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General Palace Discussion General Palace talk - please keep transfer talk in the transfer forum.

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  #1  
Old 03-12-2017, 10:26 AM
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No width, no creativity, no goals

Bored of seeing RLC out wide, he's quite clearly not a winger nor particularly comfortable in wide positions. Bored of seeing Wilf with his back to goal, he's so blatantly more effective when he's out wide running at players scaring the sh*t out of them. Sure he's scored a couple of goals whilst playing up front, but I really think now that Benteke is back the team would benefit if we swapped Wilf and RLC.

We need to make this change ASAP imo. Hodgson has managed to find a formation that nullifies two of our biggest threats in RLC and Wilf, which in turn has negatively impacted Benteke's game too as Wilf would be creating so many more chances for him if he was playing out wide. How many dangerous crosses has RLC put in the box for Benteke to attack? None from memory. Wilf would put at least 3 or 4 per game.

Hodgson has neutralised the threat of RLC, Wilf and Benteke in one fell swoop. We need to go 433 or 4231 and attack with width, which shouldn't be hard to do seeing as we have two excellent wingers and a target man who needs crosses.

For the record- I appreciate we've started picking up points with this formation/shape, but we're toothless going forward what with all the square pegs in round holes. What has Wilf contributed in the last 3 games? RLC? (Yes he scored vs Stoke but he was very poor in open play playing RM).

Last edited by Eagle96; 03-12-2017 at 11:43 AM.
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  #2  
Old 03-12-2017, 10:33 AM
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Agree with this, with the utmost respect to Hodgson (who is doing an excellent job so far), there doesn't seem to be any reason defensively to make their current positions important to keep any shape - in fact, Wilf is far better defensively than RLC and would definitely move the ball up the pitch quicker than RLC.

There has to be a valid reason, but without inside knowledge it's difficult to know what it is.
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Old 03-12-2017, 10:38 AM
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Can't disagree with any of that.

Benteke needs to believe he's the main man. He needs to believe that if a cross comes into the box....he's the one to get onto it and do his job.

Wilf up front, or inside left as Roy calls it, can cause confusion. Get him on the left wing, running at the likes of Bruno, get 5 or 6 crosses in a game, same with Townsend on the other side.

12 good crosses per game. Big Ben gets on the end of 6. He misses 4 but buries 2.
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Old 03-12-2017, 10:39 AM
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Moan, moan, moan....

but actually I tend to agree with you
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Old 03-12-2017, 10:43 AM
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I think this is right but I can see why Roy has focused on making us hard to beat first and then build from there. The question is whether he is capable of adding the attacking flair now he seems to have fixed things defensively.

It will be interesting to see who he wants to sign. The club better back him early and not dick about like we normally do. We need to have signings lined up in early Jan for a change.

In the meantime, he must play RLC centrally and Wilf out wide on the left. It's crying out for that.
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Old 03-12-2017, 10:53 AM
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In the meantime, he must play RLC centrally and Wilf out wide on the left. It's crying out for that.
Can anyone give a good reason why this doesn't happen ?
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Old 03-12-2017, 10:55 AM
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Can anyone give a good reason why this doesn't happen ?
It makes no sense to me as it seems to play two people out of position. Wilf is so much more of a threat out wide and RLC looks much better centrally. I don't get it but he will have his reasons I guess. It doesn't seem to be getting the best out of both of them though.
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Old 03-12-2017, 10:59 AM
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We just need signings, we've set a team up to play a certain way and dont have a striker who can do it atm
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:00 AM
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Results have been good, we are picking up points away from home and unbeaten at home for 5 games. Whilst i agree with the principle of moving Wilf out wide and bringing RLC more centrally, you have to have faith in the manager at this point.
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:00 AM
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Part of the reason we were so successful under Sam was giving a Wilf a free role next to Benteke. It meant he didn’t have to track back and mark advancing full backs (which putting him on the wing would mean he needs to) - and his assist and goal rate went up as a result. It coincided with our remarkable run.

