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View Full Version : Attendances and prices Pt2 - a letter to Simon Jordan


Tony
08-09-2008, 12:07 PM
Many of you will have seen the ongoing thread ‘How would you fill 10,000 empty seats?’ discussing ticket prices and attendances.

http://forums.cpfc.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=174489&perpage=20&pagenumber=1

Hopefully, the discussion will continue there, but this second thread contains a draft letter, which I will post in a moment, for the attention of Simon Jordan and other Palace executives proposing ways that the club might begin to fill those empty seats.

It’s not easy to get a perfect letter ‘written by committee’, and constant revision will be difficult (not to say tiresome for me) although it is still a work in progress. If you agree with the general gist of it and would like your name to be included on it, please either add your name to this thread or, if you prefer, send me a PM.

I don’t think it’s necessary to have thousands of names on it, this isn’t a petition, but it would be better if it comes from a reasonable number of concerned supporters rather than one individual.

It might also be useful to state whether you are an existing season ticket holder, a ‘casual’ attendee or a supporter who no longer attends because of ticket prices.

For those who no longer attend because of ticket prices...
I’ve also included a poll (at least I hope I have, not too sure how it works) just to get a rough idea of what ticket prices might need to be in order to attract new or lapsed supporters to attend regularly.

Tony
08-09-2008, 12:11 PM
This is the draft letter... it may well be updated, but I doubt the overall sentiment will change too much. If you are prepared to put your name to it please either post on this thread or send me a PM.


Dear Mr Jordan

As Palace supporters of long standing, we are writing to you with regard to the declining attendances at home games and to suggest some ideas to help increase support and revenue for the club.

An average of 10,000 empty seats at every game represents huge potential revenue lost and has a detrimental effect on the atmosphere at Selhurst Park. We are concerned about the club's long-term ability to compete effectively in the Championship if we cannot attract more people to attend on a regular basis.

Palace tickets are regularly cited as being the most expensive in the Championship and we believe that the current pricing structure is inconsistent and confusing. Even many committed Palace supporters are unclear what the prices actually are, and are often unaware of any special offers that the club makes, and say that they cannot encourage more people to attend because it is difficult to justify the cost of tickets to their family and friends.

This could be tackled swiftly by the introduction of a simplified and more attractive pricing strategy with the aim of filling as many of the vacant seats as possible. This in turn would create a more positive view of Palace as a brand and as well as extra ticket sales would further benefit the club through increased takings from catering outlets, programmes and merchandising.

We believe it is essential to place greater emphasis on encouraging ‘casual’ supporters to attend as these are potential season ticket holders of the future. We would like to see the club significantly reduce matchday prices for the rest of this season and consider a review of ticketing for next season.

There are several areas of particular concern. Prices for families are too expensive especially in comparison to competing attractions, including other football clubs, in London. Not only do we need to help fans bring more children, but we also need to keep these young fans as they grow older by targeting supporters in the 16-21 age bracket, including students, with prices they can afford.

We feel that CPFC needs to review the balance between value for money for those who commit to every game and those who only attend occasionally. We ask you to consider the following suggestions and would be delighted to hear your thoughts on how Palace might attract larger crowds.

We would like the club to invite supporters to attend an ‘open meeting’, perhaps before or after a match, to discuss ways in which we can increase attendances with the initial aim of helping our regular crowds reach and eventually exceed 20,000.

Other clubs including Bristol City, Huddersfield and Bradford City have seen significant attendance rises after revising their prices and we believe such measures could do likewise for Palace.

In the meantime, we have set out some proposals for price changes. These would need to be supported by a media campaign and letters to existing fans to ensure that people understand the new strategy. By introducing some or all of these measures we believe the club can attract new supporters, encourage lost fans to return and increase its income significantly.

1. Extend the ‘kids-for-a-quid’ scheme for under-12s accompanied by an adult to every match. The scheme should also be extended to include season-ticket holders. The club may need to consider making a gesture of goodwill towards those who have already bought season tickets for their children, possibly in the form of club shop vouchers (which in turn might help generate additional sales), or tickets for an FA Cup tie.

2. Simpler and cheaper matchday pricing designed to target borderline fans, young adults and those who cannot attend every game. We suggest: £15 for adults (£20 in the Main Stand), £10 for 17-21 year-olds (all areas), £5 for 12-16 year-olds. Drop category A, B and C pricing.

3. Remove the incremental increases of season ticket prices with the lowest prices being for those who commit before Christmas. We believe this is counter-productive as it discourages people from buying once they have missed the cheapest prices. We suggest that there should be a standard price with possibly one ‘early bird’ discount ‘window’.

4. Offer existing season-ticket holders the chance to nominate one family member or friend for a substantially discounted season ticket at, say, £150, the aim of which would be to fill seats, get people into the habit or attending matches again and engage existing fans in the efforts to improve attendances.

5. Consider establishing a campaign, or possibly an informal ‘twenty thousand club’ with the express aim of helping to drive attendances upwards. Many fans are willing advocates for the club, but the biggest obstacle when trying to encourage new people to come to games is that it is too expensive.

We believe these proposals are straightforward and could be introduced swiftly. We are convinced they would increase the attendance and bring in significant additional revenue – even selling 5000 seats at £15 would realise an additional £75,000 per match. We believe these moves would be of benefit to the club and new and existing supporters.

We have signed this letter in our individual capacities and not as part of an organised supporters group. However, a small representative group would be pleased to meet with you and other Palace executives to discuss these ideas. Please reply to the above address in the first instance, we look forward to your reply.

We understand that you are looking to sell Crystal Palace and we’d like to take this opportunity to thank you for your commitment to the club.


With best wishes for a successful season

sw16girl
08-09-2008, 12:15 PM
saying it is not part of an organised supporters group is a very good idea. You may want to address it to Mr Jordan rather than Simon but your choice.

I think it is a brilliant letter and wish you luck with it.


I am happy to put my name to it

elgin eagle
08-09-2008, 12:23 PM
All good ideas and well written. I would say kids for a quid at every match might be a little too cheap. Perhaps kids for a fiver would be more realistic for 2 hours 'entertainment'.

Prices have been unrealistic for far too long. Anything that fills the stands has to be done for the good of all.

Palace Bear
08-09-2008, 12:25 PM
Agree adress to Mr Jordan not Simon. It's effectively a business proposal so should be kept relatively formal.

But agree, good letter, don't necessarily agree with the finer details but with the principle I do.

:p

Tony
08-09-2008, 12:29 PM
Originally posted by elgin eagle
All good ideas and well written. I would say kids for a quid at every match might be a little too cheap. Perhaps kids for a fiver would be more realistic for 2 hours 'entertainment'.

Prices have been unrealistic for far too long. Anything that fills the stands has to be done for the good of all.

Thanks Elgin. I think on the other thread (and I know it's awkward having two, but I want people to actually see this letter) we went through quite a number of options. These prices don't have to be set in stone but at least provide the club with specific examples of our thinking and the prices we consider to be necessary to give things a kick start.

Kids for a quid for this season at least would hopefully have a positive impact. If that turned out to be uneconomic in future at least we've got people interested and could then find a way of working out a reasonable charge for coming seasons.

Tony
08-09-2008, 12:30 PM
Changed to 'Dear Mr Jordan'

thanks :)

Posters, please remember to indicate if you are willing to put your name to it.

PalaceMonkey
08-09-2008, 12:32 PM
i'll put my name to it.

also regarding his selling of the club, increased attendances & revenues would make the club more saleable.
You could put something to that effect in there

Tony
08-09-2008, 12:38 PM
Originally posted by PalaceMonkey
i'll put my name to it

Thanks. I'll need to know your real name, though... including 'PalaceMonkey' on the list of the signatures might cause the club some consternation (let alone when we get to Wooden Fish On Wheels and Psychokiller!) :)

hilairehair
08-09-2008, 12:38 PM
Please put my name on it. I would travel to more than the half a dozen or so homes I go to if it would be more affordable. I could persuade to bring London based mates too, if it were cheaper.

SJ'sLoveMonkey
08-09-2008, 12:40 PM
Count me in for sure

Dorking .Eagle
08-09-2008, 12:48 PM
Brilliant letter Tony. Delighted to put my name to it -

David London - Season ticket holder.

Certainly if the club are not keen to have Under 12's for a quid at every game, then certainly every afternoon kick-off would be a good comprimise - not many under 12's go to evening games anyway.

Henfield Eagle
08-09-2008, 12:54 PM
Originally posted by Dorking .Eagle
Brilliant letter Tony. Delighted to put my name to it -

David London - Season ticket holder.

Certainly if the club are not keen to have Under 12's for a quid at every game, then certainly every afternoon kick-off would be a good comprimise - not many under 12's go to evening games anyway. Good Point.
Have sent PM :p

cheekychippie
08-09-2008, 01:06 PM
well done,count me in
andrew potter season tkt holder

Optimistic Kev
08-09-2008, 01:06 PM
Excellent ideas and well balanced letter. Happy to put my name to it.

You could also add in with regards to increasing attendances this also increases 'additional revenue' - if another 5,000 people turned up this would increase sales of food, beers, programmes & merchandise.

When I have taken my younger cousin before - by the time you buy him a burger, programme and something from the Club shop there isnt much left out of £20 (a lot more if he wants a replica shirt or training top etc) - I am not saying this type of income would be represented at every match but if 5,000 people spent another £20 - then that also another £100,000 additional income on top of the match ticket income. Just £10 spend would bring in another £50,000 per match - on a 23 match season this comes out too £1,150,000 of revenue + ticket sales.

I know when Noades held the lease he received much of the match day revenue in terms of catering, therefore it wasn't in Simons interest to court this money. Now it doesn't go to Noades it certainly is.

Barbara4003
08-09-2008, 01:11 PM
Good letter :)

I'm happy for mine, my daughter and my husbands name to it.

Barbara and Jennifer Poole - Season Ticket Holders

Geoff Poole - occasional ticket purchaser (due to work and the cost of the ticket to attend in the Main Stand).

drizzt
08-09-2008, 01:13 PM
I'd certainly attend a little more often if tickets were say under £20.

Being based in Dorset with tickets at £35 (or whatever they currently) are what with petrol, lunch (at a minimum) a programme etc, a trip to Palace certainly is'nt a cheap option.

Tony
08-09-2008, 01:24 PM
Originally posted by Dorking .Eagle
Brilliant letter Tony. Delighted to put my name to it -

David London - Season ticket holder.

Certainly if the club are not keen to have Under 12's for a quid at every game, then certainly every afternoon kick-off would be a good comprimise - not many under 12's go to evening games anyway.

Thanks all...

I guess the kids for a quid in evening games almost polices itself given that many younger ones (mine included don't attend night matches because of late nights and school).

It's noticeable that the fixture computer has been particularly unkind to us this season with Charlton, Forest, Southampton, Birmingham and Wolves all being played in midweek rather than Saturdays... :(

Tony
08-09-2008, 01:26 PM
Just looked at the poll as well. It's only a small sample obviously but perhaps a reasonable endorsement of our thinking on prices.

stupalace
08-09-2008, 01:30 PM
Originally posted by drizzt
I'd certainly attend a little more often if tickets were say under £20.

Being based in Dorset with tickets at £35 (or whatever they currently) are what with petrol, lunch (at a minimum) a programme etc, a trip to Palace certainly is'nt a cheap option.

Palace were offering a season ticket for this season and next season for £525 thats well under £15 a game .Perhaps this could have been advertised more but the offer was out there , also after the Watford home game this season i was offered a season ticket for £240 plus a free home or away shirt .

m_reid
08-09-2008, 01:31 PM
Originally posted by Tony
a samll representative group would be pleased to meet with you and other Palace executives to

nice letter, saw one "small" mistake, just so your aware

ardeo
08-09-2008, 01:45 PM
A very good and well written letter Tony, just a few suggestions:

Originally posted by Tony


We would like to see the club significantly reduce matchday prices for the rest of this season ahead of a full review of all ticketing for next season. Possibly don't need to put a timeline in, as the letter is trying to help not tell them what to do

In the meantime, we have set out some proposals for price changes. These would need to be supported by a media campaign and letters to existing fans to ensure that people understand the new strategy. Change would to could, same reason as above.

2. Simpler and cheaper matchday pricing designed to target borderline fans, young adults and those who cannot attend every game. We suggest: £15 for adults (£20 in the Main Stand), £10 for 17-21 year-olds (all areas), £5 for 12-16 year-olds. Drop category A, B and C pricing. This should be implemented immediately and then reviewed at the end of the season. Already mentioned about reducing prices and review earlier, and should probably steer away from dictating to Mr Jordan

We believe these proposals are straightforward and could be introduced swiftly. We are convinced they would increase the attendance and bring in significant additional revenue – even selling 5000 seats at £20 would realise an additional £100,000 per match. We believe these moves would be of benefit to the club and new and existing supporters. Not quite as simple maths as that, as the club will be making less money on the current pay on the day fans, but agree with other poster that more fans = more spending on other things

We have signed this letter in our individual capacities and not as part of an organised supporters group. However, a small representative group would be pleased to meet with you and other Palace executives to discuss these ideas further. Please reply to the above address in the first instance, we look forward to your reply.


