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View Full Version : Was it a penalty?


Looking2curl1
13-02-2016, 09:22 PM
Not see any replays but thought it looked incredibly harsh in real time. No Watford appeal either.

Not a penalty, a harsh penalty or stonewall??

GreatGonzo
13-02-2016, 09:25 PM
No-one in the ground realised he had given a penalty for about 5 seconds, not the players not the fans, no-one so if it was I think it was probably harsh and soft but haven't seen it again.

Salad_Burnet
13-02-2016, 09:25 PM
I've not a clue what happened. I saw one of their players climb on the shoulders of one of ours and thought the decision was for that, but that was it.

st albans
13-02-2016, 09:26 PM
Pardew seemed to think it was

Looking2curl1
13-02-2016, 09:27 PM
Exactly what I thought at the time. When I left the ground I thought more would've been made of this controversy on here.

I guess our general shitness has rather stolen the limelight.

cpfcfly
13-02-2016, 09:27 PM
Jedinak pulled down Deeney.

By the letter of the law it's a penalty.

The implementation of said law however is sketchy. Jedinak himself has been subject to the same type of treatment or worse within the penalty area and nothing has happened. The inconsistency of officials applying the law is terrible.

It is a penalty, but we should've had more earlier in the season too.

GreatGonzo
13-02-2016, 09:28 PM
Pardew seemed to think it was

He said there was holding but we have had players grappled to the floor and nothing so in the 1st set play of the game to give it was harsh was hat he said.

Jim Cannon
13-02-2016, 09:28 PM
Initially I thought he was giving a free kick to us for some infringement though I had no idea what.

El Aguila
13-02-2016, 09:30 PM
Yes, it was a penalty. Completely unnecessary, and a bit unusual to see those given, but it was a penalty.

A Wooden Fish On Wheels
13-02-2016, 09:31 PM
Was there a foul that lead to the free kick that indirectly gave them their second goal?

Radio said the penalty was, 'controversial', the players and fans didn't seem to spot anything much at the time, my gut instinct says it was something that happens in every game from every corner... but then I haven't seen the all-important video :D and I didn't see anything at the time at the game!

orp pisshead1
13-02-2016, 09:32 PM
Not one Watford player appealed and you could tell they shocked when it was given.

hatter8142
13-02-2016, 09:35 PM
I thought I saw a Watford hand pushing Deeley in the back.

orp pisshead1
13-02-2016, 09:35 PM
Was there a foul that lead to the free kick that indirectly gave them their second goal?

Radio said the penalty was, 'controversial', the players and fans didn't seem to spot anything much at the time, my gut instinct says it was something that happens in every game from every corner... but then I haven't seen the all-important video :D and I didn't see anything at the time at the game!

Was in the AW and everyone went mad when he gave the free kick. Awful ref performance.

orp pisshead1
13-02-2016, 09:36 PM
I thought I saw a Watford hand pushing Deeley in the back.

Clever ploy if true.

Chillo
13-02-2016, 09:37 PM
Radio said the penalty was, 'controversial',

as does the Sky Sports report on their app.

I think about 24k fans and players were surprised to see it given.

DeanGoodsnake
13-02-2016, 09:38 PM
Jedinak pulled down Deeney.

By the letter of the law it's a penalty.

The implementation of said law however is sketchy. Jedinak himself has been subject to the same type of treatment or worse within the penalty area and nothing has happened. The inconsistency of officials applying the law is terrible.

It is a penalty, but we should've had more earlier in the season too.

Shocking decision bearing in mind what teams have got away against us...,
The cnuts in charge don't seem to know either ...Barry against Jedinack and Wickham against spurs result in actually us being penalised again

jordanismygod
13-02-2016, 09:39 PM
Yes, it was a penalty. Completely unnecessary, and a bit unusual to see those given, but it was a penalty.


Letter of the law, yes. Should it of been a penalty? No.
10 penalties a game otherwise.
It just shows how inconsistent they are.

A Wooden Fish On Wheels
13-02-2016, 09:40 PM
If you give a pen at one end then you have to be consistent with any holding, pushing etc. at the other end but he was not. To be fair he seemed to be right up with the play for most of the game and was very close to the action... when he gave the wrong decisions. Which makes you wonder if he was just stupid or was favouring Watford.

Thefunkymonk
13-02-2016, 09:40 PM
Technically yes.

But that didn't cost us he game.

Brumie Allan
13-02-2016, 09:43 PM
I think this ref topped Clattenburg, which is no mean feat.

Looking2curl1
13-02-2016, 09:44 PM
Letter of the law, yes. Should it of been a penalty? No.
10 penalties a game otherwise.
It just shows how inconsistent they are.

And the last thing we needed in the opening 15 minutes with already fragile confidence.

What is it with football? That sort of thing that only happens when the chips are down. :rolleyes:

917L
13-02-2016, 09:45 PM
Technically yes.

But that didn't cost us he game.

Well seeing as we only lost by 1 goal, it did

GreatGonzo
13-02-2016, 09:46 PM
Well seeing as we only lost by 1 goal, it did

His decisions like not to give free kicks when our players were body checked or when Wilf was tripped in front of Block B didn't help us either.

JDawg
13-02-2016, 09:47 PM
Who was the ref and was it his first game? He might need to re-aquaint himself at under 8 level before getting another PL gig.

A Wooden Fish On Wheels
13-02-2016, 09:48 PM
I think this ref topped Clattenburg, which is no mean feat. The game was so slooooooow! He pissed around so much we must have only seen about 30 minutes of 'open play'.

El Aguila
13-02-2016, 09:48 PM
Yeah, he made a lot of bad decisions and they were nearly all against us.
But it was a penalty, it really was. The red card was correct as well.

Hedgehog
13-02-2016, 09:49 PM
It was a bloody rugby tackle! Mile has form for this.

redandblue
13-02-2016, 09:50 PM
as does the Sky Sports report on their app.

I think about 24k fans and players were surprised to see it given.


Sadly what the sky sports app, the bbc and what all the fans and players see or don't see does not matter

maestro
13-02-2016, 09:51 PM
Very unlucky to get that given against us but Jedinak does have a horrible habbit of wrestling players

917L
13-02-2016, 09:52 PM
Who was the ref and was it his first game? He might need to re-aquaint himself at under 8 level before getting another PL gig.


Robert (Bobby) Madeley

Oddly when he was warming up in front of the AW he was getting a bit of banter, shit refree etc, which he took in good spirit, laughing and gave thumbs up

Someone near me said that he was now likely to give an odd decsion against us, and he certainy did

Not seen a replay of the pen yet, but he must have been teh only person in SE25 who thought there was an offence worthy of a penalty when the ball was played in

Everyone thought he had blown for a Palace freekick at first

eagle-leg
13-02-2016, 09:52 PM
If you are going to give those as decisions you have to do so in the first game of the season, not half way through feb

Looking2curl1
13-02-2016, 09:53 PM
Very unlucky to get that given against us but Jedinak does have a horrible habbit of wrestling players

Hmmm Burnley last year springs to mind.

mrgins
13-02-2016, 09:53 PM
If it was outside the box, it would clearly be a foul. In the box, refs will often judge things a bit differently. He saw Jedi wrestle deemed but he didn't see deemed push Jedi in the chest. I thought it was six of one half dozen of the other

Jim Cannon
13-02-2016, 09:59 PM
Yeah, he made a lot of bad decisions and they were nearly all against us.
But it was a penalty, it really was. The red card was correct as well.

I do not think a single person would argue about the red card unless they are an idiot

Golf Boy
13-02-2016, 10:09 PM
Having just seen it, jedinak had arms around but did not pull him down or pull his shirt. Ok give the pen but also 10 others per game.

brighton_eagle
13-02-2016, 10:09 PM
Was there a foul that lead to the free kick that indirectly gave them their second goal?


No way was that a foul. Won the ball cleanly. Also thought it shouldn't have been a corner.

I would like to see the 60000000 offside decisions again.

Malarkey
13-02-2016, 10:13 PM
Yep

Thefunkymonk
13-02-2016, 10:15 PM
Well seeing as we only lost by 1 goal, it did

Terrible tactics, terrible defending were to blame for us losing. Excuse after excuse on here.. 'Refs fault', 'injuries'... Maybe we just aren't that good...

pardew's shorts
13-02-2016, 10:17 PM
It was a penalty, but then why, having given it without any warnings/discussions, did the referee then warn/discuss the next time we had a corner?

It was a penalty, but then why didn't we get one for Barry on Jedinak, or Vertonghen on Wickham, to name just two examples? Why isn't it a penalty every time Smalling defends a corner?

917L
13-02-2016, 10:19 PM
Terrible tactics, terrible defending were to blame for us losing. Excuse after excuse on here.. 'Refs fault', 'injuries'... Maybe we just aren't that good...

