamie is a very good player, sat two to my right during the whole evening. On the bubble I shoved with 33 up against Jamie Bullens 99. I was dealing my own fate and produced a 3 which doubled me up and from then on played good poker on the FT.

SamTheOldGoat
02-01-2007, 05:41 PM
WEEEEEEEEEEEEE (http://www.blondepoker.com/index.php?q=node/6589)

SamTheOldGoat
02-01-2007, 07:42 PM
Correct laydown? I was kicking myself afterwards however with El left to move after reraising me I thought I was beat. I would have taken the 'race' if it had been AK... Grrrr

Click me (http://www.pokerhand.org/?708790)

DANCOO
02-01-2007, 09:55 PM
Nice one STOG, how long did the tourney take?

SamTheOldGoat
02-01-2007, 10:18 PM
Ta mate, it was the second time in a casino since going back to Uni in Sept so was happy. Kicked off at 8 and last hand HU was at 3am! I think he was a bit of a novice though so managed to deposit of him in about 10 hands, ironically he was only in the tournament by calling my push all in with 15 left with 88 v my 99, and hit an 8 on the river, see folks, it even happens live ;)

Playing stud tonight Dan, had a pretty good run and made money very quickly, have you played/tried it?

saul1664
02-01-2007, 10:55 PM
was playing in a rounders competition, thankfully level one, was chip leader but my 2 pair JK lost to AA after 4 hearts made a better flush for him than me, left with 1,000 chips.

BB 3J, nail flush on flop (or so i thought), check turn, check river, he raises I call all in. He has two pair, wait to get the money, tells me that I'm out, then realise that the 3 clubs on the flop were actually 2 clubs and a spade, so was pushing all in with nothing against AK.

At least it was at level 1.
:clown:

DANCOO
02-01-2007, 11:06 PM
Four...Colour...Deck.

saul1664
02-01-2007, 11:10 PM
And now my QA all in was called with 79, with two 7's coming on turn and river. Time to call it a day I think.

se1eagle
02-01-2007, 11:27 PM
Just been in the $50,000 Ladbrokes Player Point tournament - finished 168/1223 - been playing since 19:30. 100th would have got me $100 - 3rd would have got me on the Laddies Poker Cruise.

Feeling a bit sick after four hours of solid playing - was in 60th position and had QQ, and raised under the gun and guy next to me goes all in preflop with AJ offsuit. Stupidly I called, and he hit an Ace on the flop and took me out. So close... but yet so far...

However the fact I'm actually profitable on the cash tables is what I shall concentrate on for now - that, and the fact I saw someone with 4 of a kind 4s call an all-in on the flop and lose to pocket 5s that hit turn 5 and then river 5. Worst bad-beat I think I've ever seen.

saul1664
02-01-2007, 11:37 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
And now my QA all in was called with 79, with two 7's coming on turn and river. Time to call it a day I think.

There is something inherently wrong with the prima network (i was on betdirect). Shortly after that hand, just a small stakes STT, dealt QQ (which is fast approaching my least favourite hand), raise 5 x BB, called by 1 (he has 9 10 off), raggedy flop with 9 as third card, push all in as fairly short stacked, turn 9, river 9. Every time you see a 3 way all-in, lowest hand seems to win all the time.

Had 20 chips left, my 45 goes against AK and JJ. Of course mine holds up. Bit late by then. :rolleyes:

Strathclyde Eagle
02-01-2007, 11:46 PM
I'm not getting into all the ins and outs of the Prima Network, but have been on Poker Stars for about a month now and am getting to be more and more impressed with their software, especially the instant hand history option.

Worth a try if you haven't before, and as they don't offer a refer-a-friend deal probably best to go through the official Palace website so at least a common interest benefits (stupidly I didn't sign up through them - do they have specific Palace-only tournaments or something?).

Strathclyde Eagle
02-01-2007, 11:53 PM
BTW, very interesting Million Dollar Cash Game on Sky Sports 1 or 2 tonight. Interesting to see the starting hands and lots of post-flop action. Very different to tournaments, extremely wide variety of starting hands.

DANCOO
03-01-2007, 12:43 AM
Originally posted by se1eagle

Feeling a bit sick after four hours of solid playing - was in 60th position and had QQ, and raised under the gun and guy next to me goes all in preflop with AJ offsuit. Stupidly I called, and he hit an Ace on the flop and took me out.

Why stupidly?:confused:

se1eagle
03-01-2007, 12:57 AM
Originally posted by DANCOO
Why stupidly?:confused:

Well I was a 73%/27% favourite so in some ways it wasn't stupid - but I was in 60th out of 168, I'd been playing for ages, if I'd stayed tight and only played hands against people with less chips than me then I would have almost certainly made 100th. By risking an all-in, even thinking I was winning, against a similarly stacked player I did myself out of the cash.

