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oz_da II
30-03-2007, 11:54 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
Is there anyone who can put hands through a hand checker program so I don't have to keep writing this down.

Join up with http://www.pokerhand.org/

se1eagle
31-03-2007, 02:38 AM
Originally posted by saul1664
why is he calling 12 x BB on a 4 outer. Only when he reraised did I think 10 A and then couldn't quite believe it and called the extra $6 as pot committed.


IMVHO I don't think you bet enough on the flop and turn. He called without the right odds but still your bets were actually not giving him terrible odds for a loose player in a big pot! He limped into the pot preflop, then called a large bet out of position and then was committed enough to call a reraise so he's definitely loose - he probably committed more of his chips preflop than he would have liked and tried to find justifications to stay in the pot.

On the flop he called $1.20 into a $12.50 pot - that's odds of 10.4-1 which is close enough to the 10.8-1 needed purely to catch an inside straight draw.

On the turn he called $2.40 into a $14.90 pot - that's odds of 6.2-1. He probably talked himself into believing that his Ace might be good if it hit - if he assumes he wins with an Ace or a Queen then he'd be about 6.5-1 to win the pot which is roughly the odds your bet gave him.

DANCOO
31-03-2007, 08:22 AM
Originally posted by saul1664

Am I looking to push all in on turn, it's a non-threatening board for me, unless he has trip Kings, never saw 10 A, and why is he calling 12 x BB on a 4 outer. Only when he reraised did I think 10 A and then couldn't quite believe it and called the extra $6 as pot committed.


Although it is a lot easier to do in hindisight, I 'think' the correct play should be to raise him on the flop, not flat call, then maybe look to push on the turn.

saul1664
31-03-2007, 08:23 AM
Originally posted by se1eagle
IMVHO I don't think you bet enough on the flop and turn. He called without the right odds but still your bets were actually not giving him terrible odds for a loose player in a big pot! He limped into the pot preflop, then called a large bet out of position and then was committed enough to call a reraise so he's definitely loose - he probably committed more of his chips preflop than he would have liked and tried to find justifications to stay in the pot.

On the flop he called $1.20 into a $12.50 pot - that's odds of 10.4-1 which is close enough to the 10.8-1 needed purely to catch an inside straight draw.

On the turn he called $2.40 into a $14.90 pot - that's odds of 6.2-1. He probably talked himself into believing that his Ace might be good if it hit - if he assumes he wins with an Ace or a Queen then he'd be about 6.5-1 to win the pot which is roughly the odds your bet gave him.

Thanks. He hadn't played loose all game, in fact it was a fairly tight table. To be fair I'm betting to keep him in the pot on the flop as (rightly) I think I am a long way ahead. I should have made it a much more difficult decision on the turn, because if he doesn't hit on the river anyway, he's going to fold to any bet.

saul1664
31-03-2007, 10:24 AM
Originally posted by oz_da II
Join up with http://www.pokerhand.org/

Don't think I can use this. Can't copy and paste hand history from poker client. Won't highlight text and right clicking doesnt work. Unless I can print the screen?

saul1664
31-03-2007, 10:40 AM
Shame as I wanted to post this hand. Anyway simple enough here. This has to be the worst play of Aces ever known to man.

Just me and one other person in the hand. I am BB, everyone folds pre flop before me, so I check with 99. Player with AA flat calls 0.20

Flop is non-threatening (can't remember exactly what it was) but doesn't stand up to a big raise with me holding 99. Aces are first to act. He flat calls 0.20$

Turn is 9

He then decides to try and win the pot, raises $2.60. I put him all in for his stack ($11). He calls, and to rub it in river is 9 for quads.

SamTheOldGoat
31-03-2007, 07:29 PM
Away on hols boarding and got wi-fi where I'm staying. Going to play for the first time in ages. 20x $109 SNG's. Will report back on whether my time away/studying is paying off.

How's everyone doing at the tables?

Se1? Strath? PoolK? Dan? Oz? David?

se1eagle
01-04-2007, 02:05 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
How's everyone doing at the tables?


It's been pretty good recently - my play is improving enormously, mainly due to watching a lot of videos from Card Runners (lots of videos of very well explained online play by people like Taylor Caby and Brian Townsend). I'm going to sign up for a full account there as it's brilliant.

I decided to stop playing long-handed tables, and start playing 6-seaters which I used to hate. I moved down a couple of levels to 0.05/0.10 and tried loosening up and playing more hands aggressively in position - after a few teething problems getting used to a new style, it's really been paying dividends!

Now I'm more confident being aggressive I've moved up to 0.10/0.25 and my bankroll is now up to $890 which is a new high for me. :lux: :D

It's been a real learning experience - I'm not going near my previous level of 0.25/0.50 until I've got a much bigger bankroll - playing short-handed really makes you realise how important good bankroll management is.

The main improvements to my game are that I'm betting more and calling less, I'm picking up more blinds than I used to, and most importantly I'm now much happier to lay down a good hand because I'm playing more hands and by definition have to fold more.

DANCOO
01-04-2007, 02:52 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat

How's everyone doing at the tables?


Hello mate.

Not doing a lot really myself. I haven't been able to commit to playing decent long sessions, so I find myslef logging on for an hour here, and an hour there, and it doesn't really work.

Signed up with a couple more poker rooms to see what their action is like aswell.

You playing your 20 sng's on PS?

budgie
01-04-2007, 03:02 PM
For everyone who complains of bad beats, I wasn't involved in this one, but even I felt the pain.

http://www.pokerhand.org/?956463

DANCOO
01-04-2007, 03:42 PM
Originally posted by budgie
For everyone who complains of bad beats, I wasn't involved in this one, but even I felt the pain.

http://www.pokerhand.org/?956463

Pretty sick.

Didn't realise you played big limits budgie.

se1eagle
01-04-2007, 04:04 PM
Originally posted by DANCOO
Pretty sick.

Didn't realise you played big limits budgie.

Hehe I thought that at first but it's a $5 tourney and the chips are displayed as cash

DANCOO
01-04-2007, 04:14 PM
Originally posted by se1eagle
Hehe I thought that at first but it's a $5 tourney and the chips are displayed as cash

Oh yeah. :clown:

budgie
01-04-2007, 09:10 PM
Originally posted by DANCOO
Pretty sick.

Didn't realise you played big limits budgie.

I wish. :D

SamTheOldGoat
01-04-2007, 11:14 PM
Originally posted by DANCOO
Hello mate.

Not doing a lot really myself. I haven't been able to commit to playing decent long sessions, so I find myslef logging on for an hour here, and an hour there, and it doesn't really work.

Signed up with a couple more poker rooms to see what their action is like aswell.

You playing your 20 sng's on PS?

Yer, only played 13 or so and over $1k+ which is pretty good and the plays been good. Been playing them with my brother so used both our brains and out of those 13, we have bubbled 4. These are $109 TURBOS so the blinds get a bit savage at the end but will keep working on it while I'm away.

Congrats SE1, that's really good work and the rolls building nicely. Cardrunners have some great stuff and green plastic, sbrugby etc are the best in the game! Defo recommend you sign up to it OR PokerXFactor :)

Check this for a sick flop earlier on HU for nearly $500. I'm /-/4rris

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v16/mymarktwogolf/SF.jpg

Gav The Hamster
03-04-2007, 12:54 AM
rarely post in this thread any more but have to give the thumbs up to AA !! So often a bogey hand its done me proud the last 2 times I have had it...

AA on a 666 flop - he eventually puts me all in with AK for $320 pot

AA on a Q 9 6 flop - he had Q9 - all in - hit the A on turn for $200 pot

:)

for those on laddies they have a basically free $50 offer, cant go wrong.

RichieG
03-04-2007, 07:51 AM
Is that their "Bankroll Booster" promotion? I thought that was free $25 if you put in $50 and then play enough cash to get 100 player points?

Good deal, I've done it the last 2 months, even though I normally play only tourneys, it's a nice change to play a bit of cash every now and then. Are they running it again for April?

Strathclyde Eagle
03-04-2007, 08:46 AM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
Away on hols boarding and got wi-fi where I'm staying. Going to play for the first time in ages. 20x $109 SNG's. Will report back on whether my time away/studying is paying off.

How's everyone doing at the tables?

Se1? Strath? PoolK? Dan? Oz? David?
Not been playing much lately. Had a quick game last night and saw my tens full beaten by the only hand that could have realistically beaten me (although to be fair I was only winning on the flop, behind to pocket Queens pre-flop and from the turn onwards).

Won a hand where I accidentally called instead of folded 9-5os UTG. :clown:

Gav The Hamster
03-04-2007, 09:49 AM
Originally posted by RichieG
Is that their "Bankroll Booster" promotion? I thought that was free $25 if you put in $50 and then play enough cash to get 100 player points?

Good deal, I've done it the last 2 months, even though I normally play only tourneys, it's a nice change to play a bit of cash every now and then. Are they running it again for April?

it is the bankroll booster and this month its $50 and takes literally an hour to get the necessary bonus.

SamTheOldGoat
03-04-2007, 03:53 PM
Up to $1.6k profit in about 25 games. I swear $109 sng's are THE easiest game on Stars

Gav The Hamster
04-04-2007, 12:13 AM
and again !! he reckons he had 74 lol

** Game ID 722435064 starting - 2007-04-04 01:09:14
** Orchard Beach [Hold 'em] (1.00|2.00 No Limit - Cash Game) Real Money

- Ellomallo sitting in seat 1 with $260.30
- Kallllle sitting in seat 2 with $226.35
- Tolbod sitting in seat 3 with $165.90
- jimmymoondus sitting in seat 4 with $423.47 [Dealer]
- oldman_100 sitting in seat 6 with $163.85

oldman_100 posted the small blind - $1.00
Ellomallo posted the big blind - $2.00

** Dealing card to oldman_100: Ace of Spades, Ace of Hearts
Kallllle folded
Tolbod called - $2.00
jimmymoondus raised - $4.00
oldman_100 raised - $15.00
Ellomallo folded
Tolbod folded
jimmymoondus called - $15.00

** Dealing the flop: 4 of Hearts, 3 of Hearts, 7 of Diamonds
oldman_100 bet - $34.00
jimmymoondus went all-in - $408.47
oldman_100 went all-in - $115.85

** Dealing the turn: Jack of Diamonds

** Dealing the river: Jack of Hearts
oldman_100 shows: Ace of Spades, Ace of Hearts
jimmymoondus mucks:
oldman_100 wins $331.70 from the main pot

End of game 722435064

oz_da II
04-04-2007, 12:36 AM
Originally posted by Gav The Hamster
and again !! he reckons he had 74 lol


Note to self: Find a table with jimmymoondus on it. :clown:

saul1664
04-04-2007, 12:45 PM
Fed up with having Kings cracked, have lost the last five. First two in cash games, got called all in by small stack (he only had $6 so it was a no brainer), turns over AA. Again I get KK and raise 4 x BB from early position, an A hits the board, and I fold to a significant raise from mid position, he wins with 56, five paired on board. And again in tournament, I have them in mid position, raise to about half my stack, get called all in, he had aces.

Have you got to assume that when you get raised with Kings that someone is almost certainly got Aces. Doyle Brunson says that you should never let them go unless you are sure that your opponent has aces, or they have an Ace if one comes on the board, but obviously it's harder to tell online. Is it just a case of getting as much money on your premium hands as you can and clean up in the long run.

After all people do tend to call in with anything. AA got cracked by 99 when he made unlikely straight on the river, after call my reraise all in for all his stack in a cash game, and have gone out of a sit and go, when player to my right pushed all in with a pair of threes which dominated my Queens with a 3 on the flop.

Every time I have come up against Aces with Kings, an Ace has come on the board as well.

Gav The Hamster
04-04-2007, 01:24 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
Have you got to assume that when you get raised with Kings that someone is almost certainly got Aces. Doyle Brunson says that you should never let them go unless you are sure that your opponent has aces, or they have an Ace if one comes on the board, but obviously it's harder to tell online. Is it just a case of getting as much money on your premium hands as you can and clean up in the long run.

If you raise big with KK then generally you can narrow down the hands that the remaining players have.

They dont always necessarily have the A which is why if an A hits the flop i will tend to bet the pot size. If i get called or raised and there is no real draw out there, then you fold otherwise you take down the pot there and then.

SamTheOldGoat
05-04-2007, 04:03 PM
I'm never passing Kings in a cash game or SNG online or live, but possibly will in tournaments both live and online if there's significant action before me and we are bubbling etc.

$3k up from 35 games, mainly 110sngs and 210sngs. It's a nice profitable holiday when I get in from the slopes before the beers!

Strathclyde Eagle
05-04-2007, 11:04 PM
Had a quick SNG before dinner. Nothing like Sam's standards. ;)

Anyway, 5-player table. One player went out first hand, but the rest of us were pretty equal, until I got lucky with the last three hands.

First of them, dealt KK. Blinds at 160/320, I've got 1400 and am UTG. I've got the big blind covered and he's been pretty aggressive, so I go all-in. He calls with A8os. The inevitable ace doesn't come.

Next hand, I'm in the small blind with J9os. Big blind is all-in so myself and the other player call and start checking down. Jack high flop, plus another jack on the river.

Final hand, get dealt 82os. It's heads-up and generally I'll see a cheap flop with any two cards. Flop comes K88 rainbow. I check behind him. An ace comes on the turn and he chooses to represent it by going all-in. I call and he only has J5.

Nice to get favourable flops when the blinds are that high. :)

knowlesyUCLA
06-04-2007, 08:09 PM
played in $10 live tournie last night, got accused of sucking out by one cock.

raised 4 x BB preflop with K J clubs, one caller. flop comes two clubs and a low red card, all of them were 9 or less. i bet he reraises me all in, i call and he turns over pocket queens, one of which was a club. turn was red 10, river was 2 clubs to make king high flush.

he wasnt that pissed but this other dude thought i was a donkey for calling. he busted out 4 hands later. i thought i was in decent shape, flush draw and an overcard, i mean i thought he had a high pair so perhaps was a loose call but i knew i had outs regardless of what he had.

thoughts anyone?

DANCOO
06-04-2007, 08:12 PM
Stacks, position, blinds...

Strathclyde Eagle
06-04-2007, 08:36 PM
Sounds like fair play for both of you. His re-raise is the right play, it's then a matter as to whether or not you're getting the right odds to call.

saul1664
06-04-2007, 11:26 PM
Originally posted by knowlesyUCLA
played in $10 live tournie last night, got accused of sucking out by one cock.

raised 4 x BB preflop with K J clubs, one caller. flop comes two clubs and a low red card, all of them were 9 or less. i bet he reraises me all in, i call and he turns over pocket queens, one of which was a club. turn was red 10, river was 2 clubs to make king high flush.

he wasnt that pissed but this other dude thought i was a donkey for calling. he busted out 4 hands later. i thought i was in decent shape, flush draw and an overcard, i mean i thought he had a high pair so perhaps was a loose call but i knew i had outs regardless of what he had.

thoughts anyone?