With best wishes for a successful season

Feel free to ignore use the suggestions as you like (used to it at work with my boss ignoring half of my suggestions)

ardeo
08-09-2008, 01:47 PM
I forgot to say that I am happy for you to use my name:

Tom Olney (2 year season ticket holder in the AW- probably can guess from my sig!)

Scrumpy
08-09-2008, 01:54 PM
Very good letter. Agree with the points in the letter and hope it starts some action.

I'll be happy to put my name to it.

My name is Jack Laws.

Beckenham Boy
08-09-2008, 01:58 PM
Tony, good letter.

I know the letter is already a good length, however on the kids for a quid, it may be wise to mention that kids each paying £1 over the remianer of the season is better than handing out free tickets to kids through schools on a few occassions.

Happy to put my name to it - Daniel Lane - Season ticket holder

Tony
08-09-2008, 03:01 PM
Originally posted by Beckenham Boy

I know the letter is already a good length, however on the kids for a quid, it may be wise to mention that kids each paying £1 over the remianer of the season is better than handing out free tickets to kids through schools on a few occassions.


Not only that, but if the prices were right in the first place the club would have less work to do on constantly coming up with initiatives to try to attract more fans.

It does seem that there are supporters who, for whatever reason, have to wait either for club offers or for mates to be in a position to lend them tickets before they can go to games. That's not a healthy state of affairs.

Also thanks for the pointers ardeo. Communicating with Palace is tricky at the best of times. I agree we need to be 'advising' rather than 'dictating'. The maths is kind of simplistic as we don't know what the club knows about its income, likewise different people on here have different views of what prices are reasonable or workable. What I hope we have made clear is that 10,000 empty seats produces no value for anyone.

Thanks for the other comments here.

cpfcmazz
08-09-2008, 03:14 PM
Mattie, Robert, Jeremy Hero - Season Ticket Holders AWS

CP Satellite
08-09-2008, 03:25 PM
I would like to endorse the comments in Tony's letter.

Furthermore, I think CPFC are missing out on several hundred potential fans by not giving reduced prices to students aged 16-18 who possibly do not have the income to commit to a season ticket or adult matchday prices. I feel the club are begining to isolate this type of support, which could be very harmful for Palace in the long term, as these fans may lose the habit of going altogether at current prices.

PalaceMonkey
08-09-2008, 03:26 PM
Originally posted by cpfcmazz
Mattie, Robert, Jeremy Hero - Season Ticket Holders AWS

that is an excellent surname.

eagle101
08-09-2008, 03:27 PM
I'm happy to put my name down. Will send PM.

Andy in Rome
08-09-2008, 03:39 PM
Also happy to sign up to this letter - check for PM.

eagleforlife
08-09-2008, 03:50 PM
I'll put my name to it.

Tom Fitton - occassional ticket purchaser due to costs.

milky87
08-09-2008, 03:52 PM
Put me and a few others down

Mark Jones - season ticket holder and 100% away traveller

Mark Lydon - season ticket holder and 100% away traveller

Peter Jones - season ticket holder

Jack Jones - season ticket holder

KevTheOptimist
08-09-2008, 03:58 PM
I'd imagine Mr Jordan would do some simple maths, 13000 * 35 = 455,000 or 20000 * 15 = 300,000.

Barbara4003
08-09-2008, 04:01 PM
Originally posted by stupalace
Palace were offering a season ticket for this season and next season for £525 thats well under £15 a game .Perhaps this could have been advertised more but the offer was out there , also after the Watford home game this season i was offered a season ticket for £240 plus a free home or away shirt .

This is another area they seem to fail miserably at.

I have never heard of half the offers some people mention on here, and I have been a season ticket holder for a number of years.

It seems rather hit and miss as to who gets the offers and who doesn't. I don't expect to have to keep checking the official website. My name is on their database so surely it's not too much to ask to be informed when offers such as the 2 year deal is offered. I would certainly have taken that up.

Salisbury
08-09-2008, 04:03 PM
Good letter Tony; very happy to put my name to it.

Ribbo
08-09-2008, 04:09 PM
It cost me 30 quid 2 seasons ago for an under 6 never again.Even the bloke who sold it to me in the ticket office was disgusted

James
08-09-2008, 04:18 PM
Very good letter - good luck with it.

One big problem I see with the proposals in the letter as it stands is this bit:

"Offer existing season-ticket holders the chance to nominate one family member or friend for a substantially discounted season ticket at, say, £150, the aim of which would be to fill seats, get people into the habit or attending matches again and engage existing fans in the efforts to improve attendances."

That's a great idea, if it could work as proposed. However, I fear that the Club would be concerned that many Season Ticket holders, who would pay the full price if there were no choice, might band together to take advantage of the heavily discounted ticket. I think you would have to limit the offer to family members - or perhaps anyone who has never previously purchased a Season Ticket.

You have already highlighted another concern. What do you do about existing Season Ticket holders? These are the people that the Club needs to keep onside. They are the most loyal of the Club's supporters, and whatever else the Club might do, it cannot afford to ignore their views. That effectively rules out making any offer to third parties which betters the deal already negotiated by existing Season Ticket holders, unless adequate compensation is paid. I am not sure that Club Shop vouchers would be sufficient.

GreatGonzo
08-09-2008, 04:27 PM
Great idea and effort.

I would say though that suggesting a adult ticket at £15 and then doing your maths based on £20 would be unwise. I believe in 2003/4 a ticket to the Holmesdale was £19 i think that would be a reasonable cost.

Then even taking into account the concessions youw would be looking at an average ticket price being £10-15, when multiplied by 5k it is still a lot of money, 20 more home games and thats £1-1.5m this season i think.

ricardoro
08-09-2008, 04:29 PM
good letter

Richard Capewell, 50 plus year supporter but only occasional
attender nowadays due to high cost

GreatGonzo
08-09-2008, 04:29 PM
Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
I'd imagine Mr Jordan would do some simple maths, 13000 * 35 = 455,000 or 20000 * 15 = 300,000.

10,000 of those he is getting £0 for between now and the end of the season.

He will be getting £0 for my seat for an awfully long time, same goes with quite a few others.

Even at £500 a season ticket only works out at a shade over £20 per game - still too much IMO.

The main issue is if you do not have a season ticket very very few will pay on the door prices. Being a Palace fan is almost a decision you make once a year, you either buy a ST or you do not go to games.

Palacemad2002
08-09-2008, 05:56 PM
Liking the changes to the letter mate, makes the points that need to be raised stand out perfectly.
You can put mine and my dads names down for sure: Chris Mead - 3rd generation supporter of 22 years, season ticket holder of 10 years and regular away traveller.
John Mead - Supporter of 60 years, Season ticket holder for around 40 and regular away traveller.

Despite all these names on here though i still think names should be collected in person at one of the upcoming home games as theres plenty of supporters that either dont use this site, just browse message boards or dont use the internet altogether.
Would be an example to the club as to what advertising in different areas rather than one can actually achieve i.e. make sure there aware that signatures were collected from both the internet, at a game, in one of the local pubs etc.

the digger
08-09-2008, 06:27 PM
Much improved letter Tony, and with some worthwhile contributions on this thread I think you will have a very powerful document. A few points:

- I agree with those that say 'kids for a quid' is unnecessarily cheap, £5 would be fine if the other tickets were reasonably priced.
- I also think that collecting signatures at games may be a better route than through the BBS. Not all Palace fans use this site, but it may be a good way to raise awareness and find people willing to collect signatures.
- At the moment it seems a bit of a case of 'preaching to the converted' as most signees are already season ticket holders or regular attendees. For this to have weight we need more people who would come more often if there was a better pricing strategy.

But sign me up, I'll PM you.


On a sidebar: Where do people find out about these amazing season ticket deals? I phoned to ask about prices and was quoted £525 for the Arthur. That's £23 per game, if you can get to them all which I can't.

Spender
08-09-2008, 06:36 PM
On the gate prices are far too expensive and do put off a lot of people who might otherwise turn up for say 4 games a season.

917L
08-09-2008, 06:40 PM
Very good letter Tony

Happy to put my families names to that

Gary & Mark Stanford - Season Ticket Holders

Burgess
08-09-2008, 06:47 PM
Put me on pls!!! Damian Lee

cpfc0809
08-09-2008, 06:59 PM
nice one, keep up the great work!
Me n my bro had a season ticket for 8 years in the AW block V until this season! shall i PM r names etc?

RDSdaEAGLE
08-09-2008, 07:12 PM
You can add the following names to the letter too. It's a brilliant letter, Tony.

Robert Sutherland - Former Season Ticket Holder
Sheila Sutherland - Former Season Ticket Holder
Sarah Sutherland - Former Season Ticket Holder
Colin Sutherland - Current Season Ticket Holder
Ian Hallett - Former Season Ticket Holder
John Hallett - Former Season Ticket Holder

Riley
08-09-2008, 07:23 PM
Tony- good work mate, we all appreciate it!

Have PM'd you too...

:lux:

Malakite
08-09-2008, 08:56 PM
Brilliant letter Tony - you can stick me down! :p

howard
08-09-2008, 09:19 PM
The clowns were advertising games for £15 in last weeks local papers. Good luck with the letter, hope SJ takes the time/effort to read it & reply(rather than one of his lackeys).

Tony
08-09-2008, 10:35 PM
Originally posted by the digger
I also think that collecting signatures at games may be a better route than through the BBS. Not all Palace fans use this site, but it may be a good way to raise awareness and find people willing to collect signatures.


Thanks for all the PMs. At the moment there are just under 50 signatories so far. I won't reveal any names here and will delete the PMs in due course.

I'm afraid gathering signatures at a match is beyond me as I can't get to Selhurst Park until just before kick off because of Saturday morning commitments and travelling. If anyone feels it is worth doing, perhaps we could organise a few volunteers to take the letter around pubs to sign.

As I said, I don't feel it need to be a petition as such, more a statement of concern.

I've made one or two slight edits again just to take into account a couple of worthwhile points, thanks.

sw16girl
09-09-2008, 06:52 AM
I know that in the past the club management have rather dismissed issued raised on the BBS when brought up by PISA as only being a few people having a moan and getting things off their chest on a message board.

I wonder if (knowing that the club monitor here) people posting blocks of names who they say are happy to sign the letter is a good way of doing things. While I have no doubt that those people would be happy to have their name put to the letter it does give the impression that it is simply people claiming their friends/relations will sign it without those people necessarily having read the letter or approved it. Maybe the best thing is for every one to PM personally and for those pms to be copied and clipped to the letter. Perhaps if Tony could let people have an email address then those who want to sign and who are not on the BBS could then email their own confirmation - thus stopping any claim that it is just a few people signing up everyone else in their absence

Pistol Knight
09-09-2008, 08:37 AM
I agree with Palacemad2002, that signatures need to be gained from other sources, the only trouble is it then looks like a petition!! which its not, sw16girl's idea is also a good one
It is in everyone's interest, from the Chairman,the team, Manager and supporters (and yes the tea lady), to try to fill the ground.
I'm not even sure if you can buy a ticket on the day anymore.......that's how long I have stayed away for (and will continue to stay away unless prices are reduced)
£18 - is a fair price for adults (£15 in the AW)
£5 - under 16's
£10 - 16 - 18's & OAP's (Student cards accepted, Uni up to 21)
Will PM my details

Tony
09-09-2008, 09:08 AM
Originally posted by sw16girl
I know that in the past the club management have rather dismissed issued raised on the BBS when brought up by PISA as only being a few people having a moan and getting things off their chest on a message board.

I wonder if (knowing that the club monitor here) people posting blocks of names who they say are happy to sign the letter is a good way of doing things. While I have no doubt that those people would be happy to have their name put to the letter it does give the impression that it is simply people claiming their friends/relations will sign it without those people necessarily having read the letter or approved it. Maybe the best thing is for every one to PM personally and for those pms to be copied and clipped to the letter. Perhaps if Tony could let people have an email address then those who want to sign and who are not on the BBS could then email their own confirmation - thus stopping any claim that it is just a few people signing up everyone else in their absence

The easiest thing is if people PM me with their names in confidence if they wish to add them, although I'll post an email address here if it's preferred.

There's nothing to be gained from filling pages and pages of names for the sake of it, it's the weight of argument that counts rather than the weight of numbers.

If club representatives have read these threads, or are aware of them, I hope they'll be more impressed by what it reveals about how fans care for the club, the potential revenue being lost and, above all, about how the present problems can be addressed. This is vital for Palace's future, because as things stand I don't see how our attendances will do anyhting but continue to decline.

macstar
09-09-2008, 09:12 AM
Originally posted by Spender
On the gate prices are far too expensive and do put off a lot of people who might otherwise turn up for say 4 games a season.

so true.

any mates who think about turning up soon change their mind when you tell them the price!

and if they do decide to go, they come away from the match wondering why they paid all that money for a 'poor' level of football.

i think £20-24 is about right...

Sick Bucket
09-09-2008, 09:32 AM
Good letter and I like the general idea, but I very much doubt Jordan will cut the price for adults in half from £30-40 to £15-20. Lets says 5000 people currently pay the £30-40 on match day obviously you're going to have to double that figure just to bring in the same amount - quite a risky strategy. That said I think you should definitely send the letter because it's well written and raises some good points.

Tony
09-09-2008, 10:14 AM
Originally posted by Sick Bucket
Good letter and I like the general idea, but I very much doubt Jordan will cut the price for adults in half from £30-40 to £15-20. Lets says 5000 people currently pay the £30-40 on match day obviously you're going to have to double that figure just to bring in the same amount - quite a risky strategy. That said I think you should definitely send the letter because it's well written and raises some good points.

