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  #41  
Old 08-09-2006, 09:16 AM
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Last nights program was probaly the only 9/11 i have watched from start to finish this was because it gave an insight into the actions and thoughts of ordinary workers on the actual day and did not have endless interviews with politicians or so called terror experts.
I still find it very distressing watching the poor desperate people who jumped to the deaths rather than burn to death .
The only uplifting thing that came out of the programme was the willingness of some brave individuals who risked their lives to help others.
After watching how a lot of workers where told to stay at their desks and even return to the building after leaving i can only say if anyone finds themselfs in the same or similar position just flee ASP.
The frightening thing is that i got the impression that the US secret services seemed to ignore all the intelligence pointing towards the plot and individuals carryinging it out as if they wanted it to happen to justify an attack on Iraq.
Also can anyone explain why the video of the attack on the Pentagon fails to show the plane i know it was traveling at great speed but surely the FBI can slow it down to show more detail..
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Last edited by racehorse-80s; 08-09-2006 at 09:23 AM.
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  #42  
Old 08-09-2006, 09:26 AM
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The security camera that taped that only took frames once every second. A plane travelling at that speed wouldn't get picked up. However, if you look very closely at the frame before the impact you can see the tip of the wing appear at the side of the picture. Had the plane arrived one second later the shot would have been of the plane making the impact rather than showing the fireball that followed.
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  #43  
Old 08-09-2006, 09:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by racehorse-80s

After watching how a lot of workers where told to stay at their desks and even return to the building after leaving i can only say if anyone finds themselfs in the same or similar position just flee ASP.
As I said people never think it'll happen to them. I saw this on a much smaller scale when we had the bus outside our office on 21/7 last year, with a suspected bomb on it. If it had gone off and was big enough it would certainly have blown our office windows in (at least) so I left work ASAP and went home.

Incredibly, people carried on as if nothing was happening and as if they faced no danger.
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  #44  
Old 08-09-2006, 09:46 AM
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It was really difficult to watch but I'm glad I did. What with it being five years later I'd almost started to remember it as a bit of a hollywood action sequence so it brought a whole load of reality back into it. I hadn't really considered how trapped those people were; the inhuman scale of showing the entire towers in the most memorable news footage definitely dehumanised the collapse.
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  #45  
Old 08-09-2006, 09:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by OscillateWildly
As I said people never think it'll happen to them. I saw this on a much smaller scale when we had the bus outside our office on 21/7 last year, with a suspected bomb on it. If it had gone off and was big enough it would certainly have blown our office windows in (at least) so I left work ASAP and went home.

Incredibly, people carried on as if nothing was happening and as if they faced no danger.
A few years back their was a fire in a manchester department store i believe and the alarm sounded but several people who had just received their meals in the cafeteria stayed put and paid with their lives .
At the end of the day if you are caught up in a terrorist attack or any sort of disaster you should remove yourself from any potential danger not only for your own sake but if you do get trapped or injured someone else will have to possibly risk their lives rescueing you.
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Last edited by racehorse-80s; 08-09-2006 at 10:12 AM.
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  #46  
Old 08-09-2006, 09:53 AM
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I was in New York at the time and that was the most difficult programme I've ever watched. The most surreal few days of my life
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Last edited by Ferris Bueller; 08-09-2006 at 09:57 AM.
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  #47  
Old 08-09-2006, 09:58 AM
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It was a very well produced programme, and as one person commented sometimes you forgot you were watching a reconstruction. Unlike that programme a couple of months back about the people who jumped which ended on a positive note that these people had somehow set themselves free and taken their fate into their own hands, last nights programme ended on a very serious note that more attacks could happen at any time.

I have a somewhat morbid fascination that i can't explain with watching anything about 9/11 (except that ridiculous 9/11 Millionnaire Wives that was on C4 the other day).

The twin towers themselves also utterly fascinate me, and watching films made prior to 2001 such as one i saw the other night called "The Bone Collector" which features shots of The Twin Towers makes it all the more utterly bizarre and sad at the same time.

