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General Palace Discussion General Palace talk - please keep transfer talk in the transfer forum.

View Poll Results: As of 05/02/17 who should be first choice Goalkeeper
1 Julian Speroni 311 26.22%
13 wayne Hennessey 178 15.01%
30 Steve Mandanda 561 47.30%
Another 136 11.47%
Voters: 1186. You may not vote on this poll

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  #961  
Old 09-04-2015, 04:22 PM
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I have always said Hennessey is a good keeper, I just think Speroni is better. I am welsh and get to see Hennessey play more often than some on here.
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  #962  
Old 09-04-2015, 04:26 PM
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I just wish some people would not let their blind hero worship get in the way of their eyes. We have so much crap on here about people who try hard such as Moxey and Ramage but for some reason the likes of Kelly getting crucified when they are one of the better players. even Jedi is being given shite despite being our captain. Fact is Jules had some poor games that cost us goals, Hennessy has never been given more than one game on the trot yet is crap according to so many. Last year Jules suddenly played better when Pulis got competition in, and suddenly is playing better again when his time was almost up. The vitriol on here comes from those who thinks that when Jules farts it smells of roses.
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  #963  
Old 09-04-2015, 04:32 PM
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I just wish some people would not let their blind hero worship get in the way of their eyes. We have so much crap on here about people who try hard such as Moxey and Ramage but for some reason the likes of Kelly getting crucified when they are one of the better players. even Jedi is being given shite despite being our captain. Fact is Jules had some poor games that cost us goals, Hennessy has never been given more than one game on the trot yet is crap according to so many. Last year Jules suddenly played better when Pulis got competition in, and suddenly is playing better again when his time was almost up. The vitriol on here comes from those who thinks that when Jules farts it smells of roses.
Nobody is saying that Jules is exempt from criticism.

However, mistakes shiuld be viewed in the context of contribution to the club as well. So Sanogo missing a sitter will attract more vitriol than if Murray does. It is human nature.

and three managers have not given Hennessey a chance, having seen him train daily even with some mistakes by Jules. I take that as a statement.
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  #964  
Old 09-04-2015, 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted by kolinkins View Post
.....

However, mistakes shiuld be viewed in the context of contribution to the club as well. So Sanogo missing a sitter will attract more vitriol than if Murray does. It is human nature.........
I don't get this bit and I am intrigued in part because I always am fascinated by how differently we (the human race not you and I) see and interpret things.

I guess my position is that I want everyone at Palace to do well irrelevant of how long they have been here during a match.

I think I probably tend to give new players or youngsters a bit more patience than established players purely because being new is a challenge and it takes time to settle. So I try hard not to discount them. I try to assess each performance based on that match but I am human too and inevitably over time I expect certain players to win certain challenges and some to duck them and I am sure that colours my view. but I don't think that is the same as the above.

Again this next bit is more a general point - why do new players seem to get such a hard time because they have replaced an existing player in the team. For me it's exciting but judging by the BBS most see it as stealing someone's slot. I really don't get it.

K - apologies as I doubt you were posting a deep and meaningful post there and maybe even more of a comment on others than a personal view. I am genuinely interested as to why a player is deemed better because they have been here longer.
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  #965  
Old 09-04-2015, 06:15 PM
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If Wayne leaves this summer for whatever reason I would be more than happy with Pantilimon, he'll probably have a shocker at the wkend but I think he is the best keeper in the bottom half by far.
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  #966  
Old 09-04-2015, 06:30 PM
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I remember there being a thread calling for Speroni to be dropped for Lewis Price in the 2010/11 season, and similar calls after gifting Watford two goals in the first game of the promotion season, as well as last season before Pulis joined.

Since that first 10/11 thread, the following managers have chosen Speroni as first choice:
Burley
Freedman
Lawrence/Fleming as caretakers
Holloway
Millen (caretaker)
Pulis
Millen 2nd caretaker spell
Warnock
Millen 3rd caretaker spell
Pardew

Now it would be stupid to say that Speroni had been in top form that whole time or has made no mistakes. But a goalkeeper is not like a striker who you can just rotate in and out of the team at ease, so I found it strange that people were calling for him to be dropped because of a few goals he could have done better on (I wouldn't even call some of them, such as Everton at home a mistake).

That is not to say that we should not look for another keeper in the Summer but I do not see what Hennessey has done in his career to date to show he is an obvious upgrade on Speroni and should get his chance as soon as Speroni has a slight dip in form.
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  #967  
Old 09-04-2015, 07:43 PM
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I love Speroni but did someone really say there's only 3 keepers better than him in the league? Lol.

For starters some individual clubs have two keepers a fair bit better than him, never mind the entire league....

Last edited by Friskey; 09-04-2015 at 07:51 PM.
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  #968  
Old 09-04-2015, 08:36 PM
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Originally Posted by maestro View Post
My position has always been that Jules is a good championship GK but in my humble opinion he is to put it kindly a mediocre premier league keeper, why is that such an outrageous opinion to have?
Because for the second season in a row it's likely that we'll finish in a mid-table position with Julian Speroni playing a contributing role. It's indisputable.
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  #969  
Old 09-04-2015, 09:02 PM
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Just because an opinion is different to yours doesn't make it wrong.

