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  #121  
Old 15-10-2003, 11:30 AM
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Cheers Al...but the thing is I can't see myself doing that because I am not the type of person to just basically talk about personal stuff to people,especially strangers...When I saw the psychologist I felt I gave a false impression of myself as I'd say "blah blah made me unhappy" but I would leave it at that,I wouldn't say how awful it made me feel or the amount of impact,I would just keep answering"I don't know" if she probed any further when in fact I knew damn well what I felt...if I can make a (bad) comparison it was like me saying "I won the lottery" and leaving it at that...you would all think it was like a million pounds when in fact I didn't tell you it was in fact a tenner,does that make sense?...what I'm trying to say is when I DO try and discuss this with people I trust I still only give a tiny portion of what i really think/feel?
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  #122  
Old 15-10-2003, 11:38 AM
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Cognitive Behavioural Therapy

Cognitive behavioural therapy for anxiety and depression is well established as a promising and frequently effective treatment.

What is CBT?

Cognitive behavioural therapy (CBT) refers to a group of therapies that aim to reduce dysfunctional emotions and behaviour by altering behaviour and by altering thinking patterns, based on the assumption that prior learning is currently having adverse consequences. The purpose of therapy is to reduce distress or unwanted behaviour by undoing this learning or by providing new, more adaptive learning.

Cognitive behavioural therapists believe that a change in symptoms follows a change in thinking (or cognitive change) which is brought about by a variety of possible interventions, including the practice of new behaviours, analysis of faulty thinking patterns, and the teaching of more adaptive self-talk.

In controlled trials, CBT has been shown to have some effect in schizophrenia even in people who previously did not respond to medication. As a low risk therapy with no physical side-effects CBT could be useful alongside drug treatment. In addition, CBT may be particularly suitable to people who don't comply with their drug treatment or for whom drugs are ineffective.



Where did the idea for CBT come from?

Aaron Beck developed the idea of CBT for treating depression after noticing that depressed clients experienced specific thoughts that they were only dimly aware of. Unless their attention was directly focused on them, they didn't report these thoughts and seemed unaware of them. These thoughts or cognitions tended to rise quickly and automatically they were not subject to conscious control.

Low self-esteem, self-blame, self criticism, negative interpretations of experience, negative predictions and unpleasant recollections were persistent themes. In ambiguous situations, depressed clients were particularly prone to make negative interpretations when a positive one would have been more appropriate.

To describe negative thinking in depression, he postulated the presence of a 'negative cognitive shift' where positive information relevant to the individual is filtered out (cognitive blockage) while negative self-relevant information is readily admitted. This cognitive shift was universal for all types of depression whether a depression was the primary diagnosis or whether depression was secondary to some other disorder such as schizophrenia.
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  #123  
Old 15-10-2003, 11:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by sydney eagle
Cheers Al...but the thing is I can't see myself doing that because I am not the type of person to just basically talk about personal stuff to people,especially strangers...
The therapist will bring you out of yourself without being forceful Paul. You may feel like you dont want to talk about stuff but believe me, it is the best way, and if you go in with an open mind wanting to improve things, you will. Give it a try, what have you got to lose, except the cloud thats hanging over you?
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  #124  
Old 15-10-2003, 12:03 PM
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Thanks AJ/Gosling/Graham and Al for those posts/advice above

How do you go about finding one of these guys?..should I ask my doctor?

Sorry for asking all these questions and sounding monotonous
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  #125  
Old 15-10-2003, 12:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by sydney eagle
Cheers Al...but the thing is I can't see myself doing that because I am not the type of person to just basically talk about personal stuff to people,especially strangers...
Except you've just talked a load of personal stuff to everyone who has read this thread - most of whom are strangers. Also, in the rest of your post you've performed exactly this sentence from AJ1969's piece : "depressed clients were particularly prone to make negative interpretations when a positive one would have been more appropriate".

Paul, you've already done the hardest task of all. Not posting on here about it but having the realisation and admitting it to yourself. And knowing what you tried before didn't work and that things need to change. That's the bit that takes courage. The steps forward from there will be easier.

