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  #1041  
Old 14-07-2016, 06:49 PM
Nth Kent Eagle Nth Kent Eagle is offline
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Originally Posted by biggus mickus View Post
People I know back in South London.
Half my local area near Dartford comes from Penge, Sydenham and Beckenham like me and we don't have them here. We do seem however have locals who seem to earn a living through sales of unregulated products but not sure they are necessarily worried about jobs.
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  #1042  
Old 14-07-2016, 06:49 PM
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Originally Posted by delboy01 View Post
Well we can cut VAT, cut income tax, increase personal allowances, cut interest rates (which would lower the exchange rate), offer incentives to business, cut business rates. We now have control to do what we want and are not governed by the twats in Brussels.

As I said in a previous post government borrowing has dropped to 0.7% that's a record so if we are in so much trouble why are our borrowing rates at record lows.
First, we can do all those things anyway inside the EU including on VAT as the rules are being loosened.

Secondly, the rates on government bonds are not directly tied to our overall economic performance which is why they were also falling when we were still in recession during the global crisis. UK bonds are attractive because a) we have never defaulted, ever b) we have a sovereign currency so it's a safe haven when other global investment is risky and c) our central bank is creating cheap money.

You may as well ask why you think the Eurozone is in trouble when German bonds have been sold at minus rates.
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  #1043  
Old 14-07-2016, 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted by biggus mickus View Post
People I know back in South London.
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  #1044  
Old 14-07-2016, 06:55 PM
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I see Economists for Brexit are back in the news. The hard free market economists have plenty of ideas for growth as long as there is a low tax frenzy. Won't be long before the construction lobby demand gigantic infrastructure projects so they get juicy contracts, even if smaller local projects are what we need.
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  #1045  
Old 14-07-2016, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by mik59 View Post
You literally can't "take" a job.

Our number of long term unemployed is 462,000. The rest cycle in and out of work.

Foreign nationals aren't taking work that they could otherwise fill, especially the 60%+ of them that create their own work.

There are about 8 million young people and of those only about 400,000 are not in work or in education or training.

So while it isn't rocket science it doesn't seem to be maths that proves your point either.

Take out those foreign nationals then you simply have a smaller labour market and thus less jobs and thus less national income.
Anecdotally I met quite a few Brexiter voters who weren't too bothered about the levels of migration so far but were concerned if it continued at this level. The idea of the population growing from 64m to 84m by the middle of the decade was for them too much. There were those who felt that outside the EU free movement zone we could put up temporary barriers if necessary. Closer to home I know others who are concerned about free movement for those in Europe but not for their relatives from Jamaica and India.
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  #1046  
Old 14-07-2016, 07:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Nth Kent Eagle View Post
Anecdotally I met quite a few Brexiter voters who weren't too bothered about the levels of migration so far but were concerned if it continued at this level. The idea of the population growing from 64m to 84m by the middle of the decade was for them too much. There were those who felt that outside the EU free movement zone we could put up temporary barriers if necessary. Closer to home I know others who are concerned about free movement for those in Europe but not for their relatives from Jamaica and India.
Yeah. The data seems to show that high Leave votes correlated with increases in migration over a relatively short time. So it's not scale but pace.

As I've said on the Referendum thread: you could put a case for a smaller economy with less growth and a smaller labour market. You could paint that as beneficial. But it's a severe adjustment.
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  #1047  
Old 14-07-2016, 07:37 PM
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Originally Posted by catty View Post
I manage approximately 105 care staff working within the county council, 65% are not from the UK. We are going to have serious issues in a few years time. Add to this the increase in costs form the living wage (a good thing of course) and the cuts in social care funding which dwarfs the 2% precept in council tax for adult social care & things don't look good.
Do you ever enquire of your employers why they employ so many non UK people ? What is their reply ?
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  #1048  
Old 14-07-2016, 07:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Bankerhater1 View Post
I've been ignoring this thread as pointless for some time - but I'll say one more thing in response to some of the recent ranting by leavers.

The issues around labour mobility/unit cost/salary are a product of the global capitalist system - See - China exporting labour and capital - South Asian labour to the Gulf - filipino labour to just about everywhere, mexican labour to the USA, etc, etc, etc .....

Leaving the EU will not resolve those issues.

And no, it won't solve all the other issues of capitalism either - including the hijacking of the UK political system by a few very wealthy people.

It is no longer a world where it is possible to pull up the drawbridge and stay at home. Unless you want to live in North Korea.
You really shouldnt have bothered posting that. Pointless as you say.
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  #1049  
Old 14-07-2016, 07:43 PM
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Originally Posted by delboy01 View Post
Spot on.