Thanks, Sick Bucket. You may well be right and I wouldn't say I'm confident that we'll get the response we're hoping for. But from what we've been hearing here, our figures are about right if Palace want to attract new support and win back the fans it has lost. I'm reasonably convinced that existing matchday ticket prices are £10-15 too much (and top end season ticket prices are too expensive too).

Yes, it's a very big drop we're advising them to take. But, as Gonzo pointed out earlier, 10,000 x £0 = a big fat nothing... and that's what Palace are currently making from those empty seats.

People have different circumstances, but I think we can say with a degree of certainty that many of those who do not attend on a regular basis are price sensitive. Charge £15-20 and they will be able to come, anything above that (and Palace are way way above it) and they won't. It's depressing to hear of so many people turning away, it's a shame for the fans and it's bad for the club.

It is a risky strategy, but if the club carries on as it has been then the general decline in attendances will I suspect deepen. In my opinion, the club should address this now while it still has a reasonable base from which to build. If it does nothing then it will be much more difficult to repair the damage.

All of this is just the financial side. There's also the issue of perception. For those in the ground it's an increasingly hollow experience; if you watch when we're on telly you could be forgiven for thinking that there's hardly a soul there, and if you read the attendance in the newspaper reports you're hardly going to deduce that Palace are a club on the up. Bigger crowds will build their own momentum, even if we could get it back up to 18-19,000 it would feel like something was stirring...

Palace is a fantastic club, we all love it to death, most of us don't want to have some oil billionaire buy a Robinho for us, but we would at least like the club to make the most of itself.

selhurstparkflyer
09-09-2008, 10:36 AM
I agree with a lot of this; I live in Bath and bring my kids to London 4 or 5 times per season. I, though, begrudge paying upwards of 60 quid for what is more than likey to be poor entertainment, so I don't bother.

Charging kids 18 quid for a football is really very counter productive. I know if I phone and book in advance I can get it cheaper but that automatically takes out the spontaneous support for which we seek.

And, most importantly, any price specials the club does offer must be very very heavily advertised and coupled with some flags, banners, clappers, whatever, that will help make a game a memorable experience for a child, rather than the endless tedium being served up today.

Always an Eagle
09-09-2008, 11:00 AM
Originally posted by James
Very good letter - good luck with it.

One big problem I see with the proposals in the letter as it stands is this bit:

"Offer existing season-ticket holders the chance to nominate one family member or friend for a substantially discounted season ticket at, say, £150, the aim of which would be to fill seats, get people into the habit or attending matches again and engage existing fans in the efforts to improve attendances."

That's a great idea, if it could work as proposed. However, I fear that the Club would be concerned that many Season Ticket holders, who would pay the full price if there were no choice, might band together to take advantage of the heavily discounted ticket. I think you would have to limit the offer to family members - or perhaps anyone who has never previously purchased a Season Ticket.

You have already highlighted another concern. What do you do about existing Season Ticket holders? These are the people that the Club needs to keep onside. They are the most loyal of the Club's supporters, and whatever else the Club might do, it cannot afford to ignore their views. That effectively rules out making any offer to third parties which betters the deal already negotiated by existing Season Ticket holders, unless adequate compensation is paid. I am not sure that Club Shop vouchers would be sufficient.

I think James has hit the nail on the head that the club will consider ST holders as their priority & while I support Tony's initiative (I'll PM my details) I think the club may be more receptive to something that increases the ST base because at best I suspect they'll bring something in for the odd game (like family days etc-Are the cheap tickets supported/covered by a sponsor.)

Season ticket holder views is an area that is untapped. While the organisers of the trust, PISA etc are constantly rebutted by the club & SJ, any phoenix of those organisations could have an (IMHO) impact if it was clear that this new supporters group had a substantial number of season ticket holders forming the core of it. My random thoughts anyway.

kolinkins
09-09-2008, 11:03 AM
It's a very good letter, and passion is so clear yet it doesnt compromise the point.

We do have to be aware of certain regulations and concerns that the club will have - less revenue and more expense if the prices come down, but boy wouldnt it be good to have 20k plus in each game?

Excellent stuff

swissroll
09-09-2008, 12:17 PM
Kids and student deals are easy to get running and generally people dont have an issue with those people paying alot less. Clearly whatever promotion is done, this should be all games and season long so everyone knows the score

Beckenham Boy
09-09-2008, 12:24 PM
Just looking at the prices for the upcoming away games.

Wolves away: -
Adults £28
Senior Citizens (Over 60) £15
Students £15
Under 17s £12
Under 12s £10

Ipswich away: -
Adults £28
Senior Citizens £19.50
Students £19.50
16-19 year olds £19.50
Under 16s £10

winterj
09-09-2008, 12:37 PM
put my name to it please very good letter,hopefully may make a difference (fingers crossed)

Leap of faith
09-09-2008, 12:47 PM
Originally posted by GreatGonzo
you either buy a ST or you do not go to games.

Seems like the crux of it to me for the majority.

CPFC_R_GREAT
09-09-2008, 12:53 PM
Put my name down...

Dan Purvis...Leeds based broke fan...Attend local Away Days

MasterYoda
09-09-2008, 12:53 PM
Due to the distance I have to travel I've gone to far more away games in the last 2 seasons.

This saves me money but obviously doesn't benefit our club. I've written to Palace about this before now and had a reasonable if ultimately unhelpful response.

This season I will do Bristol City, Cardiff, Swansea as a minimum and probably most of Southampton, Plymouth,Birmingham, . Would ordinarily have done Reading too but didn't.

rednbluethrunth
09-09-2008, 01:04 PM
Good letter.

Add us please

Mike, Joe, and Sam Young, Chloe Rozier,

Long term season ticket holders

sw16girl
09-09-2008, 04:03 PM
Originally posted by Beckenham Boy
Just looking at the prices for the upcoming away games.

Wolves away: -
Adults £28
Senior Citizens (Over 60) £15
Students £15
Under 17s £12
Under 12s £10

Ipswich away: -
Adults £28
Senior Citizens £19.50
Students £19.50
16-19 year olds £19.50
Under 16s £10

But if you look at what they are charging their own supporters in the cheap home stand it is a bigger difference:-

Wolves

Adult - £24
Senior Citizen (over 65) & Students (with NUS card) £14
U 17's £11
U 12's £8

The kids prices are even cheaper in the family stand (£8 and £5)

Ipswich

Adult - £24
Concessions (senior citizens and students) £16.50
U 20's £16.50
U 16's £7

And if you buy that it entitles you to a discount of £5 off an adult ticket for the Barnsley match if bought at the same time.

time and again it is the student/young persons price difference that is most noticeable - a 17 year old at Palace is £25 as against £14 or £16.50 - and once people get out of the habit it is difficult to woo them back.

Billy Rhino
09-09-2008, 04:10 PM
Am I right in thinking that you can buy a season ticket for the next season in December for something like £300 but come the summer it goes up to £525?
Obviously, £300 is a pretty good deal but it does smack of blackmail a bit and is counter-productive in the long run, as the 'full price' £525 ticket is way too expensive rather than the £300 deal being necessarily that cheap.

Now I dont know how many fans have bought a season ticket for the full £525 but I cant imagine it's many, however how can you reduce the matchday price to below the £23 per game this ticket offer?

I would recommend, however unlikely it is, that the club drop this price back to £450 (pro-rata) and refund the few who have paid the full £525 the £75 difference.
Then there would be leverage to lower the overall adult price to somewhere around £20/£22 (maybe keeping only the Charlton game at £25). This would be a grand generous gesture and hopefully show the club is listening to the fans, who would hopefully return the gesture by showing up!

Personally, I only go occasionally these days for a few reasons :

1. I normally play football on a Saturday.
2. My Palace supporting friends have either moved from the area or refuse to pay £25-£30 to watch "that rubbish".
3. I think £25-£30 is too expensive for what's on show (except the Burnley game last season which was fantastic).
4. Probably due to the poor standard of football, the atmosphere is generally pretty poor (except again for the same Burnley game, which was the best at Selhurst for years!).

Always an Eagle
09-09-2008, 05:27 PM
Originally posted by Billy Rhino
Am I right in thinking that you can buy a season ticket for the next season in December for something like £300 but come the summer it goes up to £525?
Obviously, £300 is a pretty good deal but it does smack of blackmail a bit and is counter-productive in the long run, as the 'full price' £525 ticket is way too expensive rather than the £300 deal being necessarily that cheap.


It was £330 in the h'dale lower. I got mine at that price & this stems back to a long term deal I signed maybe 6 years ago & when that was coming to an end the best renewal (for single years) price was in December & yr on the same so once you're on that merry go round renewing every twelve months isn't a big deal.
A friend decided to buy a S/t at the start of last year for him & his two boys & cos it was august he paid something like £900 for 3, he then had to agonise over renewing in december for the 3 for around £600 so that was £1500 on s/t for two years in the space of four months (how he got it past his wife I don't know). Not many people would do that so the season ticket base will stay flat or decrease,

jamie12
09-09-2008, 05:32 PM
i'll put my name in dude!!

cranesparkeagle
09-09-2008, 05:50 PM
The thrust is good but not sure Mr Jordan will entertain the idea of an open forum to discuss this issue. Also not sure if mentioning a possible sale of the club is good tactics in the context of ticket sales. It might just get backs up. Otherwise would be happy to support

stamford triumph
09-09-2008, 06:09 PM
This certainly has my full support. I always buy a spare kids season ticket so my children can take cousins/friends to matches and it is low cost if renewed in December (although tricky to find the readies in the month of Christmas). However, I would take more people to games on a casual basis if we could get the on the day price down.

PJJY
09-09-2008, 06:13 PM
Very good letter.

I'll put my name to it.

Patrick Young - Season Ticket Holder

Good luck

Robson
09-09-2008, 08:45 PM
Bump, and, yes, I'd whack my name on it.

Excellent letter. Someone's obviously got some executive experience!

The Omen
10-09-2008, 09:39 AM
Please add my name to the list:

Carl Turland - Priced out student fan

Latvian
10-09-2008, 09:49 AM
.

Typical Palace
10-09-2008, 06:11 PM
It's not just Palace.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/b/burnley/7606382.stm

Burnley chairman bemoaning the lack of casual fans. He still plans to target s/t sales though.

cardiffeagle
10-09-2008, 10:36 PM
I'll put my name to it.

Ian Hart
10-09-2008, 10:37 PM
Brilliant letter, and I am very happy to put my name to it.

I do think however that the economics of football pricing are a little more complex than is sometimes believed.

Axie
11-09-2008, 08:41 AM
In today's local East Grinstead paper Palace have taken out two full page colour advertisements. One for new shirts in club shop and one for a three match deal for 2 adults and 2 children for £52. Matches are Swansea, Plymouth and Charlton.

Can't remember them doing that before down here.

Dobbo
11-09-2008, 12:21 PM
Certainly the concession for youngsters needs to be adjust. My two 21yr old lads got a reduced price at Reading. Please add my name to the list Tony.

Bob Dobson 10yr season tickets holder

Dorking .Eagle
11-09-2008, 01:50 PM
Originally posted by Axie
In today's local East Grinstead paper Palace have taken out two full page colour advertisements. One for new shirts in club shop.........


Bit of a waste of money as they've been out of stock of all home shirts above Large for almost a month

Tony
11-09-2008, 02:30 PM
Sorry for going quiet on this, I've been busy at work. I guess this thread has kind of dried up now as we've discussed all the issues and there seems to be a reasonable consensus, even if we're not exactly agreed on the maths.

Unless someone can commit to collecting signatures at forthcoming games, which I don't think will necessarily prove anything to the club, shall I just go ahead and send it and we'll see where we go from there?

It's not perfect, but we have at least offered CPFC a number of constructive and potentially workable solutions and raised the issue.

I think the poll is pretty conclusive... 170 replies isn't a bad sample (although hardly scientific) and 80% of those say they would attend more regularly if ticket prices were pegged to £20 or less. I'm sure Palace might say that is difficult to achieve, but £20 is still a lot of money to many people. I think many of us also have our own anecdotal evidence to support that conclusion.

Thanks for a constructive and helpful discussion. Up the Palace... and up the attendances too :)

Jay_Palace
11-09-2008, 02:36 PM
Originally posted by Dorking .Eagle
Bit of a waste of money as they've been out of stock of all home shirts above Large for almost a month

Pathetic. The off the field side of this club isn't fit to grace League Two, let alone the Championship.

Absolutely no excuses of running low on stock, letters/numbers for replica shirts etc.

kolinkins
11-09-2008, 03:33 PM
No excuse for running low on stock? How about selling well?

Beckenham Boy
11-09-2008, 03:43 PM
Originally posted by Tony
Sorry for going quiet on this, I've been busy at work. I guess this thread has kind of dried up now as we've discussed all the issues and there seems to be a reasonable consensus, even if we're not exactly agreed on the maths.

Unless someone can commit to collecting signatures at forthcoming games, which I don't think will necessarily prove anything to the club, shall I just go ahead and send it and we'll see where we go from there?

It's not perfect, but we have at least offered CPFC a number of constructive and potentially workable solutions and raised the issue.

