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  #2401  
Old 17-08-2017, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin H View Post
I still think the formation is being blown out of all proportion in terms of its impact. It's player quality/quantity that is our issue. We can play in a 10-0-1 and still concede if we don't have quality and with strength in depth. When the ball is crossed a player needs to win it in the air etc etc. As an aside, most negative comments on here have far less to do with formation and more to do with how you implement it.
Agreed - the formation wasn't the main problem, it was the fact that we don't have the players at our disposal to play a passing game at the moment - the style of play being forced on the players isn't one that comes naturally to them - and so they struggle with it.

Saturday's performance was bad, but I suspect it would have been just as bad in a 4-2-3-1, had we tried playing the way we did. And the style isn't directly linked to the formation. The formation didn't help, as Huddersfield picked the holes in it, and managed to exploit them (the gap behind Ward for example), but most of it came from us carelessly giving the ball away in the middle third of the pitch, trying to play intricate passing moves with limited movement off the ball and a lack of space.

A player like Cabaye in the middle would offer a lot more than, say, Puncheon, just because of his ability to firstly find space and secondly play the slightly harder pass better.
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  #2402  
Old 17-08-2017, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by orp pisshead1 View Post
We'll still end up 2 short out of the 4 required
You think we will sign two more players
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  #2403  
Old 17-08-2017, 02:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thefunkymonk View Post
Ok.. so let's revert back to the formation that we got smashed by Sunderland and barely won us a home game for last two seasons..
Not necessarily saying that either. He just needs to figure out what formation works the best with our current group. It doesn't look like 3 at the back is going to work until we get in some different type of players so I hope he shows the flexibility to try something else if it continues to notwork.
  #2404  
Old 17-08-2017, 02:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin H View Post
I still think the formation is being blown out of all proportion in terms of its impact. It's player quality/quantity that is our issue. We can play in a 10-0-1 and still concede if we don't have quality and with strength in depth. When the ball is crossed a player needs to win it in the air etc etc. As an aside, most negative comments on here have far less to do with formation and more to do with how you implement it.
Maybe we'll get better at it and all 4 wide players will fire early Beckham-esque wide balls at Benteke all match to actually make him effective in this system.
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  #2405  
Old 17-08-2017, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elgin eagle View Post
Maybe we'll get better at it and all 4 wide players will fire early Beckham-esque wide balls at Benteke all match to actually make him effective in this system.
Or we will lose every match 3-0 for the first few games, then get better at it, then eventually get relegated by a point/on goal difference...
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  #2406  
Old 17-08-2017, 03:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malarkey View Post
Or we will lose every match 3-0 for the first few games, then get better at it, then eventually get relegated by a point/on goal difference...
I prefer my vision.
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  #2407  
Old 17-08-2017, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prince Phillip View Post
Digression but we played a tall-centre-half three-at-the-back for a few games about 10-odd years ago. Paddy McCarthy was one of them I think, who the manager was at the time and the names of the other two big lads escapes me......there was a loanee...?? Might have even been the Bruce era, so scrap Paddy!
Steve Vickers
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  #2408  
Old 17-08-2017, 03:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elgin eagle View Post
I prefer my vision.
But his is way more Palace
  #2409  
Old 17-08-2017, 03:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zulu84 View Post
But his is way more Palace
Sadly true. If we fire balls at Benteke it will probably knock him out.
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  #2410  
Old 17-08-2017, 03:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin H View Post
I still think the formation is being blown out of all proportion in terms of its impact. It's player quality/quantity that is our issue. We can play in a 10-0-1 and still concede if we don't have quality and with strength in depth. When the ball is crossed a player needs to win it in the air etc etc. As an aside, most negative comments on here have far less to do with formation and more to do with how you implement it.
Don't agree. Both Allardyce and Pulis showed that if you can organise a pile of shit you can get the most unlikely results. We are utterly disorganised, and if we continue to play like that will continually get stuffed.
  #2411  
Old 17-08-2017, 03:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elgin eagle View Post
Sadly true. If we fire balls at Benteke it will probably knock him out.
Made me laugh, thanks!
  #2412  
Old 17-08-2017, 03:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FourtyTwo View Post
Agreed - the formation wasn't the main problem, it was the fact that we don't have the players at our disposal to play a passing game at the moment - the style of play being forced on the players isn't one that comes naturally to them - and so they struggle with it.