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  #126  
Old 15-10-2003, 12:06 PM
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I really hope you find a good person Paul. I cannot tell you how lucky I am that Monty found someone to sort her out. And, as she has told you herself and I have mentioned several times, it really DID save her life.
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  #127  
Old 15-10-2003, 12:08 PM
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yes but Graham...discussing it on the BBS and discussing this in person with anyone(including people who I trust unconditionally) is very different,My friend Kellie i would basically discuss anything with her & I have confided in her but not to the level that I have on the BBS because it's more anonymous,I don't have to sit here and face anyone when it's on the BBS if that makes sense?
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  #128  
Old 15-10-2003, 12:11 PM
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CBT and talking saved mine too. All the best and if I can help in any other way then let me know.

With CBT, don't expect instant results. It kind of works like mind tuning and the old mind needs some serious practice to retune. The saying 'you can't teach old dogs new tricks' is only partly true though and you'll be surprised at how soon your thought patterns will start shifiting to a more positive vibe. Practice, practice and practice but above all, THINK POSITIVE
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  #129  
Old 15-10-2003, 12:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by sydney eagle
yes but Graham...discussing it on the BBS and discussing this in person with anyone(including people who I trust unconditionally) is very different,My friend Kellie i would basically discuss anything with her & I have confided in her but not to the level that I have on the BBS because it's more anonymous,I don't have to sit here and face anyone when it's on the BBS if that makes sense?
Talk to her. You may be surprised at how easily it comes out, even after an intial period of blockage. I found that once I'd started talking to people I started feeling better and better. I could go to the pub with friends and not feel like a fruitcake when after 30 minutes I felt like leaving. I told them, they said talk about it, I did, I stayed and next time it was even better. Hey presto.
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  #130  
Old 15-10-2003, 12:26 PM
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Originally posted by AJ1969
Talk to her. You may be surprised at how easily it comes out, even after an intial period of blockage. I found that once I'd started talking to people I started feeling better and better. I could go to the pub with friends and not feel like a fruitcake when after 30 minutes I felt like leaving. I told them, they said talk about it, I did, I stayed and next time it was even better. Hey presto.
funnily enough she is at uni studying to be a psychologist. I don't want to bother her because it is her exam time so she has enough to deal with at the moment,we do plan to spend a fair bit of time hanging out at the end of November and december so maybe then...I just hate that feeling of humiliation when you mention this in the presense of another person,I drop my head or look at anything but the person...if I can get past that it would begin to be easier
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  #131  
Old 15-10-2003, 12:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by sydney eagle
if that makes sense?
It does. I had a pen friend years ago (back in pre-internet times when dinosaurs roamed the earth) and we'd quite easily write a couple of long letters each week. When we met we couldn't think of a single thing to talk about. For the first few minutes, anyway, and then that awkwardness disappeared.

Your issue with talking to people face-to-face about this is understandable as you have far fewer worries about being judged by someone at the end of a modem than someone sitting in front of you. Also, you can't stick that person on an ignore list. On the net or even writing on paper you get to control what you express because you get to edit before making your words available for public consumption. You also get to keep all non-verbal stuff hidden which gets picked up when dealing with a real person. And I think it's that perceived loss of control which hampers people discussing things with other people.

Just like the process in A.A. the first step is to tell someone else - in person - what is the situation with you. That first one is always the hardest but the most necessary. You could make the initial one slightly easier, perhaps, by emailing this thread to Kellie.
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  #132  
Old 15-10-2003, 12:38 PM
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Paul - she is a friend, she will want to speak to you about how you are feeling, regardless of whether it is exam time. She would be more hurt to find out you needed to talk but didn't because you thought she was busy. You will be surprised at how many people want to help - those that don't aren't real friends. That's what happens when you are suffering from depression, your real friends stay your real friends, the rest disappear into the shadows because they can't handle what you are going through.
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  #133  
Old 15-10-2003, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
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I just hate that feeling of humiliation when you mention this in the presense of another person,I drop my head or look at anything but the person...if I can get past that it would begin to be easier
So remind me what happened last Sunday, then.
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  #134  
Old 15-10-2003, 12:46 PM
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That's what happens when you are suffering from depression, your real friends stay your real friends, the rest disappear into the shadows because they can't handle what you are going through.
Thats a factor in this...pre accident in 1999 I had at least 30 odd "close" friends