I think the poll is pretty conclusive... 170 replies isn't a bad sample (although hardly scientific) and 80% of those say they would attend more regularly if ticket prices were pegged to £20 or less. I'm sure Palace might say that is difficult to achieve, but £20 is still a lot of money to many people. I think many of us also have our own anecdotal evidence to support that conclusion.

Thanks for a constructive and helpful discussion. Up the Palace... and up the attendances too :)

Tony

Yes, I think you should send it off now and see what (if any ;) ) response you get. I look forward to hearing what they think.

If anything they need to do something on the price of tickets for young fans as they are the Season Ticket holders of the future, or the Charlton Season ticket holders...

JHJ EAGLE
11-09-2008, 03:57 PM
Sounds very good to me, I will put my name to it. PM. on the way.

bkcbongo
11-09-2008, 07:49 PM
Originally posted by Axie
In today's local East Grinstead paper Palace have taken out two full page colour advertisements. One for new shirts in club shop and one for a three match deal for 2 adults and 2 children for £52. Matches are Swansea, Plymouth and Charlton.

Can't remember them doing that before down here.

I actually think these deals are a bit narrowly targeted - I don't have any kids, and am of an age where none of my mates have kids old enough to take them along. So these deals are of lesser incentive to me and all others not going as a family..

Think that the club could do more to create a community as well, a sense of inclusion and belonging - there must be more they could do to capture the hearts of the potential local fanbase.

But back on thread, good effort with the letter. It's a big step up on those of us that just sit on here and moan about the situation! :p

Jay_Palace
11-09-2008, 07:54 PM
Originally posted by kolinkins
No excuse for running low on stock? How about selling well?

Why don't they order more stock then? If it's not the shirts then it's something relatively small like not having enough numbers/letters available to print shirts. It's not acceptable and is no way to run a merchandising operation at a supposedly ambitious club. I would think you'd be embarrassed to see how well our "operation" compares even to a club like MK Dons.

Not wishing to detract form Tony's excellent letter of course. l still very much doubt it will receive much, if any response from the powers that be though but it is definitely worth a try.

Dorking .Eagle
11-09-2008, 08:17 PM
Also not detracting from Tony's letter (ready to go IMO), but on the shirt stock issue, the largest size of replica home shirts sold out in the first week of the season back at the start of August, and told next batch wouldn't be in till October.

Delighted for them, but it is frustrating for the fans who want to show their support for the clubs efforts but are still faced with such obstacles.

orp pisshead1
12-09-2008, 12:25 AM
Originally posted by kolinkins
No excuse for running low on stock? How about selling well?

No , absolutely no excuse, they knew this seasons 2 kits would sell well and if they didn't then they did little research/they don't know their market.

Typical Palace
13-09-2008, 07:05 PM
Shocking attendance today @12,500 Palace fans.

I know we have two games in eight days, and an away one as well. But this crowd was dreadful and makes Tony's initiative all the more important. Something must be done.

If we went on a season long unbeaten run at home I doubt we'd increase the crowds by as much as we should be expecting

Typical Palace
13-09-2008, 07:08 PM
BTW Re club shop. Tried to buy a baby grow for a new born family member with West Ham Dad. None in stock. 'Maybe in Oct'. What ever happened to speculate to accumulate? No stock = No sales = Less income.

It also means there's (at least) one less baby in red and blue. :(

rbarmy
13-09-2008, 07:36 PM
Originally posted by Typical Palace
Shocking attendance today @12,500 Palace fans.



Thought it was announced at 14,600? Still lower than it could be though, I agree

Typical Palace
13-09-2008, 07:49 PM
rbarmy, I was estimating @2,000+ Swansea fans.

Dorking .Eagle
13-09-2008, 08:14 PM
Was just thinking about the attendance today, and had similar thoughts re the number of Palace fans there today. Bear in mind that the announced figure is ticket SALES, including all season ticket holders, whether there or not, I reckon the number of Palace fans ACTUALLY there would be under 12k today.

I just wonder how low it's gonna go - a visiting team with poor away support will probably redduce the gate further - Barnsley perhaps, which is also on Sky TV (why???)

Tom's Old Man
14-09-2008, 04:02 PM
Originally posted by Dorking .Eagle
Was just thinking about the attendance today, and had similar thoughts re the number of Palace fans there today. Bear in mind that the announced figure is ticket SALES, including all season ticket holders, whether there or not, I reckon the number of Palace fans ACTUALLY there would be under 12k today.

I just wonder how low it's gonna go - a visiting team with poor away support will probably redduce the gate further - Barnsley perhaps, which is also on Sky TV (why???)
Unless they make them family day matches, there probably won't be many more than 10k actually in attendance. :confused:

stupalace
14-09-2008, 04:43 PM
Originally posted by Typical Palace
BTW Re club shop. Tried to buy a baby grow for a new born family member with West Ham Dad. None in stock. 'Maybe in Oct'. What ever happened to speculate to accumulate? No stock = No sales = Less income.

It also means there's (at least) one less baby in red and blue. :(

it seems that with no new shirts coming in and basically no new stock of any sort until october perhaps the usual palace thing of paying our suppliers at the last minute is happening again , we are probably on stop with them all and refusing to issue more stuff until we have settled up for the last lot

AJ's right boot
14-09-2008, 05:00 PM
Fantastic, only just seen this. Im happy to put my name down for something.

etu
14-09-2008, 07:22 PM
An idea I may have missed but can't see anywhere is simply to offer 3 for the price of 2 or whatever on casual tickets sold at the window. I think its a great idea for the club, as it drives prices down - but only if we come in numbers. Which is what we want.

Originally posted by KevTheOptimist
I'd imagine Mr Jordan would do some simple maths, 13000 * 35 = 455,000 or 20000 * 15 = 300,000.

It was 12,000 against Swansea. I know they're not a glamour tie and a poor start pushes people away but thats still a sign of a downward curve that needs to be arrested asap.

More over, Jordan will do the maths on other figures as well. 7000 extra fans drinking beer, eating burgers, buying programmes, thinking about popping into the club shop... it adds up.

Ian Hart
14-09-2008, 07:58 PM
Originally posted by etu
An idea I may have missed but can't see anywhere is simply to offer 3 for the price of 2 or whatever on casual tickets sold at the window. I think its a great idea for the club





With respect, I can't see how it is a great idea for the club at all. What would surely happen is that in the queue outside, people would simply pair up with other fans they don't even know and approach the window as a threesome. I'm not sure how many new fans it would generate, whilst simply meaning the club would lose 33% of the casual ticket money from fans who would have queued anyway to pay the full price.

sw16girl
17-09-2008, 10:43 AM
Did you send it Tony? And if so when was it and have you had an acknowledgement yet?

Billyd
17-09-2008, 10:44 AM
Originally posted by Ian Hart
With respect, I can't see how it is a great idea for the club at all. What would surely happen is that in the queue outside, people would simply pair up with other fans they don't even know and approach the window as a threesome. I'm not sure how many new fans it would generate, whilst simply meaning the club would lose 33% of the casual ticket money from fans who would have queued anyway to pay the full price.

agree, i think thats a terrible idea

etu
17-09-2008, 11:58 AM
Originally posted by Ian Hart
With respect, I can't see how it is a great idea for the club at all. What would surely happen is that in the queue outside, people would simply pair up with other fans they don't even know and approach the window as a threesome. I'm not sure how many new fans it would generate, whilst simply meaning the club would lose 33% of the casual ticket money from fans who would have queued anyway to pay the full price.

I agree thats a flaw; I don't know how common it would be, but if people did it all the time it would immediately knock the benefit out of it.

In which case, limiting it to buying in advance might knock some of the abuses out of the system. You'd still get some people buying x then selling them onto their mates, but I still think it'd be worth a go to get more people in.

Tony
17-09-2008, 12:29 PM
Hello all.

I posted the letters this morning. I've written to Simon Jordan and the commercial manager Kevin Watts and also copied one to Neil Warnock with a brief covering letter explaining what it was all about. Doubtless he's more concerned with team affairs, but he might be interested in why the team receives such feeble support at the moment.

As Ian Hart and James Mitchell have noted, perhaps it's not as simple as we believe, it may also not be the best time to raising this when Simon Jordan is looking to sell, but it does at least raise the issue with the club. I can't believe that CPFC is not worried by the downturn.

I will of course let you know what response I get.

Tony

Always an Eagle
18-09-2008, 11:07 AM
Interesting article on the BBC site about QPR ticket prices & Derby refusing to agree. Never realised away teams had any say & wonder what derby will make of our away ticket prices if we're supposed one of the highest...

Apparently QPR have recently restructured their ticket pricing with adult tickets ranging from £20 to £50 for league matches.

Dorking .Eagle
18-09-2008, 11:23 AM
Originally posted by Always an Eagle
Interesting article on the BBC site about QPR ticket prices & Derby refusing to agree. Never realised away teams had any say & wonder what derby will make of our away ticket prices if we're supposed one of the highest...

Apparently QPR have recently restructured their ticket pricing with adult tickets ranging from £20 to £50 for league matches.

Thanks for the tip-off

Just had a look at the QPR website.

The seats at Loftus Road are now divided into 4 price bands - Platignum, Gold, Silver and Bronze. There are virtually no seats in the Bronze category, bar really restricted view corner seats.

The away End is classified as "Gold" in the Upper Tier, and "Silver" in the Lower Tier

QPR's home games are in 3 categories - Cat A,B and C.

Derby are Cat A (presumably because they were Premiership last season)
Blackpool are Cat C.

I would have thought that when Palace visit, we would be Cat A, as it is a London derby. If we're struggling at the bottom of the table when tickets for our game go on sale, it is possible we could be classed as Cat B opposition I suppose.

The away end holds 3400 seats according to their website, and their policy is to sell (the more expensive) upper tier seats first (1723 seats) and only sell the lower tier if the Upper tier sells out.

Assuming the League uphold the QPR prices, assuming our game is Cat A, then Upper Tier would be £40 adults, Lower Tier £30.

I agree with Derby, no visiting Championship supporters should have to pay £40. Fair enough if they went up to the Prem, but not in this division

ee-ay-ee-ay-ee-ay-o
18-09-2008, 12:23 PM
Originally posted by Dorking .Eagle
Thanks for the tip-off

Just had a look at the QPR website.

The seats at Loftus Road are now divided into 4 price bands - Platignum, Gold, Silver and Bronze. There are virtually no seats in the Bronze category, bar really restricted view corner seats.

The away End is classified as "Gold" in the Upper Tier, and "Silver" in the Lower Tier

QPR's home games are in 3 categories - Cat A,B and C.

Derby are Cat A (presumably because they were Premiership last season)
Blackpool are Cat C.

I would have thought that when Palace visit, we would be Cat A, as it is a London derby. If we're struggling at the bottom of the table when tickets for our game go on sale, it is possible we could be classed as Cat B opposition I suppose.

The away end holds 3400 seats according to their website, and their policy is to sell (the more expensive) upper tier seats first (1723 seats) and only sell the lower tier if the Upper tier sells out.

Assuming the League uphold the QPR prices, assuming our game is Cat A, then Upper Tier would be £40 adults, Lower Tier £30.

I agree with Derby, no visiting Championship supporters should have to pay £40. Fair enough if they went up to the Prem, but not in this division

Blimey ! seems like you have to go on a course just to understand their pricing structure..why do things have to be so complicated..? !

Stroud Eagle
18-09-2008, 06:53 PM
Originally posted by etu
An idea I may have missed but can't see anywhere is simply to offer 3 for the price of 2 or whatever on casual tickets sold at the window. I think its a great idea for the club, as it drives prices down - but only if we come in numbers. Which is what we want.



It was 12,000 against Swansea. I know they're not a glamour tie and a poor start pushes people away but thats still a sign of a downward curve that needs to be arrested asap.

More over, Jordan will do the maths on other figures as well. 7000 extra fans drinking beer, eating burgers, buying programmes, thinking about popping into the club shop... it adds up.

Not when they see the prices.£4.80 for a pie. is just one example.Most people eat and drink outside the ground,apart from half-time.Where prices,quality,service and atmosphere are far superior.

stupalace
18-09-2008, 06:55 PM
arsenal are selling tickets for the league cup game against sheff u at £10 adults and £5 for kids . people know he will play the kids but its a cheap way of seeing your side play at home

Maidstoned Eagle
19-09-2008, 08:07 AM
This week Malaga are playing away to Almeria, it's a bit of a derby clash. Therefore Almeria are charging Malaga fans €60+ for tickets. The supporters groups here announced they were boycotting this game, Almeria have now halved the ticket prices to anyone with a season ticket and are carrying ID. The boycott still stands.

may blunderer
20-09-2008, 12:03 AM
Just seen this Tony as I've been on holiday. Sorry for not being able to give you my name before you sent the letter. I think it's excellent. Let's hope for a favourable response from the club.

Phil.

lost eagle
20-09-2008, 07:07 AM
Add my name to it Ian Johnson

Typical Palace
20-09-2008, 11:56 AM
Originally posted by Stroud Eagle
Not when they see the prices.£4.80 for a pie. is just one example.Most people eat and drink outside the ground,apart from half-time.Where prices,quality,service and atmosphere are far superior.
Those pies are tasty though. I'd rather pay £4.80 for something I might buy away from the football than pay £3.50 for a gross pie with non descript gravy and a trace of some sort of meat by product.