There's a film called "World Trade Center" coming out at the end of this month by Oliver Stone that i think re-tells the story of the firemen who survived that featured in last nights BBC1 programme.
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  #48  
Old 08-09-2006, 09:59 AM
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I broke the story on the BBS as I was working from home and always had BBC News 24 on.
I opened the thread with a line like "Some idiot just crashed into the Trade Towers. Couldn't he see it?!" Followed by wondering how a pilot in trouble did not ditch the plane in the sea!
Realised the shocking error I'd made minutes later when I saw the pictures.
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  #49  
Old 08-09-2006, 10:25 AM
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A very well produced documentary on the awful events of 9/11,
which was handled in a completely realistic way with a skilful
mixture of real footage and re-enacted scenes, which brought
out both the horrific personal experiences of many of those
working in the stricken buildings, and those risking their lives
trying to rescue them.

It dealt extremely well with the quiet bravery of ordinary
citizens and the rescue workers who consciously defied
certain death trying to do their professional job of saving
human life.

Found watching it an extremely chilling experience, although
it also helped to show the heroism and selflessness of many
people when faced with a life and death situation.

The sheer incompetence of the CIA and the other Security
agencies that failed to understand or suspect the potential
threat and capability of el Qaeda to carry out such a major
atrocity despite previous attacks abroad and in the US under
both the Clinton and Bush regimes, was mind-boggling.

Last edited by Freddy Kurz; 08-09-2006 at 10:32 AM.
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  #50  
Old 08-09-2006, 10:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by One game a season
I broke the story on the BBS as I was working from home and always had BBC News 24 on.
I opened the thread with a line like "Some idiot just crashed into the Trade Towers. Couldn't he see it?!" Followed by wondering how a pilot in trouble did not ditch the plane in the sea!
Realised the shocking error I'd made minutes later when I saw the pictures.
In fairness though it was a mistake made by many at the time, with catastophic results especially for those in the 2nd tower to be hit.
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  #51  
Old 08-09-2006, 11:35 AM
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Still don't understand how a fire and explosion on the 40 something floor resulted in the entire building collapsing all the way to its foundations.
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  #52  
Old 08-09-2006, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by racehorse-80s
Also can anyone explain why the video of the attack on the Pentagon fails to show the plane i know it was traveling at great speed but surely the FBI can slow it down to show more detail..
Yes that's quite easy. The Pentagon wasn't hit by an aircraft.
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  #53  
Old 08-09-2006, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Pistike
Still don't understand how a fire and explosion on the 40 something floor resulted in the entire building collapsing all the way to its foundations.
think the official line is it melted the core, but there have been rumours that there were secondary bombs set off after the crashes that caused he buildings to collapse

who knows?
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  #54  
Old 08-09-2006, 11:48 AM
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Could have sworn that heat travels up.

Must have been a duff physics teacher.
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  #55  
Old 08-09-2006, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Pistike
Still don't understand how a fire and explosion on the 40 something floor resulted in the entire building collapsing all the way to its foundations.
Think of it being a bit like an avalanche. When you've a quarter of the building accelerating into the weakened structure it's gonna to fall down.
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  #56  
Old 08-09-2006, 11:50 AM
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Also the steel didn't fully melt but was massivel heated by the fire to a point where it lost the majority of it strength and buckled.
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Old 08-09-2006, 11:52 AM
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Weakened by what?

The impact of the aircraft didn't weaken the structure beneath the impact point.
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Old 08-09-2006, 11:54 AM
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Heat travels up.

I can see why the structure might have collapsed above the impact.

Its the next 40 something floors that went down like playing cards that I have a problem with.
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Old 08-09-2006, 11:56 AM
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The aircraft hit at angles affecting several different floors in different places. Also the structural system was probably designed as a whole with some of the strength for the lower floors coming from ties and structure further up so any weakness above would have had an effect on the structure below.
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  #60  
Old 08-09-2006, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Pistike
Weakened by what?

The impact of the aircraft didn't weaken the structure beneath the impact point.
I am not an engineer but here's my guess.

The top of the building was inflamed and the floors started collapsing. As they collpased, on fire, so the weight of the falling caused the floors below to collapse and so on.

This explains why the building collapsed outwards as well.

By the time you get to the Ground Floor, there will have been considerable momentum from the floors falling from the top.
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If we can beat the Germans with full employment (albeit, not with 11 men) then why can't we use those men to fight poverty and disease?
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