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  #41  
Old 07-02-2018, 07:26 AM
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Old 07-02-2018, 09:58 AM
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  #43  
Old 07-02-2018, 10:02 AM
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This club wouldn't exist without the academy.
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Old 07-02-2018, 10:18 AM
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Compare Southampton’s catchment area with ours and the teams that are in that area. The academy is probably under invested but we are probably 5th choice at best for youngsters in the london area just on reputation alone.
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  #45  
Old 07-02-2018, 10:28 AM
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This club wouldn't exist without the academy.
I Agree but it needs a major overhaul i worked as a scout for the CPFC pre academy u7/8 they train at the astro at the Crystal Palace Sports centre a very old centre with coaches that were at best average i got a few boys into this centre but talking to parents in general they were dissapointed with the facilites and the coaches feedback and the general lack of professionalism i lost 2 very good players to Chelsea so the facilities there are second to none all the boys receive a full kit and train with 2 coaches per squad it needs to be run with the utmost professionalism sadly as much as i tried to convey this it fell on deaf ears i am now employed by Chelsea as a coach its the last thing i really wanted to do but this side of things is not Premier league standard
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  #46  
Old 07-02-2018, 11:20 AM
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Post above really is very disappointing to read.
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  #47  
Old 07-02-2018, 12:15 PM
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When people mention Southampton bringing players through, they forget that before ep3 their catchment area was double everyone else which included London.
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  #48  
Old 07-02-2018, 12:26 PM
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playing at Goals with poor pitches which are rented hardly helps to give them the best chances to develop.
Regarding this specific point are the pitches really low quality? They look perfectly manicured and maintained to me.
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  #49  
Old 07-02-2018, 12:43 PM
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I don’t think we need to be too defensive about whether this is a valid question, because a business really should re-evaluate why it’s doing things regularly.

The academy does cost a considerable amount, so we shouldn’t just do it ‘because we’ve always done it’. It does need to justify itself.

Personally, I’d love to see a thriving academy and there is a special bond of affection towards players we’ve produced, rather than those we’ve bought in.

Plus I do agree that the community aspect is important for how the club is perceived locally. Palace are a presence in the local football ‘scene’ and it would be odd if we just left the field clear for other London clubs to hoover up the talent.

But how do we put a monetary value to that? Tricky. I do think our academy presence boosts interest in the club, and I know academy boys (and parents) who remained as spectators (even season tickets holders) long after their son was no longer playing for us.

But I do think there might be an argument that if we’re going to have an academy, it needs to be either done properly with significant funding (do we want to be category 1?), because maybe the alternative of doing it a bit half-heartedly isn’t worth it. That’s not a comment re the staff, who work hard, but a comment re funding, location, facilities etc.
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  #50  
Old 07-02-2018, 01:21 PM
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And sorry to be a pedant but we won the FA Youth Cup in 1977 and 1978. Not 1979. I enjoyed the 77 win much more cos final over 2 legs so was great to see such a large crowd at Selhurst. I didn't enjoy 78 so much as had to traipse to Highbury for one leg final at neutral venue.
You are of course right what I meant by 79 winners was the Div two winners now of course known as the "Championship"
Sorry for the confusion I was at the game in 1977 but cant remember who we beat ,so who was it?
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  #51  
Old 07-02-2018, 01:24 PM
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This club wouldn't exist without the academy.
You are obviously entitled to your opinion but could you please explain this.

Given we have just one player actually playing from the academy in seven and a half years how is your claim justified?
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  #52  
Old 07-02-2018, 01:53 PM
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And sorry to be a pedant but we won the FA Youth Cup in 1977 and 1978. Not 1979. I enjoyed the 77 win much more cos final over 2 legs so was great to see such a large crowd at Selhurst. I didn't enjoy 78 so much as had to traipse to Highbury for one leg final at neutral venue.
I enjoyed that game in 78 against Villa singing in the North Bank Highbury and on Victoria afterwards.
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  #53  
Old 07-02-2018, 01:55 PM
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The fact that the academy isn't producing the players to come through during the current injury crisis means a) that there should be some criticism of the executive chairman and chief executive for the fact that we are in this mess and b) the deadline day brinkmanship transfer strategy was even more risky.
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  #54  
Old 07-02-2018, 02:02 PM
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I would like to see the levels of academic achievement by academy boys relative to their intelligence. Perhaps judged on their GCSE and A level outcome against their SAT scores at KS1 and KS2. I am far from convinced that for many being involved has a positive impact on their lives at all.

I think there is a role for clubs to play in making youth football affordable for all. An academy boy saves his parents a fortune by playing and being clothed for free. However this isn't far reaching enough. The game and in particular the premier league isn't doing enough to bring down the cost of grassroots football and ensuring participation levels are as high as they could be on facilities that are affordable and of good enough quality.

I have seen inside a few academies and have friends that coach in them. They hardly paint a picture of institutions really committed to the best interests of the kids involved, be that from an academic or even a football perspective. I have heard some very dubious advise being dished out to kids faced with choices where academic and footballing interests collide.

I personally feel deeply uncomfortable about the age at which clubs signs and release players. All this against a backdrop of barely any of them making it. Let's not kid ourselves here this isn't just a premier league problem. A couple of years ago I was speaking with a coach at Leyton Orient and he had been in the academy 5 years in that time not one made the first team. That was in league 2.