I hate this happening to me as well. Blinds 30/60, I get dealt pocket queens, raise before me of 240, I re-raise 800, everyone else folds, flop comes J 8 4 (2 spades). He has equivalent stack to me. He puts me all in so I call, he turns over K10 of spades, and the ubiquitous spade comes on the river and knocks me out. He doesn't have anything on the flop at all (wouldn't mind if he was represented by at least a pair), but this kind of play drives me mad (although I am sure we have all done it at some stage). Always seems to happen when I have a premium hand as well QQ KK mostly. The only advantage over it against a straight draw is that you have more outs. Can you print the hand?

saul1664
07-04-2007, 12:01 AM
Now this is a bad beat. Limit Hold Em. Blinds 4000/8000. Was doing ok but had been gradually getting stack whittled down and I have 9000 chips. Am on BB, get dealt 44, everyone folds in front of me, I raise to 8000, guy calls beside me and puts me all in for my remaining chips. He turns over 4Q.

Flop no help.

Turn Q.

I have one card out.

River 4.

Five hands later I am up to $73,000. Unfortunately I play a bit loose after and go out in 10th, when QK runs into J7 flush. Just realised I played 4 hours and 58 minutes to win $9.79.

SamTheOldGoat
07-04-2007, 07:31 AM
Knowlsey, your mate with QQ should have re-raised on PF, however your call with the flush draw is obviously going to lose the majority of the time, nh though ;0

se1eagle
08-04-2007, 01:09 AM
If I ever moan about variance again, do please give me a slap. I have had the most wonderful run of success in the last 2000 hands, it's hard for me to tell how exactly much is down to luck and how much is down to the improvements in my game since studying CR videos and becoming more aggressive, but my bankroll is now at $1330 - it was at a new high at $890 on 01/04 - since then my average is an incredible 34 BB/100 hands. The best bit is this is all from 0.25NL and 0.50NL cash games, and I honestly don't think I've sucked out on anyone once! It's so exciting!

On the flipside, I seem to be absolutely pants at tournaments - I can see why people call them donkaments! For now I'm going to keep going with the cash tables and dream about the WSOP at a later date!

Oh and I also read there's going to be the first European WSOP tournament held in London later this year with a £10,000 entry fee (yikes!). Might be fun to go along and railbird...

saul1664
08-04-2007, 02:41 AM
AA just been cracked by 36 offsuit.

Reps AJ
08-04-2007, 05:33 PM
Cold cold cards all day, absolutely no decent cards then 2 back to back hands have turned my day into profit... I get QQ and hits trips on the flop and thankfully someone calls my all-in and then I have a pair of 2s which give me a full house on the turn but someone was slow playing trips and put me all-in so I gladly took all their money

David Amsalem
08-04-2007, 05:45 PM
Originally posted by oz_da II
Note to self: Find a table with jimmymoondus on it. :clown:

You joke, but it is actually a very interesting point.

Since I've been playing cash tables, I can't go onto a table without having notes on somebody. I've actually followed a few poor players around, and taken their money on numerous occasions now.

oz_da II
08-04-2007, 06:03 PM
Originally posted by David Amsalem
You joke, but it is actually a very interesting point.

Since I've been playing cash tables, I can't go onto a table without having notes on somebody. I've actually followed a few poor players around, and taken their money on numerous occasions now.

I'm not joking, I do the exact same.
One of the most important, quite possibly the most important (once you get the basic fundamentals), in online poker is table selection and position. I never just plop myself down on any table. I fish hunt first.

David Amsalem
08-04-2007, 06:42 PM
Fancy giving the ladders a go tonight, quick question to anybody who has played before on Laddies, I want to start on Level 1, $3.30 table, you get the opportunity to win ten tokens, (entry to the next level) - is it possible to keep playing the $3 table to earn enough tokens for the last stage?

I only ask as I've just viewed one and it appears to be a low standard.

Reps AJ
08-04-2007, 06:50 PM
Originally posted by David Amsalem
Fancy giving the ladders a go tonight, quick question to anybody who has played before on Laddies, I want to start on Level 1, $3.30 table, you get the opportunity to win ten tokens, (entry to the next level) - is it possible to keep playing the $3 table to earn enough tokens for the last stage?

I only ask as I've just viewed one and it appears to be a low standard.

When I played the ladders (can't remember if it was Laddies or Bet365) you won a token to the next level so you couldn't save them up and skip all the levels

se1eagle
08-04-2007, 09:31 PM
Originally posted by David Amsalem
Fancy giving the ladders a go tonight, quick question to anybody who has played before on Laddies, I want to start on Level 1, $3.30 table, you get the opportunity to win ten tokens, (entry to the next level) - is it possible to keep playing the $3 table to earn enough tokens for the last stage?

I only ask as I've just viewed one and it appears to be a low standard.

The first $3 level cannot be entered with tokens. If you win level 2 or 3, you can use the tokens you win to replay that level, but level 1 has to be bought into.

David Amsalem
10-04-2007, 05:38 PM
Cheers lads, that is actually what I meant to say, thanks for confirming.

oz_da II
11-04-2007, 05:32 PM
A lot of buffoonery on the tables tonight. Tonight I won two 20+ BB pots with nothing more than ace-high on two seperate tables.

Found I was folding far too many rivers a while ago, in limit all you have to do is win about 1 in 10 calls to produce a profit (depending on the size of the pots, obviously). If I'm heads-up with a half-decent pot I will never fold one bet with anything less than ace-high. It's proving to be quite profitable.

Micky Spilane
11-04-2007, 08:01 PM
Originally posted by David Amsalem
Fancy giving the ladders a go tonight, quick question to anybody who has played before on Laddies, I want to start on Level 1, $3.30 table, you get the opportunity to win ten tokens, (entry to the next level) - is it possible to keep playing the $3 table to earn enough tokens for the last stage?

I only ask as I've just viewed one and it appears to be a low standard.

Not sure if you can save them up, but, I have in the past had two lots of 10 tokens used one lot on the $10 level where I got to the $30 level before crashing out then used my other 10 to go into another $10. So If you want to try it why not earn 30 tokens and then try to enter the $30 level, if it doensn't let you at least you have three entries to the $10 tables. I might give this a try myself later this evening, if I do I will let you know the result, I think it may work because in reality the tokens are the equivalent of paying cash to enter the table.

P.S. You are correct about the standard, if it works I would estimate that it would probably take me about 12 games ($36.60) to get enough tokens to enter the top table, mind you be prepared to be bored for a long time, also the standard on the $30 tables is of a much higher standard, I would imagine better players often go fishing at the higher end of ladder tourneys.

SamTheOldGoat
11-04-2007, 10:36 PM
Fifth last night in Rendezvous £20R for £240 or so, not bad and got caught shoving from SB with 44 and ran into QQ in the BB, gg me.....

Don't suppose anyone fancies £220 F/O at Big Slick on Saturday do they, should be a full house of 120 and a LARGE prize pool

RichieG
12-04-2007, 07:53 AM
£220 a bit big for me, but I'll be at the Rendezvous on Friday playing the £10R.

What's the £20R like Sam, do you get as many maniacs who are happy to spend £100, all in with J7 in the rebuy period etc? How much were you in for?

Also, what's your strategy for the re-buy period? I tend to keep it TAG, which usually involves waiting for a premium holding and ending up AI by the flop if not before.

SamTheOldGoat
12-04-2007, 01:44 PM
The £20R was a good tournament and a good structure with 25 min clock, 1500 starting stack. Normally Tues night is the best tourny of hte week with 80+ runners but when I played 2 nights ago there were only 45.

There are some fools playing poorly but in general, I was pretty impressed with my table. I like to build up chips and will raise in position after second level nearly every hand regardless and steal all over the place. I like to go in after the break with around 7k worth of chips ready for the 100/200 level when those that are on 2k chips start to get desperate with a low M and can be bullied. I will call raises with suited connectors from the loose players on the table and reraise and raises with premium cards as the raises on the table often come from mid suited connectors and low pairs from what I've experienced. I will stick my money in with a good draw, i.e. 2 overs and a high F.D in the rebuy stages in the hope of building my stack.

That's just how I play and it's pretty successfull, I will come play the £10r when I'm back in Brighton and we can meet up then Richie :)

Reps AJ
12-04-2007, 05:52 PM
Originally posted by Micky Spilane
P.S. You are correct about the standard, if it works I would estimate that it would probably take me about 12 games ($36.60) to get enough tokens to enter the top table, mind you be prepared to be bored for a long time, also the standard on the $30 tables is of a much higher standard, I would imagine better players often go fishing at the higher end of ladder tourneys.

It is also possible to get it to pay - I've managed it! Its on here somewhere many, many pages back, came in 2nd for $1200 although think it was on Bet365. There were some guys buying straight into the final table for $500+$50

David Amsalem
12-04-2007, 06:15 PM
Good words Micky, when I get an afternoon to play some, gonna give it a go.

Recently, I've lost a few games because I'm playing for the sake of it rather then because I want too. Anybody else guilty of this?

Funk Butter
12-04-2007, 06:19 PM
Horrible week for me so far. Can't draw to any hands, can't make my sets, when I do have a Full House, I get beat by quads. Flop the nut straight, then my hole cards get hit with runner-runner for a higher straight. Awful stuff.

On the opposite end, my fiance just started playing last week. I set her up with $50 on Poker Stars and let her at them. She's just playing the 45 person $1 SnG or the $4.40 180 person SnG. Well, she started off bad, just playing bad, so I gave her some tips to get the rough edges out. She seems to have taken my advice. In her last 5 SnGs, she's cashed 4 times, including a win, a second and a third. At least one of us is making money.

se1eagle
12-04-2007, 06:39 PM
Originally posted by Funk Butter
Horrible week for me so far. Can't draw to any hands, can't make my sets, when I do have a Full House, I get beat by quads. Flop the nut straight, then my hole cards get hit with runner-runner for a higher straight. Awful stuff.


It is incredible the way good/bad luck happens in runs - after my amazing run the previous weeks, I'm now experiencing similar hands to yours above. Just gotta keep chilled, keep playing well and wait for the good times to return - as hard as it may be...

SamTheOldGoat
12-04-2007, 09:53 PM
New account set up, and I'm quite fond of the name.......

NiceHitFish©

Seems to have wound people up already! :D

oz_da II
13-04-2007, 04:33 AM
Been analyzing my play today, off ill from work.

Bankroll increasing at a nice rate but I've been amazed at the happenings at the two sites I play most of my poker at.

One site I'm cruising, seems so easy and I double up my buy-in in no time at all (limit). The other site over the past month I can't seem to have any success. It's been a lot of clowns hitting lucky rivers. Premium hands losing out because every man and his dog calling my raise and someone hitting something. Worst bit of variance I've ever experienced. I multi-table (3-4) between the two sites at the same time. My stats (VPIP, Pre-flop raise, agg factor) between the two sites are near on identical. Players seem equally shit... And I know who to target on both sites.

Bet365: 13800 hands -0.1BB/100 (went under last night)
TitanPoker: 9000 hands 9.63BB/100

I'm sure it will change, loving Titan at the moment, really disliking bet365...

se1eagle
13-04-2007, 09:27 AM
Bet365 and Ladbrokes seem to have a preponderance of Scandis... I hate getting muffed out so I try and avoid both these sites

Reps AJ
14-04-2007, 06:52 AM
Playing a cash game and everybody limps in to me in BB holding Q7 so I check. Flop comes 777 :D Fortunately someone has an over pair and I manage to get all his chips in the middle :lux:

saul1664
14-04-2007, 09:40 PM
Never seem to win when I am short stacked and push all in.

1,400 chips, blinds 200/400

I push all in with A7 from mid position, BB calls with 48 and hits 4 on the river, yet when other players do it they tend to catch.

Earlier this guy pushes all in,

board comes up J Q K A 8

he flips over 22, his two other all in callers have 45 and 78, what are the odds on that

se1eagle
15-04-2007, 11:49 AM
Poker doctor help required!! Since my last post where everything was going swimmingly, I'm now hugely down in just one week. I cannot bring myself to play any more - my bankroll nudged $1500 last week, now it's down to $996 which is a psychological blow to me.

I know this will look like a bad beat post, but I genuinely need some advice on how I should have played these hands differently... Right now I just feel like giving up poker and would really appreciate some help from my betters.

Top two pair (A9) cracked by trip 5s ($98.85)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000037

Top pair cracked by trip 5s on river ($53.45)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000059

Straight cracked by overstraight on river, prob shouldn't have paid him off on the river but could have been a bluff ($18.60)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000025

Two pair cracked by board pairing, don't think I did much wrong here but please correct me if I did ($43.65)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000027

Draws all way to flush and I stupidly pay him off on river ($47)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000029

Top pair cracked by flush - don't think I did anything wrong here but please correct me if I did ($92.45)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000032

Aces cracked by 7-2 - don't think I did much wrong here ($41.30)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000034

Straight cracked by full house on turn - prob should have backed off when ace came on turn ($71.05)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000040

Aces cracked by trips on flop, I think I overplayed them ($42)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000072

DANCOO
15-04-2007, 12:20 PM
A very brief opinion.

Hand 1. Nothing you can do about that, especially when a club comes on the turn, unlucky. Played it fine though.

Hand 2. Check/fold on the river, so many hands have you beat there.

Hand 3. I probably pay him off aswell, once again played fine IMO.

Hand 4. Again, played it fine, got unlucky.

Hand 5. Same as Hand 2 - check/fold, don't think I would call an all-in with just a weak AA.

Hand 6. As long as you have a good read on your opponent, it was very unlucky and you made a good turn call.

Hand 7. Nothing wrong with that - you're never folding to a small all-in push on the turn, unlucky again.

Hand 8. Definately just call the raise on the turn. When the river comes out, depending on what your opponent does, you are probably playing for a split pot at best.

Hand 9. The sort of hand where you know you are probably beat, but difficult to lay down. I would probably make the incorrect play and call this maybe 80% of the time.

Reps AJ
15-04-2007, 12:42 PM
Just absolutely rivered some bloke by hitting the nut flush on the river to crack his his pocket AA and took all his cash :D

It was probably terrible play from me but he really annoyed me earlier when his 88 cracked my AK (A on the flop, 8 on the turn)

Tilt is your friend :lux:

oz_da II
15-04-2007, 02:33 PM
Originally posted by se1eagle
Poker doctor help required!! Since my last post where everything was going swimmingly, I'm now hugely down in just one week. I cannot bring myself to play any more - my bankroll nudged $1500 last week, now it's down to $996 which is a psychological blow to me.