I havent asserted any of those things, merely rebuffed the statement you made

He doesnt give the openalty, we dont lose the game (All other things being equal)

Thefunkymonk
13-02-2016, 10:21 PM
I havent asserted any of those things, merely rebuffed the statement you made

He doesnt give the openalty, we dont lose the game (All other things being equal)

In the basic term yes I agree.. But we aren't good at the moment. Second half we looked better.. Until Pardew took Mutch off for Campbell.. Woeful decision. Really doubting his tactical nous

glenn.f
13-02-2016, 10:24 PM
Watching the replays it looked to me like Deeney, after pointing out to the ref, allowed Jedinak to keep grabbing him before sort of falling down, rather than being pulled down. Clever play or gamesmanship who knows, but Jedinak was a tit for being so blatant. Standard that it was a Palace player that was caught with his pants down with a ref proving a point.

sydney eagle
13-02-2016, 10:24 PM
The thing that infuriated me was 2 minutes after gifting them a penalty they didn't even remotely appeal for we had a corner and he stopped the game to warn the Watford defenders. Meanwhile Scott Dann was sticking the ball in the net.

Jedinak fouled Deeney, no argument but it quite literally happens in every corner in every game in any league. The inconsistency is shambolic

917L
13-02-2016, 10:24 PM
In the basic term yes I agree.. But we aren't good at the moment. Second half we looked better.. Until Pardew took Mutch off for Campbell.. Woeful decision. Really doubting his tactical nous

Oh, I agree with that 100% :p

Penstone Eagle
13-02-2016, 10:24 PM
Jedi is more interested in fouling than playing football, usually a sign of a player totally out of his depth.

elwood
13-02-2016, 10:28 PM
Watford were the better team today, but the ref made some very odd and inconsistent decisions today, he wasn't the worst ref I've seen at selhurst this season, he wasn't a blatant cheat like some, he just lost any control of the game after the first 10 minutes, and then really had no idea what he was doing!

Golf Boy
13-02-2016, 10:29 PM
The ref was very consistant. If a Watford player fell over, he gave a foul. All game.

elwood
13-02-2016, 10:30 PM
In the basic term yes I agree.. But we aren't good at the moment. Second half we looked better.. Until Pardew took Mutch off for Campbell.. Woeful decision. Really doubting his tactical nous

Very odd decision, I thought Mutch was having a half decent game! Campbell is woeful.

Danny boy
13-02-2016, 10:31 PM
The thing that infuriated me was 2 minutes after gifting them a penalty they didn't even remotely appeal for we had a corner and he stopped the game to warn the Watford defenders. Meanwhile Scott Dann was sticking the ball in the net.

Jedinak fouled Deeney, no argument but it quite literally happens in every corner in every game in any league. The inconsistency is shambolic

Spot on has anyone else conceded a penalty like we did today? Joke decision

anti-addick
13-02-2016, 10:36 PM
We lost only because of his blatant bias. He cheated.

If you give those you give 12 pens per game.

He ignored Adebayor being pulled backwards onto the ground at the D.

Thefunkymonk
13-02-2016, 10:37 PM
Very odd decision, I thought Mutch was having a half decent game! Campbell is woeful.

It's not the first odd decision... Really starting to doubt pards... Every club he's managed at say the same.. Now it's happening here... I hope I'm wrong mind

CPFC31
13-02-2016, 10:38 PM
Against us, Yes. Anyone else, No.

anti-addick
13-02-2016, 10:40 PM
Watford were the better team today,

No they were not. So we had a poor first half, but they still did little. Second half we battered them, they didn't get a chance until 70 mins, despite the help of Madley.

glenn.f
13-02-2016, 10:41 PM
The thing that infuriated me was 2 minutes after gifting them a penalty they didn't even remotely appeal for we had a corner and he stopped the game to warn the Watford defenders. Meanwhile Scott Dann was sticking the ball in the net.

Jedinak fouled Deeney, no argument but it quite literally happens in every corner in every game in any league. The inconsistency is shambolic

I had a complete wobbler at my TV for that one. To attempt to manage the game that way after already deciding that he was going to penalise the same infringement with a penalty first up completely sums up the sodding inconsistencies of refs in this country. No qualms with it being given when you see it but don't point it out just to show how clever you are the second time round.

anti-addick
13-02-2016, 10:43 PM
After a corner Gomez laid on his back in the goal after flapping at it. The ball was live so Marley stopped play. Then Gomez just got up, and Mafley did NOTHING. It was a yellow, he stopped our pressure by feigning injury and Marley conspired. ****.

ExiledStirling
13-02-2016, 10:54 PM
It was as blatant a penalty as can be. You cannot bring rugby style tackling into the penalty box and then say it should not be given.

Golf Boy
13-02-2016, 10:59 PM
It was as blatant a penalty as can be. You cannot bring rugby style tackling into the penalty box and then say it should not be given.

Arms around but he fell down on his own. Fair enough to give the pen, but what about the 10 other pens for holding every match. Plus Ade getting pulled down by the shirt in front of the ref -- no decision.

orp pisshead1
13-02-2016, 11:09 PM
Watford were the better team today, but the ref made some very odd and inconsistent decisions today, he wasn't the worst ref I've seen at selhurst this season, he wasn't a blatant cheat like some, he just lost any control of the game after the first 10 minutes, and then really had no idea what he was doing!

:eek: Watford were no way the better team.

El Aguila
13-02-2016, 11:09 PM
I watched on TV by the way. The reason we didn't see the penalty is because the ball was going nowhere near Deeney and Mile. It was a completely unnecessary foul.

orp pisshead1
13-02-2016, 11:11 PM
Arms around but he fell down on his own. Fair enough to give the pen, but what about the 10 other pens for holding every match. Plus Ade getting pulled down by the shirt in front of the ref -- no decision.

What about the free kick they took where their lad took it then touched it first wtf was the ref doing giving it to them again.

Breaking rocks
13-02-2016, 11:19 PM
I think it was harsh, but also expected.

It seems that if anyone, apart from the big teams, questions a refereeing decision, then the ref is hard on them the next match.

Looking2curl1
13-02-2016, 11:28 PM
That is never a penalty in a million years

LLCOOLSTEVE
13-02-2016, 11:31 PM
That is never a penalty in a million years

You will prob also say it wasnt a red card for Souare then :S:

Looking2curl1
13-02-2016, 11:33 PM
You will prob also say it wasnt a red card for Souare then :S:

It was soft as shit like you when dougie left

LLCOOLSTEVE
13-02-2016, 11:34 PM
It was soft as shit like you when dougie left

Good one, you post makes total sense and is completely relevant to today ! Good one.:S:

Terrace Bickle
13-02-2016, 11:34 PM
Deeney just gave up and threw himself on the floor. I hope our players do exactly the same when held in future, but I bet we won't get any penalties as a result.

Celestial Empire
13-02-2016, 11:36 PM
Terrible tactics, terrible defending were to blame for us losing. Excuse after excuse on here.. 'Refs fault', 'injuries'... Maybe we just aren't that good...

That is true, the first half was truly dire, and that is all down to Pardew and his ridiculous set-up. It's becoming pretty clear that he is not the long-term manager for Palace.
But that ref ? Bought and paid for by the Pozzos. No words for his performance.

Looking2curl1
13-02-2016, 11:38 PM
Good one, you post makes total sense! Good one.:S:

You know what it meant you cry baby.

As for the penalty, stupid from Jedinak but Deeney just falls over.

ExiledStirling
13-02-2016, 11:40 PM
You know what it meant you cry baby.

As for the penalty, stupid from Jedinak but Deeney just falls over.
According to you it was never a penalty in a million years so why exactly was it stupid from Jedinak?

Selhurst Celtic
13-02-2016, 11:41 PM
You will prob also say it wasnt a red card for Souare then :S:

It wasn't. He clearly got the ball.

PalaceSi
13-02-2016, 11:41 PM
That penalty was a joke. Not only are offences like that routinely ignored week in week out, in fact Scott Dann is given treatment like that at pretty well every corner and has done at pretty much every match all season but also the ball was heading nowhere near either of them. If he is going to flag one up at least have the ball remotely involved i would have thought.
There needs to be some ruling about what sort of holding is allowed at corners and some consistency from refs. It was a bad game and a bad moment for a decision like that to go against us.

Looking2curl1
13-02-2016, 11:42 PM
According to you it was never a penalty in a million years so why exactly was it stupid from Jedinak?

Because he puts his arms up and gives Deeney a chance to con the ref.

That doesn't make it a foul.

LLCOOLSTEVE
13-02-2016, 11:42 PM
It wasn't. He clearly got the ball.

:D:moo:

ExiledStirling
13-02-2016, 11:42 PM
It wasn't. He clearly got the ball.
Almost both.

st albans
13-02-2016, 11:44 PM
We lost only because of his blatant bias. He cheated.

If you give those you give 12 pens per game.

He ignored Adebayor being pulled backwards onto the ground at the D.

He'd not biased, it's not cheating, and ade literally fell over after not controlling the ball

LLCOOLSTEVE
13-02-2016, 11:44 PM
That penalty was a joke. .


It was a joke yes, but its also a penalty - it does happen in every game and how many times do we all sit here and say why dont the refs give them?!