You can criticise the club for an awful lot, but the catering has improved. I NEVER used to use it but now I do.

Tom's Old Man
20-09-2008, 01:22 PM
Originally posted by stupalace
arsenal are selling tickets for the league cup game against sheff u at £10 adults and £5 for kids . people know he will play the kids but its a cheap way of seeing your side play at home

Cheaper than Palace v Hereford in the 1st round.

Malakite
20-09-2008, 04:51 PM
Originally posted by stupalace
arsenal are selling tickets for the league cup game against sheff u at £10 adults and £5 for kids . people know he will play the kids but its a cheap way of seeing your side play at home
Absolutely, and still guaranteed far better quality that the cr@p currently being dished up at Smellhurst! :D

762657
20-09-2008, 05:37 PM
Attendance today seems to disagree with all of you, on this link anyway.... http://www.sportinglife.com/football/live/latestscores/

palacemaniac
20-09-2008, 05:46 PM
Originally posted by 762657
Attendance today seems to disagree with all of you, on this link anyway.... http://www.sportinglife.com/football/live/latestscores/

142,000 :D

stupalace
20-09-2008, 05:48 PM
Originally posted by 762657
Attendance today seems to disagree with all of you, on this link anyway.... http://www.sportinglife.com/football/live/latestscores/

record gate receipts as well , bit worried the football league might close selhurst down , that must breach our safety certificate

LeeH
20-09-2008, 05:55 PM
On the official site too so must be true...

Sam Spade
20-09-2008, 06:15 PM
Its a small point Tony but I would be tempted to re word the last sentence of the letter which links his "commitment" with his decision to sell. A sensitive soul may note a hint of sarcasm where clearly none is intended. Noting his action in investing in us to get out of administration and then effectively subsidising the running costs over the years can be shown to be genuinely appreciated whilst acknowledging the decision to sell and the hope that he comes up with a buyer to ensure his legacy.

Alternatively I may just be a picky s*d.:)

Robson
21-09-2008, 10:04 PM
Wouldn't a better process be for all of us to print out a copy of this letter, sign with our own names and post it off?

I'm sure if Selhurrst Park got 1 000-odd letters in the post saying the same thing, they'd have to listen?!

Barbara4003
21-09-2008, 10:07 PM
I wonder how many letters Simon Jordan actually gets to see? If you don't get a response, you should print it out, and hand it to him at the next home game he attends. He is usually quite receptive :)

Tony
22-09-2008, 09:35 AM
Originally posted by Robson
Wouldn't a better process be for all of us to print out a copy of this letter, sign with our own names and post it off?

I'm sure if Selhurrst Park got 1 000-odd letters in the post saying the same thing, they'd have to listen?!

I would think that variations of the letter from individuals would be a good idea, it can't do any harm (although I would suggest a tone that is constructive rather than hostile).

There's probably no point in just re-sending what has already been written, although by all means use it as a template. Many people have special circumstances and other examples which could be pointed out to the club.

sw16girl
23-09-2008, 06:13 PM
Well well well

http://www.cpfc.premiumtv.co.uk/page/News/0,,10323~1401548,00.html

I think you may be able to take some credit for this Tony - well done.

AJ's right boot
23-09-2008, 06:18 PM
Its a great start :p

Leap of faith
23-09-2008, 06:27 PM
Originally posted by sw16girl
Well well well

http://www.cpfc.premiumtv.co.uk/page/News/0,,10323~1401548,00.html

I think you may be able to take some credit for this Tony - well done.

Either that or a very large coincidence. Well done Tony and well done to the club, it can be logistically difficult to introduce new ticketing procedures. Great start :p :p :lux: Come on students get on board!

Barbara4003
23-09-2008, 06:28 PM
Well done Tony :)

Godstone Eagle
23-09-2008, 06:28 PM
Graet stuff :)

mearns
23-09-2008, 08:29 PM
I think the letter is fine -well done Tony!. I can only attend 6 or so games a season now and Plymouth was my first in this. I was struck by the lack of atmosphere in the ground and how few children seemed to be present. Such a contrast to when I was a youngster and the most of the kids on our estate would go to Selhurst Park. Walking through South Norwood rec en route to the match there were scores of kids paying organised football - there were signs saying that the facilities were supported by Barclays Bank and CPFC. All very well except that these local kids should have been at Selhurst on Saturday afternoon! It is also noticeable that the population of South Norwood and Thornton Heath seems to be largely black yet the crowd at Selhurst appears to be 99% white. If a Coca Cola league football club is to survive it needs to have its main support from the local community but this seems to have passed CPFC by. Tony is right to draw attention to the fact that the marketing executives at CPFC appear to be prepared to tolerate 10.000 empty seats at every home match and they seem to focus their energies on events such as golfing days or executive boxes.This misses the point. Getting thousands of people into the habit of visiting Selhurst on a regular basis has to be the key to a long-term supporter base. OK - they may only pay a small sum to get in now but a significant number will develop a long-term addiction.

Am I the only one to worry about the cheap offers being made to existing season ticket holders to buy their seat for future seasons? Of course its good for the individual season-ticket holder but since CPFC appears to have no effective strategy to increase attendances, where will the income come from in future seasons? Speculative leveraging by certain banks is drawn to mind.

Come on Palace - lets think big and fill the 10,000 empty seats every week!

sw16girl
23-09-2008, 08:31 PM
Originally posted by mearns

Am I the only one to worry about the cheap offers being made to existing season ticket holders to buy their seat for future seasons? Of course its good for the individual season-ticket holder but since CPFC appears to have no effective strategy to increase attendances, where will the income come from in future seasons? Speculative leveraging by certain banks is drawn to mind.


No you aren't the only one to worry about it.

Richard
23-09-2008, 08:42 PM
Originally posted by mearns
IAm I the only one to worry about the cheap offers being made to existing season ticket holders to buy their seat for future seasons? Of course its good for the individual season-ticket holder but since CPFC appears to have no effective strategy to increase attendances, where will the income come from in future seasons? Speculative leveraging by certain banks is drawn to mind. I've been banging on about this since the club started doing it. Fine in rising markets or to finance assets that will generate cash in the future, but a recipe for disaster in hard times.

Ian Hart
23-09-2008, 10:01 PM
Originally posted by Richard
I've been banging on about this since the club started doing it. Fine in rising markets or to finance assets that will generate cash in the future, but a recipe for disaster in hard times.

All very true.

But the fact is that if the club had not offered these season ticket deals in the past, there would be even smaller attendances now. There must be a fair number of people who were enticed into "future seasons" season ticket deals in the hope (being Palace fans) that they would end up watching Premiership football at bargain prices. We can assume that a proportion of fans who took such offers might not have renewed their season tickets this season were it not for the fact that they had already bought them a year or two ago - indeed, I've read some people making comments to that effect. That proportion would have then joined the ranks of the "non-season ticket fans" who instead buy their tickets as and when they want to - and we already know that the high prices for such tickets tend to encourage people to attend less and less regularly.

I don't pretend to know what the answer is. It seems to me the club has got itself into a vicious circle. If it removes the cheap season ticket offers, it will turn some season ticket holders into occasional fans. To encourage occasional fans to attend more regularly, it has to significantly reduce prices. But if it significantly reduces prices to non-season ticket holders, it has to reduce the price of season tickets too, otherwise there might be little incentive to buy a season ticket. Can the club afford to drop season ticket prices? I just don't know.

Well that was a helpful input :o

Wright+Bright
23-09-2008, 10:09 PM
I'm a student but am 24 :( looks like I still won't be able to afford it!

Great stuff though and about time to!

Tony
24-09-2008, 09:26 AM
I haven't received a reply from Palace as yet, but I only sent the letter last week.

It's good news that they are introducing a student ticket, although there doesn't seem to be a confirmed price yet. Let's hope there may be other revisions in the pipeline as well.

As soon as I hear back from Palace I'll let you all know.

While we're on the subject I hope that as many of us as possible will try to ensure this news filters through to students. I don't know whether the club will do much promotion, but we should certainly try to spread the news around as much as possible ourselves.

Another idea suggested to me the other day was that the current two adults two kids for £52 offer could be shared by individuals with one child each - I don't know how workable it is but maybe we should have some kind of ongoing ticket share thread where people could be put in touch with deals, offers, spares etc?

the digger
24-09-2008, 09:34 AM
Great news, good work Tony.

What about us mature students? I don't understand why they would make this discrimination.

Tony
24-09-2008, 10:06 AM
Originally posted by the digger
Great news, good work Tony.

What about us mature students? I don't understand why they would make this discrimination.

If and when the club reply, I intend to send them a response (which hopefully will be a nice 'thank you' letter!). I'll raise that point with them.

Might as well keep up the dialogue.

Beckenham Boy
04-10-2008, 11:15 AM
Originally posted by Tony
If and when the club reply, I intend to send them a response (which hopefully will be a nice 'thank you' letter!). I'll raise that point with them.

Might as well keep up the dialogue.

Take it nothing back yet then?

Tony
13-10-2008, 03:51 PM
Take it nothing back yet then?

No, I've had no acknowledgement from Palace. I'm going to write again this week to express my disappointement about the lack of response, particularly in light of the recent comments by Simon Jordan about how clubs might address the economic downturn.

stupalace
13-10-2008, 03:56 PM
No, I've had no acknowledgement from Palace. I'm going to write again this week to express my disappointement about the lack of response, particularly in light of the recent comments by Simon Jordan about how clubs might address the economic downturn.


They take their own club charter thing very seriously dont they

:rolleyes:


Fans' Charter & Ground Regulations
Posted on: Wed 11 Jul 2007

THE FANS' CHARTER

Crystal Palace Football Club are committed in working towards providing the best possible service to all its customers/supporters.

The Customer Charter sets out how the Club interacts with customers/supporters and covers a wide range of areas including ticket prices, supporter club memberships, community activities, merchandise and customer service policies.

The Club will respond to every letter, fax or email within 14 days of receipt.


If it is considered that the content of the letter cannot be responded to in full within 14 days, then an acknowledgment will be sent within 14 days setting out a time frame by which the Club will respond in full.

Kevin Watts, HR and Commercial Director, has overall responsibility for customer service. In the first instance however, the Club encourage customers/supporters to make an initial contact, verbal or written whichever you prefer, with the relevant department as listed below.

http://www.cpfc.premiumtv.co.uk/page/FansCharter/0,,10323,00.html

Alternatively you can e-mail your enquiry to info@cpfc.co.uk marking it for the attention of the relevant contact and this will be immediately forwarded on.

In the event that you are dissatisfied with the response received, or the time taken to respond to you, then you should write to Kevin Watts, c/o of Stacie Muir, the Customer Services Officer at: CPFC, Selhurst Park, London SE25 6PU, or email: stacie.muir@cpfc.co.uk.

The Club consults its customers/supporters on a regular basis through forums, questionnaires and general feedback.

racehorse-80s
13-10-2008, 04:02 PM
I emailed them 2 weeks ago about prices and additional charges when buying ticket online and as of yet had no response .

Sheik Yerbouti
13-10-2008, 04:13 PM
I'm going to Man City vs Stoke in a couple of weeks for the princely sum of £5.50. I know that Croydon doesn't have the same student population as Manchester, but surely they can make a slight effort.

Tony
22-10-2008, 12:02 PM
I've only just got around to writing again to Palace, as I've been busy lately, but I have now done so expressing my disappointment at the lack of response and re-copying the original letters. I am a little surprised that I didn't receive any acknowledgement at all, but I don't inted to let it rest just yet.

The attendance against Barnsley wasn't exactly brilliant, although not helped by relatively small away support, but there were more people around and it's a shame that increased effort can't be made on a regular basis.

racehorse-80s
22-10-2008, 02:30 PM
I've only just got around to writing again to Palace, as I've been busy lately, but I have now done so expressing my disappointment at the lack of response and re-copying the original letters. I am a little surprised that I didn't receive any acknowledgement at all, but I don't inted to let it rest just yet.

The attendance against Barnsley wasn't exactly brilliant, although not helped by relatively small away support, but there were more people around and it's a shame that increased effort can't be made on a regular basis.


I have emailed them twice about season ticket information and my thoughts on matchday prices and never recieved a reply .
The second time i used the complaints address stacie.muir@cpfc.co.uk but still no response .

They obviously don't like fans who question the cost of admission prices on matchdays, which is fair enough it's Jordan club and and he can charge what he likes for matchday admission but a reply along them lines would be better than none surely.

greenlight
23-10-2008, 07:12 PM
Although pricing is obviously an issue, I think all seater stadia hardly help.
If I want to take anyone with me to a match, it will mean me changing my seating arrangements if I want to sit with them. This will mean buying the ticket in advance of the day putting an onus on the "3rd party" deciding and commiting to going rather than a "saturday morning" impulse!
This follows the trend at other clubs since implementation of the Taylor Report.

Bank Rupt
24-10-2008, 09:49 AM
I have emailed them twice about season ticket information and my thoughts on matchday prices and never recieved a reply .
The second time i used the complaints address stacie.muir@cpfc.co.uk but still no response .

They obviously don't like fans who question the cost of admission prices on matchdays, which is fair enough it's Jordan club and and he can charge what he likes for matchday admission but a reply along them lines would be better than none surely.