Having said that, the flipside is that if my QQ had held up I'd have been in with a decent chance of the cruise tickets... :sob:

oz_da II
03-01-2007, 01:03 AM
Originally posted by se1eagle
Well I was a 73%/27% favourite so in some ways it wasn't stupid - but I was in 60th out of 168, I'd been playing for ages, if I'd stayed tight and only played hands against people with less chips than me then I would have almost certainly made 100th. By risking an all-in, even thinking I was winning, against a similarly stacked player I did myself out of the cash.

I've read articles about people throwing away aces pre-flop in similar situations. I've been burned in a similar situation with KK where if I walked away and let my blinds be eaten up I would have qualified for the next stage of some entry satellite tourney for an LV event.

SamTheOldGoat
03-01-2007, 01:15 AM
I've binned Aces in a pot where 5 or so were all in before me, and they wouldn't have held up and passed QQ last night live when 3 were all in in front of me, and would have been up against KK and AK....

SamTheOldGoat
03-01-2007, 01:21 AM
It often pays to 'put down the best hand' in my opinion.

SOS, what's going on with the limits you were playing in the previous hand history, do you often play those limits?

oz_da II
03-01-2007, 01:30 AM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
SOS, what's going on with the limits you were playing in the previous hand history, do you often play those limits?

I think it has got something to do with him believing no one "sucks out" on him at that level. :clown:

DANCOO
03-01-2007, 01:42 AM
If you're playing for a satellite seat and figure you will easily get there, then QQ may be worth a pass.
But playing for a cash finish, with a healthy chip stack, you simply can't fold QQ in that position unless you have a really good read on him for an over pair.
Like you said, you would have been in great position had you won that hand for a much bigger payout. Give me QQ v AJ every single hand I play, and I will die a very wealthy man.
The only other time I might pass is if I am around the bubble and have virtually zero chance of progressing to the second cash cut-off stage.

When I was in the Laddies Daddy a couple of weeks back I was sitting around 14/21, with top 20 getting paid. Player in front of me pushed all-in (had me covered), and I called with AK (putting him on an underpair).
He turns over 99, I hit a K and take down the pot.
Had he won the hand I would have bubbled and missed out on around $600, but winning it allowed me to get to the final table, where I was unlucky not to finish higher than I did (7th I think).
Never a truer cliché - To win, you must be willing to die.

SamTheOldGoat
03-01-2007, 11:38 AM
Originally posted by oz_da II
I think it has got something to do with him believing no one "sucks out" on him at that level. :clown:
I'll believe that when I see it!:D

Dan, I completely understand and agree with what you have written with regards to QQ, and the position in a cash game. Did you see my pokerhand on page prior to this with re-raise and re-re-raise behind me, what do you do there? It wouldn't have affected my roll so I probably should have called :veryangry

SamTheOldGoat
03-01-2007, 11:39 AM
I think this is the right emotion actually:bash:

Just had A 10, limped in, flop AA 10, I slow roll it, and end up splitting with someone else who has A 10 and miss AA on my other table where 2 raisers have made it $15 to play, Grrrrrrrrr :bash: :D :p

DANCOO
03-01-2007, 12:36 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
Did you see my pokerhand on page prior to this with re-raise and re-re-raise behind me, what do you do there? It wouldn't have affected my roll so I probably should have called :veryangry

I suppose it would depend on how he had been playing, and what sort of player he had you down as.

This is the reason why I don't do well at cash games.
People with bigger bank rolls, and a more 'don't give a ••••' attitude, tend to play much more aggressive than me.
In a freezeout tourney, although there is more often less money at stake (as far as the buy-in is concerned), even aggressive players don't want to go out of a tourney after 3 hours of play with nothing to show for it, so I tend to do better at that sort of game.

I suppose I 'may' have folded. If I had been on a bad run though, I probably would have called out of frustration.

saul1664
03-01-2007, 01:08 PM
Originally posted by DANCOO
If you're playing for a satellite seat and figure you will easily get there, then QQ may be worth a pass.
But playing for a cash finish, with a healthy chip stack, you simply can't fold QQ in that position unless you have a really good read on him for an over pair.
Like you said, you would have been in great position had you won that hand for a much bigger payout. Give me QQ v AJ every single hand I play, and I will die a very wealthy man.
The only other time I might pass is if I am around the bubble and have virtually zero chance of progressing to the second cash cut-off stage.