It should be the consistency we moan about not the fact that it was given against us and as such it shouldnt be a penalty.

brighton_eagle
13-02-2016, 11:44 PM
Soft pen after seeing the replays and it looked like deeney had a hold of Jedi too. Definitely a red card though.

ExiledStirling
13-02-2016, 11:46 PM
Because he puts his arms up and gives Deeney a chance to con the ref.

That doesn't make it a foul.
Sometimes I can still be surprised by the level of blinkered stupidity some fans show.

Looking2curl1
13-02-2016, 11:48 PM
It was a joke yes, but its also a penalty - it does happen in every game and how many times do we all sit here and say why dont the refs give them?!

It should be the consistency we moan about not the fact that it was given against us and as such it shouldnt be a penalty.


So was it a penalty or not Rain Man?

LLCOOLSTEVE
13-02-2016, 11:50 PM
So was it a penalty or not Rain Man?

Can you read?

racehorse-80s
13-02-2016, 11:52 PM
Don't know , don't care and Watford were the better side so it means billy shite to the result:D

Looking2curl1
13-02-2016, 11:53 PM
Sometimes I can still be surprised by the level of blinkered stupidity some fans show.

Sometimes I can still be surprised by the rudeness of sad old bastards from Scotland.

Old Joe Paxton
13-02-2016, 11:54 PM
Jeez a needling thread moaning about a badly awarded penalty. Like moaning about the mediocre canapés on the Titanic. Or not seeing the wood for the trees.

One or t'other anyway

ExiledStirling
13-02-2016, 11:54 PM
Sometimes I can still be surprised by the rudeness of sad old bastards from Scotland.
Have you been on the drink tonight?

Looking2curl1
13-02-2016, 11:56 PM
Can you read?

Better than you can write seemingly Steven.

Looking2curl1
13-02-2016, 11:58 PM
Have you been on the drink tonight?

I had a pint at the game actually. Don't suppose you were there old boy.

ExiledStirling
14-02-2016, 12:02 AM
I had a pint at the game actually. Don't suppose you were there old boy.
You really are being a twat on here. I was hoping, for your sake, it was because you were pissed. Then you tell me you have no such an excuse.

Langers
14-02-2016, 12:03 AM
http://i.imgur.com/03S65c6.png

Why us? Smalling, Terry, Cahill get away with it week after week.

First corner of the match and he pings Jedi? The ball sailing harmlessly over everyone's head and no one appeals for a foul. It feels like we have been cheated.

LDNEAGLE
14-02-2016, 12:05 AM
Harsh penalty gets my vote

NorthPalace23
14-02-2016, 12:06 AM
The problem is a lack of consistency with the officials.

I personally believe that the standard of refereeing generally is getting worse with every season.

gozzoli
14-02-2016, 12:07 AM
The MotD commentator just pointed out that Madley had (already) given more penalties than any other Premier League ref this season. Presumably, the club brief players on what to expect from the referee: what they penalise, what you can get away with etc. So - while of course there should be more consistency between referees - Jedinak really should have known better than to defend a corner WWE-style...

Looking2curl1
14-02-2016, 12:08 AM
You really are being a twat on here. I was hoping, for your sake, it was because you were pissed. Then you tell me you have no such an excuse.

I hate to sound childish, but you started it old chap.

There is a possibility you have overlooked that in your unrelenting pomposity.

Go back and see where you called me stupid in response to a perfectly reasonable post.

thefox
14-02-2016, 05:50 AM
Yes it was a penalty.

Is it ever given, no.

Why did he just give a warning when Watford did it ?

This ref has given 11 penalties in 18 games.

Kai
14-02-2016, 07:00 AM
Clear penalty but how often do refs actually give them? That's what bothers me. Then he should give that every time and for every corner and free kick in to the box until players stop doing it.

I find it incredible that someone as experienced as Jedi does that, and for me he is a very unwise player having done lots of silly thing the last couple of seasons.

Golf Boy
14-02-2016, 07:38 AM
He'd not biased, it's not cheating, and ade literally fell over after not controlling the ball

The guy was holding and pulling his shirt. It was very obvious - According to Deeney the ref had warned the players that would not be tolerated. Perhaps it was just our players he warned.

917L
14-02-2016, 07:44 AM
The guy was holding and pulling his shirt. It was very obvious - According to Deeney the ref had warned the players that would not be tolerated. Perhaps it was just our players he warned.

If that's true its odd that it was only not tolerated for the second it took to give the penalty. It was happening from every subsequent free kick and corner for both sides, but no action was taken

stumpy feelers
14-02-2016, 07:51 AM
Harsh pen. Doesn't excuse the shit defending again though.

EddieEdwards
14-02-2016, 08:19 AM
If penalties were awarded for every offence of that nature, the grappling and shirt-pulling would be greatly reduced and the game would probably be better for it. But there are and will continue to be numerous similar offences every game, every week that will either be completely ignored or handled by stopping the game and 'warning' the players like Madley did to Watford just after he'd given them a penalty. His seemingly random decision to give that penalty cost us very dearly but that's what tends to happen when you're on a run like we are. There's nothing we can do about it now and there's very little we can do about shit refereeing in general, but there is something we can do about our own shit performances so it's probably better if we focus on that rather than rather than on hoping that refs will suddenly start being competent and even-handed.

Penstone Eagle
14-02-2016, 08:30 AM
Pity our team isn't good enough to go and right the wrongs by scoring goals and winning games, we lost because we were shite from the first whistle and our defending is awful, do that and you are always likely to go behind, fairly or not.

Home fans being treated to dross, again.

alf
14-02-2016, 08:37 AM
I thought the ref had awarded us a free kick for the foul on Delainey by their CH. That after all was where the ball was travelling to.
Deeney was being held in a half hearted way by Mile. It was easy for him to fall over and make the most of the opportunity. A very weak penalty in my mind but why did Mile have to put his arms around Deeney.
Not even the Watford players realised a penalty had been given by the ref :(

Crozzy71
14-02-2016, 08:41 AM
It's was a penalty, but the issue is lack of refereeing consistency.

These things happen at every corner. Either the league says "we will give a penalty if you do it" or they let it go.

The problem is you can't have one referee making it his mission to punish such offences. That's why every player walked out of the box assuming we'd won the free kick.

Windsor_Eagle
14-02-2016, 08:49 AM
Just typical that a ref decides to implement a rule against us that hasn't been implemented elsewhere this season and won't be again.

It is the inconsistency that is the bone of contention, not whether or not it was a penalty strictly speaking. So many ******* awful decisions costing us right now (and no, that doesn't mean that the team / manager are absolved of blame) and if anyone thinks that the officiating has no bearing on our results then they are deluded.

Timbo
14-02-2016, 08:58 AM
My opinion...Not a justifiable penalty decision by current Premier League standards

Yoda
14-02-2016, 09:07 AM
Decided not to post until I'd seen a TV replay.

Really annoyed by what I've seen on MOTD, as that sort of contact takes place all the time! I've seen players' shirts pulled so much that you can see the fabric stretching and the striker can't make his run at all.

A match changing decision, and if I was Pardew I'd be tempted to look at coverage of our corners to see if the ref missed identical levels of contact by Watford defenders.

As others have said, it's the inconsistency of the refs that leaves a bad taste.

HRP
14-02-2016, 09:26 AM
Decided not to post until I'd seen a TV replay.

Really annoyed by what I've seen on MOTD, as that sort of contact takes place all the time! I've seen players' shirts pulled so much that you can see the fabric stretching and the striker can't make his run at all.

A match changing decision, and if I was Pardew I'd be tempted to look at coverage of our corners to see if the ref missed identical levels of contact by Watford defenders.

As others have said, it's the inconsistency of the refs that leaves a bad taste.

So your really annoyed that the ref gave a correct decision , your not really annoyed with the fact Jedinak does it in every game ? The match changing decision was at 1-1 Campbell came on

Kai
14-02-2016, 09:28 AM
Putting your arms around the opposition is asking for it especially if the ref's already warned the players beforehand. It's not a harsh decision as it happened right in the refs line of sight and one can only expect as much then. Jedi should be fined for letting the team down again and he held onto Ighalo as well right before the end of the game so he clearly hasn't learned his lesson.

jordanismygod
14-02-2016, 09:29 AM
Pity our team isn't good enough to go and right the wrongs by scoring goals and winning games, we lost because we were shite from the first whistle and our defending is awful, do that and you are always likely to go behind, fairly or not.

Home fans being treated to dross, again.


You think we were dross second half?
Yes defending was poor for the second goal.

917L
14-02-2016, 09:32 AM
So your really annoyed that the ref gave a correct decision ,

No, I am annoyed he decided to only give that decision once in the game

Either give all of them, or none

Eaglesfan1
14-02-2016, 09:34 AM
Thought it was harsh. If the ref really was that officious he could simply have made a point of delaying the corner and telling everyone to cut it out, any further holding before the ball came in play resulting in a yellow (this is FIFA's own guidance in the Laws of the Game).

The warning for our corner came from Wilf retaliating to the hold with a push, so no complaints from me for that one.

