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  #201  
Old 16-05-2018, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by ebyeeckeagle View Post
Erm, up pops a poster on a thread that he is interested in. That is kind of what we all do. Really not sure what the point is you are trying to make.
I think it’s called whataboutery!
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  #202  
Old 16-05-2018, 09:22 AM
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Try visiting Morocco

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  #203  
Old 16-05-2018, 09:24 AM
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It's a 'Jewish' place? Based on what? And all of it is?

I'm not sure what designates a place to a cultural group for eternity. Current occupancy? Length of time served? Original founder status? However you define it, what you have just written is bollocks. Its like right wingers who cling to the concept of England as an Anglo-Saxon nation.
I think israel has a right to rule over the area. I think that's reasonable given the areas significance to judaism and history. I think relatively recent immigrants should respect the areas history but also be welcome and involved in any political process. Now i better back off because as i say my reading is limited on the topic and i probably shouldn't be spouting on the topic therefore.
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  #204  
Old 16-05-2018, 09:25 AM
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Try visiting Morocco

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I was in Casablanca a few months ago and my cab driver was making this point. It is a good point but Morocco is the exception rather than the rule.
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  #205  
Old 16-05-2018, 09:36 AM
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I think israel has a right to rule over the area. I think that's reasonable given the areas significance to judaism and history. I think relatively recent immigrants should respect the areas history but also be welcome and involved in any political process. Now i better back off because as i say my reading is limited on the topic and i probably shouldn't be spouting on the topic therefore.
I'm not talking about modern history. Which is why I asked the question about what designates a place as 'belonging' to a particular group. Israel (the land, not the state) has seen a mess of various peoples, cultures and religions, wax and wane over
1000's of years, long before a cohesive 'Jewish' identity.

Your knowledge is limited so you don't want to post? If we all used that criteria, threads would be very short
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  #206  
Old 16-05-2018, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by ebyeeckeagle View Post
I'm not talking about modern history. Which is why I asked the question about what designates a place as 'belonging' to a particular group. Israel (the land, not the state) has seen a mess of various peoples, cultures and religions, wax and wane over
1000's of years, long before a cohesive 'Jewish' identity.

Your knowledge is limited so you don't want to post? If we all used that criteria, threads would be very short
I don't normally let it stop me but where people are getting killed it does make me more hesitant.

Belonging is a strange one i admit. I think of all people Arabs/Muslims would appreciate the importance of having your holy place respected though. I don't think the likes of hamas do so for sure.
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Old 16-05-2018, 09:43 AM
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Iran has a sizable population of Jews. And they are pretty free to carry out their religion as well !! Now, I was never told about this by the media, all I was told is that the Iranians hate everything and everyone...Note to ones self "never believe anything I see or hear from the media"

ran's Jewish community is officially recognized as a religious minority group by the government, and, like the Zoroastrians and Christians, they are allocated one seat in the Iranian Parliament. Siamak Moreh Sedgh is the current Jewish member of the parliament, replacing Maurice Motamed in the 2008 election. In 2000, former Jewish MP Manuchehr Eliasi estimated that at that time there were still 60,000–85,000 Jews in Iran; most other sources put the figure at 25,000.[63] The United States State Department estimated the number of Jews in Iran at 20,000–25,000 as of 2009.[64]

Iranian Jews have their own newspaper (called "Ofogh-e-Bina") with Jewish scholars performing Judaic research at Tehran's "Central Library of Jewish Association".[65] The "Dr. Sapir Jewish Hospital" is Iran's largest charity hospital of any religious minority community in the country;[65] however, most of its patients and staff are Muslim.[66]

Chief Rabbi Yousef Hamadani Cohen is the present spiritual leader for the Jewish community of Iran.[67] In August 2000, Chief Rabbi Cohen met with Iranian President Mohammad Khatami for the first time.[68] In 2003, Chief Rabbi Cohen and Maurice Motamed met with President Khatami at Yusef Abad Synagogue which was the first time a President of Iran had visited a synagogue since the Islamic Revolution.[69] Haroun Yashayaei is the chairman of the Jewish Committee of Tehran and leader of Iran's Jewish Community.[69][70] On January 26, 2007, Yashayaei's letter to President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad concerning his Holocaust denial comments brought about worldwide media attention.[71][72][73]