When I was in the Laddies Daddy a couple of weeks back I was sitting around 14/21, with top 20 getting paid. Player in front of me pushed all-in (had me covered), and I called with AK (putting him on an underpair).
He turns over 99, I hit a K and take down the pot.
Had he won the hand I would have bubbled and missed out on around $600, but winning it allowed me to get to the final table, where I was unlucky not to finish higher than I did (7th I think).
Never a truer cliché - To win, you must be willing to die.
To miss the bubble you need to be the bubble

DANCOO
03-01-2007, 01:16 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
To miss the bubble you need to be the bubble
:confused:

If I had went out in 21st, I would have bubbled.

SamTheOldGoat
03-01-2007, 01:27 PM
Chortle at this bad beat I put on someone just now, this is literally superb and one of the worst ones I've seen in recent times! Only playing SNG's today to get my Sharkscope back to +EV, as only been playing cash for last 6 months and hate telling people my username and them looking me up thinking I'm donkified due to some bad play at the beginning of my poker 'experience' :)

Check it ;)

sicko hand (http://www.pokerhand.org/?710790)

saul1664
03-01-2007, 01:43 PM
Originally posted by DANCOO
:confused:

If I had went out in 21st, I would have bubbled.

If you try not to be the bubble you often end up being the bubble. You are better off with big raises and blind steals, unless of course you are extremely short stacked and plan to fold every single hand.

Son of Selhurst
03-01-2007, 01:54 PM
Normally $5/$10 but there was no available slots so I moved up. Ended up on $630 and then cashed out as my missus discovered my late-night shennanigans and ordered me to bed... :(

Strathclyde Eagle
03-01-2007, 07:44 PM
That never happens to me.






Sorry, gotta go, dinner's waiting. :cool: :D

Reps AJ
03-01-2007, 08:54 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
Chortle at this bad beat I put on someone just now, this is literally superb and one of the worst ones I've seen in recent times! Only playing SNG's today to get my Sharkscope back to +EV, as only been playing cash for last 6 months and hate telling people my username and them looking me up thinking I'm donkified due to some bad play at the beginning of my poker 'experience' :)

Check it ;)

sicko hand (http://www.pokerhand.org/?710790)

Out of curiosity what did you put him on to re-raise all in?

SamTheOldGoat
04-01-2007, 12:10 AM
He was UTG+3 in a 6 handed game and from his double up which you may notice was a COMPLETELY awful play, much like my reraise all in. In that he min raised to attempt to get someone off a hand and was pot committed when the re-re-raise came back in to put him all in, and went runner runner straight IIRC.

I put him on TPTK or A with mid kicker, which is what he got lucky with earlier on. It was a bad read and re-re-raise by me, but him calling a 6xbb in level 1 out of position to me with 56 was pretty bad imo.

I had outs for the riv ;)

SamTheOldGoat
04-01-2007, 12:21 AM
I meant to say in first sentence that in his position UTG+3 I would have expected some sort of raise with AK. AQ, AJ, mid-high pair....

KevTheOptimist
04-01-2007, 07:39 PM
Great. $25 tourney on laddies, second hand get AA. Raise 5 x BB with one caller. flop 8 9 Q I bet, call, turn 7 I bet he calls, river 6 I bet he calls and turns over 6 7 suited.

Board had 4 clubs on it as well. How may ways can the board get any scarier. Hasn't taken me out the comp yet

se1eagle
04-01-2007, 07:59 PM
Feeling sick again now. Have lost $150 in the last 24 hours, all with AA and KK. People keep calling my $1.80 raises (blinds are 30c) and hitting two small pairs on the flop - this has happened to me twice this afternoon. A couple of four card flushes and one four of a kind complete my misery. Any advice on how to spot this/lay them down? From my analysis I am actually losing considerable money on AA and KK so I must be doing something wrong... I'm not going near the tables for another 24 hours.

KevTheOptimist
04-01-2007, 08:17 PM
Originally posted by se1eagle
I'm not going near the tables for another 24 hours.

Pussy.

:D

saul1664
04-01-2007, 08:28 PM
Originally posted by se1eagle
Feeling sick again now. Have lost $150 in the last 24 hours, all with AA and KK. People keep calling my $1.80 raises (blinds are 30c) and hitting two small pairs on the flop - this has happened to me twice this afternoon. A couple of four card flushes and one four of a kind complete my misery. Any advice on how to spot this/lay them down? From my analysis I am actually losing considerable money on AA and KK so I must be doing something wrong... I'm not going near the tables for another 24 hours.

All in pre flop.

saul1664
04-01-2007, 08:30 PM
Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
Great. $25 tourney on laddies, second hand get AA. Raise 5 x BB with one caller. flop 8 9 Q I bet, call, turn 7 I bet he calls, river 6 I bet he calls and turns over 6 7 suited.

Board had 4 clubs on it as well. How may ways can the board get any scarier. Hasn't taken me out the comp yet

Went out of a STT yesterday. Down to last 8, struggling for chips, call all in on an A5 suited, I still have 800 chips at this stage, two calls, K4 and 22, a 4 on flop wins it for the chips, as I miss completely. Nice call I say, he replies well I had two hearts. You've got to love them.