Ryan_the_eagle
14-02-2016, 09:35 AM
Am I the only one who doesn't see an actual foul. I don't know any rule that says you can't put your arms around an opponent. Deeney then makes his run and falls to the floor. The shirt pull at the start of the move is from the Watford player.

crowboro eagle
14-02-2016, 09:50 AM
The issue for me is consistency. 99 games out of 100 that wouldn't be given. I could put a million pounds on if that was wilf being pulled down it would not have been given. To many decisions by referees are based on where a player is on the pitch. Swansea were denied a pen yesterday that to be honest any where else in the pitch the ref blows up for. The only consistency in current reffing standards is that they are all consistany bad. Unfortunately for us at moment we are on the receiving end of them.

Penstone Eagle
14-02-2016, 09:56 AM
You think we were dross second half?
Yes defending was poor for the second goal.

No, I didn't make it clear that I meant the first half, we were of course better in the second half but no where good enough.

That start to the game, a home game, was unforgiveable.

Buck stops with the manager who clearly can't put a team together to do the job.

swhib
14-02-2016, 10:16 AM
If the refs start stamping down on this, Shawcross will have to find himself a new profession.

swhib
14-02-2016, 10:20 AM
Also, can we now have a penalty against Spurs please, after that blatant shirt pull?

brighton_eagle
14-02-2016, 10:23 AM
Am I the only one who doesn't see an actual foul. I don't know any rule that says you can't put your arms around an opponent. Deeney then makes his run and falls to the floor. The shirt pull at the start of the move is from the Watford player.

Deeney seems to be holding Jedi too from the replay.

What I don't get is why he then immediately after giving a penalty for holding, he then stopped the game to warn the Watford defender who was holding at our corner. Why didn't he warn Jedi too?

New LP
14-02-2016, 10:23 AM
Don't know , don't care and Watford were the better side so it means billy shite to the result:D

This isn't true though, if the ref doesn't decide to make a one in a hundred decision at that point it's 0-0. It had a massive impact on the result because we ultimately lost by one goal.

Essexeagle
14-02-2016, 10:28 AM
Arms around but he fell down on his own. Fair enough to give the pen, but what about the 10 other pens for holding every match. Plus Ade getting pulled down by the shirt in front of the ref -- no decision.

Deeney had pointed out to the ref 10 seconds earlier that Jedinak had both arms around him, so both Deeney and Jedinak knew the ref might be watching. There's a different between holding a bit and hugging a player, at a certain point you have to let go of the player. Jedi has a habit of doing this a lot whenever his man gets the jump on him, which Deeney had done. There is no need to hold on with both arms from behind the player if you manage to stay goalside or in front of your player.

pants
14-02-2016, 10:29 AM
If the refs start stamping down on this, Shawcross will have to find himself a new profession.

Skirtel won't be far behind him!

jordanismygod
14-02-2016, 10:30 AM
Also, can we now have a penalty against Spurs please, after that blatant shirt pull?


I can remember a few where we should of had penalties this season for similar incidents.
The shirt pull on Jedi a few weeks ago was blatant.
Was it the Everton game?

HurstpierPalace
14-02-2016, 10:32 AM
No other penalties will be given for it the rest of the season either way.

jordanismygod
14-02-2016, 10:33 AM
No, I didn't make it clear that I meant the first half, we were of course better in the second half but no where good enough.

That start to the game, a home game, was unforgiveable.

Buck stops with the manager who clearly can't put a team together to do the job.


I agree about the first half. We were awful.
Another day with a bit of luck the second half performance would have resulted in a win.
Like my dad said yesterday, things just don't seem to be going for us at the moment. Add in some poor defending at crucial times and we could of had 2/3 wins.

Palaceguard
14-02-2016, 10:37 AM
The arms were around and there was holding but he wasn't hauled to the ground, Deeney played for it and whilst holding should be a foul and a penalty if in the box this was incredibly soft

Still time to move on and "dig deep" (smug moLeicester Tw@!! :veryangry)

Pikie Punisher
14-02-2016, 10:40 AM
Also, can we now have a penalty against Spurs please, after that blatant shirt pull?

Yes, this highlights the ridiculous inconsistency by the officials, whilst we only have ourselves to blame for the result yesterday after not turning up for the first half, it infuriates me when one child gets sent home from school for wearing the wrong colour trousers whereas other kids are doing what they like!

Yes, we should of then had a clear pen against Spurs when Wickham was stopped from moving due to having his shirt gripped by their ****, Wickham then throws the elbow back in frustration and rightly gets sent off. A week or so later, clearly captured by the cameras on MOTD (3:12 onwards, link below) and seen by the officials, Robert Huth elbows Lallana in the face, doesn't even get a yellow and it all gets laughed off in the usual MOTD Leicester wank fest! It's all bollocks!

https://youtu.be/E8fKTzJ8UfM

Owngoal
14-02-2016, 10:45 AM
I've not a clue what happened. I saw one of their players climb on the shoulders of one of ours and thought the decision was for that, but that was it.

Exactly what I thought - it was their player fouling one of ours that stood out in real time at the match. The lino on that side was extremely poor all match and didn't seem to notice. MOTD usual fence sitting, seen them given. I've seen far more holding from Damien in recent games but as MOTD pointed out, this ref has given more penalties than any other.

swhib
14-02-2016, 10:46 AM
Yes, this highlights the ridiculous inconsistency by the officials, whilst we only have ourselves to blame for the result yesterday after not turning up for the first half, it infuriates me when one child gets sent home from school for wearing the wrong colour trousers whereas other kids are doing what they like!

Yes, we should of then had a clear pen against Spurs when Wickham was stopped from moving due to having his shirt gripped by their ****, Wickham then throws the elbow back in frustration and rightly gets sent off. A week or so later, clearly captured by the cameras on MOTD (3:12 onwards, link below) and seen by the officials, Robert Huth elbows Lallana in the face, doesn't even get a yellow and it all gets laughed off in the usual MOTD Leicester wank fest! It's all bollocks!

https://youtu.be/E8fKTzJ8UfM
I'm not sure what's happened to the officiating this year, we've clearly upset them in some way, perhaps being fifth in the table was just a step too far.

Brumie Allan
14-02-2016, 10:47 AM
I can remember a few where we should of had penalties this season for similar incidents.
The shirt pull on Jedi a few weeks ago was blatant.
Was it the Everton game?The shirt pull on Wickham leading to to elbow.

Langers
14-02-2016, 10:48 AM
Skirtel won't be far behind him!

Smalling is the master - doesn't even look at the ball. And wait until the Euros in the summer - every corner will be a free for all in the box.

The refs go for Palace because they can - the media ignore it unless it happens at one of the "big clubs" and then the ref is hung out to dry

Dobbo
14-02-2016, 11:14 AM
Pards was correct in saying that Scotty gets held back like that every game, but we've never got anything from it.
The thing that really pissed be off, was given Madley's "letter of the law" approach to the game, how come he allowed Deeney's penalty to stand when at least four of them were well into the area when he struck it.
Cabaye had to retake for Gayley doing the same earlier in the season.

Sam Spade
14-02-2016, 11:24 AM
Was it a pen? Yes.
If Smalling / Monreal/ Kolarov / Skeletor had done the same at Old Trafford / Emirates/ Etihad / Anfield would it have been given? HaHaHaHaHaHaHa

averity
14-02-2016, 11:30 AM
never a penalty, because that happens at all most every corner

jobiinthelastmi
14-02-2016, 11:33 AM
Yes it was a penalty.

Is it ever given, no.

Why did he just give a warning when Watford did it ?

This ref has given 11 penalties in 18 games.

Doesn't the ball have to be in play for it to be a penalty? That's probably why they got away with it.

But I see your point, let us take the corner and give us a penalty. Contact started before they took their corner, why not stop and warn Jedinak about it?

Latvian Eagle
14-02-2016, 11:35 AM
I think everyone was confused as **** at the time. Literally saw nothing.

Then my mate showed me a clip on the train home, wad a very blatant penalty. Deeney won it by throwing himself on the floor. That's what I think sold it for the ref.

dubsy1
14-02-2016, 11:46 AM
Was it a penalty? Yes. Are they usually given? Never. Does it happen to Scott Dann evert week? Yes. Can't hide behind it though, a totally abject performance from Jedinak and the team in general!

AddoWolz
14-02-2016, 11:53 AM
If that was a penalty then the ref might as well give a penalty decision instead of awarding a corner because that sort of stuff goes on at EVERY SINGLE CORNER and nothing happens
never in a million years is that a ******* penalty never never never never

also a Watford player pushed Deeney

max power
14-02-2016, 11:58 AM
It's a Penalty and it isn't a Penalty

We see it in every game

I guess we were unlucky that the Ref decided this time to give it

Will he give one in the next game he does ? Probably not

We will now win all our remaining games cmon you eeeeeeeeeeagles

Lombardo's hair
14-02-2016, 12:04 PM
All I will say is ......The ref was awful. Referees do affect results despite what some moaners say. Otherwise giving or not giving penalties sending off or not sending off or foul or no foul would not matter. In fact why have a referee if decisions don't matter? My main complaint about refs is not bad decisions but the lack of any consistency not over the season but DURING THE SAME BLOODY MATCH BY THE SAME BLOODY REF! That's all

LONDONMAN
14-02-2016, 12:06 PM
Could not see anything to give a penalty at the match. Now I have seen the highlights on MotD and in the context of other body checks and pushes that were flatly ignored by the same referee, it was a harsh call.