Saturday's performance was bad, but I suspect it would have been just as bad in a 4-2-3-1, had we tried playing the way we did. And the style isn't directly linked to the formation. The formation didn't help, as Huddersfield picked the holes in it, and managed to exploit them (the gap behind Ward for example), but most of it came from us carelessly giving the ball away in the middle third of the pitch, trying to play intricate passing moves with limited movement off the ball and a lack of space.

A player like Cabaye in the middle would offer a lot more than, say, Puncheon, just because of his ability to firstly find space and secondly play the slightly harder pass better.
This thing about the space behind Ward. It was a problem in HK because Luka was playing behind Townsend and 'bless him' Luka didn't handle it well and was staying very narrow etc. etc.. No fault of his, he is not used to playing there and it was early days. But I really don't think there was acres of space there this week because F-M handled it. Don't get me wrong, there is by definition always space somewhere and with a 3 4 3 it can often by in the wide channels but we weren't getting hammered by that. The first two goals arose from situations where we were sitting deep and JW was actually in his normal space. I won't step through it all again here but even if you use the eagles highlights and step through carefully you can see. Interesting and awful at the same time.

Will mention one thing that I hadn't noticed in RT was in that second goal Wardy knew he was stuck 2 on 1 and was waving his hand (either to Luka behind him or RL-C to come in to give him a hand to close it down. Luke did move but too late and by then Ward had sold himself by leaving the gap for Mooy. **** will happen and TBH the cross should have been cleared.
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  #2413  
Old 17-08-2017, 04:19 PM
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I see Southampton are buying a CB from Lazio and WBA look like getting Wimmer and maybe Gibson. I really can't see any other clubs putting in a sizeable offer for Sakho given his wages. I think we may be the only offer in town unless they will loan him.
  #2414  
Old 17-08-2017, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by BillyTKid View Post
I see Southampton are buying a CB from Lazio and WBA look like getting Wimmer and maybe Gibson. I really can't see any other clubs putting in a sizeable offer for Sakho given his wages. I think we may be the only offer in town unless they will loan him.
More interest may come in towards deadline as teams miss out on targets
  #2415  
Old 17-08-2017, 04:55 PM
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He can't be far off, he's been gyming it for ages, although haven't seen him train yet
  #2416  
Old 17-08-2017, 05:11 PM
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[QUOTE=Will mention one thing that I hadn't noticed in RT was in that second goal Wardy knew he was stuck 2 on 1 and was waving his hand (either to Luka behind him or RL-C to come in to give him a hand to close it down. Luke did move but too late and by then Ward had sold himself by leaving the gap for Mooy. **** will happen and TBH the cross should have been cleared.[/QUOTE]

Sadly I watched highlights again last night and although Ward had a poor game , not sure he was at fault for second goal . As you said he had two players to watch with little support from Luka or RLC .
  #2417  
Old 17-08-2017, 05:38 PM
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i reckon we will get him but he is getting fit so we may as well leave it till the last minute, saves wages for a few weeks and gets him fitter at their cost
  #2418  
Old 17-08-2017, 05:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malarkey View Post
You think we will sign two more players

Think we'll Sign 3 More Goal-Keeper,Forward & Mamadou Sakho,at a Reduced Fee,or another Centre-Back.
  #2419  
Old 17-08-2017, 06:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zulu84 View Post
Not necessarily saying that either. He just needs to figure out what formation works the best with our current group. It doesn't look like 3 at the back is going to work until we get in some different type of players so I hope he shows the flexibility to try something else if it continues to notwork.
Or maybe the current group just aren't good enough? (As a whole)
  #2420  
Old 17-08-2017, 06:46 PM
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Or maybe the current group just aren't good enough? (As a whole)
What none of them ?
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