SamTheOldGoat
04-01-2007, 08:38 PM
Up at Big Slick now playing £10R, hopefully do as well as Monday, will letyou know how I get on :)

KevTheOptimist
04-01-2007, 08:56 PM
Argghhh

KK goes out v AQ with a river poxy ace.

I swear there was a time when I'd survive these hands. These days where the possibility is there to lose t an over card, I always poxing well do.

KevTheOptimist
04-01-2007, 09:29 PM
Exported a load of hands to poker office.

Cash game wise, KK has cost me in the region of $150 and is comfortably my worst tournement hand.

KevTheOptimist
04-01-2007, 09:59 PM
In a real dry patch at the moment. Can't seem to get anywhere in 10 handed tournies. Betfair 6 handed and I get lots of finishes. Laddies 10 handed and nothing, not a single cash that I can remember.

Annoying thing is I'm getting outdrawn or losing to marginal hands when holding better starting hands. the hand above is an example but not the only one, whenever I'm in with Ax, I'm always losing to mateys with a lower x and losing.....

Does the fact I can't get anywhere 10 handed say anything about my play? Or how can you adapt form 6 to 10 handed ?

Gladys Allover
04-01-2007, 10:04 PM
I only play 5 hand on Pokerheaven as haven't got the patience to play 10 handed! You have to sit and wait for people to knock themselves out rather than get impatient and start playing hands you shouldn't. There are too many people in the group that can have good hands. Stick to low numbers and keep taking their cash instead!!!

oz_da II
04-01-2007, 10:05 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
All in pre flop.

That wins him $0.45 (assuming everyone folds).

oz_da II
04-01-2007, 10:11 PM
Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
Exported a load of hands to poker office.

Cash game wise, KK has cost me in the region of $150 and is comfortably my worst tournement hand.

Do you not use PokerOffice while you are playing?

Strathclyde Eagle
04-01-2007, 10:12 PM
Originally posted by oz_da II
That wins him $0.45 (assuming everyone folds).
To use a term I've heard a lot lately, you're only getting called by a hand that's beating you.
Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
Does the fact I can't get anywhere 10 handed say anything about my play? Or how can you adapt form 6 to 10 handed ?
Be a lot tighter early on tends to work for me (in general). First time round the table I'll only play AA, KK or AK, just in case a maniac goes all-in with junk.

Being tight for a few rounds generally lets a few players get short-stacked, can see who's doing what, etc. For some reason though on Poker Stars tournaments the players seem to be quite level. Whereas on other sites you'll see a chip leader with about 3x starting chips you sometimes see a chip leader with just under double their starting stack. Seems to find it harder when it's like that for some reason.

oz_da II
04-01-2007, 10:20 PM
Originally posted by se1eagle
Feeling sick again now. Have lost $150 in the last 24 hours, all with AA and KK. People keep calling my $1.80 raises (blinds are 30c) and hitting two small pairs on the flop - this has happened to me twice this afternoon. A couple of four card flushes and one four of a kind complete my misery. Any advice on how to spot this/lay them down? From my analysis I am actually losing considerable money on AA and KK so I must be doing something wrong... I'm not going near the tables for another 24 hours.

Keep doing what you're doing except don't be afraid to throw them away if you don't like the look of the board.

saul1664
04-01-2007, 10:39 PM
Originally posted by oz_da II
That wins him $0.45 (assuming everyone folds).

But you want to get all your chips in and be called, otherwise you are in danger of getting outdrawn. A big pre flop raise will result in same folds or only big hands calling. Surprisingly what people will call with. Have met all in with 22 55 JJ AK. If you are calling with AA should win 4 out of 5. Obviously depends on position and table image as well.

saul1664
04-01-2007, 10:40 PM
Any quick tips on 5 card draw while I'm here. Initial raising hands and betting after discards?

saul1664
04-01-2007, 10:53 PM
help

saul1664
04-01-2007, 10:57 PM
too late

Reps AJ
04-01-2007, 11:00 PM
Got to love people who can't see the bigger picture - playing a 10 person STT and there are four of us left, only 3 getting paid. I've got 40 chips left :D and am about to be blinded out when two of the others get themselves all in. Thanks for the $40 guys :p

oz_da II
04-01-2007, 11:00 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
But you want to get all your chips in and be called, otherwise you are in danger of getting outdrawn. A big pre flop raise will result in same folds or only big hands calling.

And you will be on average a 4:1 (aces hold up 4 out of 5 times) favourite to win (heads-up) against any random hand (that includes premium hands). Best ploy is to isloate one or two players and build a pot. And once again don't be afraid to chuck them away if you don't like the look of the board. Best way to build a bankroll is to minimize losses and maximize wins (obviuosly).

