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Eric the Ginga
15-11-2004, 09:43 AM
Plenty of threads re who we should buy, but I guess our wage bill won't take too many more players. So who should we offload to make room. For what it's worth here's my selection.
1. Kaviedes (He comes from Ecuador, he's never gonna score). Seen enough already, not a hope in the Prem.
2. Speroni. Help!! Not enough of a presence.
3. Powell. (probably gone anyway)
4. Black. 1st Div player
5. Shipps. Won't cut it in the Prem.

I'll reserve judgement on Torghelle, I think there's potential...............

Thoughts??

davematt
15-11-2004, 09:51 AM
Originally posted by Eric the Ginga
Plenty of threads re who we should buy, but I guess our wage bill won't take too many more players. So who should we offload to make room. For what it's worth here's my selection.
1. Kaviedes (He comes from Ecuador, he's never gonna score). Seen enough already, not a hope in the Prem.
2. Speroni. Help!! Not enough of a presence.
3. Powell. (probably gone anyway)
4. Black. 1st Div player
5. Shipps. Won't cut it in the Prem.

I'll reserve judgement on Torghelle, I think there's potential...............

Thoughts??

Agree with all of them apart from Powell, especially if Sorondo takes a while to get back.

MasterYoda
15-11-2004, 10:07 AM
Having seen Powell and Hudson on Wednesday I know who looked better to me.

Palace Don
15-11-2004, 10:42 AM
Who?

Lion
15-11-2004, 10:55 AM
Originally posted by Eric the Ginga
Plenty of threads re who we should buy, but I guess our wage bill won't take too many more players. So who should we offload to make room. For what it's worth here's my selection.
1. Kaviedes (He comes from Ecuador, he's never gonna score). Seen enough already, not a hope in the Prem.
2. Speroni. Help!! Not enough of a presence.
3. Powell. (probably gone anyway)
4. Black. 1st Div player
5. Shipps. Won't cut it in the Prem.

I'll reserve judgement on Torghelle, I think there's potential...............

Thoughts??

1. How much have you seen on Kav?

He's on a season longs loan with a view of a perm move - there is a long way to go this season and people who have seen the reserve games have commented on his potential, why would we send someone back from a loan deal? We may not have a place for him in the 1st team squad at the moment but could come good if we need him later in the season.

2. Speroni has great potential. I am sick and tired of people knocking this guy - he needs time to develop as a player and is still young - We have a decent goal keeping coach and he will help develop the guy into one of the best keepers we have had, i'm sure of it. People should not expect players to come in and be perfect straight away, especially when they come on the cheap.

3. Probally heading to Reading, but could still do a job for Palace IMHO. Will be a shame to see him go.

4. Black - Agreed here, I think that Black is good, but he wants first team football and won't get that with Palace at the moment.

5. We should keep hold of Neil if he is prepared to be a bench player - he's had a few injuries and not up to match fitness at the moment, but he is a good squad player, and we may need a "big man" like him against some of the teams we will come across.

Personally, I don't feel we should be getting rid of players unless they want to leave - there needs to be completition for every place and it can only be healthy having a big squad.

brighton_eagle
15-11-2004, 10:57 AM
Originally posted by Eric the Ginga
Plenty of threads re who we should buy, but I guess our wage bill won't take too many more players. So who should we offload to make room. For what it's worth here's my selection.
1. Kaviedes (He comes from Ecuador, he's never gonna score). Seen enough already, not a hope in the Prem.
2. Speroni. Help!! Not enough of a presence.
3. Powell. (probably gone anyway)
4. Black. 1st Div player
5. Shipps. Won't cut it in the Prem.

I'll reserve judgement on Torghelle, I think there's potential...............

Thoughts??

Yes.

I think you are being a tad previous with a few of those.

Kaviedes - we don't know too much about still. Unfair to judge based on couple of brief sub appearances. If he worked his way into the team, and got a run, he could settle and still prove to be valuable to us.

Speroni - Had a bad run of form, confidence must be low, but is still young for a goalie and I have faith he wil turn it around.

Powell - Maybe he should go. I would like to see him get a chance before we write him off though.

Black - absolutely should go. Is so far from the first team now that is the only player of this selection that I actually expect to leave, possibly before the window since he won't be going to a Premier League side.

Shipps - Can offer us something up front, particularly later on in the season when things start getting tough and we need a presence with experience up front.

brighton_eagle
15-11-2004, 10:59 AM
Uncanny Lion, we seem to have said virtually the same thing.

Steve in Phoenix
15-11-2004, 11:01 AM
It would be silly to let Kaviedes and Speroni go.

Powell and Black I expect to be going.

Shipps maybe..

Jay_Palace
15-11-2004, 11:08 AM
Originally posted by Eric the Ginga
Plenty of threads re who we should buy, but I guess our wage bill won't take too many more players. So who should we offload to make room. For what it's worth here's my selection.
1. Kaviedes (He comes from Ecuador, he's never gonna score). Seen enough already, not a hope in the Prem.
2. Speroni. Help!! Not enough of a presence.
3. Powell. (probably gone anyway)
4. Black. 1st Div player
5. Shipps. Won't cut it in the Prem.

