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  #13101  
Old 03-11-2017, 12:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Heb 7:4 View Post
A lot of people seem to want to argue that it shouldn't have been created in order to move to it should be destroyed.
Pardon?
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  #13102  
Old 03-11-2017, 01:13 AM
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There are people who think Israel should be destroyed. You can find anti-Semitic memes to this effect.
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  #13103  
Old 03-11-2017, 02:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Heb 7:4 View Post
Id suggest that endlessly reexamining that historical decision how hasn't helped things much though. Israel exists. A lot of people seem to want to argue that it shouldn't have been created in order to move to it should be destroyed.

Which is troubling.
Well, of course it is. I hope you are not inferring that is my suggestion?
And there's no point in teaching history if we don't 'endlessly' re-examine events. History breathes, it is not preserved in amber, but a living, changing fluid thing, constantly reshaped. It is our duty and privilege to do so.
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  #13104  
Old 03-11-2017, 02:38 AM
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I wasn't suggesting that was your intention, no, just that there are many (not you) who take a great deal of interest in this particular piece of history, whilst not really giving a shit about history in general.

We shouldn't be naive to the fact that some people's motive in questioning the circumstances of the creation of Israel is because they're interested in reversing that outcome.
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  #13105  
Old 03-11-2017, 08:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Heb 7:4 View Post
I wasn't suggesting that was your intention, no, just that there are many (not you) who take a great deal of interest in this particular piece of history, whilst not really giving a shit about history in general.

We shouldn't be naive to the fact that some people's motive in questioning the circumstances of the creation of Israel is because they're interested in reversing that outcome.
Thanks for clarifying, Heb. Agree completely, but unfortunately nuance seems to also get thrown out the window when people indicate both frustration and opposition to contemporary actions of the country. Equally, some whitewash the actions of those in the region who have been, and remain, hostile to Israel. It's an area of historical and political debate that struggles for objectivity, which for me is one of the pre-requisites.
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  #13106  
Old 03-11-2017, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by stamford triumph View Post
Quite, the temerity of suggesting the Jewish people should have their own homeland where they had been resident for more than 2000 years. Instead let's invent a new people called the Palestinians and suggest its their rightful homeland rather than any of the other 50 majority Muslim countries.
There is no evidence for the biblical exodus.
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  #13107  
Old 03-11-2017, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by SE25 exile View Post
There is no evidence for the biblical exodus.
Maybe not, but there is plenty of evidence for those people being in Palestine, along with others, BC. I wouldn't be using the bible to forward an argument one way or the other. The point, if you want to make it, is that the region was homeland to many, and there is no argument for giving one group exclusive ownership. One of the issues is also the Palestinians refusal to accept a two state solution in 1948. I can only assume that this occured because it would be received as acceptance of the founding of Israel? Someone else here probably has more knowledge of that.

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  #13108  
Old 03-11-2017, 09:27 AM
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Amazing how often this thread gets derailed by bollocks from the same hate-filled poster.
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  #13109  
Old 03-11-2017, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Stellavista View Post
Maybe not, but there is plenty of evidence for those people being in Palestine, along with others, BC. I wouldn't be using the bible to forward an argument one way or the other. The point, if you want to make it, is that the region was homeland to many, and there is no argument for giving one group exclusive ownership. One of the issues is also the Palestinians refusal to accept a two state solution in 1948. I can only assume that this occured because it would be received as acceptance of the founding of Israel? Someone else here probably has more knowledge of that.
When I was a kid, my friends and I used to dig up a red ants nest and place it on top of a black ant's nest. The result was carnage, but then we never expected anything else to happen.
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  #13110  
Old 03-11-2017, 09:35 AM
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While on this diversionary subject, this:

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  #13111  
Old 03-11-2017, 09:54 AM
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It's great to have Stamford Triumph on these boards. That is all.
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  #13112  
Old 03-11-2017, 09:55 AM
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While on this diversionary subject, this:

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This has what to do with Corbyn or Labour.....so secret a meeting one attendee put a Twitter picture out on the day. Now 2 months latter its news really ....

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  #13113  
Old 03-11-2017, 10:01 AM
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Amazing how often this thread gets derailed by bollocks from the same hate-filled poster.
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  #13114  
Old 03-11-2017, 10:32 AM
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Old 03-11-2017, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Heb 7:4 View Post
I wasn't suggesting that was your intention, no, just that there are many (not you) who take a great deal of interest in this particular piece of history, whilst not really giving a shit about history in general.

We shouldn't be naive to the fact that some people's motive in questioning the circumstances of the creation of Israel is because they're interested in reversing that outcome.
I agree. However given not just history, but that millions of Palestinians are in refugee camps, I don't think in its current form, which is a type of apartheid, should continue. Just like the South African apartheid state. I would like to see one state, the right of return, and equal rights for all within a state for Jewish people and Palestinians. Otherwise if you say that Israel should exist as a Jewish state, you are automatically trampling over the rights of Palestinians.
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  #13116  
Old 03-11-2017, 04:26 PM
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I agree. However given not just history, but that millions of Palestinians are in refugee camps, I don't think in its current form, which is a type of apartheid, should continue. Just like the South African apartheid state. I would like to see one state, the right of return, and equal rights for all within a state for Jewish people and Palestinians. Otherwise if you say that Israel should exist as a Jewish state, you are automatically trampling over the rights of Palestinians.
Would you call all those countries who expelled Palestinians over the last century apartheid states then? Shouldn't they also have the right to return to Jordan, Iraq, Kuwait, Tunisia etc? Shouldn't Jews also have the right to return to all those countries they were chucked out of?
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  #13117  
Old 04-11-2017, 12:57 PM
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Would you call all those countries who expelled Palestinians over the last century apartheid states then? Shouldn't they also have the right to return to Jordan, Iraq, Kuwait, Tunisia etc? Shouldn't Jews also have the right to return to all those countries they were chucked out of?
The definition of apartheid is a state only being able to exist by oppressing another nationality or race.

And 100% Jews should have the right of return.
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  #13118  
Old 17-11-2017, 11:40 AM
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Old 17-11-2017, 11:46 AM
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Old 17-11-2017, 12:44 PM
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