As it goes I play limit, I find it a lot easier to accumulate a bank roll (you play a lot more poker as well). It seems like with the tables you play, you get a premium hand, throw in all your chips and hope for the best.

saul1664
04-01-2007, 11:06 PM
Depends what limits you play at. On smaller limits, 4 x BB isn't going to scare off a lot of average or developing hands that can catch straights, flushes, or two pair on the flop. When stakes are higher, play may be better and you may be able to play your hands differently.

oz_da II
04-01-2007, 11:14 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
Depends what limits you play at. On smaller limits, 4 x BB isn't going to scare off a lot of average or developing hands that can catch straights, flushes, or two pair on the flop. When stakes are higher, play may be better and you may be able to play your hands differently.

You can't bet 4xBB on limit.

se1eagle
04-01-2007, 11:27 PM
Originally posted by oz_da II
Keep doing what you're doing except don't be afraid to throw them away if you don't like the look of the board.

Thanks! I'm pretty good at throwing them away when an overcard comes down and people bet at it - however on these hands my opponent flopped 2 pair and I figured I had the overpair so I bet.. With no re-raise I figured they were drawing and bet more...

Hehe I like your location! Grrr!

saul1664
04-01-2007, 11:37 PM
Originally posted by oz_da II
You can't bet 4xBB on limit.

I was talking generically. Obviously you need a different approach to limit. I've never really got into it myself.

SamTheOldGoat
05-01-2007, 02:08 AM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
Up at Big Slick now playing £10R, hopefully do as well as Monday, will letyou know how I get on :)
BANG
Take it down with 43 runners for £720...... 2 wins in 2 nights of poker including £10R @ Grosvenor Brighton on Monday. So happy after not playing live since September due to Uni work-

My face is like this :D , $2500 + to my online roll, weeeeeeeeeeeee :rolleyes: :D

SamTheOldGoat
05-01-2007, 03:59 AM
In fact just under £720, dealt at £400 for both of us HU and played for about another £270 or so plus the bounties so=£710 I think, home, I'm shattered :

knowlesyUCLA
05-01-2007, 04:51 AM
just had ace high flush which i made on the turn cracked on the river by quads (Queens). Pretty disgusting to be honest. Thank God there isnt a rebuy because I would be there and on tilt to the max.

Reps AJ
06-01-2007, 01:56 PM
Amazing today, people calling raises with nothing and hitting :bash: KK loses to Q3 and just lost with AQ to J5

PoolKing
07-01-2007, 02:11 AM
Originally posted by Reps AJ
Amazing today, people calling raises with nothing and hitting :bash: KK loses to Q3 and just lost with AQ to J5

Story of my week:veryangry :bash: :veryangry :bash:

Just finished a session tonight and lost 3 big pots and the chance of losing ALL 3 is just 1% :bash: :sob: :bash: :sob:

Billyd
07-01-2007, 02:50 AM
just had a sick beat:

PokerStars Game #7804002395: Hold'em No Limit ($0.10/$0.25) - 2007/01/06 - 21:44:55 (ET)
Table 'Adelinda II' 6-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: billyd77 ($17.30 in chips)
Seat 2: AMUNO ($14 in chips)
Seat 3: MontyBurns18 ($24.50 in chips)
Seat 4: Parseval ($48.30 in chips)
Seat 5: mEoAnSeY1 ($27.45 in chips)
Seat 6: Magnusdalber ($31 in chips)
MontyBurns18: posts small blind $0.10
Parseval: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to billyd77 [9h Kh]
mEoAnSeY1: calls $0.25
Magnusdalber: folds
billyd77: raises $1 to $1.25
AMUNO: calls $1.25
MontyBurns18: folds
Parseval: calls $1
mEoAnSeY1: calls $1
*** FLOP *** [Ah 7h 4h]
Parseval: checks
mEoAnSeY1: bets $4
billyd77: calls $4
AMUNO: raises $6 to $10
Parseval: folds
mEoAnSeY1: raises $12.50 to $22.50
billyd77: calls $12.05 and is all-in
AMUNO: calls $2.75 and is all-in
*** TURN *** [Ah 7h 4h] [4d]
*** RIVER *** [Ah 7h 4h 4d] [Jh]
mEoAnSeY1 said, "lol"
*** SHOW DOWN ***
mEoAnSeY1: shows [4c 4s] (four of a kind, Fours)
billyd77: mucks hand
mEoAnSeY1 collected $6.30 from side pot
AMUNO: mucks hand
mEoAnSeY1 collected $41.20 from main pot
AMUNO said, "lol nice"
AMUNO said, "lol"
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $49.95 Main pot $41.20. Side pot $6.30. | Rake $2.45
Board [Ah 7h 4h 4d Jh]
Seat 1: billyd77 mucked [9h Kh]
Seat 2: AMUNO (button) mucked [Kc Th]
Seat 3: MontyBurns18 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 4: Parseval (big blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 5: mEoAnSeY1 showed [4c 4s] and won ($47.50) with four of a kind, Fours
Seat 6: Magnusdalber folded before Flop (didn't bet)

Reps AJ
07-01-2007, 12:52 PM
Originally posted by Billyd
just had a sick beat:

Flopping the nut flush and then having people put you all-in has got to be the dream. I feel your pain :sob:

KevTheOptimist
10-01-2007, 05:09 PM
Bit dead on here, everyone on holiday or something?!

