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  #50121  
Old 10-11-2017, 11:09 PM
Hpalace Hpalace is online now
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Originally Posted by Se9 eagles View Post
Just got back from the pub and you lot are still banging on about this.GET A LIFE!
Se9 I have remained civil throughout. Is there any need to be rude? I only just rejoined around an hour ago having come home from the pub myself...
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  #50122  
Old 10-11-2017, 11:54 PM
cockneyrebel cockneyrebel is offline
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Originally Posted by Se9 eagles View Post
I bet he listens to that excruciating John Lennon record as well.What a load of old tosh!
Nope that's a load of middle class, hypocritical crap. But note you had no response. You might think your interests are the same as the billionaires and royals because you're both British and doormat yourself in the process like an utter mug and a chump. But I don't.
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  #50123  
Old 10-11-2017, 11:55 PM
cockneyrebel cockneyrebel is offline
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Originally Posted by Les Butler View Post
I had all my duty free fags taken off me by customs whilst arriving home from a holiday in Majorca the other week. However, I notice that Walter Raleigh had no such problem when he was bringing in cheap tobacco from another country. In Fact, they even fecking knighted him.

So once again there’s one rule for a 16 th-century lord of the realm and yet another for the rest of us.

Mr.Rebel

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**** off am I from Croydon.
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  #50124  
Old 10-11-2017, 11:58 PM
cockneyrebel cockneyrebel is offline
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Originally Posted by Les Butler View Post
I was reading the Viz letters online and felt this was appropriate for C,rebels post.
Says the man of the people in a backwater in Canada.
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  #50125  
Old 11-11-2017, 12:12 AM
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Les Butler Les Butler is offline
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Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
**** off am I from Croydon.
Seriously, I thought I was doing you a favour by not saying Lewisham?

Should I have said East Blackheath?
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  #50126  
Old 11-11-2017, 12:20 AM
cockneyrebel cockneyrebel is offline
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Originally Posted by Les Butler View Post
Seriously, I thought I was doing you a favour by not saying Lewisham?

Should I have said East Blackheath?
Lewisham is far better than Croydon. Stick the Blue Orchid up your arse.
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  #50127  
Old 11-11-2017, 12:43 AM
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Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
Lewisham is far better than Croydon. Stick the Blue Orchid up your arse.
In Lewisham, you may like sticking blue flowers up your arse but in Croydon, we just grow them....
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  #50128  
Old 11-11-2017, 09:13 AM
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mik59 mik59 is offline
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Originally Posted by Hpalace View Post
Of course the ecj could reject a turnaround and/or the Eu parliament could reject a turnaround but they wouldn't. Everyone has made it pretty clear we can stay if we wish - just like they did with Ireland.
This is not comparable to Ireland where Dublin got changes to the draft Treaty and the 2nd Ref (a legal requirement for them) got a different result. In our case, the EU27 in the Council could agree to extend A50 but revocation is a matter of interpreting the Treaty and that is solely the ECJ's job if a national court refers the case to them. (People or businesses etc can bring a case but in this case those would have to argue an infringement of EU rights under the Treaty and I can't see how they can.) So one scenario would be if UKippers or similar challenged revocation as being illegal & if that went to the Supreme Court they might have to refer if A50 prohibited it or not.

Now then the ECJ could decide A50 can not be revoked because it does not say it can - and here Kerr's opinion as the drafter is neither here nor there as he is not the judicial authority and his job ended when the draft went to the Council. So did the Council as the legislature intended it could be revoked? Is that consideration on record or not? If not then would a one way door be within the rules of natural justice? My guess is that it is not but there are many cases where it is: once you're out you are out for good with no right of return.
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  #50129  
Old 11-11-2017, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by mik59 View Post
Now then the ECJ could decide A50 can not be revoked because it does not say it can - and here Kerr's opinion as the drafter is neither here nor there as he is not the judicial authority and his job ended when the draft went to the Council. .
Dunno about the ECJ, but own own Supreme Court, when ruling on the interpretation of legislation, often talks of the intent behind the law, or in other words, the wishes of those who drafted it.

So whilst he may not be able to predict an ECJ ruling, his views on the intent behind the law remain of interest and relevance.
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  #50130  
Old 11-11-2017, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Maz View Post
Dunno about the ECJ, but own own Supreme Court, when ruling on the interpretation of legislation, often talks of the intent behind the law, or in other words, the wishes of those who drafted it.

So whilst he may not be able to predict an ECJ ruling, his views on the intent behind the law remain of interest and relevance.
Sure and that is always a line of investigation but for Parliament we have a record but for Intergovernmental Conferences on Treaties that job is harder as records of national positions are confidential. And what Kerr intended as the drafter is not relevant to what Council intended as the legislature.