We have had a few go our way over the last couple of seasons, but I would say they were more clear cut than that.

BTW, one Watford player had hold of Deeney's shirt, just before his spectacular fall, almost like a lumberjack shouting 'Timber' before the Redwood crashes to the ground.

Big decision in the context of the game. Also felt we were harshly done by in the lead up to the second goal, but overall, poor Palace defending is to blame for the goals as much as yet another set of match officials that have been partial to the opposition and inept and inconsistent in their application of the Laws.

Shame that somebody did'nt show Souare's haste in reaching that hospital ball that saw him get sent off when Watson had two bites at sending the cross in for the winner with nobody within 15 yards of him.

It seems we go from one extreme to another, too physical for the refs liking and too weak in vital areas of defence for our own good

kettle
14-02-2016, 12:12 PM
was a penalty, Jedinak had his arms wrapped round Deeney.
That said none of the Watford players appealed for it - and seemed bemused as to why it was given.
We've seen far worse and no pen given, so refereeing inconsistency is always an issue. That said, Maddeley has form for giving pens (9 in 12 games, so maybe we should have been alert to that).
Actually thought lino on main stand was worse. ball went out of play 3 times in first 10-15 mins and he missed them all.

Yoda
14-02-2016, 12:22 PM
So your really annoyed that the ref gave a correct decision , your not really annoyed with the fact Jedinak does it in every game ? The match changing decision was at 1-1 Campbell came on

No, it's clear I, and many others, are annoyed by the inconsistency in how refs apply that rule.

Nor can I agree with you about Campbell coming on. He's not responsible for Ward leaving a striker of Deeney's ability alone in the box, when our CH's were already going for their cross.

Nor is Campbell responsible for us wasting the first half playing in the wrong formation.

Benzhiyi
14-02-2016, 12:28 PM
No, it's clear I, and many others, are annoyed by the inconsistency in how refs apply that rule.

Nor can I agree with you about Campbell coming on. He's not responsible for Ward leaving a striker of Deeney's ability alone in the box, when our CH's were already going for their cross.

Nor is Campbell responsible for us wasting the first half playing in the wrong formation.

From replays it looks as though Campbell was supposed to be Watson's marker at the point when he crossed for the second goal. Instead he's yards away, and makes no attempt to block the ball.

(Don't like him or Mutch or Hennessey being the scapegoat, but in this instance he made a grave error.)

SeanPalace84
14-02-2016, 12:34 PM
Was it a penalty? Yes. Are they usually given? Never. Does it happen to Scott Dann evert week? Yes. Can't hide behind it though, a totally abject performance from Jedinak and the team in general!

Simple as this! Not usually given but we have no excuse and can't feel hard done by.

Yoda
14-02-2016, 12:42 PM
From replays it looks as though Campbell was supposed to be Watson's marker at the point when he crossed for the second goal. Instead he's yards away, and makes no attempt to block the ball.

(Don't like him or Mutch or Hennessey being the scapegoat, but in this instance he made a grave error.)

Are you saying Campbell was more at fault for their goal than Ward?

Can't agree on that. Yes, I rate Ward way more highly than Campbell, but on that particular incident Ward must mark Deeny and let our CHs do their job. It's schoolboy defending to have 3 defenders drawn towards a cross.

HARRY MONK
14-02-2016, 12:56 PM
Give that pen there will be 10 a game

DARZET EAGLE
14-02-2016, 01:15 PM
Any foul in the box should result in a penalty. There is a need to cut out professional fouls.

LLCOOLSTEVE
14-02-2016, 01:18 PM
Deeney seems to be holding Jedi too from the replay.

What I don't get is why he then immediately after giving a penalty for holding, he then stopped the game to warn the Watford defender who was holding at our corner. Why didn't he warn Jedi too?


Cause Jedi wasn't holding before the kick was taken, yet at the other end the holding took place while the ball was still not in play.... From what I can remember

SOUTHGATE EAGLE
14-02-2016, 01:31 PM
Any foul in the box should result in a penalty. There is a need to cut out professional fouls.

Absolutely. But if refs are going to be black and white in the application of the laws, then it should be universal and there should be forewarning, like when the tackle from behind was outlawed. As clumsy a liability Jedinak is, he thought he was occupying the safe, 'grey area' of behaviour most profssionals are allowed to get away with and it cost us another potential three points. I don't like a ref suddenly deciding to apply the laws 'black and white' against us when it is very grey the other 99.9% of the time.

wrightchipvcfc
14-02-2016, 02:29 PM
Absolutely. But if refs are going to be black and white in the application of the laws, then it should be universal and there should be forewarning, like when the tackle from behind was outlawed. As clumsy a liability Jedinak is, he thought he was occupying the safe, 'grey area' of behaviour most profssionals are allowed to get away with and it cost us another potential three points. I don't like a ref suddenly deciding to apply the laws 'black and white' against us when it is very grey the other 99.9% of the time.

Both this and Harry monk spot on you will see this let go 100s a time in a season.

hedge end eagle
14-02-2016, 02:36 PM
Whilst we are on the subject ofconsistency, square quite rightly gets sent off for his challenge yet Drinkwater with a similar two footed challenge today does not even get booked! Also thir sub who came on should also have gone for the challenge on Montreal

If we are going to have these decisions, let's see it applied for everyone

Essexeagle
14-02-2016, 02:45 PM
Cause Jedi wasn't holding before the kick was taken, yet at the other end the holding took place while the ball was still not in play.... From what I can remember

Jedi grabbed onto Deeney because Deeney had got the jump on him and was a yard in front. It's not the first time it's happened. He was also a whisker away from giving away a second penalty later in the game.

Sceagle
14-02-2016, 02:48 PM
Jedinak does that every time he plays and always risks a pen. He was finally pulled up on it yesterday.

TomEagle
14-02-2016, 02:59 PM
That ref yesterday has given more penalties than any other ref this season. I'm sure I saw somewhere that he's averaging about 1 a game. He's an arrogant **** anyway. Strutting around the pitch like he owned the place. No wonder refs get no respect in this country when they act like complete self important tossers who don't provide any consistency. If he's going to give a penalty for that in the first 15 minutes at the first set piece then there should have been another 4 in that match. ****.

Biscuitboffin
14-02-2016, 03:18 PM
I don't buy it that Jedi has dragged him to the ground. Deeney dives when it is clear the ball is going nowhere near him. This is what the modern game requires you to do, rather than try to battle your way free as Connor did (too enthusiastically)against Spurs. As much as I hate that about the game, we need to be cleverer in those situations.

People pointing out that it's a penalty according to the rules of the game needn't bother. We all know that. It's simply not the issue. I was looking forward to another 5 or 6 penalties after he gave that one.

chelmsfordeagle
14-02-2016, 03:29 PM
It was a penalty. It was right in front of the ref and directly in his eyeline. It was a stupid a decision by Jedinek. Yes, refs miss loads of these and will continue to do so unless there is extra help but that doesnt mean it wasn't the correct decision.

Biscuitboffin
14-02-2016, 03:42 PM
It was a penalty. It was right in front of the ref and directly in his eyeline. It was a stupid a decision by Jedinek. Yes, refs miss loads of these and will continue to do so unless there is extra help but that doesnt mean it wasn't the correct decision.
Once again, nobody is saying it wasn't the correct decision as written down. It's not why it's being questioned

It's amazing that you think refs miss them. Every opinion I've heard, from people with fully functioning vision, sees it all the time. Refs can't fail to see it several times every match. They just don't give it.

DeanGoodsnake
14-02-2016, 05:01 PM
Are you saying Campbell was more at fault for their goal than Ward?

Can't agree on that. Yes, I rate Ward way more highly than Campbell, but on that particular incident Ward must mark Deeny and let our CHs do their job. It's schoolboy defending to have 3 defenders drawn towards a cross.

It's also basic school boy defending to allow 2 on 1 from a corner and let Watson cross the ball unchallenged .
Stop the cross stop the goal

LONDONMAN
14-02-2016, 05:45 PM
It's also basic school boy defending to allow 2 on 1 from a corner and let Watson cross the ball unchallenged .
Stop the cross stop the goal

My thoughts entirely and it was really annoying, as a Palace fan that knows how good Ben can be from set pieces, that nobody closed him down.

At the corner from that dubious free kick before the goal, Watson was allowed to take the kick with nobody within thirty yards of him and once the ball was cleared for the throw, once again he was left unchallenged for the cross that led to the winner.

We are battling against harsh refereeing decisions but also seem to be turning off at vital moments defensively which is costing us in many of our recent defeats.

Essexeagle
14-02-2016, 05:49 PM
It's also basic school boy defending to allow 2 on 1 from a corner and let Watson cross the ball unchallenged .
Stop the cross stop the goal

A lot of modern teams (us included) defend narrow and play the percentage game of defending the box (where you have a numerical advantage) rather than going all out to stop the cross coming in.