DANCOO
10-01-2007, 06:08 PM
Not played for about a week.
I intend to change that shortly though.:)

se1eagle
10-01-2007, 11:55 PM
I just cannot win at the moment... my cash table bankroll started at $20 on Dec 22nd and I'd been steadily, slowly growing it up to $550 about a week ago is now down to $400.. If I have the nuts, then someone will catch a one-outer and I'll split - either that or I'll be outdrawn as below. I probably should have bet more initially on the flop, but apart from that I don't think I did anything wrong. As always any comments greatly appreciated.

** Game ID 662031281 starting - 2007-01-10 23:44:47
** Camargue [Hold em] (0.15|0.30 No Limit - Cash Game) Real Money
- chad22 sitting in seat 1 with $9.98
- Zepplin sitting in seat 2 with $187.83
- JoakHesseman sitting in seat 3 with $21.77
- joep1978 sitting in seat 4 with $32.35
- roberto11 sitting in seat 5 with $25.58
- Dondo sitting in seat 6 with $43.05
- Najdorf sitting in seat 7 with $90.10
- siggesagge sitting in seat 8 with $32.14
- dexi sitting in seat 9 with $21.52 [Dealer]
- shinehead sitting in seat 10 with $17.37
chad22 posted the small blind - $0.15
Zepplin posted the big blind - $0.30
** Dealing card to joep1978: King of Clubs, King of Hearts
JoakHesseman folded
joep1978 raised - $1.20
roberto11 called - $1.20
Dondo called - $1.20
Najdorf folded
siggesagge folded
dexi called - $1.20
chad22 called - $1.20
Zepplin called - $1.20
** Dealing the flop: King of Spades, Ace of Clubs, 3 of Spades
chad22 bet - $0.30
Zepplin folded
joep1978 raised - $2.02
roberto11 called - $2.02
Dondo raised - $15.28
dexi folded
chad22 went all-in - $8.63
joep1978 went all-in - $29.13
roberto11 went all-in - $22.36
Dondo called - $31.15
** Dealing the turn: 6 of Spades
** Dealing the river: 5 of Spades
joep1978 shows: King of Clubs, King of Hearts
Dondo mucks:
roberto11 shows: 9 of Spades, Ace of Spades
chad22 mucks: Ace of Hearts, 9 of Hearts
joep1978 wins $13.54 from side pot 2
roberto11 wins $40.78 from the main pot
roberto11 wins $86.27 from side pot 1
End of game 662031281

oz_da II
11-01-2007, 12:47 AM
A bit unlucky, not a bad play from roberto11 - top pair with an ace high flush draw.

Must have been praying no spade (or pair the board) after the all-ins... :moo:

I had a similar hand a few days ago with a set of jacks and managed to pair the board that also made someone's flush. Nice little bump up for the bankroll. :p

DANCOO
11-01-2007, 09:57 AM
Come on then, what are all your New Years poker resolutions.

For me, it's no cash hold'em games.

citizen sane
11-01-2007, 10:44 AM
Originally posted by DANCOO
Come on then, what are all your New Years poker resolutions.

For me, it's no cash hold'em games.

I stopped playing cash tables months ago for the same reasons that you stated in an earlier post on the subject .

New years poker resolutions ?

I want to become a successful online MTT player . ( thats all I play nowadays ) and better my biggest ever cashout ( winning 5k guaranteed ) .

Just after christmas I loaded $50 into my laddies and pokerstars accounts and I'd like that to be the last time I reload these this year .

Currently I have $120 in Lads and $40 in pokerstars .

citizen sane
11-01-2007, 10:52 AM
Oh yeah , I also want to win the $1500 freeroll on Laddies , I normally play this alongside any other tournament I'm in . My highest place in this is currently 68th .