If Kerr wanted them to be aware of this option then he should have drafted A50 differently. For example, why explicitly give the EU27 the power to decide unanimously that A50 can be extended but intend that the leaving nation can unilaterally stop the process? That does not make sense, especially when you consider that what he wrote is all about the remaining EU setting the terms and conditions for exit from the Treaties they remain governed by. If the Council were aware of this contradiction then surely they would have wanted to clarify the points this raises? Why would they knowingly allow a country to suspend the process and try again at an indeterminate point?
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  #50131  
Old 11-11-2017, 10:35 AM
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The days are counting down and Dumb Dumb Davies says nothing. Two weeks to come up with £50bn, a borderless Ireland and EU citizens rights. 550 days of total garbage. Waste of everyone's time. 14 more days to come up with the stuff to resolve the issues above. Or no talks about trade talks. 55 institutions to be created to replicate what we have as part of the EU. Nothing. 45% of our trade is within the single market. 15% trade with us. The imbalance is massive yet our idiots and fools have nothing to offer but walk away. The chaos that will bring is unimaginable.
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  #50132  
Old 11-11-2017, 10:39 AM
Skintagain Skintagain is offline
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Originally Posted by mik59 View Post
This defies logic. We have to leave the EU under Article 50 before we can make a trade deal with the EU under Article 218. To leave is to legally separate ourselves from the Treaties. In turn that means fulfilling the commitment we made under the Treaties on the EU Budget. Whichever way you cut the cake, we will settle our financial commitments as an EU Member before becoming a non-EU country and making a trade deal with the EU.
What are they, what ever happened to £100bil, last I read they are now after £40bil.
So their view of our financial commitments appears to have dropped by £60bil. It seems our current view of our financial commitment is £20bil.

In that light the hysterical wailing of the remainers seems unjustified. Who cares about Article this, Article that, that's their rules we're leaving, anything can be negotiated. Politicians are never constrained by other peoples rules.
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Last edited by Skintagain; 11-11-2017 at 10:52 AM.
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  #50133  
Old 11-11-2017, 10:42 AM
Se9 eagles Se9 eagles is offline
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Originally Posted by Hpalace View Post
Se9 I have remained civil throughout. Is there any need to be rude? I only just rejoined around an hour ago having come home from the pub myself...
Fair play H.You will be glad to know I'm being punished with a monumental hangover...

Last edited by Se9 eagles; 11-11-2017 at 10:50 AM.
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  #50134  
Old 11-11-2017, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Skintagain View Post
In that light the hysterical wailing of the remainers seems unjustified. .
Whatever you might think of Mik's informed posts, hysterical is the very last thing that they are. Yet again, facts get twisted and ignorant rhetoric remains the order of the day.
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  #50135  
Old 11-11-2017, 10:45 AM
Skintagain Skintagain is offline
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Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
And again in response to your nationalism:

This is just meaningless drivel. Indeed the whole concept of nationalism is not only a recent development, but also total drivel.

What have I got in common with billionaires and the royal family? Jack shit. Their interests are totally different, and opposed, to mine and my loved ones.

Why would I be proud of what the ruling class has done in this country, both now and in history? It is soaked in genocidal murder in an historical perspective and colonialism. It would be like saying Germans should be proud of all of their past.

What I am proud of is the Chartists, the general strike in the 1920s, the miners strike, the huge working class movements that meant we got the NHS, comprehensive education, pensions and welfare. But that's not being proud to be British, it's proud of working class history.

Also what does British culture mean? Again it is totally different on a class basis, my culture has nothing to do with the rich. Added to that is that there are thousands of different cultures around Britain, there is no single British culture.

I imagine that in terms of Britain past and present that I am proud of things that you would be ashamed of, and you would be proud of things I'm ashamed of. Lumping it altogether is bollocks.
I dream of the day you get the foreman's job.
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  #50136  
Old 11-11-2017, 10:54 AM
Se9 eagles Se9 eagles is offline
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Originally Posted by Skintagain View Post
I dream of the day you get the foreman's job.
It's easy to be far left when you have nothing and jealously covert what others have.Otherwise if you have no talent and shun hard work you've got no chance of a comfortable life and retirement....
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  #50137  
Old 11-11-2017, 10:56 AM
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  #50138  
Old 11-11-2017, 10:57 AM
Skintagain Skintagain is offline
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Whatever you might think of Mik's informed posts, hysterical is the very last thing that they are. Yet again, facts get twisted and ignorant rhetoric remains the order of the day.

Oooh, who are you Mik's minder?
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  #50139  
Old 11-11-2017, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Se9 eagles View Post
It's easy to be far left when you have nothing and jealously covert what others have.Otherwise if you have no talent and shun hard work you've got no chance of a comfortable life and retirement....
It's also easy to be an odious tit when you post. Well done
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  #50140  
Old 11-11-2017, 11:11 AM
Se9 eagles Se9 eagles is offline
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It's also easy to be an odious tit when you post. Well done
Another reasoned post.Ah,the insight...
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