The Jews of Iran have been best known for certain occupations like making gold jewelry and antique dealing, textiles and carpets.
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  #208  
Old 16-05-2018, 09:59 AM
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Iran has a sizable population of Jews. And they are pretty free to carry out their religion as well !! ....
I have no idea of your source for this, but the Wiki entry for the Iranian census of 2011 suggests under 10k Jews remain in Iran. I have no idea as to their treatment so can't comment. But in the words of the lovely Khomeini when he took power, "We recognize our Jews as separate from those godless, bloodsucking Zionists." Which was nice.
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  #209  
Old 16-05-2018, 10:00 AM
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Iran has a sizable population of Jews. And they are pretty free to carry out their religion as well !! Now, I was never told about this by the media, all I was told is that the Iranians hate everything and everyone...Note to ones self "never believe anything I see or hear from the media"

ran's Jewish community is officially recognized as a religious minority group by the government, and, like the Zoroastrians and Christians, they are allocated one seat in the Iranian Parliament. Siamak Moreh Sedgh is the current Jewish member of the parliament, replacing Maurice Motamed in the 2008 election. In 2000, former Jewish MP Manuchehr Eliasi estimated that at that time there were still 60,000–85,000 Jews in Iran; most other sources put the figure at 25,000.[63] The United States State Department estimated the number of Jews in Iran at 20,000–25,000 as of 2009.[64]

Iranian Jews have their own newspaper (called "Ofogh-e-Bina") with Jewish scholars performing Judaic research at Tehran's "Central Library of Jewish Association".[65] The "Dr. Sapir Jewish Hospital" is Iran's largest charity hospital of any religious minority community in the country;[65] however, most of its patients and staff are Muslim.[66]

Chief Rabbi Yousef Hamadani Cohen is the present spiritual leader for the Jewish community of Iran.[67] In August 2000, Chief Rabbi Cohen met with Iranian President Mohammad Khatami for the first time.[68] In 2003, Chief Rabbi Cohen and Maurice Motamed met with President Khatami at Yusef Abad Synagogue which was the first time a President of Iran had visited a synagogue since the Islamic Revolution.[69] Haroun Yashayaei is the chairman of the Jewish Committee of Tehran and leader of Iran's Jewish Community.[69][70] On January 26, 2007, Yashayaei's letter to President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad concerning his Holocaust denial comments brought about worldwide media attention.[71][72][73]

The Jews of Iran have been best known for certain occupations like making gold jewelry and antique dealing, textiles and carpets.
Slightly out of date the numbers continue to fall the last census number was roughly 9000 in 2011. I have not seen any latest figures.
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  #210  
Old 16-05-2018, 10:00 AM
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Loz - that’s a very interesting counterpoint. There are indeed many Jews still in Iran and they are by and large left alone although clearly like other Iranians they are faced with the same challenges in daily life.

Spurred on by your post, I found this interesting article in the Israeli new site Haaretz from a Jew who left Iran when she was a child but whom is more optimistic about change in her place of birth than in Israel. To view the link you have to Register or Login
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  #211  
Old 16-05-2018, 10:00 AM
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I once travelled around Iran, it's a pretty open place for a religious theocracy with wonderfully friendly people.
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  #212  
Old 16-05-2018, 10:01 AM
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Originally Posted by loz View Post
Iran has a sizable population of Jews. And they are pretty free to carry out their religion as well !! Now, I was never told about this by the media, all I was told is that the Iranians hate everything and everyone...Note to ones self "never believe anything I see or hear from the media"

ran's Jewish community is officially recognized as a religious minority group by the government, and, like the Zoroastrians and Christians, they are allocated one seat in the Iranian Parliament. Siamak Moreh Sedgh is the current Jewish member of the parliament, replacing Maurice Motamed in the 2008 election. In 2000, former Jewish MP Manuchehr Eliasi estimated that at that time there were still 60,000–85,000 Jews in Iran; most other sources put the figure at 25,000.[63] The United States State Department estimated the number of Jews in Iran at 20,000–25,000 as of 2009.[64]

Iranian Jews have their own newspaper (called "Ofogh-e-Bina") with Jewish scholars performing Judaic research at Tehran's "Central Library of Jewish Association".[65] The "Dr. Sapir Jewish Hospital" is Iran's largest charity hospital of any religious minority community in the country;[65] however, most of its patients and staff are Muslim.[66]

Chief Rabbi Yousef Hamadani Cohen is the present spiritual leader for the Jewish community of Iran.[67] In August 2000, Chief Rabbi Cohen met with Iranian President Mohammad Khatami for the first time.[68] In 2003, Chief Rabbi Cohen and Maurice Motamed met with President Khatami at Yusef Abad Synagogue which was the first time a President of Iran had visited a synagogue since the Islamic Revolution.[69] Haroun Yashayaei is the chairman of the Jewish Committee of Tehran and leader of Iran's Jewish Community.[69][70] On January 26, 2007, Yashayaei's letter to President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad concerning his Holocaust denial comments brought about worldwide media attention.[71][72][73]

The Jews of Iran have been best known for certain occupations like making gold jewelry and antique dealing, textiles and carpets.
I doubt you'll ever hear anything factual from our bent media about anywhere that is an enemy of the US, and therefore the UK lapdog as well, whether it be Iran, Russia, North Korea, Venezuala, Syria or anywhere else they cant control.

