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  #21  
Old 19-03-2012, 12:36 PM
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People with Oysters really think they are getting bargain discounts?
Not me (but then I have annual rows with people about the CPFC season ticket early bird prices not being discounts).
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  #22  
Old 19-03-2012, 01:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz
People with Oysters really think they are getting bargain discounts?

I don't understand all this fuss about high fares then - after all, you seem to happily wish them on others.

The vast majority of tube users have Oyster cards, and the system works well for most. I ride my bike pretty much all the time but its easy to have the Oyster for those odd occasions when I need it. Let go of your resistance to it and you'll be glad you did.
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  #23  
Old 19-03-2012, 01:37 PM
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I don't live in London, but think Oyster cards are really handy. Whenever I'm down there I don't have to worry about buying the right ticket (do I get a day pass or singles etc.), or checking what zone is which. I just use the transport network and swipe my Oyster card.
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  #24  
Old 19-03-2012, 04:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz
People with Oysters really think they are getting bargain discounts?

I don't understand all this fuss about high fares then - after all, you seem to happily wish them on others.
No, no matter what the semantics are of diacounted and full fares standard fare is the oyster fare. The paper ticket fare is a punitive fare.

I have no problem with the fees going up for everyone. The fact that public transport in London is effectively subsidised by the rest of the country is simply bizarre.
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  #25  
Old 19-03-2012, 04:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adlerhorst
No, no matter what the semantics are of diacounted and full fares standard fare is the oyster fare. The paper ticket fare is a punitive fare.
.
There should be no such thing as a 'punitive' fare on any form of public transport.

I think the clue is in the word 'public' (and of course 'transport').
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  #26  
Old 19-03-2012, 04:07 PM
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I fail to see how anyone can vote for Ken
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  #27  
Old 19-03-2012, 04:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James Melody
I fail to see how anyone can vote for Ken
I am amazed and very disappointed that the Labour party decided to go with Ken yet again. I would have liked to have seen Oona King given the opportunity.

KL is turning into a real liability with his Tax issues and now he has apparently promised to make London a beacon of Islam in a very cynical attempt to win votes from the Muslim community.

It would have been a better position to make London a beacon or understanding between all faiths and non faiths. I am sure people of other religions and of no faith will be overjoyed with his latest attempt to secure votes from just one section of the community.

He has of course been accused before of links to Islamic fundamentalism. It was only two years ago that in Tower Hamlets, he campaigned against his own party’s candidate to back a controversial independent politician, who had been sacked by Labour for his links to a Muslim extremist group. I just do not understand why he was allowed to get away with this?

I am amazed that Labour cannot find a better option than Ken?
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  #28  
Old 19-03-2012, 04:53 PM
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I suspect that Ken has too much knowledge of where the bodies are buried in the Labour Party, for there to be any determined effort to derail him.
Same goes for Boris, though with the added danger for Cameron that Boris at large, rather than tied to the London job, is a threat to the leadership.

Neither of them have covered themselves in glory, and it is piss-poor that one of the most high profile political offices in the land can only attract such mediocre candidates.
I expect that the turnout will be low, and that Boris will hang on without a popular mandate.
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  #29  
Old 19-03-2012, 05:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Budgie Byrne
KL is turning into a real liability with his Tax issues and now he has apparently promised to make London a beacon of Islam in a very cynical attempt to win votes from the Muslim community.

It would have been a better position to make London a beacon or understanding between all faiths and non faiths. I am sure people of other religions and of no faith will be overjoyed with his latest attempt to secure votes from just one section of the community.

He has of course been accused before of links to Islamic fundamentalism. It was only two years ago that in Tower Hamlets, he campaigned against his own party’s candidate to back a controversial independent politician, who had been sacked by Labour for his links to a Muslim extremist group. I just do not understand why he was allowed to get away with this?

I am amazed that Labour cannot find a better option than Ken?
You need to understand that the Mayoral election is essentially fought in terms of the London transport zones.

So for example zones 4,5 & 6 will primarily vote for Boris where as 1 & 2 will usually, and there are exceptions, go for Ken with I guess 3 being pretty much mixed. But what Ken needs is turn-out, especially in those 1 & 2 areas and thus by appealling to the Islamic vote he can proportionately get higher support. Its also a part of his voter group which should, all things being equal, be more attracted to the Conservative candidate given its social outlook so Ken has to work hard to keep it. Ken knows he has the black vote in the bag but is aware that the Hindu and Sikh vote will probably go with the Tories hence his added emphasis on attracting the Muslim vote. Its the White vote that Livingstone does not give a shit about and whilst he gets the inner London soc.lib vote by default he aint going to bother wasting any time appealing to the rest of the white population.

For Ken its all about turn-out. The higher, the better.
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  #30  
Old 19-03-2012, 05:09 PM
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ahhh Boris Vs Ken the 5 yearly slander and shit slinging contest is back. Whats the latest?
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  #31  
Old 19-03-2012, 05:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz
There should be no such thing as a 'punitive' fare on any form of public transport.

I think the clue is in the word 'public' (and of course 'transport').
Well thankfully TFL thinks that people should be penalised where they insist on using an inefficient system where a more efficient system exists.
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  #32  
Old 19-03-2012, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adlerhorst
Well thankfully TFL thinks that people should be penalised where they insist on using an inefficient system where a more efficient system exists.
Indeed. Which is why TFL punishes tube passengers who should have driven.

Thank you for making my point so well for me.
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  #33  
Old 19-03-2012, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz
Indeed. Which is why TFL punishes tube passengers who should have driven.

Thank you for making my point so well for me.
Grow up. Seriously.
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  #34  
Old 19-03-2012, 07:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mat ov CPFC
You need to understand that the Mayoral election is essentially fought in terms of the London transport zones.

