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  #201  
Old 13-03-2018, 12:15 AM
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Originally Posted by vitesse View Post
Why did Porton Down give you four courses of Anthrax?
I didnt get them there. I assumed that the labs there were where it was made. If you are thinking of getting some i wouldnt recommend it.
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  #202  
Old 13-03-2018, 12:39 AM
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Whenever I hear inflammatory language against another state from politicians and our media before anything has been proven or even done, then you can’t help but think there is an agenda at hand. See ‘War on Terror’.
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  #203  
Old 13-03-2018, 06:35 AM
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I'm sure Theresa May will succeed where Napoleon and Hitler failed. We can expect to see the Union Jack flying over the Duma by Christmas.
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  #204  
Old 13-03-2018, 06:54 AM
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Originally Posted by bubbs11 View Post
Whenever I hear inflammatory language against another state from politicians and our media before anything has been proven or even done, then you canít help but think there is an agenda at hand. See ĎWar on Terrorí.
That is my take on it.

On the balance of probability it is not surprising that fingers are pointing towards a Russian link of some kind, but whether that extends as far as the Kremlin, surely from a diplomatic standpoint needs to be established before we hear publicly the rhetoric we have.

The murky world of spying appears to be a law unto itself, so self righteous declarations from any state that another are not playing by the Queensbury rules dont really wash with me.

I do agree that what has happened here has put at risk the lives of innocents, and therefore every right of our government to highlight how wrong this is, however they should have held back at attributing blame until they were clearer as to where that lay. By not doing so does indicate this has been exploited for political reasons.
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  #205  
Old 13-03-2018, 06:57 AM
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Originally Posted by elgin eagle View Post
A lot of the groundwork has already been done. See mh17, aleppo, crimea, anything else the utter **** heb 7:4 says etc. Pretty clear to me that Russians are the New Jews when it comes to smear. Its ridiculous how much they get blamed for.

What do they achieve? More illegal sanctions, demonisation of the people, seizing of lucrative assets and funds? Lots of reasons i suspect. Still we are the good guys, right.
Think about it. What advantage would the establishment have with poisoning a historical town centre?

Much easier ways of promoting anti Russian propaganda.

So who else could have done it?
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  #206  
Old 13-03-2018, 07:04 AM
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Originally Posted by elgin eagle View Post
Still we are the good guys, right.
I don't think, with the best will in world, that Putin's regime is ever going to win the award.
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  #207  
Old 13-03-2018, 07:39 AM
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Who else would do it?
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  #208  
Old 13-03-2018, 07:41 AM
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  #209  
Old 13-03-2018, 07:42 AM
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Originally Posted by elgin eagle View Post
A lot of the groundwork has already been done. See mh17, aleppo, crimea, anything else the utter **** heb 7:4 says etc. Pretty clear to me that Russians are the New Jews when it comes to smear. Its ridiculous how much they get blamed for.



What do they achieve? More illegal sanctions, demonisation of the people, seizing of lucrative assets and funds? Lots of reasons i suspect. Still we are the good guys, right.

Elgin almost anyone can be perceived as the good guys when compared to Russia. I know you have some strong left wing sympathies but there is no doubt that this attack has been sponsored, facilitated and / or delivered by the Russian state. In fact this attack is legal in Russian law and therefore they havenít done anything wrong according to their own legislation.

Itís also a reasonable strategy for Putin - it galvanises domestic support at a time of continued economic crisis and the West can do little, in retaliation, to destabilise Russiaís car crash economy further.

Russia will be on its knees within a few years and likely break up soon after. This of course may be more dangerous to the West than the status quo.
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  #210  
Old 13-03-2018, 07:47 AM
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Originally Posted by McpfcS View Post
Elgin almost anyone can be perceived as the good guys when compared to Russia. I know you have some strong left wing sympathies but there is no doubt that this attack has been sponsored, facilitated and / or delivered by the Russian state. In fact this attack is legal in Russian law and therefore they havenít done anything wrong according to their own legislation.

Itís also a reasonable strategy for Putin - it galvanises domestic support at a time of continued economic crisis and the West can do little, in retaliation, to destabilise Russiaís car crash economy further.

Russia will be on its knees within a few years and likely break up soon after. This of course may be more dangerous to the West than the status quo.
Yes there is unless you know different. Strong suspicion based on on likelihood is not the same 'no doubt'
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  #211  
Old 13-03-2018, 07:48 AM
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Originally Posted by McpfcS View Post
Elgin almost anyone can be perceived as the good guys when compared to Russia. I know you have some strong left wing sympathies but there is no doubt that this attack has been sponsored, facilitated and / or delivered by the Russian state. In fact this attack is legal in Russian law and therefore they havenít done anything wrong according to their own legislation.

Itís also a reasonable strategy for Putin - it galvanises domestic support at a time of continued economic crisis and the West can do little, in retaliation, to destabilise Russiaís car crash economy further.

Russia will be on its knees within a few years and likely break up soon after. This of course may be more dangerous to the West than the status quo.
Break up? into what pieces?
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  #212  
Old 13-03-2018, 07:51 AM
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Sorry i cant dumb it down any more mate.