So Roy is following that principle. Do we really want Wilf chasing back overlapping full backs?
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:01 AM
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:02 AM
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:13 AM
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We've gone back to just trying to get it to Benteke in the box when he's actually in there and no one and nothing else.
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:18 AM
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I think we ran out of steam against West Brom

Prior to that we’ve created a lot of chances and failed to take them. First half against West Brom we could have scored 3 or 4 with the right final ball or the finish.

We’ve missed more big chances than any team outside the top 4 and if all teams in the league had scored all chances they’d be expected to score we’d be 7th. We have created chances we haven’t finished is all.

Wilf playing off benteke has been effective at times. Don’t get me wrong I’d like to see Ruben behind benteke with Townsend and zaha either side but we’ve dramatically turned our form around playing like this and the players are well drilled in it. I think Roy’s mandate might be keep us in it for January and then he can sign a couple of players to fill in the gaps.

I think Roy’s thinking is that playing like this is creating a lot more chances than we concede, we really should have more points and then this wouldn’t even be debated. Keep playing like this with the games we have remaining and we almost certainly would stay up. Why risk it until we’ve got reinforcements? That’s the thinking I’d imagine and he’s way more experienced and successful than us so despite being able to see the merits of both change and sticking to the safe plan I’m happy to go with what he thinks is best.

He has changed during games to suit the game and it is fairly fluid in that Ruben and Jimmy when out wide have had licence to come inside with wilf drifting wide, it’s not like it’s rigid.

What we need to change is the low drilled balls into the box. When benteke was out we slowly stopped the lofted crosses to no one but now we need to revert to those more often as benteke is back. Plenty of times we get into a good crossing position and don’t. It’s benteke in the middle, give him that ball in the air and he will score. Set pieces need more work. Townsend was much better, balls in with pace. Cabaye did that a few games ago and we nearly scored a few and then he went back to not beating the first man... we’re not miles away, final ball needs improvement. Finishing obviously but that’s jut one of those things
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:21 AM
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This. Puts Wilf in his best position where can get the most from him. Gives Benteke more support so less susceptible to the long balls up top to him on his own plus the 4 across midfield is Roy's speciality and makes us much more solid. It does need more work on how can get Andros and the full backs supplying Benteke with crosses and is unfortunate for RLC but think positives outweigh the negatives and don't want Wilf wasted on the wing and us being entirely one dimensional firing endless crosses in for Benteke.

Oops forgot to quote Bola

Last edited by benjamin7; 03-12-2017 at 11:22 AM. Reason: Forgot to quote
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:22 AM
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Part of the reason we were so successful under Sam was giving a Wilf a free role next to Benteke. It meant he didn’t have to track back and mark advancing full backs (which putting him on the wing would mean he needs to) - and his assist and goal rate went up as a result. It coincided with our remarkable run.

So Roy is following that principle. Do we really want Wilf chasing back overlapping full backs?
that was a phenomenal piece of tactical nous from Big Sam, worked perfectly, I'm surprised RH never noticed that.
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:22 AM
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Good article.

This stat shocked me;

'According to a recent analysis by FourFourTwo magazine, only one in every 92 crosses in the Premier League leads to a goal.'
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:31 AM
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that was a phenomenal piece of tactical nous from Big Sam, worked perfectly, I'm surprised RH never noticed that.
Erm.. you know that’s what Roy has done right?

People on here are saying put wilf back out wide. You’re slagging off Roy and praising sam for doing the same thing

Something really wrong with you
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:34 AM
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Erm.. you know that’s what Roy has done right?

People on here are saying put wilf back out wide. You’re slagging off Roy and praising sam for doing the same thing

Something really wrong with you
I'm not slagging him down, I was merely reiterating balobalola's good point, RH has done some good work in shoring up the defence etc, I do give credit if its warranted
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:43 AM
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The main thing to know is that putting Zaha back on the wing would be counter productive.
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