Re. Rents. My previous house was purchase by an east European couple. It was a 4 bed. Thought it strange as they had no kids. My old Neighbours told me that they were renting out each room (all east European) and there were 6/7 cars/vans parked outside. This means that the outgoings side of EU immigrants balance sheet (in the cases where this happens) is much reduced. Meaning they can accept lower salaries.
Hmmn.
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Mods having a childish moment. But which one ?
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  #1050  
Old 14-07-2016, 07:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Nth Kent Eagle View Post
anyway back to the main point. Overall we are not going to be able to reduce immigration much if at all. The population is going to grow anyway so we have to take action to make it more viable. This includes inter-generational fairness (an end to the occupational pension inequalities and tax subsidies) and a switch in public sector spending away from current spending towards investment in particular housing. I don't want to leave the EU but can accept that the forgotten groups have voted against my wishes. So I would be happy with a few tweaks to EU immigration. The ability to deport repeat criminals and beggars, tighten up in EH card abuses, a bit more focus around bogus marriages, a longer period before people got tax credits and some stuff around child benefit for those whose children are still back home. I spend a fair bit of time in one high unemployment area of Spain and it is good that the local Spaniards and Romanians get the chance to come hear and work. I wouldn't want that to change in the vast majority of cases. The situation for those already here and UK citizens in the EU should be resolved quickly. I would like slightly easier access to those from Jamaica but that is a slightly different thing.
You.. would be happy. You voted for none of the above, you voted for no change. Why didnt you vote leave to achieve all of the above that you want.
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Mods having a childish moment. But which one ?
"WE LEAVE THE EU MARCH 2019"

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  #1051  
Old 14-07-2016, 07:56 PM
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Just listening to LBC where the presenters come across as very pro stay but it's starting to change with exporters and importers coming on and making very good points about China USA (+23 other countries) etc who are all outside of the EU who trade with the EU quite successfully without boarder control free movement and involvement in sovereign matters.

The scare tactics of Osborn/Dave seems to be disappearing.
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  #1052  
Old 14-07-2016, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Les Butler View Post
Just listening to LBC where the presenters come across as very pro stay but it's starting to change with exporters and importers coming on and making very good points about China USA (+23 other countries) etc who are all outside of the EU who trade with the EU quite successfully without boarder control free movement and involvement in sovereign matters.

The scare tactics of Osborn/Dave seems to be disappearing.
Is there unlimited two way free trade with all of these countries and the Eu?
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  #1053  
Old 14-07-2016, 08:02 PM
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Yo talkin bout me Willis.....
You are the right height, wrong colour.

Did you know we cant say **** on here? You can say spic and dago though, oh and honky.
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  #1054  
Old 14-07-2016, 08:03 PM
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You.. would be happy. You voted for none of the above, you voted for no change. Why didnt you vote leave to achieve all of the above that you want.
Sir, Sir, I know.

It wont happen.
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  #1055  
Old 14-07-2016, 08:09 PM
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Is there unlimited two way free trade with all of these countries and the Eu?
No sure but they seem to do very well without the rules and regulations ofter obviously negotiating deals with the EU .

The UK is not a little country like Turkey or Greece we like to buy stuff and I'm sure they will like to sell.

Hopefully, the UK will go in with a strong hand rather than begging as some would have us believe.

Talking about house prices now and how the scare tactic of house price's falling was used now they are saying its bollocks...who knew.
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  #1056  
Old 14-07-2016, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Les Butler View Post
Just listening to LBC where the presenters come across as very pro stay but it's starting to change with exporters and importers coming on and making very good points about China USA (+23 other countries) etc who are all outside of the EU who trade with the EU quite successfully without boarder control free movement and involvement in sovereign matters.

The scare tactics of Osborn/Dave seems to be disappearing.
Those countries don't share land borders with the EU though and they don't have a deal involving services trade which we need because our economy is dependent on it. The EU represents a valuable part of their trade but not a huge part unlike the UK where about half our trade is with the EU because it is closest geographically and the closest trade partners yield the highest value.

Nor does the EU get involved in UK sovereign matters. Our Parliament is sovereign. Our (unelected) law lords say so.

The only scare tactics that are disappearing seem to be those propagated by the Leave campaign: no Turkish hordes for example.
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  #1057  
Old 14-07-2016, 08:12 PM
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No sure but they seem to do very well without the rules and regulations ofter obviously negotiating deals with the EU.
Of course they're subject to EU rules and regulations. Do you honestly think we buy their stuff without any product standards e.g. Emission rules for cars?
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  #1058  
Old 14-07-2016, 08:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Les Butler View Post
Just listening to LBC where the presenters come across as very pro stay but it's starting to change with exporters and importers coming on and making very good points about China USA (+23 other countries) etc who are all outside of the EU who trade with the EU quite successfully without boarder control free movement and involvement in sovereign matters.

The scare tactics of Osborn/Dave seems to be disappearing.
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Mods having a childish moment. But which one ?
"WE LEAVE THE EU MARCH 2019"

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Old 14-07-2016, 08:15 PM
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  #1060  
Old 14-07-2016, 08:17 PM
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Of course they're subject to EU rules and regulations. Do you honestly think we buy their stuff without any product standards e.g. Emission rules for cars?
Volkswagen.
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Mods having a childish moment. But which one ?
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