That said, Campbell should have considered that Watson would look to ping one into the box from the throw and closed down better.

But the error by the back four (both Dann and Ward) was far greater. Three defenders being sucked to challenge for one ball was pretty poor stuff. I'm not actually sure why Dann needed to step in, but it made even less sense for Ward to try and run 5 yards just to reach a cross being contested by two team-mates when the ball was already in flight.

When Delaney heads the ball on. Ward is actually 2 yards from the action on both sides.

Yoda
14-02-2016, 06:03 PM
My thoughts entirely and it was really annoying, as a Palace fan that knows how good Ben can be from set pieces, that nobody closed him down.

At the corner from that dubious free kick before the goal, Watson was allowed to take the kick with nobody within thirty yards of him and once the ball was cleared for the throw, once again he was left unchallenged for the cross that led to the winner.

We are battling against harsh refereeing decisions but also seem to be turning off at vital moments defensively which is costing us in many of our recent defeats.

As stopping Watson crossing is clearly important and a key part of Watford's game play, should that be Campbell's role anyway?

Pardew took off Mutch and put on another striker, ie Campbell, to try to win the match. He gambled by conceding more of the midfield.

I get it that people are frustrated by Campbell, but he isn't solely responsible for that goal.

Stroud Eagle
14-02-2016, 06:26 PM
Give that pen there will be 10 a game

This.

brighton_eagle
14-02-2016, 06:31 PM
Cause Jedi wasn't holding before the kick was taken, yet at the other end the holding took place while the ball was still not in play.... From what I can remember

Are you being deliberately obtuse? The ball would have been in play if the ref had allowed the corner to be taken and then given the penalty for holding. The point is, he warned Watford by stopping the game and talking to their player. He didn't do the same for us a few minutes earlier.

I accept that refs aren't consistent between matches, but I'd think they might be within a 5 minutes period.

DeanGoodsnake
14-02-2016, 06:33 PM
As stopping Watson crossing is clearly important and a key part of Watford's game play, should that be Campbell's role anyway?

Pardew took off Mutch and put on another striker, ie Campbell, to try to win the match. He gambled by conceding more of the midfield.

I get it that people are frustrated by Campbell, but he isn't solely responsible for that goal.

All hands to the pump I don't buy this that because you are a striker you can't defend or shouldn't ...
Forwards defend most set pieces in their own box .
Pro footballers should be doing the basics or someone should be barking things like that out.
We are giving away bad goals some are mistakes some are just unlucky

NorwoodPride
14-02-2016, 06:34 PM
This is a problem of consistency. I would like to see this kind of grabbing or holding punished in all games, but the fact that so many referees do not take any action seems very unfair. Deeney also sank to his knees, he was impeded but not actually pulled down.

But yes, it SHOULD always be a penalty and let's see this kind of defending wiped out once and for all.

917L
14-02-2016, 07:48 PM
From replays it looks as though Campbell was supposed to be Watson's marker at the point when he crossed for the second goal. Instead he's yards away, and makes no attempt to block the ball.

(Don't like him or Mutch or Hennessey being the scapegoat, but in this instance he made a grave error.)

Ward was the major culprit

eagle-leg
14-02-2016, 08:05 PM
Ref bang out of order.

Jedi was grappling with deeney before the corner comes in. Deeney asks ref to keep an eye on jedi. Cross comes in deeney drops to his knees, ref gives weak pen.

A few minutes later. Watford player doing the same as jedinak. Ref stops play as cross comes in to warn them that he will be forced to give pen if they continue to hold. Refs given them fair warning.

Where was our fair warning from the first set play of the game?

If refs wish to clamp down on grappling in the box then thats fine, buy it needs to be all refs and from game 1 of the season. Not by some lone maverick half way through feb who changes his mind two minutes later.

Standard of officiating this season has been terrible.

Chobham Eagle
14-02-2016, 08:09 PM
Just typical that a ref decides to implement a rule against us that hasn't been implemented elsewhere this season and won't be again.

It is the inconsistency that is the bone of contention, not whether or not it was a penalty strictly speaking. So many ******* awful decisions costing us right now (and no, that doesn't mean that the team / manager are absolved of blame) and if anyone thinks that the officiating has no bearing on our results then they are deluded.

Exactly. Not only did we not get a pen for blatant shirt pulling against Spurs we ended up losing a player for three matches as a result of the ref not giving it.

Billyd
14-02-2016, 08:11 PM
Exactly. Not only did we not get a pen for blatant shirt pulling against Spurs we ended up losing a player for three matches as a result of the ref not giving it.

No. We ended up losing a player for three matches because Connor Wickham deliberately and violently elbowed someone in the face.

Biscuitboffin
14-02-2016, 08:30 PM
No. We ended up losing a player for three matches because Connor Wickham deliberately and violently elbowed someone in the face.

...whilst being blatantly fouled.

Nobody is defending Wickham. They're talking about inconsistencies of refereeing.

Michael G
14-02-2016, 08:35 PM
No. We ended up losing a player for three matches because Connor Wickham deliberately and violently elbowed someone in the face.

I'm not sure I agree witht that after watching it quite a few times. At no time does he look round to make sure he gets him in the face which does suggest that he was trying to break loose. If Yesterday's was a penalty then so must this be as he pulled his shirt in the box which is a foul.Everything that can go against us at the moment is. There is no question that yesterday's decision had a big bearing on the game. Just like Clattenburgs absurd penalty call today.

Chobham Eagle
14-02-2016, 08:35 PM
...whilst being blatantly fouled.

Nobody is defending Wickham. They're talking about inconsistencies of refereeing.

Exactly. Wickham shouldn't have done what he did, but he wouldn't have done it if the ref had blown for the blatant shirt pulling.

Billyd
14-02-2016, 08:41 PM
...whilst being blatantly fouled.

Nobody is defending Wickham. They're talking about inconsistencies of refereeing.

I was clearly responding to the post that implied a differing reason Wickham got sent off.

The difference in those two scenarios is the clever player in Troy Deeney went down whilst tugged. Connor Wickham elbowed someone in the face.

Id also suggest this thread again shows the lack of awareness and 'victimisation' feeling growing among Palace fans that id usually expect from those following Liverpool FC.
Take a look at the extended highlights of the Premier League this weekend alone. 6 or 7 big referee mistakes, many much worse than what we suffered. This victim and only happens to us attitude is pathetic.

We are losing because we are playing badly. End of.

Chobham Eagle
14-02-2016, 08:50 PM
I was clearly responding to the post that implied a differing reason Wickham got sent off.

The difference in those two scenarios is the clever player in Troy Deeney went down whilst tugged. Connor Wickham elbowed someone in the face.

Id also suggest this thread again shows the lack of awareness and 'victimisation' feeling growing among Palace fans that id usually expect from those following Liverpool FC.
Take a look at the extended highlights of the Premier League this weekend alone. 6 or 7 big referee mistakes, many much worse than what we suffered. This victim and only happens to us attitude is pathetic.

We are losing because we are playing badly. End of.

My post simply implied that Wickham wouldn't have been banned had the ref given the pen. That's a fact and says nothing about Wickham's foolishness in reacting the way he did.

Biscuitboffin
14-02-2016, 08:56 PM
I was clearly responding to the post that implied a differing reason Wickham got sent off.

The difference in those two scenarios is the clever player in Troy Deeney went down whilst tugged. Connor Wickham elbowed someone in the face.

Stupid of me. I thought you were responding to the post you quoted.

Agree about Deeney, as I have earlier posted. But another difference is that Atkinson didn't blow for a penalty for the foul on Wickham. And that is the difference that is relevant to this thread.

Billyd
14-02-2016, 09:11 PM
My post simply implied that Wickham wouldn't have been banned had the ref given the pen.

Wickham wouldnt have been sent off it he didnt elbow someone in the face. Fact.
First rule of football; play to the whistle.

Yoda
14-02-2016, 09:18 PM
All hands to the pump I don't buy this that because you are a striker you can't defend or shouldn't ...
Forwards defend most set pieces in their own box .
Pro footballers should be doing the basics or someone should be barking things like that out.
We are giving away bad goals some are mistakes some are just unlucky

I haven't said Campbell was faultless.

Campbell didn't pitch in, but if anyone failed to do their basic job, as you call it, it was Ward. Deeny was unquestionably his man.

Jim Cannon
14-02-2016, 09:22 PM
As stopping Watson crossing is clearly important and a key part of Watford's game play, should that be Campbell's role anyway?

Pardew took off Mutch and put on another striker, ie Campbell, to try to win the match. He gambled by conceding more of the midfield.

I get it that people are frustrated by Campbell, but he isn't solely responsible for that goal.

If we go down Campbell will figure heavily in the blame even if he doesn't feature again this season. He isn't a great player but the venom towards him defies belief

Hedgehog
14-02-2016, 09:27 PM
another difference is that Atkinson didn't blow for a penalty for the foul on Wickham. And that is the difference that is relevant to this thread.
But he also didn't see Wickham use his elbow, only video evidence after the fact got him in trouble.