I am thinkng off the top of my head now but I would seek to improve the level of youth leagues and have less focus on professional clubs academies. If they did this and streamed players more effectively at grassroots you would not need so much emphasis on the holy grail of being in an academy. You get too many thrashings at grassroots level because some teams are so much better than others. I am not entirely sure how you do it but this needs to be ironed out it does nothing for kids development or enjoyment. I think there is room for it to be more coordinated and not based on chance. Then once you have done that the academies can come and have their feed at 12/13.. perhaps they will have been involved all along to ensure the coaching the kids have been getting is of a high standard.

I am not sure kids should be moving countries for academy football. I also have reservations about teams treating them like commodities. There needs to be a thread running through the whole thing that central to anything is the fact they are children.

Last edited by scro; 07-02-2018 at 02:06 PM.
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Old 07-02-2018, 04:56 PM
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Post above really is very disappointing to read.
However it has been said for years.
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Old 07-02-2018, 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by scro View Post
I would like to see the levels of academic achievement by academy boys relative to their intelligence. Perhaps judged on their GCSE and A level outcome against their SAT scores at KS1 and KS2. I am far from convinced that for many being involved has a positive impact on their lives at all.

I think there is a role for clubs to play in making youth football affordable for all. An academy boy saves his parents a fortune by playing and being clothed for free. However this isn't far reaching enough. The game and in particular the premier league isn't doing enough to bring down the cost of grassroots football and ensuring participation levels are as high as they could be on facilities that are affordable and of good enough quality.

I have seen inside a few academies and have friends that coach in them. They hardly paint a picture of institutions really committed to the best interests of the kids involved, be that from an academic or even a football perspective. I have heard some very dubious advise being dished out to kids faced with choices where academic and footballing interests collide.

I personally feel deeply uncomfortable about the age at which clubs signs and release players. All this against a backdrop of barely any of them making it. Let's not kid ourselves here this isn't just a premier league problem. A couple of years ago I was speaking with a coach at Leyton Orient and he had been in the academy 5 years in that time not one made the first team. That was in league 2.

I am thinkng off the top of my head now but I would seek to improve the level of youth leagues and have less focus on professional clubs academies. If they did this and streamed players more effectively at grassroots you would not need so much emphasis on the holy grail of being in an academy. You get too many thrashings at grassroots level because some teams are so much better than others. I am not entirely sure how you do it but this needs to be ironed out it does nothing for kids development or enjoyment. I think there is room for it to be more coordinated and not based on chance. Then once you have done that the academies can come and have their feed at 12/13.. perhaps they will have been involved all along to ensure the coaching the kids have been getting is of a high standard.

I am not sure kids should be moving countries for academy football. I also have reservations about teams treating them like commodities. There needs to be a thread running through the whole thing that central to anything is the fact they are children.
One issue is that we have a few teams who dominate the youth level of football in this country so their youth teams are stockplied with more players than they can actually play. EPPP was about getting English players into and improving the national team.

Chelsea U18 keepers, Karlo Ziger is Croatian and joined last year, Nicolas Tie is French. Up front they have Redan who they bought last summer from Ajax!
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  #57  
Old 07-02-2018, 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Shoreditch CPFC View Post
Regarding this specific point are the pitches really low quality? They look perfectly manicured and maintained to me.
At Goals they are. Not as bad as they were prior to this season but still not particularly good - that is in part due to the river (stream?) running at the bottom.
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Old 08-02-2018, 12:12 PM
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I have watched players from the age of 7, go from being awful to excellent and vice versa. Kids who were walking into academies, who by 12 are just average. Then on the flipside there are boys that would have struggled even to get into their grassroots team if it had been selective, who now 4 years later have their pick of grassroots teams and could easily hold their own with boys in academy set up's. I think it's key to get all players participating good affordable coaching that focuses on individual improvement and have less focus on separating out the group of boys that excel and giving only them the best coaching.

I hate to say it but I have come across maybe 2 or 3 coaches at kids level that have really "got it" out of maybe 20, that i have seen in action. The coaching just seems too hit and miss for all to be honest. I appreciate the coaching badges are going someway to address this issue though. It seems a shame that pro's and ex pro's don't give up more of their time to get involved.
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Old 08-02-2018, 02:37 PM
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I have watched players from the age of 7, go from being awful to excellent and vice versa. Kids who were walking into academies, who by 12 are just average. Then on the flipside there are boys that would have struggled even to get into their grassroots team if it had been selective, who now 4 years later have their pick of grassroots teams and could easily hold their own with boys in academy set up's. I think it's key to get all players participating good affordable coaching that focuses on individual improvement and have less focus on separating out the group of boys that excel and giving only them the best coaching.

I hate to say it but I have come across maybe 2 or 3 coaches at kids level that have really "got it" out of maybe 20, that i have seen in action. The coaching just seems too hit and miss for all to be honest. I appreciate the coaching badges are going someway to address this issue though. It seems a shame that pro's and ex pro's don't give up more of their time to get involved.
Out of interest, what divides a good coach and bad coach in youth football, what do they do/dont do?
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Old 08-02-2018, 02:39 PM
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It's a waste of time unless you are Category One, or the team is in the Championship. We may as well disband it until either of those 2 scenarios become reality, hopefully the former. [Edit: this is from a financial point of view, and does not represent my own opinion on the value of the academy to the community etc.]
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