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  #24961  
Old 19-06-2018, 06:52 AM
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Originally Posted by DANGERMOUSE View Post
What's that got to do with it?
I believe it's known as having a bit of empathy.
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  #24962  
Old 19-06-2018, 06:52 AM
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Whilst I donít like vandalism, I donít think being smashed to pieces by a train is just punishment. Iíd rather them get arrested.... go court and do 3 months in prison, then hopefully turn their life around. So yes.... I do have sympathy for them.
It wasn't a 'just punishment' - no court sentenced them to it, and (for the avoidance of doubt, for the over-emotional out there) I'm not suggesting that all railway vandals should be run over by trains.

Nevertheless, when someone's gone to significant effort to selflishly and pointlessly make the world just that bit more shitty for everyone else, I'm not going to cry crocodile tears if they fall victim to the very forseeable and hazardous peril of their activity.
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  #24963  
Old 19-06-2018, 06:54 AM
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I believe it's known as having a bit of empathy.
I'm sure their friends and families are grieving, of course. But I wasn't discussing them.
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  #24964  
Old 19-06-2018, 07:23 AM
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I wouldnít advise anyone to lie in the 4foot. Unless you meant 6ft?
No I meant the four foot. That was always the last resort if there was no other refuge nearby.
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  #24965  
Old 19-06-2018, 07:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Stanley Boy View Post
No I meant the four foot. That was always the last resort if there was no other refuge nearby.

Isnít the 4ft the track the train runs over? The 6ft is the gap between where the trains run. I was always told ďlie flat in the 6ft and hope for a miracleĒ I have never been told to lie in front of a oncoming train.
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  #24966  
Old 19-06-2018, 07:50 AM
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Originally Posted by DANGERMOUSE View Post
It wasn't a 'just punishment' - no court sentenced them to it, and (for the avoidance of doubt, for the over-emotional out there) I'm not suggesting that all railway vandals should be run over by trains.



Nevertheless, when someone's gone to significant effort to selflishly and pointlessly make the world just that bit more shitty for everyone else, I'm not going to cry crocodile tears if they fall victim to the very forseeable and hazardous peril of their activity.

You can have sympathy for someone making a stupid decision and paying the ultimate price. These are graffiti artists not rapists/murderers.

They just made a bad choice. Iím not condoning it, just have sympathy for them.
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  #24967  
Old 19-06-2018, 07:56 AM
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6 foot or cess normally but in that location the viaduct walls rule out the cess and bridgework rules out the 6 foot in many places. Regarding the 4 foot, underbody equipment on trains nowadays means that you would likely not get away unscathed the exception being deep level tube stations where there is purpose built 4 foot cavities under the rails.
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  #24968  
Old 19-06-2018, 07:59 AM
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Is the 4ft really being taught as a viable way of avoiding getting hit by a train? Iíve never heard that... but my rules n regs arenít due for 6 months... so maybe Iím a bit shoddy.
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  #24969  
Old 19-06-2018, 08:17 AM
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Originally Posted by mushroom View Post
Is the 4ft really being taught as a viable way of avoiding getting hit by a train? I’ve never heard that... but my rules n regs aren’t due for 6 months... so maybe I’m a bit shoddy.
Ive heard it in passing a few times but never officially
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  #24970  
Old 19-06-2018, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by mushroom View Post
Yea, 3 young lads made a stupid mistake.... theyíve paid the ultimate price. Comments like ď3 less idiots in the UKĒ seems harsh and classless.
I personally would be heartless to say 3 less idiots.....
But they did get what was coming to them. If they were infact in their 20s then its likely they were a few of the regular lot who may have been tagging for years and years. They know the risks, so its not so much a 'mistake'.
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  #24971  
Old 19-06-2018, 08:26 AM
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By the way, the transport committee met yesterday(can be seen on parliament tv online at 4.45), regarding the GTR timetable situation.