Its just my opinion based on events over the last 10 years. But hey, believe whatever the feck you want. Its a free country after all. One thing i do know for a fact is you will never find out the truth from either places state media propaganda. Truth is the first casaulty of war. All about the hearts and minds. And i can see that battle is already lost. Night.

Ok EE. I get that we should approach establishment media with some scepticism. I actually backed you up on this as regards the MH incident (though I had a different view on it from you). I also get that you feel Russia is demonised for some reason. I've known these two things about you for at least the last couple of years. I also get that you feel bruised by people's attitude to Russia and your wish to put events in a different light.

Like AJ I'm always interested in understanding the possible agendas and narratives in play. I find it fascinating how difficult it is to see outside ones own set of paradigmatic assumptions.

So I'm actually with you here. I was just asking what you're theory actually was because I thought you were saying more than 'there might be another way of seeing it', legitimate though that point is. You do keep intimating that you know more about stuff ... but then you don't expand. Maybe it's deeper and more personal than should be aired on the bbs.

Sorry if it feels like I've hounded you.
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  #213  
Old 13-03-2018, 08:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Away View Post
Ok EE. I get that we should approach establishment media with some scepticism. I actually backed you up on this as regards the MH incident (though I had a different view on it from you). I also get that you feel Russia is demonised for some reason. I've known these two things about you for at least the last couple of years. I also get that you feel bruised by people's attitude to Russia and your wish to put events in a different light.

Like AJ I'm always interested in understanding the possible agendas and narratives in play. I find it fascinating how difficult it is to see outside ones own set of paradigmatic assumptions.

So I'm actually with you here. I was just asking what you're theory actually was because I thought you were saying more than 'there might be another way of seeing it', legitimate though that point is. You do keep intimating that you know more about stuff ... but then you don't expand. Maybe it's deeper and more personal than should be aired on the bbs.

Sorry if it feels like I've hounded you.
No problem pal. Don't worry, I won't be coming for you. As a spy I guess there must be times when you are usefully dead to both sides is all I'm saying. Winds me up when I read 'the Russians were definitely behind this'. Not sure what level of naivety you require to think like this. (Thats not me having a pop at you, by the way). Anyway i'll try to stay respectful to the others who fit the first criteria. Apart from one, who has 7 lives left, the Russian hating ****. Having seen the media portrayal of other dubious events involving Russia only increases my suspicions about this spy killing, but this is yet another no win thread and feck all chance of ever finding out the truth, so pointless bothering trying to get people to think differently when it comes to Russia. Prefer to stick to light hearted threads myself. Less wankers on them.
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  #214  
Old 13-03-2018, 08:23 AM
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No problem pal. Don't worry, I won't be coming for you. As a spy I guess there must be times when you are usefully dead to both sides is all I'm saying. Winds me up when I read 'the Russians were definitely behind this'. Not sure what level of naivety you require to think like this. (Thats not me having a pop at you, by the way). Anyway i'll try to stay respectful to the others who fit the first criteria. Apart from one, who has 7 lives left, the Russian hating ****. Having seen the media portrayal of other dubious events involving Russia only increases my suspicions about this spy killing, but this is yet another no win thread and feck all chance of ever finding out the truth, so pointless bothering trying to get people to think differently when it comes to Russia. Prefer to stick to light hearted threads myself. Less wankers on them.

Iím afraid Elgin the only naivety (in fact total stupidity) is coming from you.
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  #215  
Old 13-03-2018, 08:26 AM
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Originally Posted by ExiledStirling View Post
Break up? into what pieces?

Russia is a huge tapestry of many regions that have very different religious beliefs, cultures and economic potential.

Many leading thinkers on Russia suspect the country is going to hell in a hand cart and this economic catastrophe will lead (again) to its fragmentation.
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  #216  
Old 13-03-2018, 08:28 AM
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Iím afraid Elgin the only naivety (in fact total stupidity) is coming from you.
Seems a tad harsh
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  #217  
Old 13-03-2018, 08:46 AM
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Seems a tad harsh
I rest my case.
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  #218  
Old 13-03-2018, 09:03 AM
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I rest my case.

But itís not harsh in anyway. If you believe the crap youíre spouting youíre an idiot or medically unwell.
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  #219  
Old 13-03-2018, 09:06 AM
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**** you
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  #220  
Old 13-03-2018, 09:15 AM
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Russia is a huge tapestry of many regions that have very different religious beliefs, cultures and economic potential.

Many leading thinkers on Russia suspect the country is going to hell in a hand cart and this economic catastrophe will lead (again) to its fragmentation.
I used to work with a lovely Ukrainian girl but she was if you asked her Russian everything she supported through her blinkered eyes was Russian she was highly intelligent and yet believed anything about Russia and Putin. She explained to me like many her family were historically party members and from a different part of Russia but th USSR had a policy of moving many supportive families into areas that were no so supportive in hope to manage and convert the regions. This seemed to work pretty well until the break up of ussr, her family like many have stayed in Ukraine but if it all splits again and Russia splits she feels that families like hers will have to move to somewhere they have no relatives that they know
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