I'll reserve judgement on Torghelle, I think there's potential...............

Thoughts??

I would love to know how you are able to have formed a reasoned judgement on Mr Kaviedes, considering that he has only played a few games for the first team, cpoming on with 20 mins to spare.

The two however that I agree with, in your list, are Shipps and Black. I can't see either figuring in this team, and it would be best for their careers if the club moved them on.

Beanie
15-11-2004, 11:12 AM
What has Jan to do with departures? Do you seriously expect any player Palace don't want to go to another Premeiership side?

As for the suggested names - Kaviedes looks okay in the reserves, think it's more down to the strengths in the current side than his deficiencies that he isn't playing.

Speroni - who exactly do you see as back up to Gabor? Cronin? I can't see it yet. Speroni has shown in flashes both how good he can be and how bad. Leave him to Mike Kelly for a while yet.

Powell - We should hold onto him until we get somebody else permenant in that position, either Sorondo or somebody else.

Black - could well be, Shipps - sad but also true.

Could well be "one in one out" in the window though, not because of money, simply that the squad would be too big.

Lion
15-11-2004, 11:45 AM
Originally posted by brighton_eagle
Uncanny Lion, we seem to have said virtually the same thing.

Great minds think alike, etc.

KungFuCharlie
15-11-2004, 11:45 AM
It never ceases to amaze me how quickly some Palace fans are to stick the knife in.
Get rid of Speroni and Kaviedes? What a bloody stupid thing to say.

Tommy Pickle
15-11-2004, 11:52 AM
Originally posted by KungFuCharlie
It never ceases to amaze me how quickly some Palace fans are to stick the knife in.
Get rid of Speroni and Kaviedes? What a bloody stupid thing to say.

Agree. IMO Speroni's a bit dodgy, but we have only just signed him. Kav is on loan anyway and looks very exciting. I can't see what we would gain by letting either go.

SA Eagle
15-11-2004, 12:02 PM
Originally posted by Lion


2. Speroni has great potential. I am sick and tired of people knocking this guy - he needs time to develop as a player and is still young - We have a decent goal keeping coach and he will help develop the guy into one of the best keepers we have had, i'm sure of it. People should not expect players to come in and be perfect straight away, especially when they come on the cheap.


Speroni wasn't exactly cheap though, admittedly only based in comparison with our signings. I'd be tempted to let him go out on loan, to try and get some confidence. Although obviously that would be subject to us being able to get hold of an experienced keeper as back up to Kiraly for the rest of the season.

RDSdaEAGLE
15-11-2004, 12:18 PM
Mike Kelly asked Dowie to sign Speroni for a reason. He was class up in Scotland, and if the only thing he really lacks is confidence, then there's no way we'll offload him.

I think Darren Powell will be playing for Reading by the end of January. They need a couple of centre-backs and I don't think Darren really figures in Dowie's plans. Shame, as he was integral to our promotion.

Tommy Black will have to leave. I don't think Dowie sees him as a player good enough for the Premiership, and he's had a few division 1 clubs interested in him.

gold76
15-11-2004, 01:19 PM
Powell & Black will almost certainly be gone before the end of the season. Speroni has potential, but little confidence. I think Shipps could still do a job for us, maybe I'm looking through rose-tinted specs. Kaveides remains an enigma, lovely cameo against Fulham, but consigned to the reserves ever since. Maybe add Derry to the list of departures, I don't think he'll be part of Dowie's long term plans, espicially with the emergence of Tom Soares.

KennyB
15-11-2004, 01:32 PM
Dowie has a very level head, I would say.

We have several players who have had the odd 'flash in the pan' moment that has endeared them to us (I like Kav's skill and trickery, for example).

However, ID has the ability to judge whether these were just 'flash in the pan' moments, or whether they have genuinely deep talent that just needs to be brought out, exploited, honed, call it what you like.

Therefore I would say:-

Black, go.
Kav, stay.
Shipps, go
Powell, go

What I am saying is that there is no more that ID and his team can bring out of the likes of Black, Shipps and Powell.

Shame, but true.

Shipp Ahoy!
15-11-2004, 01:32 PM
Replace Popovic for a start, I am sorry but I have known it for a VERY long time that the lad is simply not Premiership material, I dread to think of the fast thinking quick movements of Shearer compared to the slow witted clumsy footed oaf of an Australian on Saturday!

I am not sure about the centre of midfield as we seem to be very good there at the moment, but if I had to pick someone to send on their way it would be Derry without a doubt. He doesn't look like he is anywhere near getting a game in and we seem to have some very good players who can cover the middle, and hopefully a new one coming in.

Up front is where I think should be the next thing sorted, I personally would offload a few strikers so we could bring in one more quality player along the lines of Ellington, that could either partner AJ or even be a player who could fill his role when he isn't available which is a big pain when he isn't. I would say goodbye to Black, Shipps and try to get a player like Dougster or Torghelle out on loan. Also if we are paying a lot of Ventola's wages we might want to consider just how injury prone he really is and if the value of having him here would be better then getting in a player such as Ellington.