Stacie Muir left the Club about a year ago so that might explain why you haven't had a response. Her e-mail should have been diverted though.

stupalace
24-10-2008, 09:53 AM
Stacie Muir left the Club about a year ago so that might explain why you haven't had a response. Her e-mail should have been diverted though.


nice to see then that the club have updated the club charter section on the website

:rolleyes:

ee-ay-ee-ay-ee-ay-o
13-11-2008, 01:44 PM
[QUOTE=Tony]I've only just got around to writing again to Palace, as I've been busy lately, but I have now done so expressing my disappointment at the lack of response and re-copying the original letters. I am a little surprised that I didn't receive any acknowledgement at all, but I don't inted to let it rest just yet. QUOTE]

Mods; I make no apology for duplicating this post I placed on another thread..

Have you not been acknowledged yet ?! That is utterly disgraceful.

And this is what gets me about the Palace...nothing has changed in 50 years of supporting them...Your case was well put together, thoughtful, challenging and with ideas & feedback. That the club can't have the decency to respond says that either their Admin is crap and that they've lost both attempts of yours to communicate (probable) and/or that they simply hold supporters in contempt (possible)...it's a two way thing Palace...if you want us to support you have to engage with the supporters...and this sort of thing just alienates them. :veryangry

Louis
17-11-2008, 01:48 PM
Write again Tony. If necessary, phone them, tell them you've had no acknowledgement of your letter. Ask you you should speak to about this and speak to that person on the phone.

If you still get nowhere, contact the Croydon Advertiser Sports Desk, and put them onto it. That might get a response.

sw16girl
17-11-2008, 02:00 PM
nice to see then that the club have updated the club charter section on the website

:rolleyes:

They certainly managed to update one bit - when it was pointed out they were in breach of their charter by not having regular meetings with PISA they removed the requirement to have regular meetings with PISA from the charter - sorted!

Ian Hart
17-11-2008, 02:12 PM
They certainly managed to update one bit - when it was pointed out they were in breach of their charter by not having regular meetings with PISA they removed the requirement to have regular meetings with PISA from the charter - sorted!

Which all goes to prove they do listen to what people say.......when it suits them :D

Norwoodguy
17-11-2008, 02:12 PM
Truly staggering. I firmly believe that club like CPFC should be community based and actively encourage effective communication with the fans.

When we were in admin, the bond between the players and the fans was awesome - its tragic that matters should have to get that bad before club hirearchy understand that the fans (even the illinformed or misguided ones) want whats best for the club they have supported since they can remember.

Its a sad indictment of the modern football clubs and how they are run......I hoped for better tbh.........

Louis
05-01-2009, 02:12 AM
From the minutes of PISA's meeting with the club on 2nd December 2008:

http://www.palace-isa.co.uk/news.shtml#newsitemEkkAEEVuVVibVZeoVK

"KEY POINTS FROM MEETING WITH THE CLUB � DECEMBER 2008

Correspondence - Apologies from club re failure to respond to Tony Matthews correspondence re ticketing � will reply. Letters should be answered in 14 days. Writers requested to address to appropriate manager noted in Fans� Charter. If no response or unsatisfactory, should go to customer service headed by Kevin Watts"

(As referred to by BBD in his thread 'Questions & Comments For the Club' http://forums.cpfc.org/showthread.php?t=177836)

Have you had a reply now, Tony?

Tony
05-01-2009, 10:49 AM
I have now had a letter in response. It's fairly long, and I've been a bit busy and haven't had time to go through it all yet, I will try to get the contents on here tonight.

Briefly, the club disputes that it's among the most expensive, although they do seem open to more ideas. They also reckon many of the ideas have already been introduced.

Apologies for not having posted it yet, I'll have to type it out and see what everyone thinks. I'll try to do it tonight if I can.

Maz
05-01-2009, 11:09 AM
I have now had a letter in response. It's fairly long, and I've been a bit busy and haven't had time to go through it all yet, I will try to get the contents on here tonight.

Briefly, the club disputes that it's among the most expensive, although they do seem open to more ideas. They also reckon many of the ideas have already been introduced.

Apologies for not having posted it yet, I'll have to type it out and see what everyone thinks. I'll try to do it tonight if I can.Before you publish it on the internet, it might be worth checking with the club that they don't mind you doing so.

(They are hardly likely to object, but it's a bit chicken and egg : if we want the Club to respond on a personal level to every letter then we have to ensure that we treat such correspondence as personal, otherwise they will not bother to reply with a personal letter. As it were.)

kolinkins
05-01-2009, 11:13 AM
A summary may be better, given Maz's post.

Great effort Tony.

The club do seem to open to more ideas and have been a lot more active in this area since Warnock got his feet under the table. I am sure he has a big influence in this area - he is old school - a club man.

Tony
05-01-2009, 12:29 PM
Fair point, I'll probably summarise the key points. I'll do my best to do it tonight.

Louis
05-01-2009, 01:39 PM
I have now had a letter in response.

Great stuff! :p

Looking forward to hearing more ...

Tony
05-01-2009, 11:36 PM
The club has responded to the letter I sent, which in the end had about 60 signatures on it. The response came from Kevin Watts, the commercial director, with an apology for the delay in responding and thanks for feedback. I’ve summarised it here with the key points. I think it's fair enough for me to post this here as I'm sure CPFC would like fans to know what initiatives it is taking and I don't believe I'm betraying any confidences.

The main points are that Palace don’t agree that they are one of the most expensive clubs and reckon that, in comparison to clubs we’re visiting, current prices are equal or better.

Kevin says the club have not increased matchday prices for the last four years and again states that CPFC wants to reward the most loyal supporters (i.e. season ticket holders).

In the last six months, the club has:

introduced family tickets for all matches 'whereby two under 16s can watch for £1 each'
introduced a student concession rate
offered kids for a quid promotions at numerous matches
bundled two, three and five game packs together

The club also works with organisations such as schools and local authorities to try to attract new support and says one such scheme ‘the schoolbook challenge’ in conjunction with Croydon Council raised more than £15,000 for schoolbooks while bringing in more than 6000 new supporters a season to Selhurst Park.

Kevin says that ‘simply making a sweeping cut on match prices does not actively increase attendances’. He also says that while the club is pursuing promotional activities it’s vital that this doesn’t erode existing income.

He says that ‘early bird season’ tickets are an excellent incentive to purchase season tickets early and believes the scheme is popular with fans.

He says the club will look at developing further a scheme offering discounted season tickets to help existing fans encourage lapsed family and friends to return to the fold and that a possible “Twenty Thousand Club” might be a good way to encourage committed supporters to help recruit new fans.

BringBackSasa
05-01-2009, 11:52 PM
Kevin says the club have not increased matchday prices for the last four years...

That's awfully nice of them, considering that 4 years ago we were in the premier league.

BlazeRIP
05-01-2009, 11:57 PM
They went up for promotion but didn't go down after relegation did they?.

Dorking .Eagle
06-01-2009, 08:09 AM
introduced family tickets for all matches 'whereby two under 16s can watch for £1 each' .

But only if you buy two adult tickets at the same time. No good for 1 adult + 1 child. Not all families have 2 adults that want to go to Palace.




bundled two, three and five game packs together .

Consecutive games though. Although the discounts are good, it is very prescriptive about which games are included, at a time when there are still literally 10k empty seats each game.



Kevin says that ‘simply making a sweeping cut on match prices does not actively increase attendances’.

Exactly! If the club did more marketing in conjuction with special offers, a-la-Charlton three or four seasons ago, we might actually get substantial numbers attending our games. On the subject of Charlton, their crowds are really dropping - what are we doing to win these casual fans who are just stopping going to the Valley?



He says that ‘early bird season’ tickets are an excellent incentive to purchase season tickets early and believes the scheme is popular with fans. .

People are motivated by the later price hikes to buy season tickets as early as they can aford to. I'm not entirely sure being cajoled into renewing your season ticket each November is 'popular', merely economic common sense.


He says the club will look at developing further a scheme offering discounted season tickets to help existing fans encourage lapsed family and friends to return to the fold and that a possible “Twenty Thousand Club” might be a good way to encourage committed supporters to help recruit new fans.

A positive end to their letter. Although to be fair they are already quite persistent in trying to get lapsed S/T holders to return by offering special deals.

Dave
06-01-2009, 08:23 AM
there is a certain amount of irony in Kevin Watts talking about ticketing policy

thereichstuff
06-01-2009, 08:31 AM
I can see both sides points of view , but we have had cheap games before and the attendences were not much improved . People simply get out of the habit of going and only come back for really big games . I always get my season ticket in dec , i try to get to every home game and it saves me alot of money even if i miss games . With monthly installments it is affordable to most people ! The fa replay is £15 & £5 so if you want to go it is affordable , lets see who goes ?

sw16girl
06-01-2009, 09:00 AM
While the letter certainly contains some positives it rather ignores the elephant in the room by claiming that we are not one of the most expensive clubs for everything except erly bird discount tickets. We are one of the more expensive clubs - a quick review of other clubs websites (rather than relying on the away ticket price which is very rarely the cheapest ticket)shows that we are. Birmingham - who were one of the other more expensive clubs have announced 10% reductions on this years prices and 0% finance on their ST's for next year.

As for saying cheaper tickets across the board will not bring in more spectators - how would they know - they have never done it consistantly and for a sustained period

racehorse-80s
06-01-2009, 09:15 AM
Palace have caused the problem by pricing casual fans away and now realise it's virtually impossible to get the lost fans back overnight if at all.
Even when palace play well and push for promotion the crowds are only a few thousand up at most on average, in the 70s Tens of thousands of casual fans would turn up if palace where playing well bringing in much needed revenue
The only way to increase the future fan base now is to concentrate on building up a following of new young fans from the local boroughs by offering under 21s tickets for £5-10 pounds longterm .

Tony Montana
06-01-2009, 09:58 AM
Or to push our name around Croydon a bit more. This means letting high street sports chains sell our shirts and merchendise.

917L
06-01-2009, 10:03 AM
to reward the most loyal supporters (i.e. season ticket holders).

He says the club will look at developing further a scheme offering discounted season tickets to help existing fans encourage lapsed family and friends to return to the fold and that a possible “Twenty Thousand Club” might be a good way to encourage committed supporters to help recruit new fans.

I've had a season ticket for the last 20 odd years

I have always renewed at the lowest price possible, until this seaon before December 31st of the previous year.

This season they moved the date back a month and have made no contact with me whatsoever about renewal either before or since

No letter, no phone call, no E Mail to either myself or my son who has had a S/T for the last 10 years

I still havent renewed as yet

I doubt anyone at the club can spell marketing let alone know anything about it

gallery sex god
06-01-2009, 10:34 AM
There never seem to be any deals for season ticket holders to occassionally bring kids for a cheap price. If I could bring one, two or three kids for a fiver each I would. I wouldnt mind sitting in a seat that wasnt my normal season ticket seat. Im all for non season ticket holders being able to buy a match ticket and add a small amount on for a child (ren) surely they could do it for the hard core supporters too:confused:

thereichstuff
06-01-2009, 10:36 AM
I've had a season ticket for the last 20 odd years

I have always renewed at the lowest price possible, until this seaon before December 31st of the previous year.

This season they moved the date back a month and have made no contact with me whatsoever about renewal either before or since

No letter, no phone call, no E Mail to either myself or my son who has had a S/T for the last 10 years

I still havent renewed as yet

I doubt anyone at the club can spell marketing let alone know anything about it I received a call but others in our clan didnt . Idont think they contact everyone . I didnt need contact to renew i just did .

917L
06-01-2009, 10:40 AM
I received a call but others in our clan didnt . Idont think they contact everyone . I didnt need contact to renew i just did .

I dont need them to contact me to renew

However, I dont buy a programme, and had no idea until week befoer that the lowest price point had been moved forward a month nor have I been told by the club what the new seaons prices are...

Yes I can find out, but they are supoposed to be selling me somnething you'd think they may make just the slightest effort to ensure I was au fait with the new timeline and prices, wouldnt you?

ee-ay-ee-ay-ee-ay-o
06-01-2009, 01:55 PM
I got a call about 3 months ago to renew my Long term ST ..I was more than happy to extend and wanted to do so but...I was in a meeting and busy. Could she call back I asked...yes she could & would...

And as Diana Ross sang; "...and I'm still waiting"

Ian Hart
06-01-2009, 02:36 PM
I dont need them to contact me to renew

However, I dont buy a programme, and had no idea until week befoer that the lowest price point had been moved forward a month nor have I been told by the club what the new seaons prices are...

Yes I can find out, but they are supoposed to be selling me somnething you'd think they may make just the slightest effort to ensure I was au fait with the new timeline and prices, wouldnt you?

I do agree with your comments. There are a group of 5 of us who have season tickets, although it's rare that all 5 of us attend. None of us regularly buy programmes, but even if we did the onus is surely on the club to ensure we got the message.

As it was, I was the only one who received a call, just a few days before the end of November. I just assumed the others had been contacted too, so didn't say anything until I met a couple of them at the next match, and was surprised to heare they knew nothing about it. They and I renewed, but the other two have not done so, and have still not received a call.

It's a very odd marketing strategy.

Louis
06-01-2009, 10:28 PM
The club has responded to the letter I sent, which in the end had about 60 signatures on it. The response came from Kevin Watts, the commercial director, with an apology for the delay in responding and thanks for feedback. I’ve summarised it here with the key points. I think it's fair enough for me to post this here as I'm sure CPFC would like fans to know what initiatives it is taking and I don't believe I'm betraying any confidences.