So for example zones 4,5 & 6 will primarily vote for Boris where as 1 & 2 will usually, and there are exceptions, go for Ken with I guess 3 being pretty much mixed. But what Ken needs is turn-out, especially in those 1 & 2 areas and thus by appealling to the Islamic vote he can proportionately get higher support. Its also a part of his voter group which should, all things being equal, be more attracted to the Conservative candidate given its social outlook so Ken has to work hard to keep it. Ken knows he has the black vote in the bag but is aware that the Hindu and Sikh vote will probably go with the Tories hence his added emphasis on attracting the Muslim vote. Its the White vote that Livingstone does not give a shit about and whilst he gets the inner London soc.lib vote by default he aint going to bother wasting any time appealing to the rest of the white population.

For Ken its all about turn-out. The higher, the better.

Don't know if I could agree with this. Surely, despite being one of the most, if not the most, ethnically diverse cities in the world, London is still predominantly white?

And if thats the case, how could you ever expect to win an election if you "don't give a shit" about the "white" vote?

Also, regarding turnout, the turnout in the last election was the highest so far wasn't it? And more people voted for Livingstone than had in the previous two elections. And yet he still lost. So you could argue that the higher turnout didn't help him.

There's so many variables and complexities in this election it seems impossible to predict the outcome. But I suspect Johnson will edge it.
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  #35  
Old 19-03-2012, 07:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thehalifaxman
ahhh Boris Vs Ken the 5 yearly slander and shit slinging contest is back. Whats the latest?
The latest is....its four-yearly!
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  #36  
Old 19-03-2012, 07:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EdMan
Don't know if I could agree with this. Surely, despite being one of the most, if not the most, ethnically diverse cities in the world, London is still predominantly white?

And if thats the case, how could you ever expect to win an election if you "don't give a shit" about the "white" vote?
Because the white vote is now predominantly tribal in nature so people who always vote Labour do so and those who vote Tory do the same. Ken is banking on the fact that a lot of white voters in zones 4,5 & 6 essentially voted against him rather than a definite vote for Boris (lets be honest any sane person would have voted for a dyslexic chimp last time around if it meant getting Livingston out of office) so the turn out might not be so high next time around in those zones.

So if he can corner the minority votes in the inner zones it gives him far more of a fighting chance.

Its why Boris is essentially fighting this election on an anti-Ken basis again and perhaps why having Ken running again was not such a good idea. Boris has, by and large, done what he said he would do and I dont guage to much anti-Boris sentiment about but its a potential indifference which could hurt him rather than any sort of genuine desire to get rid of him. Boris has to make this an anti-Ken vote election. Anybody else and it would have been different.

But who knows. From what I understand the polling of a few months ago was showing that Boris would walk it where as recently its all been going Kens way. Hence the attacks over tax (which has surprised me with Livingstone because its a silly and unnessary mistake to make especially given the source of much of that income and whilst I loathe the man and all that he stands for with a passion I cannot fault his political 'nous' which seems to have let him down this time) and no doubt some other bits and pieces to come.
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  #37  
Old 19-03-2012, 08:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EdMan
The latest is....its four-yearly!
Probably about the right length for one term of coffice but it says a lot for the lack of decent candidates from the main parties that we have to choose between Johnson, Livingstone or Paddick; London needed new blood but we've got the same old worn out hacks. What have any of them got going for them (apart from not being Cameron or Miliband or Clegg)?

Desperate times, we could have done with a genuine Londoner running for Mayor of London.
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  #38  
Old 19-03-2012, 08:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mat ov CPFC
Because the white vote is now predominantly tribal in nature so people who always vote Labour do so and those who vote Tory do the same. Ken is banking on the fact that a lot of white voters in zones 4,5 & 6 essentially voted against him rather than a definite vote for Boris (lets be honest any sane person would have voted for a dyslexic chimp last time around if it meant getting Livingston out of office) so the turn out might not be so high next time around in those zones.

So if he can corner the minority votes in the inner zones it gives him far more of a fighting chance.

Its why Boris is essentially fighting this election on an anti-Ken basis again and perhaps why having Ken running again was not such a good idea. Boris has, by and large, done what he said he would do and I dont guage to much anti-Boris sentiment about but its a potential indifference which could hurt him rather than any sort of genuine desire to get rid of him. Boris has to make this an anti-Ken vote election. Anybody else and it would have been different.

But who knows. From what I understand the polling of a few months ago was showing that Boris would walk it where as recently its all been going Kens way. Hence the attacks over tax (which has surprised me with Livingstone because its a silly and unnessary mistake to make especially given the source of much of that income and whilst I loathe the man and all that he stands for with a passion I cannot fault his political 'nous' which seems to have let him down this time) and no doubt some other bits and pieces to come.


Well London is said to be predominantly Labour so if the so called "white vote" was as tribal as you say, Livingstone would be a dead cert.

Personally I think Johnson is an utter fraud who has done f-all for London and I would love to see him booted out of public office permanently. His team have tried to focus on Livingstone's tax affairs - which are obviously perfectly in order - because their candidate hasn't come up with any policies worth shouting about.
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  #39  
Old 19-03-2012, 08:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adlerhorst
Grow up. Seriously.
Yes. That's a really mature response.

I suggest you look to yourself.
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Old 19-03-2012, 08:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EdMan
The vast majority of tube users have Oyster cards, and the system works well for most. I ride my bike pretty much all the time but its easy to have the Oyster for those odd occasions when I need it. Let go of your resistance to it and you'll be glad you did.
I don't to use the tube enough to worry about it.

But I (seriously ) have a mindset that says the fewer pieces of plastic I have in my wallet the better. And I don't understand - despite the 'explanations' of Herr Adlerhorst (he is so strict, ja?) - why I must be 'punished' for that.
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