I know this will look like a bad beat post, but I genuinely need some advice on how I should have played these hands differently... Right now I just feel like giving up poker and would really appreciate some help from my betters.


Better get out now if you get upset with the lows of poker...

se1eagle
15-04-2007, 03:17 PM
Originally posted by DANCOO
A very brief opinion.


Thanks Dan - very helpful to have an outsider's view of how I played those!

SamTheOldGoat
15-04-2007, 06:09 PM
Will have a look after dinner.

Harris junior took 4th in £220 F/O at Big Slicks last night for £1600, when his 10 10 lost a 'semi-race' to K4, K on the turn. They then all did a deal and took £3k each, my brother wasn't happy :D

Micky Spilane
15-04-2007, 10:20 PM
Originally posted by David Amsalem
Good words Micky, when I get an afternoon to play some, gonna give it a go.

Recently, I've lost a few games because I'm playing for the sake of it rather then because I want too. Anybody else guilty of this?

Yes me this last week, hit my profit target of winning enough to buy myself a laptop, since then my play has become rather loose, think I need to set myself a new goal rather than just play.

RichieG
16-04-2007, 08:29 AM
Had a fairly poor night at the Rendezvous on Friday, managed to do £60 in the £10R tourney, my table was impossible to play normally in the re-buy stage with any bet being raised all-in by people playing junk (and hitting, of course). Made it to the freezeout with 3k in chips to show for my money! Managed to double up fairly quickly with pocket 9s, before my all-in with 77 on a board of 5 4 2 (2 diamonds) was called by AJd which duly hit 8d on the turn for the nut flush.

Crazy tourney, and I find the structure a bit quick, but I'll be back for more as it's always a good night out and a chance to play some poker away from the PC.

SamTheOldGoat
16-04-2007, 09:22 AM
1. Was the 3xpot bet on flop to remove drawers? I think as soon as that bets called it's worth slowing down a little. I'm not sure about FTP but would someone really call 12 more or so to hit a spade? Was a shame though with outs for the riv.

2.Agree with Dan.

3. Nothing wrong and I think I probably make the call, it's $4 into $12 I think, although he's called your bets on Flop and Turn which to me indicates he doesn't have a made hand and is drawing.

4. Done nothing wrong, got unlucky

5. Agree with Dan again, check fold as your beating nearly nothing.

6. Again agree with Dan, your opponent drawing pretty damn thin and gets lucky, UL

7. You asked the question with the reraise on the flop and he still called. Never passing for waht it's worth on the turn, just unfortunate.

8 and 9 won't open in IE for me :(

PoolKing
16-04-2007, 02:22 PM
Originally posted by se1eagle
Top two pair (A9) cracked by trip 5s ($98.85)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000037

Top pair cracked by trip 5s on river ($53.45)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000059

Straight cracked by overstraight on river, prob shouldn't have paid him off on the river but could have been a bluff ($18.60)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000025

Two pair cracked by board pairing, don't think I did much wrong here but please correct me if I did ($43.65)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000027

Draws all way to flush and I stupidly pay him off on river ($47)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000029

Top pair cracked by flush - don't think I did anything wrong here but please correct me if I did ($92.45)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000032

Aces cracked by 7-2 - don't think I did much wrong here ($41.30)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000034

Straight cracked by full house on turn - prob should have backed off when ace came on turn ($71.05)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000040

Aces cracked by trips on flop, I think I overplayed them ($42)
http://www.pokerhand.org/?1000072

1. I agree with Sam, I think too that the opponent is unlikely to be calling with a spade draw after the flop so maybe you could have not bet so strongly after the turn...

2. Unlucky in this one but when he raises you on the turn, what do you think he has? If you think he is week, maybe it would have been worth putting him all-in on the turn if you are sure you are ahead?

3. Just get unlucky here, you play it fine, maybe you could bet the turn stronger but that would scare him off possibly sao can see why you didn't.

4. Played perfectly, 100% unluckiness!

5. You said it yourself, don't call the river, fold!

6. I like your aggressiveness in this pot and good read...nice play and long-run you win in these situations, unlucky again.

7. Nothing done wrong again. You have to call his small all-in turn bet.

8. I think you should have been more cautious here, the all-in reraise on the turn seems a bit OTT as the FH possibility is there.

9. You probably felt you were behind here by the river but still made the call, I probably would have too...I may have chacked the turn to see what he would have done.

Overall, I would say that you played all of the pots fairly well if not 'perfectly'. Hands 5 and 8 have the only real errors or bad moves... but you have pointed them out yourself in your analysis so you are already half-way there in correcting them next time they arise in play :p

Micky Spilane
16-04-2007, 06:58 PM
Originally posted by David Amsalem
Fancy giving the ladders a go tonight, quick question to anybody who has played before on Laddies, I want to start on Level 1, $3.30 table, you get the opportunity to win ten tokens, (entry to the next level) - is it possible to keep playing the $3 table to earn enough tokens for the last stage?

I only ask as I've just viewed one and it appears to be a low standard.

Right definitive answer. Yes it is possible, I had 11 tokens and I went on to the $100+10 table, the cost to me was $99 plus my tokens, I came second winning $300. That was on Laddies playing Treble Chance. What you cannot do is use the tokens from Treble Chance on Money Tree and vice versa Money Tree on Treble Chance.

The standard on the $100 table was not that impressive in my opinion, may just have been an off night but I'm not complaining!

David Amsalem
16-04-2007, 07:15 PM
Congratulations Micky :p

se1eagle
16-04-2007, 07:23 PM
Many thanks for the comments guys - really helpful and hugely appreciated. I've got my bankroll back up to $1100 now so perhaps the run's coming to an end :p

Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
1. Was the 3xpot bet on flop to remove drawers? I think as soon as that bets called it's worth slowing down a little. I'm not sure about FTP but would someone really call 12 more or so to hit a spade? Was a shame though with outs for the riv.


I find I do this more as people draw out on me and I start to get frustrated - I overbet when I think I'm winning. I think it's prob my worst leak - I detest being drawn out on so much I end up overbetting to try and force them out, and then find it really hard to lay down a beaten hand on the river when someone has called down my pot bets

Originally posted by PoolKing
2. Unlucky in this one but when he raises you on the turn, what do you think he has? If you think he is week, maybe it would have been worth putting him all-in on the turn if you are sure you are ahead?

I thought I was winning on the turn so I think you're right - however whenever I have KQ I always seem to be under AQ so I was pretty cautious about his $12 reraise after he cold called my $2.25 raise preflop. I certainly didn't expect him to have A5!

Originally posted by PoolKing
5. You said it yourself, don't call the river, fold!

There's that leak again - I knew I had been muffed but found myself clicking call out of frustration.

Originally posted by PoolKing
8. I think you should have been more cautious here, the all-in reraise on the turn seems a bit OTT as the FH possibility is there.

It's really poor play but I reraised immediately without even thinking about how the A changed the board. That was the second time I'd flopped the nut straight and after being outdrawn the previous time, by god I wasn't going to give it up by allowing him to catch a diamond on the river... Really need to temper my emotion in cases like this.

saul1664
16-04-2007, 09:10 PM
What would you do in this scenario.

$2000 tourney, early stages

Have been moved to a new table, there are 7 sitouts, my stack size is 1,500, other player to my left has 6K, other player the same.

Player to my left raises 4 x BB every single hand, if he doesn't do that he is all in, regardless of blind level, been doing it from 30/60 usually with junk. Will call any all-in attack on him and will constantly re-raise flop turn river causing lots of folds.

I decided to take a chance with A8 spades on a flop with 2 spades, unfortunately other player called as well and won pot with with pair of 5's leaving me with 190 chips.

Battled back to 3000 chips, blind level now 50/100, and he is still doing the same, now has 12K, so in relation to blinds can't call much. Mostly calling on top 4/5 hands only. And flat calling as I know 90% of the time I will be raised.

Have managed to bluff him off one pot with a flush on river, apart from that no joy. How would you play?

saul1664
16-04-2007, 09:33 PM
Got knocked out (albeit at different table). KA preflop raise got called all in by big stack, called him for a chance to double up, his 55 held up. Had chance for flush on turn and river but no good.

Strathclyde Eagle
16-04-2007, 10:00 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
What would you do in this scenario.

$2000 tourney, early stages

Have been moved to a new table, there are 7 sitouts, my stack size is 1,500, other player to my left has 6K, other player the same.

Player to my left raises 4 x BB every single hand, if he doesn't do that he is all in, regardless of blind level, been doing it from 30/60 usually with junk. Will call any all-in attack on him and will constantly re-raise flop turn river causing lots of folds.

I decided to take a chance with A8 spades on a flop with 2 spades, unfortunately other player called as well and won pot with with pair of 5's leaving me with 190 chips.

Battled back to 3000 chips, blind level now 50/100, and he is still doing the same, now has 12K, so in relation to blinds can't call much. Mostly calling on top 4/5 hands only. And flat calling as I know 90% of the time I will be raised.

Have managed to bluff him off one pot with a flush on river, apart from that no joy. How would you play?
Not quite what you're looking for, but I've been in tournaments with lots of players sitting out. It does become a race to accumulate chips from them, so you do raise with anything. If you stumble across another actual opponent you adjust accordingly - of course if he has you covered then you've got a problem against a maniac like this.

Son of Selhurst
18-04-2007, 02:18 AM
Full Tilt - biggest rake-builder of them all

oz_da II
18-04-2007, 02:40 AM
Originally posted by Son of Selhurst
Full Tilt - biggest rake-builder of them all

That happened twice in my home game on consecutive weeks.
That must have been rigged as well..

Gav The Hamster
18-04-2007, 08:48 AM
Originally posted by Son of Selhurst
Full Tilt - biggest rake-builder of them all

because you couldnt lay down AA on that board ?

saul1664
18-04-2007, 09:05 AM
Best hand winning. That is kind of surreal.

saul1664
18-04-2007, 09:08 AM
Just bubbled in tourney.

Have AQ, blinds 400/800, one caller (flat call), flop comes Q66. I check, he bets minimum, I flat call, same on turn, same on river. No flush on board, he bets minimum again. Don't put him on the trips, possibly QK QJ, re-raise him to 2400, he then pushes all in, I call (has me pot committed), turns over AA!

And I was the one who thought I had him trapped. lol.

SamTheOldGoat
18-04-2007, 11:34 AM
Originally posted by Son of Selhurst
Full Tilt - biggest rake-builder of them all
No offence, but what are you still doing in the pot if you weren't all in??

KevTheOptimist
18-04-2007, 01:00 PM
Poker stars is quality for No. of players, saw a $5 rebuy with $25k g'teed last night unbelievable for the Laddies type (me).

Gonna bosh out a bit of stars I think, also like the regular 100 and 200 man SnGs that fill up in like 10 mins.

SamTheOldGoat
18-04-2007, 02:20 PM
Agreed Kev and the guarantees are ALWAYS made, and usually doubled!

Micky Droy
18-04-2007, 05:56 PM
Anyone know if The Gutshot is closed yet after the sourt ruling?

We ought to have a little pennies game online for old time's sake soon.

Or even... a south london home game...

Strathclyde Eagle
18-04-2007, 10:01 PM
Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
Poker stars is quality for No. of players,
Can only agree with that. Prima sites since the ban of US players seem pretty much dead in comparison.

saul1664
18-04-2007, 10:45 PM
Playing H.O.R.S.E. Was down to 800 chips before I realised how badly I was playing razz. 7 card stud hi/lo taking some getting used to as well, but up to 6.5K in chips now. Some pretty poor play at limit.

Son of Selhurst
19-04-2007, 02:25 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
No offence, but what are you still doing in the pot if you weren't all in??

An example. This happens all the time. And going all in just means you lose even more in one hand.

Check the few hands before on NL cash:

I'm on the BB with K 10 spades
2 x Raise from UTG, everyone else folds. I call.
Flop comes 9 3 3 with two spades
I check, he raises half pot, I call.
Turn is a 10. I bet the pot. He calls.
River is a 10.
I check. He raises. I'm thinking please oh please have AA, KK, QQ, JJ or even better 99. I go all-in. He calls. Jackpot for me?
Two of us in. He has 9 10 unsuited. Apart from 33, that was the only other hand that could beat me, yet he raised UTG pre-flop, and the flop gave me the hook to stay in.

What I can't get through to you lot is the frequency of these sorts of long-shot anomalies. You're all posting 'bad-beat' stories every day.
"I can't believe the only other guy stayed in with the only hand that could beat me" etc

Look at my one AA. 10 10 v 9 9 and the flop has 10 and 9. So everyone crams the pot.

oz_da II
19-04-2007, 02:52 PM
Originally posted by Son of Selhurst
What I can't get through to you lot is the frequency of these sorts of long-shot anomalies. You're all posting 'bad-beat' stories every day.
"I can't believe the only other guy stayed in with the only hand that could beat me" etc


That's only Saul. :moo:

I'm not sure why you bother. I was on a bad run for a few weeks on one site. Seems to have sorted it self out now, it's called variance.

Sounds like you're just the unluckiest player around...
Interesting how almost every "bad beat" you put up here gets comments regarding poor play though.

KevTheOptimist
19-04-2007, 03:00 PM
I'm on the BB with K 10 spades
2 x Raise from UTG, everyone else folds. I call.
Flop comes 9 3 3 with two spades
I check, he raises half pot, I call.
Turn is a 10. I bet the pot. He calls.
River is a 10.

Raising UTG with 9 10 off is very random, probably so random that when you hit the jackpot with it you will generally win a lot from it! Some players do this, you watch Negreanu and Gus Hansen they make plays like this to keep everyone guessing, to raise UTG with that and show the winning hand at the end is his dream, now when he has AA UTG and raises he'll get callers......

Gav The Hamster
19-04-2007, 04:35 PM
Originally posted by Son of Selhurst
An example. This happens all the time. And going all in just means you lose even more in one hand.

Check the few hands before on NL cash:

I'm on the BB with K 10 spades
2 x Raise from UTG, everyone else folds. I call.
Flop comes 9 3 3 with two spades
I check, he raises half pot, I call.
Turn is a 10. I bet the pot. He calls.
River is a 10.
I check. He raises. I'm thinking please oh please have AA, KK, QQ, JJ or even better 99. I go all-in. He calls. Jackpot for me?
Two of us in. He has 9 10 unsuited. Apart from 33, that was the only other hand that could beat me, yet he raised UTG pre-flop, and the flop gave me the hook to stay in.