The main points are that Palace don’t agree that they are one of the most expensive clubs and reckon that, in comparison to clubs we’re visiting, current prices are equal or better.

Kevin says the club have not increased matchday prices for the last four years and again states that CPFC wants to reward the most loyal supporters (i.e. season ticket holders).

In the last six months, the club has:

introduced family tickets for all matches 'whereby two under 16s can watch for £1 each'
introduced a student concession rate
offered kids for a quid promotions at numerous matches
bundled two, three and five game packs together

The club also works with organisations such as schools and local authorities to try to attract new support and says one such scheme ‘the schoolbook challenge’ in conjunction with Croydon Council raised more than £15,000 for schoolbooks while bringing in more than 6000 new supporters a season to Selhurst Park.

Kevin says that ‘simply making a sweeping cut on match prices does not actively increase attendances’. He also says that while the club is pursuing promotional activities it’s vital that this doesn’t erode existing income.

He says that ‘early bird season’ tickets are an excellent incentive to purchase season tickets early and believes the scheme is popular with fans.

He says the club will look at developing further a scheme offering discounted season tickets to help existing fans encourage lapsed family and friends to return to the fold and that a possible “Twenty Thousand Club” might be a good way to encourage committed supporters to help recruit new fans.

Did he actually give a reason for the failure to respond to your various letters?

jhc
16-04-2009, 10:12 AM
Our average home attendance this season has been 14,881 - so far.
With the season ticket no shows, in reality it is a lot lower than that.

Unless we get pretty big crowds for our last two home games, that figure will be the lowest average in the last 20 seasons. Let's not let this happen.
With U16's just £1 again on saturday, let's, at least, try and end the season with a bit of a flourish.

Tony
16-04-2009, 10:58 AM
I don't know about the Derby game, but Sheffield United will no doubt bring a lot of extra fans with them and the club is compensating Arthur Wait season ticket holders, such as myself, for being moved out of our seats by offering us guest tickets, which we will endeavour to use.

The Christmas match against Norwich is the only occasion this season when we've had a home gate above 17,000. Although hopefully the final match may improve on that (although it's not much consolation that most of them will be visiting supporters) it is still a lamentable record.

I think most of us believe that our attendances (because of season ticket no shows) are actually smaller than published, it certainly feels that way. Whether that is correct or not, it is clear that palace has a huge problem.

The club is making a belated attempt to woo more fans with kids for a quid offers, but it's not helped by the team having little to play for this season, a situation that has been apparent to most of us more or less since that Norwich game (after which we added McCarthy to the loss of Watson and Beattie).

I still believe that attendances could be massively improved, although it is not something that can be achieved without time and hard work.

The problem is with the club itself, CPFC only has itself to blame for fans walking away in such large numbers. There's no imagination or energy there, everything just plods along... our ticketing, marketing, merchandising and customer service are dreadful. We can only hope that we get new owners soon and that the people who come in, whoever they are, not only have money to invest but just as vitally bring some fresh ideas with them.

Barbara4003
16-04-2009, 11:02 AM
Thank you for trying to do something about it :)

Terrace Bickle
16-04-2009, 11:22 AM
I'm afraid that if players wages do not come down to more 'reasonable' levels enabling casual fans to attend for between the £16 - £20 mark then football outside the Premiership will continue to suffer a slow death.

5 years ago I couldn't have conceived not attending games on a Saturday, I held a season ticket for 15 or more years previously and had been attending since I was 5 years old. I also envisaged taking my child(ren) when the time came.

Unfortunately I cannot ever see me attending games again, unless there is a sea change. If Palace can't get people like me back through the gate, then I don't fancy their chances long term.

Lord Flange
16-04-2009, 11:26 AM
I'm afraid that if players wages do not come down to more 'reasonable' levels enabling casual fans to attend for between the £16 - £20 mark then football outside the Premiership will continue to suffer a slow death.

5 years ago I couldn't have conceived not attending games on a Saturday, I held a season ticket for 15 or more years previously and had been attending since I was 5 years old. I also envisaged taking my child(ren) when the time came.

Unfortunately I cannot ever see me attending games again, unless there is a sea change. If Palace can't get people like me back through the gate, then I don't fancy their chances long term.

ditto to all that

Braders
16-04-2009, 11:49 AM
I'm afraid that if players wages do not come down to more 'reasonable' levels enabling casual fans to attend for between the £16 - £20 mark then football outside the Premiership will continue to suffer a slow death.

5 years ago I couldn't have conceived not attending games on a Saturday, I held a season ticket for 15 or more years previously and had been attending since I was 5 years old. I also envisaged taking my child(ren) when the time came.

Unfortunately I cannot ever see me attending games again, unless there is a sea change. If Palace can't get people like me back through the gate, then I don't fancy their chances long term.

Great post and sums up my thoughts exactly!

Tony
16-04-2009, 01:58 PM
I think we did what we could to try to raise awareness of our concerns, but it is the club's problem (although ultimately we'll all feel the consequences). Unfortunately communications between Palace and the supporters are poor and that's something only CPFC can change.

A large number of good ideas have been put forward by fans (some workable, others perhaps not), but ultimately it is up to CPFC to get people through the door and make those who follow Palace feel valued and part of something that's more than just a casual Saturday visit. I believe it can be done but, sadly, I don't believe there is the will (and perhaps not the ability) on the part of the club to achieve it.

To borrow a lame phrase, we could do with a kind of "Fans' Tsar", someone at the club who is not only in regular communication with supporters, but who has the necessary power to make things happen. Instead, it seems that the fans almost tread on eggshells trying to explain to the club what we feel and want. Too many seem to just accept that "this is Palace, what do you expect?" and, on the flip side, when crowds decline and no-one buys the merchandise there's almost a feeling that the club is getting what it deserves for being so hopeless.

This is kind of difficult to explain (I hope I'm not going to stray into pretentiousness), but many Palace fans have a clearly defined sense of what the club should be and how they identify with it. Within this, there are many different strands - some have a very traditional view, others fancy the club as a rebellion against corporate football, there's that oft-mentioned "family feel", while others might consider themselves a little bit "street". There's a lot of potential to work with, but running through it all is a sense of community and a belief that Palace should have a very distinctive style.

Most of us, I suspect, want to identify with what we see as "a touch of class". The fans have long done this for themselves through the fanzines, the BBS, the Holmesdale fanatics, the noisy quality of the away support etc. In those terms no club in the country can touch us, anyone would feel proud of the BBS, Eagle Eye or the Echo, or those flags in the Holmesdale. But when it comes to what the club itself does, well... "class" is hardly the word most of us would use.

If you read this website for even a short length of time, you'd soon get a pretty fair idea of what the club means to many fans. Sadly, CPFC has never managed to to tap into these aspirations or that sense of identity. In fact, I seriously doubt that those running the club have any idea that such things exist. CPFC really needs someone who can get to grips with this and say: "This club is going to look a certain way, behave in a certain way, do things with a certain style that we know our fans will like and that others will be attracted to."

This needs real imagination, but for a club like ours, facing an uphill battle to compete against the money of Chelsea in particular, but other attractions too, it could be a major selling point. If you don't like what Chelsea are offering, and there must be many peope who don't, then Palace should be the club offering something completely different - not just an impoverished version of the same thing, but something that stands against all that Chelsea, as the prime example, has become. In the minds of many of us, that's what we already are, but CPFC doesn't seem to realise that and would do well to reflect on it and try to build on it.

From relatively minor things like kit designs (that BBS kit thread was a self-contained lesson in what Palace fans think and want) to the merchandising, through to more fundamental aspects such as the way people are treated in the ground, catering, facilities, ticket prices, marketing and the image that the club presents to its local community, there is real potential but it just feels that the club has no idea and isn't bothered.

We'll all go to the Derby game and it will be the same old tat with no buzz or sense of energy. Even for the most passionate of us, it will be difficult not to feel worn down by the feeling of decline all around.

Crystal Palace FC is a nationally recognised brand, but those running OUR club seem to behave as if they're in charge of Trotters Independent Trading Co. The club needs a massive re-think. We need somebody to get to grips with the idea that, whether you're male or female, 21 or 71, or seven years-old and going to your first game, it should always feel like is that you're going to an event (and I don't mean a sale of oversized shorts in a cardboard box and people on stilts) and that you are part of something.

Ticket prices have to be affordable and, obviously, a reasonably successful or at least encouragingly developing team is essential. But beyond that, going to Palace has to be something that you WANT to invest your precious time in.

Jack Regan
16-04-2009, 02:30 PM
I think we did what we could to try to raise awareness of our concerns, but it is the club's problem (although ultimately we'll all feel the consequences). Unfortunately communications between Palace and the supporters are poor and that's something only CPFC can change.

A large number of good ideas have been put forward by fans (some workable, others perhaps not), but ultimately it is up to CPFC to get people through the door and make those who follow Palace feel valued and part of something that's more than just a casual Saturday visit. I believe it can be done but, sadly, I don't believe there is the will (and perhaps not the ability) on the part of the club to achieve it.

To borrow a lame phrase, we could do with a kind of "Fans' Tsar", someone at the club who is not only in regular communication with supporters, but who has the necessary power to make things happen. Instead, it seems that the fans almost tread on eggshells trying to explain to the club what we feel and want. Too many seem to just accept that "this is Palace, what do you expect?" and, on the flip side, when crowds decline and no-one buys the merchandise there's almost a feeling that the club is getting what it deserves for being so hopeless.

This is kind of difficult to explain (I hope I'm not going to stray into pretentiousness), but many Palace fans have a clearly defined sense of what the club should be and how they identify with it. Within this, there are many different strands - some have a very traditional view, others fancy the club as a rebellion against corporate football, there's that oft-mentioned "family feel", while others might consider themselves a little bit "street". There's a lot of potential to work with, but running through it all is a sense of community and a belief that Palace should have a very distinctive style.

Most of us, I suspect, want to identify with what we see as "a touch of class". The fans have long done this for themselves through the fanzines, the BBS, the Holmesdale fanatics, the noisy quality of the away support etc. In those terms no club in the country can touch us, anyone would feel proud of the BBS, Eagle Eye or the Echo, or those flags in the Holmesdale. But when it comes to what the club itself does, well... "class" is hardly the word most of us would use.

If you read this website for even a short length of time, you'd soon get a pretty fair idea of what the club means to many fans. Sadly, CPFC has never managed to to tap into these aspirations or that sense of identity. In fact, I seriously doubt that those running the club have any idea that such things exist. CPFC really needs someone who can get to grips with this and say: "This club is going to look a certain way, behave in a certain way, do things with a certain style that we know our fans will like and that others will be attracted to."

This needs real imagination, but for a club like ours, facing an uphill battle to compete against the money of Chelsea in particular, but other attractions too, it could be a major selling point. If you don't like what Chelsea are offering, and there must be many peope who don't, then Palace should be the club offering something completely different - not just an impoverished version of the same thing, but something that stands against all that Chelsea, as the prime example, has become. In the minds of many of us, that's what we already are, but CPFC doesn't seem to realise that and would do well to reflect on it and try to build on it.

From relatively minor things like kit designs (that BBS kit thread was a self-contained lesson in what Palace fans think and want) to the merchandising, through to more fundamental aspects such as the way people are treated in the ground, catering, facilities, ticket prices, marketing and the image that the club presents to its local community, there is real potential but it just feels that the club has no idea and isn't bothered.

We'll all go to the Derby game and it will be the same old tat with no buzz or sense of energy. Even for the most passionate of us, it will be difficult not to feel worn down by the feeling of decline all around.

Crystal Palace FC is a nationally recognised brand, but those running OUR club seem to behave as if they're in charge of Trotters Independent Trading Co. The club needs a massive re-think. We need somebody to get to grips with the idea that, whether you're male or female, 21 or 71, or seven years-old and going to your first game, it should always feel like is that you're going to an event (and I don't mean a sale of oversized shorts in a cardboard box and people on stilts) and that you are part of something.

Ticket prices have to be affordable and, obviously, a reasonably successful or at least encouragingly developing team is essential. But beyond that, going to Palace has to be something that you WANT to invest your precious time in.

Post of the Year.

I sometimes wonder if the people running Palace are Palace fans at all or is it just a job to them. Palace's idea of connecting with the fans it to hear a few hooligans chanting "Who Are Ya" at the away fans, and somehow think that'll translate well onto a T-shirt.

You Tony, amongst many others (notable Dorking Eagle) have invested a lot of time in trying to let the club know what the fans want, to little avail. You must feel like you're banging your head against a brick wall.

At the end of the day, if they won't listen, there's only one thing that does talk.

Bartman
16-04-2009, 02:46 PM
Maybe we should sell tickets along the budget airlines route. The first bunch of people that buy them get them for a fiver - up to a maximum of £30 on the day.

Maybe we could also do a "free after half time" experiment and see what happens.

aaronmax
16-04-2009, 02:49 PM
I think we did what we could to try to raise awareness of our concerns, but it is the club's problem (although ultimately we'll all feel the consequences). Unfortunately communications between Palace and the supporters are poor and that's something only CPFC can change.

