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JRLJamielin
19-04-2014, 04:22 PM
Just wondering what type of undersoil heating we have now ordered!?

Congrats to everyone at the club for keeping their heads in a time of crisis, and leading us to safety!

CPFC2010
19-04-2014, 10:04 PM
Just wondering what type of undersoil heating we have now ordered!?

Congrats to everyone at the club for keeping their heads in a time of crisis, and leading us to safety!

I don't know what it's called but it costs a lot and needs a very big boiler.

Jay1969
19-04-2014, 10:07 PM
To be honest it won't get used much.

CPFC2010
19-04-2014, 10:10 PM
To be honest it won't get used much.

I know, but like the tv studio it has to be provided in the Premier League.

MasterYoda
19-04-2014, 10:19 PM
Just tell them it's in and if we have a cold snap blame teething troubles and that it broke

Bobby Woodruff
19-04-2014, 11:35 PM
It should improve the quality of the pitch since the warmer ground will improve grass growth.

Eagle's Away
19-04-2014, 11:42 PM
Yes Steve, but 24 months ago you would have given your right arm for such seemingly daft problems. Any improvement in the ground & facilities to make us Premier League standard is fine by me.

Odds Against
20-04-2014, 01:08 AM
If the whole ground has to be dug up then surely a ground source heat pump should be installed? Forget massive boilers/fuel bills,with the RHI it could pay for itself in 3-4 years.

Taedry
20-04-2014, 07:33 AM
When they install the heating can they put a little heating under my seat please, I am sure there would be no extra cost. ;)

CPFC_Fan
20-04-2014, 09:57 AM
Solar panels on the main stand to store the power for heating the water? That will also provide some of the power for the main stand too.

Hopefully someone can do the maths for installation costs/how much money can be saved using them vs conventional means. It may even pay for itself within a few years?

stumpy feelers
20-04-2014, 10:29 AM
Sod the under soil heating please tell the groundsman to put up red and blue nets next season. Thanks.

baldeagle68
20-04-2014, 11:59 AM
If the whole ground has to be dug up then surely a ground source heat pump should be installed? Forget massive boilers/fuel bills,with the RHI it could pay for itself in 3-4 years.

This is very true and should be looked in to plus you may even get a grant for the green initiative:p

And solar panels in the roof of the new stands would be good aswell should easily cover the lighting and power costs for the stands. And the power we do not use you sell back to the utility companies....win win :p

dannyturner
20-04-2014, 01:20 PM
Avoid solar panels, they will look like receivers for our spy satellites and we'll be investigated!

Green Bin
20-04-2014, 01:41 PM
I don't know what it's called but it costs a lot and needs a very big boiler.

If you were to put in a ground source borehole or loop whilst laying the pipes for the pitch you could use a smaller boiler, as you can extract heat from the ground (even in winter) which means the amount of energy you need to heat the anti-frost loop is less.

Be nice to run a branch off the system to a heat exchanger in the Whitehorse stand so we could have hot water in the toilets!....although solar thermal and/or local electric point of use water heating would be cheaper

Sorry if a bit technical.... need to get bins for the paper towels in first!

JRLJamielin
20-04-2014, 03:42 PM
If you're looking at renewable energy methods, wind turbines are an uglier and more space consuming alternative, but are vastly superior to solar panels in terms of efficiency, reliability, longevity and energy production

JRLJamielin
20-04-2014, 07:12 PM
I'm astounded that wind turbines are both vastly superior in terms of reliability and longevity than solar panels when the former is a bag of moving parts whilst the latter has none.

How does that work then?

I did an assignment about it at University, part of an environmental project for an external client.

To be fair this information was from a source based in the US two years ago, so it may be slightly out of date, however, my definition of reliability is how often they generate power.

Wind turbines generate power night and day, and the gearboxes can be adjusted for wind speed etc. and only stop generating power when there is absolutely no wind.

Solar Panels can only produce power when there is enough light, and they work off of UV light, so even on a sunny day, they may produce less energy than a miserable day depending on what the UV levels are (although it is unlikely that on a cloudy day they will be higher than that of a sunny day).

Both technologies have come on leaps and bounds recently, but the fact is that Solar Panels convert only 20-25% of the light they absorb into electricity, whereas the tolerance with wind turbines (accounting for things such as friction) is about 95% which is a substantial difference.

Obviously a Main Stand's roof's worth of solar panels may produce more energy than 1 wind turbine or even 2, but that would be costly, especially if they decide to tear down and rebuild stands etc.

An example of a modern turbine we as a group picked out at Uni would produce 40,000KwH of electricity a year at max capacity, whereas 1 solar panel would produce about 36.5KwH energy per year (100 watt solar panel).

There is a considerable difference, but again, it depends on how they are to be used and more importantly the actions each would have on the wider community. Large wind turbines would require planning permission (and Croydon Council famously seem to dislike the club so it probably won't happen).