What I can't get through to you lot is the frequency of these sorts of long-shot anomalies. You're all posting 'bad-beat' stories every day.
"I can't believe the only other guy stayed in with the only hand that could beat me" etc

Look at my one AA. 10 10 v 9 9 and the flop has 10 and 9. So everyone crams the pot.

why dont you post up a whole session of your hands and see how many times this happens. I would hazard a guess at not very many.

SamTheOldGoat
20-04-2007, 10:31 AM
On a busy day of 4/6 tables I will play 3k hands probably a fair more? In that time, I'm expecting to be 1 outered on more than one equation, I'm expecting to have set over set and I'm expecting to get done by runner runner flush or straight more than once.

The same thing happens in home games SOS, do you not seem them in that?

I raise up with K2ss the other day, housemate smooth called in position with QQ, flop comes KKQ, check check, turn, 2, riv, K. Now you would probably call it a bad beat, but I have one over which I'll hit 30% of the time or whatever?!?!?!

Also playing at thome when people aren't great at dealing and your getting in 20/30 hands an hour MAX is a whole lot different to online when your getting in up to 150. You expect to see 5x more bad beats due to the amount o fhands your playing.

If you genuinely believe it's all rigged why the hell are you still playing?

Billyd
20-04-2007, 01:51 PM
does anyone here play on poker stars? if not what do they play on? i have accounts wih just about all most of them and i gotta say stars is best hands down

Strathclyde Eagle
20-04-2007, 02:45 PM
Stars is great. Pity the initial sign-up bonus isn't too great. However if you're playing at Sam's level (or even probably regularly at $1/$2 and above) then the reward scheme is very good indeed.

SamTheOldGoat
20-04-2007, 03:27 PM
Agree that Stars is great, although the start up bonus is awful for those new to the site. The games are filling up all the time, and you only have to look at amount of players online to see it's the no1 site on the net. When playing $100+sng's, the FPP's roll in when your platinum and picked up an 8g i-pod about 2 weeks ago and nearly got enough for another one. Me and my brother have probably played at least 100sng's at $100 level and some $200 & $300 to get that, but that's $9 of rake off every SNG so in theory we are paying $900 for an ipod?! That's why you will often see on sharkscope break even players having a +ROI but be in red i.e. not profit due to the rake.

Apparently the best way to earn FPP's is to play LIMIT.

Signed up at nicehitfish! on Paradise yesterday and played 1/2 NL and the play is SOOOOOOOOOOOOO soft although not many tables or players on the site, there were 2k about 10 minutes ago. Deposited 1k and got 150 bonus but I'm sure some sites are offering huge bonuses, $600 etc?

Strathclyde Eagle
20-04-2007, 03:49 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
Apparently the best way to earn FPP's is to play LIMIT.
True I'd say, although I think you need to be playing at $1/$2 to hit the $8 FPP mark on a pot.

I can't say I liked Paradise when I played there. Too many distractions in the software, changing bonus structure (when I was there at least - 100 raked hands did release $10 of bonus, which they changed to 100/$5) and the fees for a tournament ($5 + $1!) were ridiculous. Also the tournaments were laboriously slow, mainly because there seemed to be a mammoth pause between the turn and river being dealt when a player was all-in.

Strathclyde Eagle
20-04-2007, 03:50 PM
BTW, on my bonuses still to clear list I've got:
Full Contact $500
Doyle's Room $550
FullTilt $600
Absolute $750
Mansion $1000

And I don't think that's anything like a comprehensive list.

SamTheOldGoat
20-04-2007, 03:58 PM
WOW, that's some accounts you have there mate!

What's that about $8/FPP? I've never looked into it properly but I notice I build FPPs even when I'm not in a hand.

When playing paradise I noticed that it was pretty quick, maybe the software has changed?

When you play on stars, do you play the quick games? If I'm playing cash I will only play FAST tables as you can get in so many more hands per hour and TURBO sng's, so they last 45 mins max.

Gav The Hamster
21-04-2007, 08:47 AM
would this be your definition of a rake builder SOS ?!

** Game ID 733752745 starting - 2007-04-21 09:44:04
** Retford [Hold 'em] (0.25|0.50 No Limit - Cash Game) Real Money

- NinjaMatz sitting in seat 1 with $12.59 [Dealer]
- Vultures78 sitting in seat 2 with $56.32
- jonnyl4321 sitting in seat 3 with $51.85
- G_F_R__R_F_G sitting in seat 4 with $19.00
- Bubblehammer sitting in seat 5 with $29.10
- oldman_100 sitting in seat 6 with $90.69

Vultures78 posted the small blind - $0.25
jonnyl4321 posted the big blind - $0.50

** Dealing card to oldman_100: 6 of Hearts, 7 of Spades
G_F_R__R_F_G called - $0.50
Bubblehammer called - $0.50
oldman_100 called - $0.50
NinjaMatz folded
Vultures78 called - $0.50
jonnyl4321 checked

** Dealing the flop: 9 of Diamonds, 8 of Clubs, Jack of Diamonds
Vultures78 checked
jonnyl4321 checked
G_F_R__R_F_G checked
Bubblehammer checked
oldman_100 checked

** Dealing the turn: 5 of Clubs
Vultures78 checked
jonnyl4321 bet - $2.00
G_F_R__R_F_G called - $2.00
Bubblehammer folded
oldman_100 raised - $4.00
Vultures78 folded
jonnyl4321 raised - $17.00
G_F_R__R_F_G went all-in - $16.50
oldman_100 folded
jonnyl4321 called - $18.50

** Dealing the river: Ace of Hearts
G_F_R__R_F_G shows: King of Clubs, King of Hearts
jonnyl4321 shows: 10 of Spades, Queen of Diamonds
jonnyl4321 wins $41.35 from the main pot

End of game 733752745

amazed i got away from it to be honest, i cant lay down AA ever !

oz_da II
21-04-2007, 09:00 AM
Quite an amazing fold GTH, you had the 3rd nuts.
Did he give away a tell? ;)

It's always nice to see a limper with KK get beaten. :D

Reps AJ
21-04-2007, 10:26 AM
Originally posted by oz_da II
Quite an amazing fold GTH, you had the 3rd nuts.
Did he give away a tell? ;)

It's always nice to see a limper with KK get beaten. :D

Makes you wonder what the thought process was of the guy with KK

SamTheOldGoat
21-04-2007, 10:31 AM
WTF was KK doing in it! !

Nice pass Gav!

KevTheOptimist
21-04-2007, 12:37 PM
That's afantastic laydown Gav. Good work.

Strathclyde Eagle
21-04-2007, 01:58 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
WOW, that's some accounts you have there mate!
That's not accounts I've got, that's accounts I've still got left to go. :)

I also missed the Titan account, which I think is a $600 sign-up bonus.
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
What's that about $8/FPP? I've never looked into it properly but I notice I build FPPs even when I'm not in a hand.
I think on the lower limits that's the amount per pot that earns you an FPP. You're correct btw - you don't need to contribute to the pot to earn an FPP.
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
When playing paradise I noticed that it was pretty quick, maybe the software has changed?
Very possible. :)
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
When you play on stars, do you play the quick games? If I'm playing cash I will only play FAST tables as you can get in so many more hands per hour and TURBO sng's, so they last 45 mins max.
I haven't played on Stars for a few weeks, but I tended to play the fast tables. Their turbo SNGs might be quick, but they're not as quick as the Prima ones - according to Poker Office I recently won a 5 seater sng in eight minutes. :eek:

budgie
21-04-2007, 02:06 PM
Originally posted by Strathclyde Eagle
Their turbo SNGs might be quick, but they're not as quick as the Prima ones - according to Poker Office I recently won a 5 seater sng in eight minutes. :eek:

Thats nothing, I recently lost one, in about 15 seconds. ;)

Strathclyde Eagle
21-04-2007, 02:09 PM
That's what happens with me on Stars. ;)

As I've said many times before, I think the sngs on Stars are a lot tougher than others I've played. I know Sam will disagree with me on that though.

Poker Superstars currently on Bravo 2. Could be the worst poker show on TV imho.

Strathclyde Eagle
21-04-2007, 02:19 PM
Chris Rose, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup, shutup!

oz_da II
21-04-2007, 03:46 PM
Originally posted by Strathclyde Eagle
I also missed the Titan account, which I think is a $600 sign-up bonus.


What's your history on Titan, SE?

I find the standard really stinky, I'm really enjoying it.

Strathclyde Eagle
21-04-2007, 04:02 PM
Haven't played it at all. Have heard though that while the bonus is a decent amount it takes ages to clear.

oz_da II
21-04-2007, 04:06 PM
Ah ok. I placed in a freeroll and have turned a few dollars into a few hundred.

budgie
21-04-2007, 05:35 PM
Can someone please explain why I was called here, should I leave Laddies and try Pokerstars .

http://www.pokerhand.org/?1021008

Strathclyde Eagle
21-04-2007, 06:30 PM
That's just a bad beat budgie, you got your chips in when you were ahead, that's all you can ask for, and he's ended up catching runner-runner. You're very unlucky IMO.

budgie
21-04-2007, 06:56 PM
I think what made me feel worse, was that I was feeling very confident of winning this game, as the other players left were very poor, and had been lucky to get to this stage. I had already had two bad beats, but hadn't over commited, so as I say was confident of winning.

I have now got over it though. :sob:

saul1664
21-04-2007, 10:41 PM
Originally posted by budgie
Can someone please explain why I was called here, should I leave Laddies and try Pokerstars .

http://www.pokerhand.org/?1021008

Hmmmmm. Not surprised on prima network. Can't win a hand on there, too many people pushing all in on anything and catching.

saul1664
21-04-2007, 10:42 PM
Originally posted by oz_da II
That's only Saul. :moo:

I'm not sure why you bother. I was on a bad run for a few weeks on one site. Seems to have sorted it self out now, it's called variance.

Sounds like you're just the unluckiest player around...
Interesting how almost every "bad beat" you put up here gets comments regarding poor play though.

Its not just the internet. Live game, push all in with AK, AQ spikes Q on river and when short stacked and push in with JK, get one caller (a twat as well) calling me with 6 10 offsuit, and he makes a straight with 4 hearts on the board. That's probably variance too.

SamTheOldGoat
22-04-2007, 04:12 PM
Originally posted by Strathclyde Eagle
That's what happens with me on Stars. ;)

As I've said many times before, I think the sngs on Stars are a lot tougher than others I've played. I know Sam will disagree with me on that though.

Poker Superstars currently on Bravo 2. Could be the worst poker show on TV imho.

No, I agree Strath, Pokerstars is the hardest site on the net in my opinion, I'm sure there are other easy ones, such as Paradise. Brothers playing 10/20 limit now as nicehitfish! if anyones bored, sat with a few hundred I think and now is on $2.2k, that's how bad it is!

Agree about Poker Superstars as well, gash!

Back to all this 'rake building' and strange hits, I was in £110 F/O in Broadway in Birmingham on Thursday night and after a raise UTG made it 300 to go at 50/100 level I made it 800 more with AK from teh SB. BB called and original raiser passes. I know I have to hit board heavy but I have a fair few more chips as I took 'double chance' straight away. Flop comes A J 4 or soemthing similar. I like this board and want a reraise so make it 800 to go and BB shoves for 3k more. I took a little while to think about how he would have played his set and stuck opponent on A9-AQ as I thought he thought my bet was weak. I call, he has AQ and spikes the Q on 5th street.

It doesn't just happen on the net folks, or to build pots for rake, it really does happen, bloody rigged poker ;)

Reps AJ
22-04-2007, 06:12 PM
Originally posted by David Amsalem
Fancy giving the ladders a go tonight, quick question to anybody who has played before on Laddies, I want to start on Level 1, $3.30 table, you get the opportunity to win ten tokens, (entry to the next level) - is it possible to keep playing the $3 table to earn enough tokens for the last stage?

I only ask as I've just viewed one and it appears to be a low standard.

Thanks for asking about this the other day - played a few after you mentioned it, think I bought in about 3 times at the bottom level so about $10 total and have just finished playing the final level and finished 2nd for $300 :lux:

saul1664
22-04-2007, 06:49 PM
Here's one for the conspiracy theorists...

Three all-ins pre flop

Player 1: J c A c
Player 2: Kc A s
Player 3: Ah Qs

Flop 9c 4c A d

Turn Qd

Turn Qc

Player 3 wins with Full House

SamTheOldGoat
22-04-2007, 08:49 PM
Standard, smashed AA the other day with AQ... AQ=Nuts

SamTheOldGoat
22-04-2007, 08:49 PM
ps, that was live ;)

SamTheOldGoat
22-04-2007, 08:50 PM
Must have been a rigged deck

saul1664
22-04-2007, 08:53 PM
Plus 55 beat QQ with 4 spades to make unlikely flush. No rake involved so no conspiracy there.

David Amsalem
22-04-2007, 09:10 PM
Originally posted by Reps AJ
Thanks for asking about this the other day - played a few after you mentioned it, think I bought in about 3 times at the bottom level so about $10 total and have just finished playing the final level and finished 2nd for $300 :lux:

Congratulations man. I'm just about to embark on it, wish me luck :p

oz_da II
23-04-2007, 07:00 AM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
Standard, smashed AA the other day with AQ... AQ=Nuts

Very true ;) :moo:

I've played over 25,000 hands and AQ is far more profitable than both AKo and AKs.
AA is top, JJ second, QQ third and KK fourth, AQ is next.

Anyone watched the Aussie Millions cash game program, yet? Antonius on fire. He's got something and they call, he's got nothing and they fold, some monster 6 figure pots. Ransacks Ivey and Lindgren amongst others.

SamTheOldGoat
23-04-2007, 09:00 AM
Don't think it's appeared on UK TV yet OZ. Hansen took down to Millions didn't he; I had a friend working there for POKERTV.COM or something similar and he was adament Antonius was going to take it down, any idea where he ended up?

Strathclyde Eagle
23-04-2007, 09:01 AM
I thought Antonius wasn't bothered about winning tournaments, just absolutely wiping the floor with everyone at cash games?

oz_da II
23-04-2007, 09:31 AM
PA finished 13th - $72,000

You can find a few of the big cash game hands on youtube.
A bit of controversy with an Australian acting like a complete prick during a 300k hand between PA and Ivey.

se1eagle
23-04-2007, 09:39 AM
Originally posted by oz_da II
Anyone watched the Aussie Millions cash game program, yet? Antonius on fire. He's got something and they call, he's got nothing and they fold, some monster 6 figure pots. Ransacks Ivey and Lindgren amongst others.