JannerEagle
14-02-2016, 09:28 PM
Wickham wouldnt have been sent off it he didnt elbow someone in the face. Fact.
First rule of football; play to the whistle.
Don't think Wickham got sent off? It was TV evidence!

Biscuitboffin
14-02-2016, 09:33 PM
But he also didn't see Wickham use his elbow, only video evidence after the fact got him in trouble.

Yes, fair point. I was only trying to explain to Billyd that Connors elbow is a complete irrelevance to this discussion and what you've pointed out makes it even less so.

Also, doesn't mean he didn't see the shirt pull. It went on long enough. Wickham had already swung his elbow once and missed.

cpfcben
14-02-2016, 09:41 PM
If you give a penalty for that you would give one every game.

beef
14-02-2016, 09:53 PM
Every game that Jedinak plays in!

Windsor_Eagle
14-02-2016, 10:31 PM
I was clearly responding to the post that implied a differing reason Wickham got sent off.

The difference in those two scenarios is the clever player in Troy Deeney went down whilst tugged. Connor Wickham elbowed someone in the face.

Id also suggest this thread again shows the lack of awareness and 'victimisation' feeling growing among Palace fans that id usually expect from those following Liverpool FC.
Take a look at the extended highlights of the Premier League this weekend alone. 6 or 7 big referee mistakes, many much worse than what we suffered. This victim and only happens to us attitude is pathetic.

We are losing because we are playing badly. End of.

Our poor play is of course a major factor but you can't divorce officiating entirely from our performances or our results.

Yesterday, the game was turgid and no side was looking great (and both quite twitchy) until that pen was given which changed the complexion at that point. The game against Bournemouth where Zaha was tearing them to pieces but they were allowed from minute one to kick the shit out of him without reprimand. That led not only to his own temper getting fired up but also to the tone being set that they could disrupt (illegally) our creative outlet. Had the book come out early doors for one of those challenges then it could have led to Zaha having more of an influence and / or them going down to 10 men. Just two immediate examples in recent games that has undoubtedly influenced proceedings and arguably has impacted the potency of our performance.

Palace121
14-02-2016, 10:33 PM
I've never known a referee waste more time than the players.

Billyd
15-02-2016, 12:12 AM
Just two immediate examples in recent games that has undoubtedly influenced proceedings and arguably has impacted the potency of our performance.

Funny you didnt mention the stonewall penalty Swansea didnt get!

(Jedi could easily have been sent off in that game too.)

Windsor_Eagle
15-02-2016, 12:33 AM
Funny you didnt mention the stonewall penalty Swansea didnt get!

(Jedi could easily have been sent off in that game too.)

We can bat back and forth examples where we have benefitted and suffered at the hands of Reffing shockers / inconsistencies and we will find more of the latter I guarantee.

The point, though, is that people are quick to say that the referee does not affect a result which is patently bollocks. Why were many of our biggest critics now so keen to point out at the time that were it not for the ref that we would not have beaten Norwich on the opening day of the season? I concede that had the ref allowed that goal that the momentum would have probably led to them winning the game (if anyone). I believe that recently we have had a few poor decisions that have significantly contributed to our poor results (which again is not to say that it is the only factor).

I don't see anything at all controversial or erroneous in that sentiment.

Essexeagle
15-02-2016, 12:56 AM
Are you being deliberately obtuse? The ball would have been in play if the ref had allowed the corner to be taken and then given the penalty for holding. The point is, he warned Watford by stopping the game and talking to their player. He didn't do the same for us a few minutes earlier.

I accept that refs aren't consistent between matches, but I'd think they might be within a 5 minutes period.

I thought he stopped the game before that corner because there was a lot of pushing going on (not saying he was right to, but I thought it was because wickham and their centre half were basically shoving each other in the chest while the ball was being placed)

Hedgehog
15-02-2016, 02:00 AM
At the end of the day why would a professional player put their arms around an opposing player or blatantly pull their shirt in the penalty area while defending a corner? And then turn around and complain to the ref when they are pulled up for it?

In my years of playing Sunday League football this never happened.

Is their subconscious doing it, or is it a cold calculating gamble that they will get away with it?

alf
15-02-2016, 07:43 AM
Having seen the incident again on TV, my son thought that Deeney may have outsmarted the referee and Mile.
It looked as though he may have been tugging down Mile's shirt with his left hand on the blind side of the referee. This is a trick that lots of players do. It gives the effect that the defender is pushing them down (where in fact they are pulling the defender down on themself)
In effect it exaggerated the fact that Mile had his arms around Deene, albeit very loosely.

Ardent Eagle Forever
15-02-2016, 08:04 AM
I thought I saw a Watford hand pushing Deeley in the back.

Was Cat on the pitch then? Didn't see her:p
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/24/Cat_Deeley_2011.jpg

chelmsfordeagle
15-02-2016, 08:19 AM
Once again, nobody is saying it wasn't the correct decision as written down. It's not why it's being questioned

It's amazing that you think refs miss them. Every opinion I've heard, from people with fully functioning vision, sees it all the time. Refs can't fail to see it several times every match. They just don't give it.

it is being questioned. read some of the comments on this thread.

as for ´not the right decision as written down´ ha

and to claim that you and ´people with fully functioning vision´see all these incidents is ludicrous´ nobody can watch 6,7,8 actions at the same time. Do refs sometimes see things that should be a penalty and not give them? yes. Do they see things comparable to what jedinek did 4 or 5 metres in front of them and not give a pen? rarely. I get this is another thing for a large minority of Palace fans to feel victimised about but really we aren´t. we get some bad decision and some lucky ones. This pen was neither.

cpfc4evandeva
15-02-2016, 08:27 AM
The last 2 pages make for grim reading. Billyd is right - there is a huge growing of the 'Liverpool FC victim mentality' amongst Palace fans. It's sad to witness.

We are losing games because we are playing badly.

Barbara4003
15-02-2016, 09:31 AM
45878

pardew's shorts
15-02-2016, 09:39 AM
Stop playing the victim Barbara.

Just lie down and take the shocking refereeing, every week.

Biscuitboffin
15-02-2016, 09:40 AM
it is being questioned. read some of the comments on this thread.

as for ´not the right decision as written down´ ha

and to claim that you and ´people with fully functioning vision´see all these incidents is ludicrous´ nobody can watch 6,7,8 actions at the same time. Do refs sometimes see things that should be a penalty and not give them? yes. Do they see things comparable to what jedinek did 4 or 5 metres in front of them and not give a pen? rarely. I get this is another thing for a large minority of Palace fans to feel victimised about but really we aren´t. we get some bad decision and some lucky ones. This pen was neither.
Sorry ,mate, I really don't know if you are having me on?

I know it's being questioned. It's being questioned by those of us who don't think they are normally given. Any fan of any team will have numerous examples of their players being pulled about in the box and not getting anything.

Not sure what your second sentence is getting at? I do think it was a penalty as in the laws of the game.

Are you really taking "sees it all the time" as meaning "can watch 6,7 or 8 actions all at once?" Because that's not how it's meant.

Barbara4003
15-02-2016, 09:45 AM
Stop playing the victim Barbara.

Just lie down and take the shocking refereeing, every week.

It's irritating.

I can take the decisions - it's the inconsistency of those decisions that irritate me.

Ruskin Old Boy
15-02-2016, 09:55 AM
It's irritating.

I can take the decisions - it's the inconsistency of those decisions that irritate me.

I agree.

The lack of consistency in the premier League is shocking and one wonders how the refs get away with it. The one that Clattenberg gave Spurs yesterday was yet another dubious decision from a so-called top flight ref.

cpfc4evandeva
15-02-2016, 10:03 AM
I agree.

The lack of consistency in the premier League is shocking and one wonders how the refs get away with it. The one that Clattenberg gave Spurs yesterday was yet another dubious decision from a so-called top flight ref.

This is the main point. Anyone who thinks that this kind of crap only happens to us is a fool.

Penstone Eagle
15-02-2016, 10:06 AM
Score some ******* goals and these decisions won't matter.

Sureagle
15-02-2016, 10:10 AM
Jedinak has a habit of doing this so not surprised.

Below see an extract from Palace vs Burnley last season when he gave away a simialr penalty. Jedi does give away too many pens and free kicks generally. We nearly lost point vs Swansea because of him. Has become a liability

"Palace captain Jedinak wrestled Jutkiewicz to the ground for a clear Burnley penalty, only for Speroni to pull off a fine save to deny Arfield."

Gazpacho
15-02-2016, 10:43 AM
Ref bang out of order.

Jedi was grappling with deeney before the corner comes in. Deeney asks ref to keep an eye on jedi. Cross comes in deeney drops to his knees, ref gives weak pen.

A few minutes later. Watford player doing the same as jedinak. Ref stops play as cross comes in to warn them that he will be forced to give pen if they continue to hold. Refs given them fair warning.

Where was our fair warning from the first set play of the game?