Also, the technology for Solar Panels changes all the time, to make them slightly better year on year, whereas wind turbines are a longer term solution as the technology hasn't really changed much since their introduction

Hedgehog
20-04-2014, 08:34 PM
Lets face it, it is only needed for the diving Prima donnas of the Premiership so they will be nice and toasty rolling around in agony in that nasty cold grass.

dave_who_ru
21-04-2014, 06:25 PM
Besides the under-soil heating are there any new Premier League stadium requirements that we need to complete by next season?

CPFC2010
21-04-2014, 07:25 PM
Besides the under-soil heating are there any new Premier League stadium requirements that we need to complete by next season?

Yes - new and more powerful floodlights. That's another few hundred grand.

foresthillbilly
21-04-2014, 07:44 PM
I did an assignment about it at University, part of an environmental project for an external client.

To be fair this information was from a source based in the US two years ago, so it may be slightly out of date, however, my definition of reliability is how often they generate power.

Wind turbines generate power night and day, and the gearboxes can be adjusted for wind speed etc. and only stop generating power when there is absolutely no wind.

Solar Panels can only produce power when there is enough light, and they work off of UV light, so even on a sunny day, they may produce less energy than a miserable day depending on what the UV levels are (although it is unlikely that on a cloudy day they will be higher than that of a sunny day).

Both technologies have come on leaps and bounds recently, but the fact is that Solar Panels convert only 20-25% of the light they absorb into electricity, whereas the tolerance with wind turbines (accounting for things such as friction) is about 95% which is a substantial difference.

Obviously a Main Stand's roof's worth of solar panels may produce more energy than 1 wind turbine or even 2, but that would be costly, especially if they decide to tear down and rebuild stands etc.

An example of a modern turbine we as a group picked out at Uni would produce 40,000KwH of electricity a year at max capacity, whereas 1 solar panel would produce about 36.5KwH energy per year (100 watt solar panel).

There is a considerable difference, but again, it depends on how they are to be used and more importantly the actions each would have on the wider community. Large wind turbines would require planning permission (and Croydon Council famously seem to dislike the club so it probably won't happen).

Also, the technology for Solar Panels changes all the time, to make them slightly better year on year, whereas wind turbines are a longer term solution as the technology hasn't really changed much since their introduction

not being able to get Planning Permission would prevent any wind turbines.
Conversely, solar panels no longer need PP, and neither wold heat pumps

Lord Flange
21-04-2014, 07:51 PM
Not that I disbelieve you Steve, but how the hell do some new lamps cost a few hundred grand? Mind boggling..

CPFC2010
21-04-2014, 07:56 PM
Not that I disbelieve you Steve, but how the hell do some new lamps cost a few hundred grand? Mind boggling..

It's quite a lot more work than some new lamps!

Woosie
21-04-2014, 08:10 PM
Yes - new and more powerful floodlights. That's another few hundred grand.

Why? Are Premier League stadia darker than any other league or something?

Barbara4003
21-04-2014, 08:37 PM
Do they use LED lights in the flood lights?

I had some put in my kitchen and they are so much brighter than normal lights.

maestro
21-04-2014, 08:42 PM
It's quite a lot more work than some new lamps!

Hi Steve

Do you know what the lighting requirements are and how it differs from championship requirements? is is a certain lux level?

Ive done a search but all I kind find so far is that championship grounds have to have 800 lux average which increases from 500 lux this year

Also will the new floodlights be LED?

Sorry for all the questions, im a bit of lighting guru from my other hobby Reef tanks/coral growing.

lukecpfc123
21-04-2014, 08:49 PM
Yes - new and more powerful floodlights. That's another few hundred grand.

Its all a bit of a joke really, the stuff they ask you for, there's nothing wrong with the floodlights we have? Just unnecessary and wasteful.

spt1978
21-04-2014, 08:56 PM
Hi Steve,

Could we recycle any of these improvements into any ground development stuff we do?

dave_who_ru
21-04-2014, 09:26 PM
Yes - new and more powerful floodlights. That's another few hundred grand.

Presumably we would have had to have done this if we had been relegated as I recall reading elsewhere that the Football League had upped its minimum requirements from next season.

CPFC2010
21-04-2014, 09:33 PM
Yes, it's a requirement to increase the lux levels for the latest tv technology,

dave_who_ru
21-04-2014, 09:43 PM
Yes, it's a requirement to increase the lux levels for the latest tv technology,

:lux::lux::lux: (sorry I couldn't resist it)

JRLJamielin
21-04-2014, 09:51 PM
Yes, it's a requirement to increase the lux levels for the latest tv technology,

Is all this stuff simply for the TV rights/crews then? Seems like our lights are absolutely fine to me! Although that Jumbotron has never worked properly for ages!

andy burton
21-04-2014, 10:17 PM
Is all this stuff simply for the TV rights/crews then? Seems like our lights are absolutely fine to me! Although that Jumbotron has never worked properly for ages!

Most of the money comes from TV rights so what they want they get!