Yup watched the first two episodes of the cash game - very similar to HSP - should keep me sane until the next series of HSP returns.

I highly recommend signing up at thepokerbay.org for some great poker torrents, including the Aussie Cash game invitational.

oz_da II
23-04-2007, 09:47 AM
Yes a good site that one.

A shame the commentators on the Aussie Millions cash game were so poor as the hands were very good. Americans by the way. Would mention every two minutes that these players were playing for "real money". Got a bit annoying.

SamTheOldGoat
23-04-2007, 10:52 AM
Thanks for update, 13th, not bad!

I think Antonius probably turns up for the cash games as he's often playing Full Tilt under alia Luigi99369 or something and is on multiple tables wiht 60k etc. No doubt the money isn't an issue but maybe he wants to be even further recognised such as Ivey etc...

David Amsalem
23-04-2007, 05:35 PM
Originally posted by David Amsalem
Congratulations man. I'm just about to embark on it, wish me luck :p

Not that anybody asked for a progress, or wished me luck, (;))I done Stage One for $3.30, qualified for Stage Two, won that, and did Stage Two again and won that. I figured that the standard on Stage Two was so poor and fourth place get their tokens back so I think that is the best way to qualify for the $100 table.

Although, my QQ just lost to AK on the river on Stage Two again.

Gonna head to Stage Three instead now, have enough tokens to fall back without having to pay so here goes again.

David Amsalem
23-04-2007, 05:50 PM
The dream is over! Had AK, raised to 120, one caller. Flop is A72. I bet half the pot and am called. Turn is A. Three of a kind for me. He goes all-in. I call it, he turns over 77. Ouch.

Beats going out to rubbish play I guess. Him going all in like that confused me big time considering what he was holding and the fact he probably put me on an Ace considering the pre flop raise and bet on the flop. He must have knew he was ahead. Oh well, give it another go tomorrow night.

Really thought he had AJ, AQ...

Reps AJ
23-04-2007, 06:17 PM
Originally posted by David Amsalem
Not that anybody asked for a progress, or wished me luck, (;))I done Stage One for $3.30, qualified for Stage Two, won that, and did Stage Two again and won that. I figured that the standard on Stage Two was so poor and fourth place get their tokens back so I think that is the best way to qualify for the $100 table.

Although, my QQ just lost to AK on the river on Stage Two again.

Gonna head to Stage Three instead now, have enough tokens to fall back without having to pay so here goes again.

Just got in from work and I'm having another go :) The person that beat me is on the same table again

Sorry to hear you busted out of the stage 3, there is no getting away from a hand like that but you're right I don't think the standard is too high - I've cashed twice now for a total of $1500 and I'm not a genius. Good luck for the next attempt :p

Oh, my top tip for the 1st three stages is that 3rd is as good as 1st so you don't need to go crazy

David Amsalem
24-04-2007, 07:13 PM
Nice one Reps, I'm at it again now :p

Let me know how it goes. Just won Stage One.

Edit - but out on Stage Two. Had one hand, JJ but other then than had nothing, and I'm not at that stage where I can win with nothing. Not yet.

Reps AJ
25-04-2007, 08:00 PM
Just got to the final table again but haven't got time to play it tonight so I'll have to save it

saul1664
26-04-2007, 12:50 AM
68 offsuit is becoming a satanic hand for me.

Knocked out of live game when I matched a 5 x BB raise only to see my two pair crushed when an 8 came on the river for a full house (why did you call the raise with 68 off I asked, it's my favourite hand he says). He was down to 1100 chips early when he pushed in with 29 offsuit and made full house on river again.

And just had A9 cracked with it when 8 hit the river to give him two pair, was a qualifier for the WSOP (2nd stage) winner goes through out of 360 and I lost to it heads up (though he had 3x my stack so when A hit the flop had to push)

Reps AJ
26-04-2007, 08:00 PM
Originally posted by Reps AJ
Just got to the final table again but haven't got time to play it tonight so I'll have to save it

Just played it and just did not get the cards. I think AKos was by best starting pair I had all game which fortunately doubled me up from about 700 with a K on the flop. Got down to the last 4 and there are 2 guys on about 7\8000 each and me with 187 chips, the other guy with about 250 with blinds of 400\800 and me next to get the blinds :eek:

A quick prayer to the poker gods for decent cards saw me in the BB with 10 2 os :bash: but it seems my prayers were answered as got a flop of 10 8 2 and another 10 on the river :D So its me and the other short stack in with the other two leaving us to it. I get 23 and he has 10 4, get a 3 on the flop :lux: Bye bye :hi: He wasn't happy! $200 for a cost of about $12 this time, by the skin of my teeth

Am liking these ladders :lux:

KevTheOptimist
27-04-2007, 01:49 PM
Well, I like setting unrealistic targets, so why stop now!

Haven't played for ages so think I may play a few low level NL and stightly higher limit tables.

I wanna turn my original outlay of $100 on stars into $5000. I calculate this to be in the region of 200 double ups at .10/.25 tables, but with varience and the obvious set backs will be more like 250 double ups in total.

1 a night;-) will take me about a year! Bring it on!

KevTheOptimist
28-04-2007, 12:35 AM
Well, that's double up numero duex.

KevTheOptimist
28-04-2007, 12:35 AM
A mere 250 to go!

SamTheOldGoat
28-04-2007, 10:53 AM
Good luck Kev!

I can't wiat to start playing again after Dissertation etc. Moving in with my brother and going to play for a living over the Summer with him, aiming to multi 100-300 dollar SNG's and play around 50 a day and play cash at Broadway in Birmingham in the evening. I will keep a blog with the highs and lows and I'm sure there will be plenty of both. When we play together it seems us both putting our thoughts into each hand is positive. Does anyone else play with others online to think about different situations and plays?

Gav The Hamster
28-04-2007, 10:57 AM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
Good luck Kev!

I can't wiat to start playing again after Dissertation etc. Moving in with my brother and going to play for a living over the Summer with him, aiming to multi 100-300 dollar SNG's and play around 50 a day and play cash at Broadway in Birmingham in the evening. I will keep a blog with the highs and lows and I'm sure there will be plenty of both. When we play together it seems us both putting our thoughts into each hand is positive. Does anyone else play with others online to think about different situations and plays?

Do you not think that when you have two people looking on the same hand can cause some conflict ? I would find it difficult to change my decision on the basis of someone elses opinion but then again thats just me.

Reps AJ
28-04-2007, 12:32 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
aiming to multi 100-300 dollar SNG's and play around 50 a day

Thats about $5k a day :eek: :eek:

Your bankroll must be slightly bigger than mine :D Good luck :p

SamTheOldGoat
28-04-2007, 02:00 PM
Originally posted by Gav The Hamster
Do you not think that when you have two people looking on the same hand can cause some conflict ? I would find it difficult to change my decision on the basis of someone elses opinion but then again thats just me.

It doesn't seem to and as it's both of our monies we won't make a decision unless the other one is happy as well. Maybe it will if we are playing all day everyday but in the past i.e. when I was snowboarding a few weeks ago and we played albeit not so much we were +3.5k in the week and we weren't running good. My brothers VERY good at Maths and knows almost always what is a +EV shove etc.

Yes, I suppose it is $5k a day+ but hopefully the ROI will be 10%+ for us to make some good money. The stats at the moment for $100+ SNG's is about 15% I think. Will start the 'challenge' in a month or so :)

SamTheOldGoat
28-04-2007, 08:16 PM
Dan, how's the HI LO going?

DANCOO
28-04-2007, 09:52 PM
I've not played for over a month now.
Having had nearly a year off of work, and then suddenly having to get up at 05:30 every morning was a real wake up call (excuse the pun), and I just don't have the time at the moment.
Offices are moving a lot nearer to me in the next couple of months, so hopefully then I will manage to get some game time.:)

Strathclyde Eagle
29-04-2007, 03:00 PM
Got to heads up in a SNG earlier, went all-in with A6os and was up against KQ suited. Flop was QQx, turn was another Q!

Can't complain though, I've played four today. Second in three, third in the other. Playing the chip stacks rather than the cards when the blinds are high, working well.

se1eagle
29-04-2007, 03:45 PM
I've just played two hands in the space of 4 minutes - both times I had 10-10 and lost to 8-8 on an 8-7-2 board. The second time I called because I couldn't quite believe the guy could have 8-8 again on exactly the same board.

Spooky...

saul1664
29-04-2007, 03:49 PM
Live game. 1st level. Blinds 50/100. Dealt KA in BB. Whole table limps round to small blind who raises 200. I raise 600, he calls all in (I fancy a gamble he says). What do you do?

Strathclyde Eagle
29-04-2007, 03:54 PM
Call, definitely. You're in pretty good shape if you hit I'd say.

SamTheOldGoat
29-04-2007, 05:33 PM
Depends what the buy in is, if it's a tenner I'll do it for a laugh but if it's for a large some of money, I'll wait until I know I'm a favourite then batter them, rather going in as a dog

Reps AJ
29-04-2007, 06:20 PM
Did I play this hand wrong in this STT? I thought it was a pretty straight forward blind steal followed by and easy call for 490 chips when he went all in.

** Game ID 739383188 starting - 2007-04-29 18:12:11
** Lampeter [Hold em] (200.00|400.00 No Limit - STT) Real Money
- xxxxx sitting in seat 2 with $3230.00
- Bubbeli sitting in seat 3 with $890.00
- carpenter555 sitting in seat 4 with $3850.00
- islandhop sitting in seat 6 with $3930.00
- eagle60 sitting in seat 7 with $2800.00 [Dealer]
xxxxx posted the small blind - $100.00
Bubbeli posted the big blind - $200.00
** Dealing card to xxxxx : Ace of Hearts, 8 of Diamonds
carpenter555 folded
islandhop folded
eagle60 folded
xxxxx raised - $400.00
Bubbeli went all-in - $890.00
xxxxx called - $1090.00
Bubbeli shows: 2 of Spades, 8 of Hearts
** Dealing the flop: 5 of Clubs, 2 of Diamonds, Ace of Diamonds
** Dealing the turn: 6 of Diamonds
** Dealing the river: 10 of Diamonds
xxxxx wins $2180.00 from the main pot
End of game 739383188

The only reason I asked is that the guy practically started crying and complained that I didn't respect his table image as he'd only played 1 hand to that point. To be honest, I just laughed as he no fold equity and I had him covered by a mile

SamTheOldGoat
29-04-2007, 06:24 PM
lol, done nothing wrong and everything right:D

Reps AJ
30-04-2007, 05:54 PM
Why won't my fecking pocket As ever fecking win :bash: :bash:

If I play them strongly they lose, if I play them slowly they lose :bash:

oz_da II
30-04-2007, 06:01 PM
Bet365 curse is back.

Running into some miracle bad beats, out kicked, out flushed, out straighted (starting to make up words now). :clown: Almost all against hands that had no business going beyond the flop.
It was beyond ridiculous tonight. :moo:

I think I'll cash out.


Ahhhh that feels better...

saul1664
30-04-2007, 10:25 PM
Originally posted by Reps AJ
Why won't my fecking pocket As ever fecking win :bash: :bash:

If I play them strongly they lose, if I play them slowly they lose :bash:

Had two in two tournaments I was playing at the same time, both times I was all in. First one went against AJ which made flush on river, second one was against 99 who made trips on flop. Then next 3 or 4 hands people go all in with AA and win every time. Recovered in both tournaments then computer went down (more like AOL did) when well positioned in both, couldn't get back. When I did I found out I was 4 places outside the money after being blinded out. Doh.

Billyd
01-05-2007, 12:03 AM
Originally posted by saul1664
Live game. 1st level. Blinds 50/100. Dealt KA in BB. Whole table limps round to small blind who raises 200. I raise 600, he calls all in (I fancy a gamble he says). What do you do?


EASY fold if stack sizes are still high!!!, (but i dunno ur stack sizes so difficult to decide)

Billyd
01-05-2007, 12:04 AM
Originally posted by Strathclyde Eagle
Call, definitely. You're in pretty good shape if you hit I'd say.

you hav given the exact reason why he should fold, u more than likely have to hit. So 100% FOLD. why get in a race so early on in a tourney

SamTheOldGoat
01-05-2007, 01:50 AM
Like Ozz had a horrible evening, worst in a while and playing lowest stakes for ages. 6 tabling 50.1 for 4 hours I dropped nearly $500, big pots lost include KK v AK, (Obviously thought his A high was good as I shoved the flop and he hit his 3 outer, QQ v AK, KK v AA, QQ v 33 (set on flop obv), AA v AK...... Was only playing as I handed in a big assignment today and it was last day of the month to get platinum status on stars which I got in 4 hours but frustrating nonetheless. Then multi-ing SNG's and my pissing wireless decides to dissappear. FFS, horrible night

oz_da II
01-05-2007, 05:53 AM
Still having nightmares about last night. Two outed twice in the space of five minutes, set over set each time (both hit their's on the river). Will reiview my play tonight and then get back on the horse. I was up over 1000BB's since February, last night's hit was -90BB's. Was up 20BB's early doors, as well. Can't complain too much as my last 10 sessions have been winners, mostly on TitanPoker. Really stinky players there, a lot of them are French. :clown:

One funny hand from last night where I was steaming a little bit, I called the river with Q high (missed flush/straight draw, just to see what he had) and took the pot.

SamTheOldGoat
01-05-2007, 08:03 AM
Always a nice feeling, or to set up a river raise and you can't bring yourself to it and you check and their 79 for a gutshot is no good :D

Also having nightmares about last night! Zzzzzzzzzzzzz.

Also in the space of 4 hours with 6 tables managed to get 1 outered 3 times. Cheeeeeeeeerz

saul1664
01-05-2007, 09:36 PM
Originally posted by Billyd
you hav given the exact reason why he should fold, u more than likely have to hit. So 100% FOLD. why get in a race so early on in a tourney

Well I folded. It was the 4th hand and I didn't know the player. However when he continued to play he often raised with nothing to fold to any bet. And when I called his remaining all in with JK to hit J on the flop, I was amazingly called all in by 68 offsuit which made full house on the river to crush my two pair (unbelievably called 5 x BB with 68 off).

However finished 4th last night so not too bad, had no hands all night, best pair 44, so pleased with my play.

oz_da II
01-05-2007, 11:16 PM
Originally posted by oz_da II
Will review my play tonight and then get back on the horse.

Back to normality last night. Two tabled and doubled up both in no time. Both tables calling when I got the goods and folding when I had nothing. :p

Son of Selhurst
02-05-2007, 11:40 AM
Anyone tried PKR.COM yet? I love the game interface and the fact you have to keep checking your cards as they're not displayed face up.