I would prefer a steady eddy type keeper, the trouble with Jules who has been a great servant is he goes from world class to Hackney marshes in minutes. A keeper that is ok, and does the basics well would be fine by me. Jules is not alone in the league, rob green, Minolet etc are cut from the same cloth.
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  #970  
Old 09-04-2015, 09:40 PM
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I understand this. There are probaly 10 better than Speroni at least.

But there are also 10 better centre backs than Delaney, 10 better RB's than Ward, better players than McArthur and Bolasie and Puncheon too.

Does it mean that we call our players mediocre on that basis? I guess by defintion, they are as they play for us. But do they need that label?

And here's a freebie for you - one of the keepers who is not better than Speroni is Lewis Price.

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Nav, my position at that time was as follows:

It should not be categorically out of the question for the club to consider playing a goalkeeper on their books, whom they pay well, if the current first choice is not performing.

If Iker Cassillas can be dropped by Real Madrid, Palace can flirt with the possibilit that Speroni's position is challenged.

That was my position, remains my position. It's about a squad.
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  #971  
Old 09-04-2015, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by RDSdaEAGLE View Post
Because for the second season in a row it's likely that we'll finish in a mid-table position with Julian Speroni playing a contributing role. It's indisputable.
And no left back.
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  #972  
Old 09-04-2015, 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by maestro View Post
If Wayne leaves this summer for whatever reason I would be more than happy with Pantilimon, he'll probably have a shocker at the wkend but I think he is the best keeper in the bottom half by far.
Agreed? Hope he has a shocker too.

Last edited by RobCPFC1982; 09-04-2015 at 09:52 PM. Reason: Add to post
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  #973  
Old 09-04-2015, 10:00 PM
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Casilla's got dropped last season in la liga but played all their Champions League and Copa del Rey games, the two trophies they won. Hardly the best example.
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Last edited by greybot; 09-04-2015 at 10:03 PM.
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  #974  
Old 10-04-2015, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Martin H View Post

K - apologies as I doubt you were posting a deep and meaningful post there and maybe even more of a comment on others than a personal view. I am genuinely interested as to why a player is deemed better because they have been here longer.
It's not about being here longer. It is about contribution.

Murray has contributed to promotion and now has 5 goals in 5 games. So if he misses a sitter v Sunderland it will be more easy to forgive than Sanogo because we know what he can do for us.

Likewise Speroni - if he drops a clanger, because we know how good he has been for us, winning 4 POTY awards, we know that a mistake is just that and not an indication on ability. Hennessey does not have that luxury

There are other examples too - Delaney/Hangeland, Ward/Kelly etc etc.

The player is not deemed better for being here longer; he is just excused some errors because of his overall contribution to the club
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  #975  
Old 10-04-2015, 08:09 AM
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Originally Posted by CPFC_DAVE77 View Post
Nav, my position at that time was as follows:

It should not be categorically out of the question for the club to consider playing a goalkeeper on their books, whom they pay well, if the current first choice is not performing.

If Iker Cassillas can be dropped by Real Madrid, Palace can flirt with the possibilit that Speroni's position is challenged.

That was my position, remains my position. It's about a squad.
Casillas got dropped because he fell out with the President not because of his form.
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  #976  
Old 10-04-2015, 08:15 AM
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I'd be supportive of dropping Speroni if our other keepers were better than him.

Taylor using Kiraly, Turner and Flinders ahead of him was a joke.
During Warnock's time here, Speroni was in the form of his life and rightly never dislodged
Sine then, we have had Price, Alexander and Hennessey and none of them can make a claim of being a better player

You can't just drop a 'keeper for poor form and bring in someone not as good - how would the team benefit from that?

Hopefully we can get a massive upgrade for Hennessey in the summer and have a proper challenge for Speroni.
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  #977  
Old 10-04-2015, 08:21 AM
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Is Hennessey really that bad? People seem to be writing him off based on very little evidence.
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Old 10-04-2015, 08:23 AM
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Is Hennessey really that bad? People seem to be writing him off based on very little evidence.
Who has said he is bad? Being not as good as Speroni does not mean people are calling him bad.

But I do think that three managers, including the one that signed him, who see him daily in training have made a pretty damning judgement of him. Not as good as Speroni, even when Jules was making errors.
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Old 10-04-2015, 08:26 AM
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Is Hennessey really that bad? People seem to be writing him off based on very little evidence.
Writing him off based on the fact that if he can't oust Speroni from the side now he won't really be much of an improvement when Jules retires perhaps
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Old 10-04-2015, 08:37 AM
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Who has said he is bad? Being not as good as Speroni does not mean people are calling him bad.

But I do think that three managers, including the one that signed him, who see him daily in training have made a pretty damning judgement of him. Not as good as Speroni, even when Jules was making errors.
Do you apply that logic to Dwight Gayle?

Genuine question not being sarcastic.
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