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  #2001  
Old 19-07-2016, 04:27 PM
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  #2002  
Old 19-07-2016, 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post

Your route back to winning is a joke. Warmed up blairism.
Trying to win enough constituencies to form a majority is "Blairism" is it?
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  #2003  
Old 19-07-2016, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by nicky View Post
I think the parties mistakenly believe they win elections on a wave of love and support.

Actually they win by being the less frightening option for about 20% of the electorate in 50 ish marginals.
This is so true.

The Corbynist way to power seems to be a belief that the 33% that currently did not vote will mass as one and put a cross in the Labour box. The truth is that many people do not vote because in 550 seats the result is already a given. For example Croydon South 55% Con, 25% Lab, 11% UKIP, 6% LD. I guess many Con supports could not be bothered as the win was guaranteed and any other vote is a protest vote if you can be bothered to get off your sofa.

I guess that the turnout in the 100 marginal is somewhat higher. Any increase in the Lab vote due to the popularity of Corbyn would be lost many times over by those who will not vote or even worse vote for another party.
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  #2004  
Old 19-07-2016, 04:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Big Blue Eagle View Post
People have asked you before, but let's try again. What is your route to power, and why does actually getting elected seem so anathema to you?

If the proposed boundary changes go through, and parliament reduces to 600 seats, that means 301 MPs to form a majority, and common wisdom suggests that labour could be knocked back by around 20 seats from today's total by those changes. Either way, they probably need to go from the low 200s and win well over 50 seats to get a majority. With no likely gain in Scotland and Wales pretty static, that means they have to win in England, and have to win seats from the Tories. While also defending inner city seats from UKIP.

That means reaching out not to left leaning voters, but to centre voters with policies that make life better for them.

You may have missed the post in the flurry but over the weekend I said that the embryonic policies being proposed at present are targeting the traditional core vote hurt by austerity etc, but what about the policies or even messages to the non core vote that have to won over - and were by Blair and New Labour - to deliver a government with a working majority that means all those policies actually get implemented?
Why are you saying getting ejected is anathema? I just disagree with you. Corbyn, despite the PLP ripping the labour party apart, is still getting poll ratings as good and better than Kinnock ever got. I think there is an anti establishment mood. Once the members sort out the PLP I think labour can do very well.
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  #2005  
Old 19-07-2016, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Heb 7:4 View Post
Trying to win enough constituencies to form a majority is "Blairism" is it?
But you haven't said anything, it's just vacuous.

I think policies on mass council builds, rent caps, higher minimum wage, renationalising the railways, ending privatisation of the NHS, reversing academies, improving workers rights and scrapping the anti trade union bill and laws, higher taxes for the rich etc can all have popular appeal.
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  #2006  
Old 19-07-2016, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Kidofwonder View Post
I think a lot of people overthink politics and don't realise how many people will vote for a personality regardless of policies
Thats why you need to smear, smear and smear again
Until the electorate are convinced the man is no good
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  #2007  
Old 19-07-2016, 04:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
Why are you saying getting ejected is anathema? I just disagree with you. Corbyn, despite the PLP ripping the labour party apart, is still getting poll ratings as good and better than Kinnock ever got. I think there is an anti establishment mood. Once the members sort out the PLP I think labour can do very well.
With the greatest respect. If you mean by "very well" increasing the popular vote in seats that do not matter but losing the key marginals. Then you are correct.
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  #2008  
Old 19-07-2016, 04:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Nth Kent Eagle View Post
Sorry the 117k was my figure rather than my northern near namesake's. I took it as the average total cost of a Bovis housing unit for their interim report last year. Bovis may or may not be typical in their geography or house style. I would suspect that councils or government may get it for less if they dropped a few aesthetic features and used less prime land.
Far far less I reckon. Although I doubt it would be tower blocks this time
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  #2009  
Old 19-07-2016, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
Why are you saying getting ejected is anathema? I just disagree with you. Corbyn, despite the PLP ripping the labour party apart, is still getting poll ratings as good and better than Kinnock ever got. I think there is an anti establishment mood. Once the members sort out the PLP I think labour can do very well.
That's simply not true though. Why do you insist on making things up and then just turn them out as facts. Even kinocks lowest ever approval ratings were higher than Corbyn.
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  #2010  
Old 19-07-2016, 04:59 PM
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Owen Smith says he can be the members champion. Sadly for him the majority see him as a back stabbing, weasly waste of space.
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  #2011  
Old 19-07-2016, 04:59 PM
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  #2012  
Old 19-07-2016, 05:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
Why are you saying getting ejected is anathema? I just disagree with you. Corbyn, despite the PLP ripping the labour party apart, is still getting poll ratings as good and better than Kinnock ever got.
I hate to break this to you, but Kinnock never won a general election.
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  #2013  
Old 19-07-2016, 05:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Skintagain View Post
I do agree that it is con and a scourge on modern society that needs to be reversed. I have to say that I'm quite pleased that Obsorne increased tax costs for buy-to-letters making it slightly less attractive, hopefully this will continue.

As for the railways I do occasionally use them but do remember the good old days of filthy dilapidated trains. I see the modern railway system as a victim of its own success.
Fair enough, you little corbyite you.
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  #2014  
Old 19-07-2016, 05:01 PM
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  #2015  
Old 19-07-2016, 05:03 PM
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Originally Posted by daverambo2 View Post
That's simply not true though. Why do you insist on making things up and then just turn them out as facts. Even kinocks lowest ever approval ratings were higher than Corbyn.
What are you droning on about, I'm talking about polls. In 1987 Kinnock got just over 30% and in 1992 just over 34%. With with the PLP destroying Labour, Labour under Corbyn is getting that.
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  #2016  
Old 19-07-2016, 05:04 PM
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  #2017  
Old 19-07-2016, 05:06 PM
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Is Smith really the best this great party can do?
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  #2018  
Old 19-07-2016, 05:06 PM
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Owen Smith. Brilliant that's the best they could come up with
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  #2019  
Old 19-07-2016, 05:07 PM
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It really shows the utter lack of talent in the no marks that make up the coup lot.
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  #2020  
Old 19-07-2016, 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
Why are you saying getting ejected is anathema? I just disagree with you. Corbyn, despite the PLP ripping the labour party apart, is still getting poll ratings as good and better than Kinnock ever got. I think there is an anti establishment mood. Once the members sort out the PLP I think labour can do very well.
Can you give me a link to the figures that back the statement up...... Thanks

Edit Elgin will love this I could not work out what your sentence meant, you clarified it latter. The SNP taking over Scotland means you need a lot more than Kinnock who was nowhere near winning the elections anyway.

Last edited by N Herts Eagle; 19-07-2016 at 05:11 PM.
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