Played 2 $10 ten-man tourneys and won them both. Cards seem much more "realistic". My mate moved from Poker Million to PKR a few weeks ago and won't play anywhere else now.

Gav The Hamster
02-05-2007, 11:48 AM
and there was me thinking you were posting about how online poker is rigged.

SamTheOldGoat
02-05-2007, 03:16 PM
Right, let's have another go online..............

SOS-What do you mean realistic? Not getting one outered when you slow play top set till the riv and lose to a gutshot?

SamTheOldGoat
03-05-2007, 10:48 AM
Sik beat. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz. EVERYONE loves a 1 outer. Obviously a rake builder....

PokerStars Game #9726080499: Hold'em No Limit ($25/$50) - 2007/05/03 - 06:45:28 (ET)
Table 'Kalchas' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: n_tzzvicodin ($2372 in chips)
Seat 2: mr. burns ($3075 in chips)
Seat 3: chaos183 ($5250 in chips)
Seat 4: pandabear22 ($4771 in chips)
Seat 5: doulas12 ($11809 in chips)
Seat 6: Crazyhug ($1623 in chips)
Seat 7: Termin8or ($5000 in chips)
pandabear22: posts small blind $25
doulas12: posts big blind $50
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Crazyhug: folds
Termin8or: raises $125 to $175
n_tzzvicodin: folds
mr. burns: calls $175
chaos183: folds
pandabear22: folds
doulas12: folds
*** FLOP *** [Jh 7d 4s]
Termin8or: checks
mr. burns: checks
*** TURN *** [Jh 7d 4s] [6c]
Termin8or: bets $325
mr. burns: raises $525 to $850
Termin8or: raises $650 to $1500
mr. burns: raises $1400 to $2900 and is all-in
Termin8or: calls $1400
*** RIVER *** [Jh 7d 4s 6c] [4c]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Termin8or: shows [Jc Jd] (a full house, Jacks full of Fours)
mr. burns: shows [4h 4d] (four of a kind, Fours)
mr. burns collected $6222 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $6225 | Rake $3
Board [Jh 7d 4s 6c 4c]
Seat 1: n_tzzvicodin folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: mr. burns showed [4h 4d] and won ($6222) with four of a kind, Fours
Seat 3: chaos183 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: pandabear22 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: doulas12 (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 6: Crazyhug folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: Termin8or showed [Jc Jd] and lost with a full house, Jacks full of Fours

DANCOO
03-05-2007, 11:45 AM
Working from home for a few days as my car was written off on sunday, so thought I would deposit a few bucks in to Laddies and play a game for the first time in over a month.

Just played a little $5 Omaha MTT of 13 entrants (first Omaha tourney I've ever played), and I won it for a grand total of $32.50 :)

SamTheOldGoat
03-05-2007, 12:39 PM
Good job mate :)

DANCOO
03-05-2007, 12:47 PM
Just doubled that $30 up to $60 playing cash hi/lo. :D

Son of Selhurst
03-05-2007, 12:55 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
Right, let's have another go online..............

SOS-What do you mean realistic? Not getting one outered when you slow play top set till the riv and lose to a gutshot?

I mean that I get beaten by 10-1 shots every 11th hand rather than every hand.
Boards aren't based on who stays in (like the hand you have posted above)
Dipsticks who always show their cards when they pull-off a bluff are busted out shortly after
AA doesn't arrive very often, but when it does, it most often holds up against lower hands
Flushed hole cards don't bring a flop of the other 3 suits EVERY time
Ace-flush doesn't get beaten by a rivered FH EVERY time
etc..

And I discovered the 1st-person view last night! You're sitting at the table in 3D, and you can see the game from the player's point of view. You can even look around. Very cool.

Gav The Hamster
03-05-2007, 01:05 PM
Originally posted by Son of Selhurst
I mean that I get beaten by 10-1 shots every 11th hand rather than every hand.
Boards aren't based on who stays in (like the hand you have posted above)
Dipsticks who always show their cards when they pull-off a bluff are busted out shortly after
AA doesn't arrive very often, but when it does, it most often holds up against lower hands
Flushed hole cards don't bring a flop of the other 3 suits EVERY time
Ace-flush doesn't get beaten by a rivered FH EVERY time
etc..

And I discovered the 1st-person view last night! You're sitting at the table in 3D, and you can see the game from the player's point of view. You can even look around. Very cool.

Lol, all i can say is that you must play on a site that no one else plays on because what you describe above is nothing short of bullsh*t.

if you got beaten by 10-1 shots every hand, you'd have no money left and wouldnt be playing.

People who show a bluff dont necessarily bluff the whole time so how can they bust out shortly after ?

AA is not a guaranteed winning hand.

How many flushes have you made online ?? Plenty I'm sure.

How many times has you A high flush really been beaten by a full house ? not that many.

SOS, this question has probably been asked of you many times but still, if you think internet poker is as rigged as you say, why do you still play it ??

AddiscombeEagle
03-05-2007, 01:48 PM
I don't see the benefit in it being rigged to anyone. Surely it doesn't effect the provider whoever wins.

oz_da II
03-05-2007, 02:47 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
Sik beat. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz. EVERYONE loves a 1 outer. Obviously a rake builder....

PokerStars Game #9726080499: Hold'em No Limit ($25/$50) - 2007/05/03 - 06:45:28 (ET)
Table 'Kalchas' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: n_tzzvicodin ($2372 in chips)
Seat 2: mr. burns ($3075 in chips)
Seat 3: chaos183 ($5250 in chips)
Seat 4: pandabear22 ($4771 in chips)
Seat 5: doulas12 ($11809 in chips)
Seat 6: Crazyhug ($1623 in chips)
Seat 7: Termin8or ($5000 in chips)
pandabear22: posts small blind $25
doulas12: posts big blind $50
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Crazyhug: folds
Termin8or: raises $125 to $175
n_tzzvicodin: folds
mr. burns: calls $175
chaos183: folds
pandabear22: folds
doulas12: folds
*** FLOP *** [Jh 7d 4s]
Termin8or: checks
mr. burns: checks
*** TURN *** [Jh 7d 4s] [6c]
Termin8or: bets $325
mr. burns: raises $525 to $850
Termin8or: raises $650 to $1500
mr. burns: raises $1400 to $2900 and is all-in
Termin8or: calls $1400
*** RIVER *** [Jh 7d 4s 6c] [4c]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Termin8or: shows [Jc Jd] (a full house, Jacks full of Fours)
mr. burns: shows [4h 4d] (four of a kind, Fours)
mr. burns collected $6222 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $6225 | Rake $3
Board [Jh 7d 4s 6c 4c]
Seat 1: n_tzzvicodin folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: mr. burns showed [4h 4d] and won ($6222) with four of a kind, Fours
Seat 3: chaos183 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: pandabear22 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: doulas12 (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 6: Crazyhug folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: Termin8or showed [Jc Jd] and lost with a full house, Jacks full of Fours

:eek: I won with quad fours last night, beating Jacks full of fours. :eek:
I hit the one outer, up against a maniac so I didn't believe for a second that he had a Jack. :D

Not as high stakes as that mind you. :clown: I'll go fetch it.

oz_da II
03-05-2007, 03:08 PM
Here it is:

http://www.pokerhand.org/?1058166

oz_da II
04-05-2007, 03:27 AM
Found this on a chat forum.


some people get "boom" accounts, some "doom" accounts and some "meh" accounts. Every site does this. I don't play at FT b/c they gave me a "doom" account and won't fix it no matter how many times i email them. For that reason, I play on PS where I have a "meh" account--its better than nothing.

SOS, you need a 'boom" account, get rid of that "doom" account. :clown:

DANCOO
04-05-2007, 08:23 AM
Originally posted by oz_da II

SOS, you need a 'boom" account, get rid of that "doom" account. :clown:

:D

Son of Selhurst
04-05-2007, 08:30 AM
I have a boom account on PKR obviously.

PoolKing
04-05-2007, 08:45 AM
Originally posted by Son of Selhurst
I mean that I get beaten by 10-1 shots every 11th hand rather than every hand.
Boards aren't based on who stays in (like the hand you have posted above)
Dipsticks who always show their cards when they pull-off a bluff are busted out shortly after
AA doesn't arrive very often, but when it does, it most often holds up against lower hands
Flushed hole cards don't bring a flop of the other 3 suits EVERY time
Ace-flush doesn't get beaten by a rivered FH EVERY time
etc..


I trust you have an extensive hand history and stats to prove that what you say did actually happen over a sustained period of time on other sites.

I remember a while back you claimed to have heard ground-breaking evidence about online poker being rigged but you never spilt the beans, are there any updates to this?

SamTheOldGoat
04-05-2007, 10:34 AM
Remember that well PK, however he continues to play and won't shed any info on it.................

Son of Selhurst
04-05-2007, 05:01 PM
http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/5681/pompadorxi6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Reps AJ
04-05-2007, 07:17 PM
Originally posted by Reps AJ
Am liking these ladders :lux:

3rd final table, 3rd cash place - this time for 1st and $500 :lux:

SamTheOldGoat
04-05-2007, 07:36 PM
Congrats mate :)

SamTheOldGoat
08-05-2007, 11:58 AM
Not sure what SOS's image is there?

I don't know if anyone reads poker blogs but I find them interesting, especially from those that play the highest limits online, such as Brian townsend, see link below, Taylor Caby and the sngicons.com crew. Often interesting to see how and why they played hands and definitely recommended :)

Oh well, seems like cardrunners where the blogs are is down at the moment, but recommended nonetheless :)

Son of Selhurst
08-05-2007, 02:12 PM
It's me.... why?

Anyway, played 8 S'n'G on PKR and won 5 of them. 2 x $10 6-player, 2 x $10 10-man, and one $20 heads-up.

saul1664
08-05-2007, 05:01 PM
Last 4 live games, 4th, 3rd, 1st, 1st. Though I am glad that my trip Queens Ace kicker induced a fold from a full house when I pushed all in first hand. :eek:

Strathclyde Eagle
08-05-2007, 05:27 PM
Just got my first straight flush. :) Not likely to compete with Dancoo any time soon, but was nice to get.

Had 6s3s in the big blind in a tournament. Was short-stacked, so took a free flop. Flop came 7s 9s 10c, so I pushed. Got called by a guy with a pair of 9s. Turn was a 4s (to win me the hand), river was a 5s to complete the straight flush.

Gav The Hamster
09-05-2007, 12:21 AM
people say luck evens itself out, i guess they are right...

harsh !

NL $0.50/$1 Texas Hold'em - Tuesday, May 08, 23:00:20 GMT 2007
Table Fluorine 09 6-max (Real Money)
Seat 3 is the button
Total number of active players : 6
Seat 1: 89suited ( $95.43 )
Seat 2: kiffy ( $22.75 )
Seat 3: oldman100 ( $37.60 )
Seat 4: pokermon3 ( $77.55 )
Seat 5: joe27 ( $85.75 )
Seat 6: Alfredo ( $76.60 )
pokermon3 posts small blind [$0.50]
joe27 posts big blind [$1]
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to oldman100 [ Qc, Qd ]
Alfredo calls [$1]
89suited calls [$1]
kiffy calls [$1]
oldman100 raises to [$4.80]
pokermon3 folds
joe27 goes all-in
joe27 raises to [$85.75]
Alfredo folds
89suited folds
kiffy folds
oldman100 calls [$32.80]
oldman100 goes all-in
Returning uncalled bet [$48.15] to joe27
** Dealing Flop ** [ 7c, 8s, Th ]
** Dealing Turn ** [ Qs ]
** Dealing River ** [ 9c ]
** Showdown **
joe27 shows [ Js, Jh ] a straight, Queen to Eight
oldman100 mucks [ Qc, Qd ]
** Hand Conclusion **
joe27 wins $75.70 from main pot with a straight, Queen to Eight

a bit of luck !

NL $0.50/$1 Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, May 09, 00:10:06 GMT 2007
Table Fluorine 19 6-max (Real Money)
Seat 6 is the button
Total number of active players : 5
Seat 1: sharkie666 ( $170.28 )
Seat 2: oldman100 ( $46.50 )
Seat 3: Maserati ( $90.67 )
Seat 4: tr5 ( $0 )
Seat 5: Tr0tsky ( $254.40 )
Seat 6: andylau ( $51.81 )
sharkie666 posts small blind [$0.50]
oldman100 posts big blind [$1]
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to oldman100 [ Js, Qd ]
Maserati folds
Tr0tsky folds
andylau raises to [$2.70]
sharkie666 folds
oldman100 calls [$1.70]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 6d, 7c, Jd ]
oldman100 checks
andylau bets [$3.60]
oldman100 raises to [$7.20]
andylau goes all-in
andylau raises to [$49.11]
oldman100 calls [$36.60]
oldman100 goes all-in
Returning uncalled bet [$5.31] to andylau
** Dealing Turn ** [ 9d ]
** Dealing River ** [ Jh ]
** Showdown **
oldman100 shows [ Js, Qd ] three of a kind, Jacks
andylau mucks [ Ah, Ad ]
** Hand Conclusion **
oldman100 wins $90.50 from main pot with three of a kind, Jacks

oz_da II
09-05-2007, 07:05 AM
My second ever disconnection whilst playing online (over 50,000 hands) happened last night (first dc I wasn't in a hand). Second one occurs during the turn after I'd flopped the nut straight with two maniacs acting in front of me...

:grrr:

Needless to say I won the hand, 2nd place "winner" with two pair ended up winning more cash from the hand than I did. The other buffoon had top pair.

Was fuming. :veryangry

saul1664
09-05-2007, 07:53 AM
Just hit nut straight on turn, and called all in by two callers, first one on a complete bluff with A8 (nothing paired on board), I gladly call and he hits gutshot straight to split the pot. Doh.

SamTheOldGoat
09-05-2007, 11:04 AM
Horrible feeling when they go runner runner split pot! ZZZZZZZZ

KevTheOptimist
09-05-2007, 11:26 AM
Gav, that is a clearly a good call pre flop with QQ but an interesting one. How can you not put him on AA or KK with an all in raise pre flop like that? Even if you don't put him on AA or KK, you have to think he's got two overcards and therefore only a small underdog! Did you have a read?

Unlucky though none the less!

KevTheOptimist
09-05-2007, 11:26 AM
P.s. not sure whether you only post up your good play but you seem to make some crakcing calls and lay downs. (ahem apart from top pair mid kicker against AA!)