Horton got a bit of a grilling but was clever with his answers. That fact is they dived in straight into the deep end knowing it would be chaos but carried on regardless, mainly because other train companies were involved. No real admission though into why they couldnt see this carnage coming weeks before.
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  #24972  
Old 19-06-2018, 08:28 AM
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Originally Posted by mushroom View Post
Is the 4ft really being taught as a viable way of avoiding getting hit by a train? Iíve never heard that... but my rules n regs arenít due for 6 months... so maybe Iím a bit shoddy.
Didn't work for those 6 sheep yesterday. Mind you I doubt they were lying down. Wouldn't want to try it myself.
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  #24973  
Old 19-06-2018, 08:48 AM
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By the way, the transport committee met yesterday(can be seen on parliament tv online at 4.45), regarding the GTR timetable situation.

Horton got a bit of a grilling but was clever with his answers. That fact is they dived in straight into the deep end knowing it would be chaos but carried on regardless, mainly because other train companies were involved. No real admission though into why they couldnt see this carnage coming weeks before.
There is a strange corporate idea in many cases that it is better to complete a project or start new idea on the specified date regardless of the consequences than announce a delay? For some reason the latter although preferable is always seen as as the worse option to take. A climbdown or back track is always a no-no.
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  #24974  
Old 19-06-2018, 09:10 AM
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Originally Posted by mushroom View Post
Is the 4ft really being taught as a viable way of avoiding getting hit by a train? Iíve never heard that... but my rules n regs arenít due for 6 months... so maybe Iím a bit shoddy.
In 15 years of being a ' Controller Of Site Safety' its never been taught as a refuge. That's not to say in certain locations like tunnels or bridges it might be a option if the track set up allows it but not normally.
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  #24975  
Old 19-06-2018, 09:16 AM
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Originally Posted by macstar View Post
I personally would be heartless to say 3 less idiots.....
But they did get what was coming to them. If they were infact in their 20s then its likely they were a few of the regular lot who may have been tagging for years and years. They know the risks, so its not so much a 'mistake'.
You can have sympathy for someone dying even if it was entirely by their own actions... We were all young once.
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  #24976  
Old 19-06-2018, 09:32 AM
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As someone who has done their training a lot more recently than others, from what I remember the Cess and 6ft should always be your go to option if there are no refuges. The only time the 4ft should be used is as an absolute last resort and you have to ditch your equipment and literally lay flat out in the 4ft.

It's not taught as such that if a train is coming you lay in the 4ft it's only if you cannot reach a refuge, cess or 6/10ft in time.
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Old 19-06-2018, 09:55 AM
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You can have sympathy for someone dying even if it was entirely by their own actions... We were all young once.
I tend to want over 20s to be more accountable and responsible. Just my view. They were commiting a criminal act. Not convinced they were angels anyway. We agree to disagree.
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Old 19-06-2018, 09:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Latvian Eagle View Post
As someone who has done their training a lot more recently than others, from what I remember the Cess and 6ft should always be your go to option if there are no refuges. The only time the 4ft should be used is as an absolute last resort and you have to ditch your equipment and literally lay flat out in the 4ft.

It's not taught as such that if a train is coming you lay in the 4ft it's only if you cannot reach a refuge, cess or 6/10ft in time.
More chance of being clipped by shoegear in the 6ft ouch
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Old 19-06-2018, 09:59 AM
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There is a strange corporate idea in many cases that it is better to complete a project or start new idea on the specified date regardless of the consequences than announce a delay? For some reason the latter although preferable is always seen as as the worse option to take. A climbdown or back track is always a no-no.
Yeh...they wouldve got heavily criticised for halting the timetable change but i guess they didnt think things would be this bad.
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Old 19-06-2018, 10:20 AM
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I tend to want over 20s to be more accountable and responsible. Just my view. They were commiting a criminal act. Not convinced they were angels anyway. We agree to disagree.
I don't think we're a million miles away from each other... I just think the guy who said "3 less idiots for the UK to worry about" was a bit harsh.... I certainly don't think they were angels... they were probably a bit of a drain on society... just a bit sad they now have no chance of turning things around.
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