Interesting information about Iran though, cheers.
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Russia demonization. Akin to 1930's Germany.

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Pretty obvious really.
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  #213  
Old 16-05-2018, 10:03 AM
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I think you’ll find that quite a few thousand people from Gaza have been ‘bombed and sniped’ by the Egyptian military over the years - it just doesn’t fit with the narrative that the Palestinian issue is entirely the fault of the evil Zionists. Similarly Jordan’s role in expelling Palestinians from their homeland -strange that there is no annual gathering on that border.
I mentioned Egypt twice already. Egypt is the second biggest recipient of US Aid (after Israel) most of which is military (like Israel). This would end if they did not follow the US line on the border. Egypt's second biggest source of aid and its largest source of FDI is Saudi. Saudi would also end this support if Egypt ended the Gaza blockade. Saudi views Hamas as equivalent to the Muslim Brotherhood, its parent organisation, and wants them crushed. Egypt's ruthless policies are dictated by others which doesn't excuse them. It does demonstrate how grim the Gazans plight is as no one regionally supports them. (Hamas now reject all aid from Iran due to Iranian support of Assad).

It is incorrect to saw a few thousand people in Gaza have been killed by Egyptian forces. I'm sure people have died as Egypt tried to shut off the tunnels but probably less than the Israelis have killed this week.

Jordan hasn't had any control of Palestine since 1967 so how have they been expelling Palestinians from their homeland?

Happy to be corrected on either of those last two points but I have heard nothing about either. Enlighten me
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  #214  
Old 16-05-2018, 10:10 AM
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I think you’ll find that in those countries with a majority Muslim population that’s exactly what other religions are expected to do. Indonesia, Egypt, Iraq, Iran you name it, Christians, Jews, Buddhists are being bombed in their places of worship and continually persecuted by the authorities.

In contrast, try visiting Jerusalem rather than believing the propaganda and you’ll find an incredible melting pot of the world’s religions freely worshiping and just about co-existing despite the continuous state of tension.
Yeah it’s a happy utopia. Palestinians don’t know what they’re moaning about.

I mean it’s not as bad as East Timor was so who cares?

I do know someone who went to Gaza though. They said it was a nightmare and the IDF were horrific.
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Old 16-05-2018, 10:10 AM
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she is a bit sick in the head methinks

US ambassador Nikki Haley defended the level of Israel's use of force, saying: "No country in this chamber would act with more restraint than Israel has."
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Old 16-05-2018, 10:12 AM
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By the way for those that assume that there is widespread support in Israel for its government’s approach to the current situation, a perusal of Israeli news sites would suggest otherwise.

For example Haaretz’ opinion piece was headlined ‘Why Is Israel Using Lethal Force Against the Protesters of Gaza?’

It went on to state, ‘When Hamas sends young demonstrators towards a firing squad, that doesn’t mean Israel has to keep pulling the trigger. The loss of life in Gaza at the ends of Israeli army snipers is not only gruesome, it’s reprehensible – because lethal force is not the only way to confront protesters.’
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Old 16-05-2018, 10:13 AM
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I was in Casablanca a few months ago and my cab driver was making this point. It is a good point but Morocco is the exception rather than the rule.
But does show how people can live together and could do in one state covering Palestine and Israel and have the right of return.
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  #218  
Old 16-05-2018, 10:19 AM
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Try visiting Morocco

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I have - a lovely country and religiously very tolerant, although like everywhere under pressure from religious extremists. Also has very strong relationship with Israel. Reading my post back, I was wrong to imply that all those countries with Muslim majorities are intolerant of other religions.
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  #219  
Old 16-05-2018, 10:22 AM
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But does show how people can live together and could do in one state covering Palestine and Israel and have the right of return.
I agree with the first part but I think the second part is impossible. A two state solution may just about work but neither side (nor anyone else probably) would accept a one state solution.
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Old 16-05-2018, 10:23 AM
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By the way for those that assume that there is widespread support in Israel for its government’s approach to the current situation, a perusal of Israeli news sites would suggest otherwise.

For example Haaretz’ opinion piece was headlined ‘Why Is Israel Using Lethal Force Against the Protesters of Gaza?’

It went on to state, ‘When Hamas sends young demonstrators towards a firing squad, that doesn’t mean Israel has to keep pulling the trigger. The loss of life in Gaza at the ends of Israeli army snipers is not only gruesome, it’s reprehensible – because lethal force is not the only way to confront protesters.’
Not seen any polls for the latest massacres but in 2014:

Quote:
Public support among Israeli Jews for the military campaign in Gaza has been overwhelming throughout its 24-day duration, with a recent opinion poll showing 95% of respondents believed the war was justified.
I remember news broadcast of Israelis cheering on the hills above Gaza as bombs reigned down.
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