Gav The Hamster
09-05-2007, 11:30 AM
Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
Gav, that is a clearly a good call pre flop with QQ but an interesting one. How can you not put him on AA or KK with an all in raise pre flop like that? Even if you don't put him on AA or KK, you have to think he's got two overcards and therefore only a small underdog! Did you have a read?

Unlucky though none the less!


If he has AA or KK why would he want to raise me out of the pot with a massive bet....its not like I'm pot committed with my pre flop raise.

I'm thinking that at worse he has AK and I'm happy to run that race every time with QQ.

Gav The Hamster
09-05-2007, 11:33 AM
Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
P.s. not sure whether you only post up your good play but you seem to make some crakcing calls and lay downs. (ahem apart from top pair mid kicker against AA!)

of course I make donk calls, every one does but my play has tightened up alot recently and I'm a better player for it.

I dont get involved as much preflop with average hands which can then hit and get you in trouble. At the same time that means I'm less likely to suck out on someone and win big pots with mediocre hole cards.

And if you can lay QQ down in a cash game pre flop then I salute you ! I'm quite happy to fold JJ as I absolutely detest the hand but QQ and above no chance !

Gav The Hamster
09-05-2007, 11:36 AM
.

KevTheOptimist
09-05-2007, 11:50 AM
I've layed down QQ before and would have laid it down in the hand you posted above - all be it the wrong move having seen he has JJ.

I would lay it down if the tightest player in the world re raised a raiser with a decent amount of cash, and if someone goes in with 84 pre flop.

I do it myself with AA and KK sometimes, if it's raised before me and I think he may call then I'll go all in to create the deception that I have a weak holding, like you say, why would I go all in with AA or KK....

Number Six
10-05-2007, 12:43 PM
Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
like you say, why would I go all in with AA or KK....

What is the perceived wisdom with AA or KK? In cash games, low blinds, no limit when I slow (ish) play them (ie, with say a 4xBB preflop raise, hoping to reduce the number of callers but still interest one or maybe two others), half the time I lose the hand to rubbish or at least to moderate hands like say 10, J who would prob. have folded to a bigger bet.

Lots of these hands are not ones where you can get a good feel for when you are beaten, it's usually someone flopping a 2 pair or something (just the other day, someone calls the preflop raise with 59 (OK, it was suited but bloody hell) and flop comes down 59X and 5 on the turn!!).

I know people who seem to do better going all in or at least with a big, big preflop raise on the basis that mostly they will only clean up the blinds plus any earlier calls / raises, but now and again they get called so they now just have a one v. one with the best chance of not getting done by any one of multiple callers.

Or does slow play pay off better in the long run - will get more beats but bigger wins?

Gav The Hamster
10-05-2007, 01:21 PM
If you slow play AA or KK in a low blinds cash games your asking to get beat. Everytime i get AA KK or QQ i expect to put my whole stack at risk by no further than the turn. If you still have callers after the turn, you have made substantial size bets and there are no draws, your are comfortably beaten If you have KK or QQ and there is an A on flop and i get raised then I am likely to lay the hand down which is why I want to get my money in early, by flop really, to put the guy with Ax in a decision for all his stack.

Obviously when you commit your whole stack you still get sucked out on and it can be costly but at the same, you get more than compensated when you win. And in % terms you should be winning with AA far more than you lose with it.

oz_da II
10-05-2007, 01:59 PM
Originally posted by Number Six
What is the perceived wisdom with AA or KK? In cash games, low blinds, no limit when I slow (ish) play them (ie, with say a 4xBB preflop raise, hoping to reduce the number of callers but still interest one or maybe two others), half the time I lose the hand to rubbish or at least to moderate hands like say 10, J who would prob. have folded to a bigger bet.

Bet, bet, bet. If you come up with some resistance then you can consider folding depending on your past history with your opposition.
I play about 95% limit. So different tactics are required.

Recieved AA x 124 for a 71% win rate
KK x 139 for a 69% win rate

Quite amazingly QQ is still my most profitable hand after 30,000 plus hands, most likely because I've recieved it on 178 occasions.

Strathclyde Eagle
10-05-2007, 02:12 PM
Originally posted by Gav The Hamster
If you slow play AA or KK in a low blinds cash games your asking to get beat. Everytime i get AA KK or QQ i expect to put my whole stack at risk by no further than the turn. If you still have callers after the turn, you have made substantial size bets and there are no draws, your are comfortably beaten If you have KK or QQ and there is an A on flop and i get raised then I am likely to lay the hand down which is why I want to get my money in early, by flop really, to put the guy with Ax in a decision for all his stack.

Obviously when you commit your whole stack you still get sucked out on and it can be costly but at the same, you get more than compensated when you win. And in % terms you should be winning with AA far more than you lose with it.
What's the thing they keep repeating on Poker Night Live? "You're only getting called by a hand that's beating you." Fair enough if you're accepting that in return for mostly just picking up the blinds (beats a suck-out).

Gav The Hamster
10-05-2007, 02:55 PM
which is why I want to get my chips in early before I am behind in the hand.

The further into the hand you are being called the more chance you are being beaten, after all you only actually have one pair.

Pre flop, I will call any all in with AA KK or QQ. Post flop you dont want to the one flat calling with those hands, you want to be raising or folding. If you get sucked out on, then so be it, but at the end of the day, these are the hands that can make you the biggest pots if they hold up. (obviously the opposite applys if you get a suck out).

Number Six
10-05-2007, 04:53 PM
Where I've gone most wrong before is in late position where no one has raised, so think (know) they have nothing, so have slow played with just a 3x raise because a big bet or all in will probably grab the blinds / calls and no more - and I'm too greedy!! But then they have a good chance to hit lucky on flop.

Yeah, I think from now on its all in preflop with AA or KK, regardless of position or what anyone else has done. If that just takes down blinds then what the hell but it will avoid most of the rubbish beats!

Tell the truth, I find that overall the biggest wins at my (low) level are ones where you have a lot of passive players who let you stay in cheap preflop with a moderate hand and those hands then hit on the flop / turn (specially with Ax suited getting a cheap chance to nut flush), but that is not surprising, we all love passive players. So I reckon I will be more profitable just finding those tables, keep playing tight on those moderate hands till they hit - and just cutting out as many bad AA/KK hands by always piling in with them.

Thanks for your thoughts everyone........

Strathclyde Eagle
10-05-2007, 05:04 PM
The thing with that is that you're looking pretty transparent.

Monster raise = monster hand.
Standard raise = lesser hand.

Surely a consistent raise (whether it is 2.5x/3x/4x/5x big blind) makes you harder to read?

Number Six
10-05-2007, 11:04 PM
Originally posted by Strathclyde Eagle
The thing with that is that you're looking pretty transparent.

Monster raise = monster hand.
Standard raise = lesser hand.

Surely a consistent raise (whether it is 2.5x/3x/4x/5x big blind) makes you harder to read?

Yes thanks, I take the point about transparency. Trouble is, if having a consistent raise level and going large with AA / KK, it would also mean going large with marginal hands. That will soon get challenged. I think the thing to do is have a policy you stick with (ie, all in with AA / KK, lesser raise with other good hands) - but throw in a few curveballs now and again to mix it up and keep 'em guessing.

oz_da II
11-05-2007, 03:34 AM
Originally posted by Number Six
Yeah, I think from now on its all in preflop with AA or KK, regardless of position or what anyone else has done. If that just takes down blinds then what the hell but it will avoid most of the rubbish beats!

Tell the truth, I find that overall the biggest wins at my (low) level are ones where you have a lot of passive players who let you stay in cheap preflop with a moderate hand and those hands then hit on the flop / turn (specially with Ax suited getting a cheap chance to nut flush), but that is not surprising, we all love passive players. So I reckon I will be more profitable just finding those tables, keep playing tight on those moderate hands till they hit - and just cutting out as many bad AA/KK hands by always piling in with them.

Thanks for your thoughts everyone........

Acquiring less money with this tactic in my opinion.

Best tactic is to try to get one or two callers and take it from there. Bet the flop, bet the turn and use caution if met with any resistance.

Aces are 85% favourite against any random hand, and 87% favourite against any ace or any pair (a very ideal situation to be in). Are you sure you are getting consistently getting rubbish beats with AA? Don't see the point in taking just the blinds with a premium pre-flop hand.

RichieG
11-05-2007, 09:20 AM
I'm with Oz, I'm surprised some of you call a 4bb raise slow playing. Slow playing is calling and not raising, and is crazy play.

You must allways raise your big pairs, but you do want callers, so any more than 5bb is just bad play. In later levels (100/200+) I never raise more than 3bb. You have to give people the chance to suck out before you can take their chips.

Get Poker Tracker or Poker Office and put your bad beats in perspective, the times you get sucked out on will never be as often as the times you win with Aces and Kings - and even if in some freak case that's not true, it's variance and you shouldn't move away from optimal play just because you got sucked out on a few times.

The only time I would raise more than 5bb (in level 1 of an STT, 3bb later on) is when I have 99,1010 or even JJ and don't want to see a flop which is likely to have overcards.

SamTheOldGoat
11-05-2007, 09:34 AM
No 6- Definitely get the mix up. Sometimes I'll make it 16 to go with 45ss then only 13 to go with AK and 24 to go with AA etc at 2/4. Always mixing it up so it's harder for them to put you a 'set' hand.

As Richie mentioned, making it 4x to go, your not slowplaying, but if your playing a small limit table, people may well with calling with any old junk. I think the ONLY place to slow play AA/KK/QQ is UTG or UTG+1 if your playing full ring ready to come BACK OVER THE TOP of a raise.

PS, anyone play 7 card stud. Playing 2/4 and 3/6 limit and the play is AWFUL! Such a good game!

oz_da II
11-05-2007, 09:40 AM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
PS, anyone play 7 card stud. Playing 2/4 and 3/6 limit and the play is AWFUL! Such a good game!

Looking into it, have played a few freeroll tournaments and have had a few "live" cash games with a few mates. Currently reading the section on 7 card stud high-low in SS2, written by Todd Brunson. Definitely getting a feel for it.

Number Six
11-05-2007, 11:56 AM
Thanks for further comments. Maybe I am remembering the bad beats too much ahead of the winning hands or I'm just on a current bad run with them - or as likely, I'm not folding the AA, KK when I should so lose big too often.

Oz, the 30% of hands you lose with AA,KK - how many of them went to showdown compared with when you folded?

saul1664
11-05-2007, 09:20 PM
Can't hit trips to save my life and keep getting done by them. Called an all in raise early on in $20 tournament, read KA to my JJ, he had 88 and hit 8 on flop. Just got knocked out of sit and go one place outside of the money when his all in 66 makes quads. Need some variance my way.

saul1664
12-05-2007, 12:04 AM
When you get outdrawn, you get outdrawn. Sit and go, again top two get paid, down to last 3. Table is tight, player on left with 1500 chips always tends to call all in on my BB every time when his chips get low.

I have 3000 in chips, blinds are 200/400. I pick up KK on BB, player to the left calls all in as per usual, other player calls him, I reraise all in for all my chips thinking I am in best shape.

Cards turn over

Player to the left has Ad 6
Other player has 4d 4

Flop 6 d 6s 10 d
Turn 2d
River 7d

I go out in 3rd (one place outside the payoff)

saul1664
12-05-2007, 12:11 AM
That's only actually 58% favourite pre flop, though 80% over the 44. Don't know the odds of getting outdrawn by the two other players in a 3 way pot though.

oz_da II
12-05-2007, 02:18 AM
Originally posted by Number Six
Thanks for further comments. Maybe I am remembering the bad beats too much ahead of the winning hands or I'm just on a current bad run with them - or as likely, I'm not folding the AA, KK when I should so lose big too often.

Oz, the 30% of hands you lose with AA,KK - how many of them went to showdown compared with when you folded?

Losing with KK on 43 occassions - folded 4 of them (9.3%)
Losing with AA on 36 ocassions - folded 3 of them (8.3%)

I play limit so unless i'm about +90% sure that I'm beaten I'm going to have a look for one big bet.

KevTheOptimist
12-05-2007, 11:50 AM
I haven't won with AA for ever.

Last night was doing really well when I lost my AA to 98 suited. I knew he was trying it on going in on the flop so called on a board of 5 7 K needless to say he spiked his 6 for a $80 pot whih. I knew it was coming so didn't tilt and then proceeded to get beat by QQ wwhen holding JJ, mid straight by over straight, hig flush by higher flush and within half hour had been cleaned out.

How bad am I at poker lol

saul1664
12-05-2007, 11:36 PM
Fecking hell and again. 10 man sit and go. Have 1,000 chips, blinds 100/200, two limpers, I get QQ, push all in for 1000 chips, one of the limpers calls and makes quads with 22 (how could he think 22 was ahead?). Before I leave the table, he gets JJ next hand and hits his second consecutive quads with JJ on flop. Unreal.

KevTheOptimist
12-05-2007, 11:56 PM
ps I have actually decided I have a gambling problem lol. So, like quitting smoking, I'm quitting gambling, step by step, day by day. Total is my first clean day and long may it continue!!

And accepting that playing poker is gambling is the first step!!

RichieG
13-05-2007, 12:09 AM
Originally posted by saul1664
That's only actually 58% favourite pre flop, though 80% over the 44. Don't know the odds of getting outdrawn by the two other players in a 3 way pot though.

KK = 57.87%
A6 = 23.51%
44 = 18.31%

The draw is 0.31%

SamTheOldGoat
13-05-2007, 07:58 AM
Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
ps I have actually decided I have a gambling problem lol. So, like quitting smoking, I'm quitting gambling, step by step, day by day. Total is my first clean day and long may it continue!!

And accepting that playing poker is gambling is the first step!!

GOLD:D

KevTheOptimist
13-05-2007, 11:36 AM
Was a bit beered up lol

But is kinda true lol

saul1664
14-05-2007, 10:31 PM
0.50/$1 cash game

Dealt As Kh, raise to $2

one caller

Flop 4h Qh 10h

call $1.50

flat called

Turn Jd (giving me straight)

call $1.50
raised $3.00

River 7h (giving 2nd nut flush)

call $6
re-raised $48

what do you do now?

Keele Eagle
14-05-2007, 10:59 PM
Easy, based on 3 things
1st: You're a cash player
2nd; You're getting good odds
3rd: Some cud say you're pot commited
So you call, you can't risk running into nut flush, as by the looks he mite have limped in with Ah rag, so he mite reraise again. If you do end up winning the hand just think about the fact that u've won an extra $48 not lost wotever you cud have re-raised.
But i don't know what i'm talkin about i only deal the game.

Though i'm a bit of a gambler so i wud rearise pot, assuming it's pot limit!

eagles #1
14-05-2007, 11:02 PM
I've started playing and im only 18 :( Not good.