This was my demise last night , and what a way to go out :D

** Game ID 661746538 starting - 2007-01-10 19:05:03
** $1500 Freeroll[1153201]:Table 361 [Multi Table Hold 'em] (20.00|40.00 No Limit - MTT) Real Money

- 770126910021 sitting in seat 1 with $1500.00
- stjernenr16 sitting in seat 2 with $1490.00
- StaceyMo sitting in seat 3 with $1420.00
- berra57 sitting in seat 4 with $1580.00 [Dealer]
- Rheinsteel sitting in seat 5 with $1450.00
- spinmos sitting in seat 6 with $1480.00
- boati sitting in seat 7 with $1550.00
- sherpavan sitting in seat 8 with $1500.00
- Kheldar sitting in seat 9 with $1500.00
- spizz80 sitting in seat 10 with $1500.00

Rheinsteel posted the small blind - $10.00
spinmos posted the big blind - $20.00

** Dealing card to spizz80: Ace of Clubs, King of Hearts
boati folded
sherpavan folded
Kheldar raised - $200.00
spizz80 went all-in - $1500.00
770126910021 folded
stjernenr16 folded
StaceyMo folded
berra57 folded
Rheinsteel folded
spinmos folded
Kheldar went all-in - $1300.00
Kheldar shows: 10 of Spades, King of Clubs

** Dealing the flop: 10 of Clubs, 10 of Hearts, 8 of Diamonds

** Dealing the turn: 10 of Diamonds

** Dealing the river: 2 of Clubs
Kheldar wins $3030.00 from the main pot

End of game 661746538

citizen sane
11-01-2007, 11:03 AM
Went out in 11th in this tourny as well last night , which was a bit annoying , I had Wildrick sitting to my right for ages in this which was nice because he never tried to steal my blinds and no one tried stealing his . Also Salmonysta ( sp ) was on the same table for ages .


** Game ID 662041137 starting - 2007-01-10 23:56:52
** $2000 GTD $5 NLHE 2nd Chance PLUS[1137719]:Table 21 [Multi Table Hold 'em] (8000.00|16000.00 No Limit - MTT) Real Money

- banksoir sitting in seat 2 with $119710.10
- niloc sitting in seat 3 with $55804.96
- CroPro sitting in seat 6 with $45988.36
- yipster sitting in seat 7 with $51895.76
- spizz80 sitting in seat 9 with $28070.50 [Dealer]

banksoir posted the small blind - $4000.00
niloc posted the big blind - $8000.00

** Dealing card to spizz80: Ace of Spades, King of Diamonds
CroPro went all-in - $45988.36
yipster folded
spizz80 went all-in - $28070.50
banksoir folded
niloc folded
CroPro shows: 5 of Spades, 5 of Hearts

** Dealing the flop: 8 of Hearts, 4 of Diamonds, 6 of Clubs

** Dealing the turn: 7 of Diamonds

** Dealing the river: 4 of Spades
CroPro wins $68141.00 from the main pot

End of game 662041137

DANCOO
11-01-2007, 11:32 AM
Originally posted by citizen sane
Went out in 11th in this tourny as well last night , which was a bit annoying , I had Wildrick sitting to my right for ages in this which was nice because he never tried to steal my blinds and no one tried stealing his . Also Salmonysta ( sp ) was on the same table for ages .


** Game ID 662041137 starting - 2007-01-10 23:56:52
** $2000 GTD $5 NLHE 2nd Chance PLUS[1137719]:Table 21 [Multi Table Hold 'em] (8000.00|16000.00 No Limit - MTT) Real Money

- banksoir sitting in seat 2 with $119710.10
- niloc sitting in seat 3 with $55804.96
- CroPro sitting in seat 6 with $45988.36
- yipster sitting in seat 7 with $51895.76
- spizz80 sitting in seat 9 with $28070.50 [Dealer]



banksoir is a very good player also, and yes, wildrick is megatight.

citizen sane
11-01-2007, 12:05 PM
Originally posted by DANCOO
banksoir is a very good player also, and yes, wildrick is megatight.

Never come across Banksoir before , but yes , a tough player . Played his big stack very well .

Wildrick I've played with a few times now , unbelievably tight player .

Scanna is another very good player I've been on the same table with a few times recently . Very hard to read . He run me down once when we both had KK and he hit a flush :(

KevTheOptimist
11-01-2007, 01:58 PM
I really want to get a big cash from an MTT online soon. I've cashed and won a fair few $5 but the minute I step up to a $25 or bigger MTT I can't get anywhere.

I have played badly on a few and made some bad calls on a few but more often than not I luck out when its crapshoot time.

I'd be interested to know peoples strategies in terms of chip stacks for high placings - I don't set any targets and just play and see what happens but I now think it is very important to get a decent stack size early doors to avoid an early crapshoot. So my normal game is to play tight and then loosen where now I'm thinking it may be better to set a double stack size every say 3 levels? What do you think?