A large number of good ideas have been put forward by fans (some workable, others perhaps not), but ultimately it is up to CPFC to get people through the door and make those who follow Palace feel valued and part of something that's more than just a casual Saturday visit. I believe it can be done but, sadly, I don't believe there is the will (and perhaps not the ability) on the part of the club to achieve it.

To borrow a lame phrase, we could do with a kind of "Fans' Tsar", someone at the club who is not only in regular communication with supporters, but who has the necessary power to make things happen. Instead, it seems that the fans almost tread on eggshells trying to explain to the club what we feel and want. Too many seem to just accept that "this is Palace, what do you expect?" and, on the flip side, when crowds decline and no-one buys the merchandise there's almost a feeling that the club is getting what it deserves for being so hopeless.

This is kind of difficult to explain (I hope I'm not going to stray into pretentiousness), but many Palace fans have a clearly defined sense of what the club should be and how they identify with it. Within this, there are many different strands - some have a very traditional view, others fancy the club as a rebellion against corporate football, there's that oft-mentioned "family feel", while others might consider themselves a little bit "street". There's a lot of potential to work with, but running through it all is a sense of community and a belief that Palace should have a very distinctive style.

Most of us, I suspect, want to identify with what we see as "a touch of class". The fans have long done this for themselves through the fanzines, the BBS, the Holmesdale fanatics, the noisy quality of the away support etc. In those terms no club in the country can touch us, anyone would feel proud of the BBS, Eagle Eye or the Echo, or those flags in the Holmesdale. But when it comes to what the club itself does, well... "class" is hardly the word most of us would use.

If you read this website for even a short length of time, you'd soon get a pretty fair idea of what the club means to many fans. Sadly, CPFC has never managed to to tap into these aspirations or that sense of identity. In fact, I seriously doubt that those running the club have any idea that such things exist. CPFC really needs someone who can get to grips with this and say: "This club is going to look a certain way, behave in a certain way, do things with a certain style that we know our fans will like and that others will be attracted to."

This needs real imagination, but for a club like ours, facing an uphill battle to compete against the money of Chelsea in particular, but other attractions too, it could be a major selling point. If you don't like what Chelsea are offering, and there must be many peope who don't, then Palace should be the club offering something completely different - not just an impoverished version of the same thing, but something that stands against all that Chelsea, as the prime example, has become. In the minds of many of us, that's what we already are, but CPFC doesn't seem to realise that and would do well to reflect on it and try to build on it.

From relatively minor things like kit designs (that BBS kit thread was a self-contained lesson in what Palace fans think and want) to the merchandising, through to more fundamental aspects such as the way people are treated in the ground, catering, facilities, ticket prices, marketing and the image that the club presents to its local community, there is real potential but it just feels that the club has no idea and isn't bothered.

We'll all go to the Derby game and it will be the same old tat with no buzz or sense of energy. Even for the most passionate of us, it will be difficult not to feel worn down by the feeling of decline all around.

Crystal Palace FC is a nationally recognised brand, but those running OUR club seem to behave as if they're in charge of Trotters Independent Trading Co. The club needs a massive re-think. We need somebody to get to grips with the idea that, whether you're male or female, 21 or 71, or seven years-old and going to your first game, it should always feel like is that you're going to an event (and I don't mean a sale of oversized shorts in a cardboard box and people on stilts) and that you are part of something.

Ticket prices have to be affordable and, obviously, a reasonably successful or at least encouragingly developing team is essential. But beyond that, going to Palace has to be something that you WANT to invest your precious time in.


Such a good post that I've sent it to a guy who works at the club who may be in a position to take notice, he'll certainly pass it on. Not that I'll hold my breath, or see any change for 5 years but the post is worthy of attention at least.

jhc
16-04-2009, 05:27 PM
Maybe we should sell tickets along the budget airlines route. The first bunch of people that buy them get them for a fiver - up to a maximum of £30 on the day.

The club already have a similar scheme to this. They call them..........Season Tickets!;)

Whyteleafe_Sage
17-04-2009, 12:50 AM
I love Palace - always have and always will - but I do wish we'd show a little more class from time to time. Tony's post really hits the nail on the head for me.

On the pitch, we're bringing youngsters in and that for me is The Palace Way, but we do need to develop them along more purist principles than we've seen for much of this season if we're not going to waste the current crop of youngsters coming through. Whether NW is the man to achieve that I don't know - possibly not, as this needs to be a long term development plan.

Off the pitch we really need to sharpen up our marketing efforts and I hope that the deal with Nike might be a step in the right direction. We do need to promote the Palace brand, but do it with a bit of style, to be a low budget version of Arsenal, if you like...

PeterH
17-04-2009, 02:23 AM
TPT

Tony
29-09-2009, 09:04 AM
Apologies, I've bumped this thread as I feel that this is a vital part of the positive ideas we're trying to put forward to help Palace (such as the scarves for Blackpool idea).

We must be close to the point when the club is preparing it's season ticket plans for next season. I know we've already had a massive discussion on this thread, but please have a look through it again.

I'm thinking of trying to contact the club again about this, but we may need to employ a different tack.

Also if you haven't already done so, please vote in the poll

LiamCPFC
29-09-2009, 09:22 AM
Apologies, I've bumped this thread as I feel that this is a vital part of the positive ideas we're trying to put forward to help Palace (such as the scarves for Blackpool idea).

We must be close to the point when the club is preparing it's season ticket plans for next season. I know we've already had a massive discussion on this thread, but please have a look through it again.

I'm thinking of trying to contact the club again about this, but we may need to employ a different tack.

Also if you haven't already done so, please vote in the poll


Tony, just to let you know, I had an interview in the ticket office for a job a week or two back and Mandy (ticket office manager) was telling me how I'd be involved in season tickets for next season relatively soon if I took the job so it is definitely something they are looking at at the moment. :p

cockles
29-09-2009, 09:57 AM
Fantastic thread, and is indeed a tragedy if the club do not tap into this 'free consultancy'.

I love the idea that Palace draw a line in the sand to state, this is what we are!

I agree there must be loads around who want football in an honest format.

Someone mentioned we should really provide a distinct option to Chelsea, not a weaker form of the same model. When I think of the 'qualities' of Chelsea, and think of 1. Greed, 2. Cheating and still... 3. Racism.

Crystal Palace does not and never has to my memory came near to being accused of any of these. The club should be proud of what we are, and basically market that. We are a club properly representative of the area & don't think I've ever heard a racist chant by Palace fans.

Lower ticket prices would have many benefits, but the perception of being an antithesis of Chelsea is probably the most important. Besides, in business terms, getting people into your outlet is surely the most important - look at Ikea for instance (bizarrely I expect a Saturday afternoon competitor for Palace and many clubs...). Getting people in has to be the base for everything, including finding a buyer for the club. Proper refreshment and merchandising in all parts of the ground can follow closely behind - but that needs the economies of scale that only 'bums on seats' can provide.

A simple message for Mr Jordan is:

* Lower ticket prices
* Publicise these prices, and who and what Palace is about.

Tony
29-09-2009, 10:36 AM
One thing I'm thinking of doing is an approximate comparison of how Charlton's (sorry to mention them again) ticket model works compared to ours.

We'll need to take an average attaendance figure, make some assumptions on who attends and where, but it would be very interesting to try to work out whether their larger crowd at lower prices works better than our smaller-crowd-higher-price model.

Does anyone have approximate ideas of numbers in each of our stands and also ideas about current season ticket numbers, proportion of under 16 and over 60s? If we had some rough idea we might be able to get a closer idea of what kind of figures we're talking about.

ChickenDipper
29-09-2009, 10:38 AM
Why don't people make more of an effort to bring people to the game. If people actually wanted to make more of an effort, why don't we get the usual 12000 or so people to go home, recommend to about 5 friends each, and in hope that 1 out of every 5 people take you up on that offer. Therefore, doubling the crowd by doing so. Obviously there are flaws in this as there are children, but the parents that take those children can always ask friends and families of those children?

I think that if people make more of an effort to go along side the letters taht are being sent then the attendance will hopefully be increased, therefore allowing all of thee points highlighted in the letters to be achieved.

CPFC_R_GREAT
29-09-2009, 10:51 AM
[QUOTE=ChickenDipper]Obviously there are flaws in this as there are children, but the parents that take those children can always ask friends and families of those children?
QUOTE]

As long as they're registered child minders ;) :p

ChickenDipper
29-09-2009, 11:10 AM
goes without saying, but since u said . . .

delboy01
29-09-2009, 11:13 AM
I think one issue with reducing prices across the board is that you cant charge away fans more than home.

Therefore this could be targeted at games where the away support would be below a certain level. That way revenue would be increased by the additional attendees at those games.

What that level is, I have no idea!!!

Harry Holmesdale
29-09-2009, 11:44 AM
So far this season mates of mine have managed to acquire 'charity' tickets to 4 of the 9 home games at a cost of a tenner each!

If Palace are giving an amount of tickets out to charities surely they could also reduce prices for these home games to all fans and publish the fact too, these games always see the Arthur Wait or the Main Stand numbers swell, then programme sales, burger and beers too

Tony
29-09-2009, 11:54 AM
That's an interesting point as well. We want to encourage more fans to attend, but at the same time the club needs to make money. Heavily discounted prices and even freebies are fine to stimulate interest, but they shouldn't become the main method of boosting feeble attendances.

Son of Selhurst
29-09-2009, 11:57 AM
My mate took his wife and two kids to QPR for £20 total on Saturday, to see them thump Barnsley 5-2 in a cracking game.

Attendance at Loftus Rd with this special offer - 12025 in a 19,100 capacity stadium

Attendance v Peterbrough without the offer - 11814 - not much difference

I stopped going to Selhurst Park mainly because I just don't feel welcome there anymore. You're made to feel like a criminal, you're ot allowed to enjoy yourself, and the facilities are appalling.

palacelad1970
29-09-2009, 12:16 PM
looks like they listening :veryangry

Tuesday 29th September 2009
Coca-Cola Championship
Crystal Palace v Sheffield Wednesday
Kick-Off 8.00pm

Lower Holmesdale/Croydon Advertiser/Family J & Arthur Wait Stand

Adult £24.50
Concession £14.50
Student (Valid NUS U24yrs) £14.50

midweek game nearly £25

Harry Holmesdale
29-09-2009, 12:36 PM
That's an interesting point as well. We want to encourage more fans to attend, but at the same time the club needs to make money. Heavily discounted prices and even freebies are fine to stimulate interest, but they shouldn't become the main method of boosting feeble attendances.

For a few that I know this is the only way they will attend, and these people are ex-season ticket holders of 10-20 years, they have other issues that stop them attending but refuse to pay £25 to watch Palace play Blackpool

Baldy
29-09-2009, 12:37 PM
looks like they listening :veryangry

Tuesday 29th September 2009
Coca-Cola Championship
Crystal Palace v Sheffield Wednesday
Kick-Off 8.00pm

Lower Holmesdale/Croydon Advertiser/Family J & Arthur Wait Stand

Adult £24.50
Concession £14.50
Student (Valid NUS U24yrs) £14.50

midweek game nearly £25

Ok, so we had cheap tickets for the Man City game against top Premier opposition. How many bothered turning up for that ? If tickets were free I doubt we would see many more people making the effort.

sheepy
29-09-2009, 01:10 PM
Ok, so we had cheap tickets for the Man City game against top Premier opposition. How many bothered turning up for that ? If tickets were free I doubt we would see many more people making the effort.

Its not a short term fix. The high prices have alienated many fans from coming. Dropping them may not have a major affect in the short term but over the course of the season and following on into future seasons it would start to rectify the damage that's been done.

Certainly the club cannot continue losing supporters and needs to find a way to prevent the trend of falling attendances that are <b>not</b> linked to success on the pitch.

kettle
29-09-2009, 01:12 PM
great letter, pm sent with my thoughts. Two ideas, AW is never full, so how about walk up prices for 1-2 blocks of the Holmesdale.
£20 on a Saturday, £15 on a weekday for adults.
£15 concessions on a Saturday, £10 on a weekday.
Obviously we will need to look at where to put this block, but would suggest the 1 next to the family block would be ideal.
Really hope Tony's letter gets the response it deserves.
Also agree with the sentiment that kids for a quid, is OK occasionally, but can't be seen as a long term step.

Harry Holmesdale
29-09-2009, 01:30 PM
Ok, so we had cheap tickets for the Man City game against top Premier opposition. How many bothered turning up for that ? If tickets were free I doubt we would see many more people making the effort.

Almost 15k for a game live on Sky with only a handful of City fans aint bad really

Consistent and gimmick free pricing is the key

ugly and fat
29-09-2009, 03:57 PM
So far this season mates of mine have managed to acquire 'charity' tickets to 4 of the 9 home games at a cost of a tenner each!

If Palace are giving an amount of tickets out to charities surely they could also reduce prices for these home games to all fans and publish the fact too, these games always see the Arthur Wait or the Main Stand numbers swell, then programme sales, burger and beers too


before i was lucky enough to be able to afford a s/tkt,charity tickets was regular way of me getting tickets (i also got tickets from my youngsters school)...

since i have had a s/tkt,there have been games where,if i hadnt had the s/tkt i simply WOULDNT have gone because of the pricing policy...


recently i have been going to Fulham's european games,and have noted their pricing policy for those games;they sell the first 5,000 seats at a set price (£5?);then the next 5,000 at a different price (£10),then the remainder at £15

is there anyway this could work for a league game?