DANCOO
14-05-2007, 11:04 PM
Originally posted by Keele Eagle
Easy, based on 3 things
1st: You're a cash player
2nd; You're getting good odds
3rd: Some cud say you're pot commited
So you call, you can't risk running into nut flush, as by the looks he mite have limped in with Ah rag, so he mite reraise again. If you do end up winning the hand just think about the fact that u've won an extra $48 not lost wotever you cud have re-raised.
But i don't know what i'm talkin about i only deal the game.

Though i'm a bit of a gambler so i wud rearise pot, assuming it's pot limit!

:confused: :confused:

DANCOO
14-05-2007, 11:07 PM
Originally posted by saul1664
0.50/$1 cash game

Dealt As Kh, raise to $2

one caller

Flop 4h Qh 10h

call $1.50

flat called

Turn Jd (giving me straight)

call $1.50
raised $3.00

River 7h (giving 2nd nut flush)

call $6
re-raised $48

what do you do now?

First off, can I assume you meant:

0.50/$1 cash game

Dealt As Kh, raise to $2

one caller

Flop 4h Qh 10h

bet $1.50

flat called

Turn Jd (giving me straight)

bet $1.50
raised $3.00
call $1.50

River 7h (giving 2nd nut flush)

bet $6
raised $48

?

Keele Eagle
14-05-2007, 11:09 PM
Why the sad faces, have i said something wrong, i reckon a lot of the players i deal to would have re-raised pot, and it's definately not a hand you lay down, imo, though anybody explaining otherwise would be very welcome?

DANCOO
14-05-2007, 11:13 PM
He could well have flopped the nuts there and allowed you to catch up by hitting the fourth heart.
You bet all the way so he's probably got you on a flush by the river (this is assuming he has half a brain).

What's he been playing like up until now?

If you have him down as a solid player, you may want to consider folding. If he's the sort of person who would push with the Jh...you may consider calling.

DANCOO
14-05-2007, 11:24 PM
Originally posted by Keele Eagle
Why the sad faces, have i said something wrong, i reckon a lot of the players i deal to would have re-raised pot, and it's definately not a hand you lay down, imo, though anybody explaining otherwise would be very welcome?

Not sad faces, confused - I didn't understand your reasoning.

1st - You're a cash player ?!?
2nd - He's getting less than 2-1, he needs to have some sort of read on the player to figure out his odds, as the other player is apparantly playing the nuts.
3rd - Numbers don't add up for pot-limit.

Can't decipher the rest.


I may be way off the mark here as I haven't played cash Hold'em for quite a while, but that would be my reasoning.

Keele Eagle
14-05-2007, 11:25 PM
I see where you're comin from DANCOO, and i wud also be inclined to know how he had previously been playing, plus the positions of said players, but u'd also need to think (considering i havent worked out whether the $48 raise was pot, which it looks like it was) if it was then perhaps he's trying to overprice the pot to force you out, maybe thinkin he has at most Jh maybe with the 9h for a staright flush draw, i see a lower raise being more 'surrepticious' (though that mite not be the word, perhaps i'm think of in-conspicouos (sp))

Though as i say i only deal the game and know that playin on the computer is a whole different matter, which the two of you (saul and dancoo) seem to be well adept at.

Keele Eagle
14-05-2007, 11:36 PM
:( :( :(
OMG it's been a long day i had a look back at the caluclations and yeh they dont add up to pot limit, perhaps me evaluation was a bit premature, not knowing all the facts.

Just to clarify what i mean by being a cash player, is that it is completely different to tourney in the fact that u'll likely to throw away completely different hands. Hmm i'm not explaining this well, paps i'll just shut up.

I think this will be my last post on this thread. Bye
:hi:

oz_da II
15-05-2007, 12:35 AM
I'm only folding to the tightest of rocks.
Reluctant call...

DANCOO
15-05-2007, 06:05 AM
Originally posted by Keele Eagle
:( :( :(
OMG it's been a long day i had a look back at the caluclations and yeh they dont add up to pot limit, perhaps me evaluation was a bit premature, not knowing all the facts.

Just to clarify what i mean by being a cash player, is that it is completely different to tourney in the fact that u'll likely to throw away completely different hands. Hmm i'm not explaining this well, paps i'll just shut up.

I think this will be my last post on this thread. Bye
:hi:

:(

Wasn't trying to hound you out (we need more contributers to this thread (even though my own posts have been somewhat thin recently)), just putting my own perspective forward - correct or otherwise, plus I was very tired.

You say you're a dealer, where do you deal?

oz_da - this is probably the sort of hand where if I was playing cash hold'em I would lose most of my money on - the 'very hard top lay down hands'. I would 'probably' call in most situations, but would like to think I could fold this hand aswell if I felt I was behind.

Without more information, I would like to think I could fold this hand.

oz_da II
15-05-2007, 06:33 AM
Originally posted by DANCOO
oz_da - this is probably the sort of hand where if I was playing cash hold'em I would lose most of my money on - the 'very hard top lay down hands'. I would 'probably' call in most situations, but would like to think I could fold this hand aswell if I felt I was behind.

Without more information, I would like to think I could fold this hand.

A good reason for keeping notes. Fold to a "no-nonsnse" player, call to a loose/maniac style of a player. Most of my online play is limit (about 95%) so it's an easy call for me, actually let's cap it. ;)

oz_da II
15-05-2007, 07:19 AM
What to do...

This happened to me in a live tournament on the weekend. It was the final of a year long weekly game I play in so I know all player's tendencies very well.

UTG 600 - loose passive
MP 1000 - tight passive
CO 3000 - loose aggressive
Button (me) 5100
SB 750 - loose aggressive
BB 4200 - loose aggresive

Blinds 50-100

UTG goes all in with his 600, folds around to me on the button, I have JJ.

How would you play it?

Strathclyde Eagle
15-05-2007, 08:32 AM
Originally posted by Keele Eagle
:( :( :(
OMG it's been a long day i had a look back at the caluclations and yeh they dont add up to pot limit, perhaps me evaluation was a bit premature, not knowing all the facts.

Just to clarify what i mean by being a cash player, is that it is completely different to tourney in the fact that u'll likely to throw away completely different hands. Hmm i'm not explaining this well, paps i'll just shut up.

I think this will be my last post on this thread. Bye
:hi:
Still an interesting post. I'd follow Dancoo's lead and ask for you to post again, especially as your point that cash games and tourneys require different play is extremely valid.
Originally posted by oz_da II
What to do...

This happened to me in a live tournament on the weekend. It was the final of a year long weekly game I play in so I know all player's tendencies very well.

UTG 600 - loose passive
MP 1000 - tight passive
CO 3000 - loose aggressive
Button (me) 5100
SB 750 - loose aggressive
BB 4200 - loose aggresive

Blinds 50-100

UTG goes all in with his 600, folds around to me on the button, I have JJ.

How would you play it?
Re-raise to isolate IMO. The small blind is only going to play if he has a hand, but you don't want the big blind to have odds to call. If you just call there's 1350 in the pot and just another 500 for him to call, so take him out of the hand right then and there.

Can't say what I'd re-raise it to. That's one of those things I don't know I'm afraid. Re-raising amounts is something I always get wrong.

RichieG
15-05-2007, 09:00 AM
I'd push that hand Oz, as Strath says to isolate what is probably a poor hand, at desperation stage, with an effective M of less than 4, even if you get calls, there are after all only three hands ahead of you!

And on Saul's second nut flush example, I'd make a crying call against an unknown, and maybe lay down to a rock.

RichieG
15-05-2007, 09:10 AM
What did you do Saul, and did he have the nuts?

PoolKing
15-05-2007, 09:26 AM
Originally posted by oz_da II
What to do...

This happened to me in a live tournament on the weekend. It was the final of a year long weekly game I play in so I know all player's tendencies very well.

UTG 600 - loose passive
MP 1000 - tight passive
CO 3000 - loose aggressive
Button (me) 5100
SB 750 - loose aggressive
BB 4200 - loose aggresive

Blinds 50-100

UTG goes all in with his 600, folds around to me on the button, I have JJ.

How would you play it?

As others have said, I would raise his bet too. Probably double his bet so that it costs 1200 for BB to take part.

RichieG
15-05-2007, 10:05 AM
I still think a push is optimal, you don't want calls from hands like AK, AQ or even KQ, and if you don't push you could see overcards on a flop and end up folding.

Does depend on the structure though - how many places paid and how quick the blinds are, if it's very slow I suppose you could justify a smaller raise with a chance to get away from it if the overcards do come. Mostly in a tourney as the big stack I'm trying to dominate with hands like JJ. Raise maybe better in cash play.

oz_da II
15-05-2007, 10:16 AM
Blinds were every 30 mins and didn't double each blind, plenty of play.
Top 3 paid, first was $300, 2nd $100, 3rd $50.

RichieG
15-05-2007, 10:28 AM
With that structure you've gotta be playing for the outright win, so I push and am happy to gamble if either of the blinds has a hand. Standard 50/30/20 payouts you'd be worried more about making sure you made the money, but here you've gotta be bold!

Zola's Chin
15-05-2007, 01:59 PM
My tuppence worth...

Oz's hand I'm not thinking too hard about - raise to 1200.

Saul's dilemma is far more tricky. The re-raise is on the large size & it's difficult to tell whether it's an 'attempt to make you fold the best hand' raise or a 'I know I've got you beat, but I think you've got something you'll call with' raise.
If I call, I'm fearing the worst which has to make it the wrong move. So, fold. But if a similar situation arises at the same table later on, you've got to call, as the chances of your opponents bluffing increases if you're seen to fold to a big re-raise.

RichieG
15-05-2007, 02:31 PM
Does anyone on here use SitnGo Power Tools? Or any other ICM analysis tool for looking at push/fold decisions?

If so what effect has it had on your results? Thinking about buying SnGPT as I almost always get to the bubble in the 5-man turbos I play but have recently had about a 10 buy in downswing that is making me start to question my game.

Reps AJ
15-05-2007, 07:35 PM
Given some of the hands I've been losing to today - you know, the monsters like 85os :bash: - was it any surprise that when I flopped a royal flush no-one would play and only won a few dollars on it :sob:

bunghole
16-05-2007, 01:47 AM
Originally posted by oz_da II
How would you play it?

I'd go all in. :o :lux: :hi:

oz_da II
16-05-2007, 02:48 AM
Originally posted by bunghole
I'd go all in. :o :lux: :hi:

Yep, that's what I did, my idea was to keep the blinds out of it.

Instant call from the short stacked SB ($750), BB "ums and ahs" for ages and finally goes all in himself, what could he have???

UTG flips over A6, me - JJ, SB - KK (no worries I'm after BB's chips), BB flips over AT suited :eek: (wow how stinky is that?)

Anyway, flop comes out 2 Q Q
Turn 9 (no flush draw for BB, so he's chasing one of the two aces)
And of course the river is an ace. UTG and SB out and me crippled down to 900...

One of the worst calls I've ever seen, what did he think he was beating?
Goes on to win it and I crash out in 3rd after a series of all in. Flopped a flush when way behind to knock out the 4th place finisher, which was nice...

bunghole
16-05-2007, 03:55 AM
Might be best not to ask me what I'd do in future.

I'm now 0-1 lifetime, or 100% failure ratio. :o

oz_da II
16-05-2007, 05:33 AM
Originally posted by bunghole
Might be best not to ask me what I'd do in future.

I'm now 0-1 lifetime, or 100% failure ratio. :o

It's still (I think) the correct action. One of the first things one learns is that the correct action doesn't always result in raking in the chips.

bunghole
16-05-2007, 06:11 AM
Originally posted by oz_da II
It's still (I think) the correct action. One of the first things one learns is that the correct action doesn't always result in raking in the chips.

Much like HT/FT doubles. :o

oz_da II
16-05-2007, 06:42 AM
Originally posted by bunghole
Much like HT/FT doubles. :o

Putting cash on HT/FT doubles is never the correct action. :clown:

saul1664
16-05-2007, 10:53 AM
Originally posted by RichieG
What did you do Saul, and did he have the nuts?

I folded. I hadn't a read on the player as it was fairly early on. He's re-raised me on the turn (albeit not much) and called regulation 4 x BB pre-flop which is quite feasible with something like A3 suited, its no limit so he is getting no odds whatsoever to put me all in on the river if he hasn't got the nuts. The only other scenario is that he got the straight as well on the turn, but you'd have to be a lunatic to put someone all in on a straight with 4 hearts on the board, so I folded. He didn't tell me what he had so I'll never know.

Though earlier I won a big pot (different player) when I got pushed all in on the river. I had Q10 and hit two pair on flop. Knew I was ahead then, and though the A was a scare card, didn't put him on two pair, and betting was completely uncharacteristic in relation to pot size and cards on the board, so when he pushed all in for $40, I called and he turned over 25 offsuit (he raised 3 x BB with it as well).

Difference between the two, is that I got a read on the second, the other one was far harder.

SamTheOldGoat
16-05-2007, 11:48 AM
Dissertations in and Unis nearly finished so playing for a living is about to start. Going to run $100 sngs ONLY with $8k behind me so 80 buy ins. Will keep updated of how it goes :)

Played £20R, obviously bubbled, brother chopped it though as a £5k guarantee so not too bad. Played £2/£4 cash after, sucked out with QQ V AA then got paid heavy with quads KINGS. Lost KK to 99 when he rivered the set, then lost flush to a flopped house! LOL

Anyway, here's the sickest hand I put into p.hand that occured live last night, some (SOS ;)) MAY think it's rigged. This is the SICKEST bad beat in poker, there isn't one any worse. Enjoy

SICKEST BEAT EVER (http://www.pokerhand.org/?1100963)

Eagle Of Cray
16-05-2007, 03:33 PM
Originally posted by SamTheOldGoat
SICKEST BEAT EVER (http://www.pokerhand.org/?1100963)

Sorry thats mystified me. After the showdown it says XX shows a flush ace high yet he has put down 2 Q's. Amongst a whole host of other things what am I missing here?

Ifill Good
16-05-2007, 04:00 PM
Originally posted by Eagle Of Cray
Sorry thats mystified me. After the showdown it says XX shows a flush ace high yet he has put down 2 Q's. Amongst a whole host of other things what am I missing here?

yeah that is seriously messed up, how does he show the flush, and how does the other guy only have a pair of aces, with one already on the board?!? :confused:

I can see that losing to quad queens on the river could be a killer though!!:eek: :eek:

KevTheOptimist
16-05-2007, 04:04 PM
STOG has created that file from a live game scenario so prob hasn't put all that much effort into the finer details, it's more the cards on the board and in the hands you should be looking at.