This may mean being very aggressive and potentially reckless at times but I always seem to lose to these type of players so maybne that is the technique

citizen sane
12-01-2007, 08:55 AM
Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
I really want to get a big cash from an MTT online soon. I've cashed and won a fair few $5 but the minute I step up to a $25 or bigger MTT I can't get anywhere.

I'd be interested to know peoples strategies in terms of chip stacks for high placings - I don't set any targets and just play and see what happens but I now think it is very important to get a decent stack size early doors to avoid an early crapshoot. So my normal game is to play tight and then loosen where now I'm thinking it may be better to set a double stack size every say 3 levels? What do you think

I don't bother setting chip stack targets in tournies .I just go with the flow generally and adapt my strategy accordingly .

There are a few things I do to acculumate chips along the way even if I'm not getting the cards but generally I'll play a tight-aggressive style with a few changes in gear along the way to mix things up a bit .

PoolKing
12-01-2007, 09:10 AM
Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
I'd be interested to know peoples strategies in terms of chip stacks for high placings - I don't set any targets and just play and see what happens but I now think it is very important to get a decent stack size early doors to avoid an early crapshoot. So my normal game is to play tight and then loosen where now I'm thinking it may be better to set a double stack size every say 3 levels? What do you think?

This may mean being very aggressive and potentially reckless at times but I always seem to lose to these type of players so maybne that is the technique

I find it is better to be tight during the first hour of a tournament and loosen up as the blinds get bigger and stealing becomes more viable. You also say that you are 'potentially reckless' at times so cut this out of your game, of course every player has their own style and you will see in the early stages of tournaments a high number of hyperaggressive players constantly pushing in their chips and hitting the cards but once you get nearer to the final table you will find most of the players there to be tight and aggressive.

In terms of setting chip targets, I don't really see any need to do this. Just be patient and do not panic, the thing to keep an eye on is the average chip stack. If at anytime in a tournament I am equal or above the average stack then I feel I am in a well placed position, even with half the average stack you don't have to panic as one double-up will put you in a good position.

KevTheOptimist
12-01-2007, 11:30 AM
Funny, in Negreanu's recent article on the gutshot website he says that he takes no notice of the average chip stack as it is the ratio of your stack vrs the blinds which dictate how he plays.

I think this is fine when entering deep stacked tournies with like 10k starting chips because the blinds by relation aren't as big but when you start with 1000 or 1500 then I think you are right that it is important to be in line with the average.

Strathclyde Eagle
12-01-2007, 08:17 PM
Average chip stack can be deceiving. In one of those $1 45 player MTTs on Poker Stars recently I was below the average stack size and yet I was third out of about seven or eight players left at the time.

What I find is worse is if you have a massive chip stack immediately to your left. It just about leaves you with no room for error whatsoever.

KevTheOptimist
12-01-2007, 08:27 PM
One dissappointing thing about laddies is that they do not have too many shorthanded tournies.

I do far better 6 handed than 10 handed

Strathclyde Eagle
12-01-2007, 09:44 PM
Just what you want when you're starting a tournament, Chris Kamara at your table.

KevTheOptimist
12-01-2007, 10:20 PM
Poker office is a bad omen.

Hence I have stopped using it!

KevTheOptimist
13-01-2007, 02:07 AM
My luck continues. Was about to go 1/20 in a $20 MTT and this happens:

** Game ID 663702748 starting - 2007-01-13 01:55:04
** $20 Quick Blinds NLHE Freezeout[1137994]:Table 2 [Multi Table Hold 'em] (1000.00|2000.00 No Limit - MTT) Real Money

- scoopar sitting in seat 2 with $4965.02
- bins sitting in seat 4 with $10742.52
- xxghostiexx sitting in seat 6 with $15567.02
- dw48 sitting in seat 7 with $3377.52 [Dealer]
- bubbled sitting in seat 8 with $26770.88
- bobmonkey sitting in seat 9 with $670.64
- KanAbyss sitting in seat 10 with $11740.00

bubbled posted the small blind - $500.00
bobmonkey posted the big blind - $1000.00

** Dealing card to KanAbyss: Queen of Clubs, King of Spades
KanAbyss called - $1000.00
scoopar folded
bins folded
xxghostiexx called - $1000.00
dw48 folded
bubbled called - $1000.00
bobmonkey checked

** Dealing the flop: Queen of Spades, King of Clubs, 4 of Diamonds
bubbled checked
bobmonkey checked
KanAbyss bet - $1000.00
xxghostiexx folded
bubbled called - $1000.00
bobmonkey folded

** Dealing the turn: Ace of Hearts
bubbled bet - $1000.00
KanAbyss raised - $2000.00
bubbled went all-in - $24270.88
KanAbyss went all-in - $7740.00
bubbled shows: 5 of Clubs, Ace of Spades

** Dealing the river: 4 of Spades
bubbled wins $25480.00 from the main pot