2003-1,maybe 2

and the thing is i have managed to drive enough people away(including a fiancee) over this so if i decide to tell kel or anyone else this stuff I want to do it in a better,clearer way than I have been because the way i have been acting has obviously given the wrong impressions of how I am
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  #135  
Old 15-10-2003, 12:49 PM
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So remind me what happened last Sunday, then.
I got drunk and had a 10-15 min chat with you about certain aspects of this...nothing too major/scary though,just about the types of drugs and what they do etc..right?..and I remember I looked at anything in that pub but you when we were speaking.
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  #136  
Old 15-10-2003, 12:56 PM
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And a couple of weeks ago you wouldn't even have done that. You've already travelled some way but you're looking at the negative 'how far to go' rather than the positive 'how far I've come'. Which is exactly what AJ1969 is on about.
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Old 15-10-2003, 01:03 PM
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And a couple of weeks ago you wouldn't even have done that. You've already travelled some way but you're looking at the negative 'how far to go' rather than the positive 'how far I've come'. Which is exactly what AJ1969 is on about.
I guess you're right although the alcohol had a bit to do with it.

I know I'm coming across like this pessimistic doom merchant & I've been bangin on in this thread for ages now but the truth is I do know I need more now from myself and my attitude.The night I posted this thread I was really on the edge as I think I told you Graham and thatch. I know I have to change my thinking but this is much more unbelievably fecking harder than it seems

I think I've ranted enough tonight...thanks again people for listening to it.

Night
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  #138  
Old 15-10-2003, 02:32 PM
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You cant just change your thinking Paul. You need someoen to help you do it. Monty used to tell me she couldnt or wouldnt talk to anyone about her problems, but as soon as she went to cognative therapy she was a changed person. It took a while, but as i cannot say enough, it was worth it. She also used to come home and tell me some of what went on and on the whole it sounded far more like she was put at ease rather than made to be afraid of opening up. Yes, there were tears along the way, but they were necesary in order to exorcise the negativity and pent up emotion inside and to make her think in a different and more positive way. Gaining a new perspective on life I suppose it is, changing the way you view yourself, others and life itself. And it works!
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  #139  
Old 15-10-2003, 02:45 PM
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Sydney Eagle as you said earlier on in thread you said you dont want to be away from home yet you want to socalise but you dont like big crowds, in a certain way im like you when im out im absouloutly loving it yet for some reason i want to get back home when i am at home im bored and turn to the drink or sommot which annoys me, i admitted to myself today that i had a problem which in a way has helped, at the current time its like i have half a decent day and 5 bad ones its terrible and personally i cant see it changing just by a click of finger, But i no i have a problem and i actually thought i have to do sommot, i finnished work early today and was allowed to go home instead of going home and straight to the pub i went on a bike ride, hey i know it sounds a bit sad going on my own but as i biked 25 miles today theres nothing like beer or owt that was going to stop me, i said to myself im going to Derby and back from Burton and its the first time iv done such thing on Bike, i went on the A38 down to today and was shit scared but i tested my motavation and i did it and im very pleased.

Now i must keep little things like that up (motavation that is) maybe in the next few weeks which i no are going to be very difficult and painfull something now i have admitted to myself, But i just want to get my life back on track and enjoy life, Next month Palace play Walsall and Stoke both away i think it is in the space of 4 days and thats something im looking forward to and will enjoy, so hopefully in time my life will come back together.

Its Just horrible as my own problem has gradually got worse from July time i started drinking alot and its frightening what alcohol does to you, my mates said calm the drink down and to be fair i should have been clean and told them to my mates but only a couple know BUT im hoping to stay of heavy drinking and still have a good time BUT it will be very very hard, and like i said its not going to change within 2 days or weeks theres probably only a 1000/1 chance in that happening

Anyway lads as sydney has said thanks for the support
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  #140  
Old 16-10-2003, 08:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by sydney eagle
[B]I I know I have to change my thinking but this is much more unbelievably fecking harder than it seemsB]
Hard, but not impossible. Just remember that the reason it is so hard is because you're trying to change something which you've probably always had, or at least have developed gradually over time. You will change it though

Quote:
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I think I've ranted enough tonight...thanks again people for listening to it.
You're not ranting, you're making the first good steps towards recovery.
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