If refs wish to clamp down on grappling in the box then thats fine, buy it needs to be all refs and from game 1 of the season. Not by some lone maverick half way through feb who changes his mind two minutes later.

Standard of officiating this season has been terrible.

Agree with this.
Jedinak has form for this. Anyone from Watford doing the scouting in preparation for this game would have known about Jedinak's habit of grappling in the box at set pieces.
Deeney was clever and after the ref had said he was watching made a point of going down in full view.
Smart, devious, whatever by Watford. Clumsy, foolish, unprofessional by Palace.

Would the same penalty be given against Man Utd or Chelsea? No, of course not and it is frustrating that we get a lower level of service from the refs, if you can call it that.

However, Palace do need to wise up. And quickly. It is dog eat dog each game and at the moment and we are making it easy for the other dog in the fight by only using 3 of our legs.

Billyd
15-02-2016, 10:54 AM
This is the main point. Anyone who thinks that this kind of crap only happens to us is a fool.

Exactly the point that im making. Just for the record I completely agree it was very harsh that we suddenly get pulled up for a tug in the box.

However this only happens to us is just nonsense. Referees are human and cannot possibly get every decision right or continually make the same exact decision for every like for like situation based on one view at an incident at real time.

Its why the ref missed Swansea's clear penalty, or didnt send Jedi off, or why Zaha didnt get sent off for raising his hands to Bournemouth player (when plenty of players have got sent off for the same).

Madley Saturdays ref has given away the most penalties this season. He also recently pretty much stopped Everton getting through to a cup final.

We should be far more concerned with what we can control such as why:
Our players are losing our discipline far too often, 2 sending offs in a matter of weeks for violent acts.
Why 3 defenders are going to the same attacker.
Why it takes 45 minutes to realise to put Zaha up against Nyom.

Penstone Eagle
15-02-2016, 11:20 AM
Exactly the point that im making. Just for the record I completely agree it was very harsh that we suddenly get pulled up for a tug in the box.

However this only happens to us is just nonsense. Referees are human and cannot possibly get every decision right or continually make the same exact decision for every like for like situation based on one view at an incident at real time.

Its why the ref missed Swansea's clear penalty, or didnt send Jedi off, or why Zaha didnt get sent off for raising his hands to Bournemouth player (when plenty of players have got sent off for the same).

Madley Saturdays ref has given away the most penalties this season. He also recently pretty much stopped Everton getting through to a cup final.

We should be far more concerned with what we can control such as why:
Our players are losing our discipline far too often, 2 sending offs in a matter of weeks for violent acts.
Why 3 defenders are going to the same attacker.
Why it takes 45 minutes to realise to put Zaha up against Nyom.

Spot on.

Still, I'm sure a week in Spain pre cup game will resolve all these issues :rolleyes:

Biscuitboffin
15-02-2016, 11:41 AM
Exactly the point that im making. Just for the record I completely agree it was very harsh that we suddenly get pulled up for a tug in the box.

However this only happens to us is just nonsense. Referees are human and cannot possibly get every decision right or continually make the same exact decision for every like for like situation based on one view at an incident at real time.

Its why the ref missed Swansea's clear penalty, or didnt send Jedi off, or why Zaha didnt get sent off for raising his hands to Bournemouth player (when plenty of players have got sent off for the same).

Madley Saturdays ref has given away the most penalties this season. He also recently pretty much stopped Everton getting through to a cup final.

We should be far more concerned with what we can control such as why:
Our players are losing our discipline far too often, 2 sending offs in a matter of weeks for violent acts.
Why 3 defenders are going to the same attacker.
Why it takes 45 minutes to realise to put Zaha up against Nyom.
I agree with you. If there is somebody on here who thinks it's only us I think that is bonkers.

Penstone Eagle
15-02-2016, 11:44 AM
I agree with you. If there is somebody on here who thinks it's only us I think that is bonkers.

it's the manager believing it and using it as a reason that's the problem

cantspell
15-02-2016, 11:50 AM
Definitely a penalty but Smalling and other do it regularly and don't seem to get penalised for it.

Read Man City hadn't conceeded a penalty for 13 months until yesterday that seems bizarre despite yesterday's wrongly awarded penalty

Biscuitboffin
15-02-2016, 12:06 PM
it's the manager believing it and using it as a reason that's the problem
I don't always think they believe what they say, especially with Pardew, who from recollection has outright lied about players availability before. Maybe he is trying to manage the mindset of the players in some way. Or just play mind games with future refs. Maybe he should get some tips from Derren Brown.

Windsor_Eagle
15-02-2016, 01:35 PM
It isn't only against us. Nobody has said it is only against us.

However, to argue that Reffing decisions have no bearings on results is like saying the manager doesn't have a bearing on results. It is absurd.

grand aigle
15-02-2016, 03:17 PM
ThanksExactly the point that im making. Just for the record I completely agree it was very harsh that we suddenly get pulled up for a tug in the box.

However this only happens to us is just nonsense. Referees are human and cannot possibly get every decision right or continually make the same exact decision for every like for like situation based on one view at an incident at real time.

Its why the ref missed Swansea's clear penalty, or didnt send Jedi off, or why Zaha didnt get sent off for raising his hands to Bournemouth player (when plenty of players have got sent off for the same).

Madley Saturdays ref has given away the most penalties this season. He also recently pretty much stopped Everton getting through to a cup final.

We should be far more concerned with what we can control such as why:
Our players are losing our discipline far too often, 2 sending offs in a matter of weeks for violent acts.
Why 3 defenders are going to the same attacker.
Why it takes 45 minutes to realise to put Zaha up against Nyom.

Who were the 2 sending off? Souare was one who was the other??

orp pisshead1
15-02-2016, 03:27 PM
It wasn't. He clearly got the ball.

It's only a red in my book if St. John's ambulance staff are required to carry the player off to the mortuary :p.
Going back to terms of inconsistent refereeing what about the two footed lunge by the Watford player going completely unpunished.

Bobsta
15-02-2016, 03:30 PM
Dive

orp pisshead1
15-02-2016, 03:31 PM
Thanks

Who were the 2 sending off? Souare was one who was the other??

That Wickham has been poor in previous 3 games prior to Saturday ;)

orp pisshead1
15-02-2016, 03:33 PM
Definitely a penalty but Smalling and other do it regularly and don't seem to get penalised for it.

Read Man City hadn't conceeded a penalty for 13 months until yesterday that seems bizarre despite yesterday's wrongly awarded penalty

More worryingly how shit their centre halves are:D.

Selhurst Celtic
15-02-2016, 03:52 PM
It's only a red in my book if St. John's ambulance staff are required to carry the player off to the mortuary :p.


Amen.

Essexeagle
15-02-2016, 04:01 PM
45878

I don't remember the incident, but if Adebayor was actively trying to get away from the defender (hard to tell from the pic if he was on the move or not) and he didn't let go and then went to ground, then it would be a fair point.

orp pisshead1
15-02-2016, 05:20 PM
I agree.

The lack of consistency in the premier League is shocking and one wonders how the refs get away with it. The one that Clattenberg gave Spurs yesterday was yet another dubious decision from a so-called top flight ref.

Main problem is lack of refs coming through according to Graham Poll last week as it means current batch are fairly safe in their job. Their looking at Stuart Attwell again due to lack of depth in the refereeing pool.

airaos
15-02-2016, 09:30 PM
Penalty yes.
Was it needed - no - the ball was high and flying over the top - Deeney no where near it had he been free

Thefunkymonk
15-02-2016, 09:33 PM
In answer to the thread title... Quite simply yes.

Buglebob
16-02-2016, 01:46 PM
No. First offence should be given, therefore free kick to Palace for Deeney's shove on Jedinak.....although the ball may not have been in play at that moment in which case the ref should have stopped play and given him a warning.

If the ref only saw the aftermath, i.e. Jadinak holding Deeney, then he was right to give a penalty; he can only give what he sees, so we can't really blame him.

As has been mentioned before on other threads, particularly after the Bournemouth fiasco, we need to be a bit smarter to get more of these decisions in our favour.

A Wooden Fish On Wheels
16-02-2016, 05:49 PM
it was very harsh that we suddenly get pulled up for a tug in the box. Fnarr!

meee
16-02-2016, 07:03 PM
It wasn't a penalty.Jedinak had his arms round Deeney but didn't actually foul him.Prodl pulled Deeney's shirt from behind.None of the Watford players appealed.They were as shocked as anyone.

stujii
16-02-2016, 07:35 PM
Not a penalty

Deeney had hold of Jedi's arm on the blind side of the ref and kept it pinned to his chest. He then fell over and pulled Jedi on top of him, a sly old trick...note the Watford players hand pulling Deeney's shirt at the same time...smells of set up to me

Lombardo's hair
16-02-2016, 08:38 PM
Mirror reporter praised Madley for what he called the best decision of the day in awarding the penalty. Says it is about time all in wrestling was cut out at corners. I can't disagree with the latter part of statement......just don't see why we should be on receiving end of this eureka moment. Also why warn Watford players surely they would be aware of consequences of wrestling opponents in box from the penalty award.....unless of course they didn't know why it was given!