I don't think we will give up on Speroni yet he has only been here what 6 months? While I don't think he will ever cut it, I am sure Dowie will not throw him on the scrap heap just yet.
Certainly don't think Kaviedes should be sent back yet, when I have seen him he looks hungry and talented, he has quick feet and has been unlucky not to score so far.

zonin2000
15-11-2004, 01:41 PM
Originally posted by Lion
Great minds think alike, etc.

'Great minds think alike' is something of a tautology, although not quite perfect.

Bad minds also think alike, I would imagine!

Fide et Fiducia
15-11-2004, 02:18 PM
Originally posted by Lion
Great minds think alike, etc.

Fools seldom differ;)

Jimbo ?
15-11-2004, 02:18 PM
kaviades hasnt had a chance yet.


black powell freedman shipps derry all look on borrowed time and wont really do the business in the prem or in D1 if we went down, while they may play a bit we need to get rid of the worst players and buy better however good the worst players are

Richwak
15-11-2004, 03:06 PM
Kaviedes is a great player, he is not getting a chance to show himself at the fans his potential at the moment. when he has come on as a substitute he has been exciting, he can run through defenders and get a shot in at goal, certainly do not agree with kicking him or Speroni out!

Malakite
15-11-2004, 03:08 PM
Personally I would OxO Black, Torghelle and Shipps! :hi:

Lion
15-11-2004, 03:23 PM
Why the hell would you get rid of Torghelle ?!?

brighton_eagle
15-11-2004, 03:29 PM
Feck knows. I wonder sometimes, I really do.

adrenalin john
15-11-2004, 03:39 PM
IMHO A first team squad should comprise 2 goalkeeprs and 20 out field players. 7 defenders, 5 midfielders, 3 wingers, 4 attackers 2 utility players (ie can play in midfield and defence or winger and forward etc)

Thus goalkeepers we have

Kiraly
Speroni 2

Defenders

Hall
Popovic
Granville
Boyce
Leigertwood
Hudson
Sorondo
Borrowdale 8

Midfielders

Aki
Hughes
Watson
Derry 4

Wingers

Koolka
Routledge
Laksis
Soares 4

Forwards

AJ
Freedman
Torghelle
Ventola
Shipps
Andrews
Kaviedes 7

Utility

Danny B
Tommy B 2

so by my reckoning we need to sign another midfileder but sell a few others (3 forwards, one winger and one defender)

GJN
15-11-2004, 03:41 PM
Originally posted by Malakite
Personally I would OxO Black, Torghelle and Shipps! :hi:


Torghelle is a quality player just waiting to happen. When we have two central midfielders that can make a 4:4:2 work, this is the guy who will be AJ's strike partner.

Malakite
15-11-2004, 03:43 PM
Originally posted by Lion
Why the hell would you get rid of Torghelle ?!?

Because I expect he is on very high wages, and we also have Ventola and Kaviedes who both look better strikers than him IMHO!

Malakite
15-11-2004, 03:43 PM
Originally posted by GJN
Torghelle is a quality player just waiting to happen. When we have two central midfielders that can make a 4:4:2 work, this is the guy who will be AJ's strike partner.
Lets hope so...you could be right!

RDSdaEAGLE
15-11-2004, 03:44 PM
Originally posted by Malakite
Because I expect he is on very high wages, and we also have Ventola and Kaviedes who both look better strikers than him IMHO!

To be fair Ady, I reckon Torghelle's wages will be far far less than either of Ventola's or Kaviedes'.

Lion
15-11-2004, 03:45 PM
Originally posted by Malakite
Because I expect he is on very high wages, and we also have Ventola and Kaviedes who both look better strikers than him IMHO!

He is very unlikely to be on high wages due to his age/experience/nationality. Ventola and Kav are on loan, one of which is injury prone and one of which has had less playing minutes than Toghelle.

I'm glad you're not the manager!!!

1dougiefreedman
15-11-2004, 03:45 PM
Originally posted by Eric the Ginga
Plenty of threads re who we should buy, but I guess our wage bill won't take too many more players. So who should we offload to make room. For what it's worth here's my selection.
1. Kaviedes (He comes from Ecuador, he's never gonna score). Seen enough already, not a hope in the Prem.
2. Speroni. Help!! Not enough of a presence.
3. Powell. (probably gone anyway)
4. Black. 1st Div player
5. Shipps. Won't cut it in the Prem.

I'll reserve judgement on Torghelle, I think there's potential...............

Thoughts??

I disagree with all except for shipps and black.

1.Hasnt played enough yet, and when he has played hasnt looked to bad.
2.speroni is our back up keeper and as already said has potential, lacks confidence i think.
3.powell i think is a solid defender who should be pushing for a 1st team place, faster and more powerful than popovic

Whitney
15-11-2004, 03:46 PM
The way i look at it this season we need to stay in the Premier League (which is looking increasingly likely) and to do that we need as big a squad as we can afford to deal with injuries / suspensions / loss of form / being able to change the way we play and game plan.

Therefore the only players we should off-load in January are thosse who have no chance of getting near the first team. To me this means only Tommy Black.

Then when we stay up we need to improve our first team. To me Granville and Popovic need replacing. We also need stronger back-up especially for central midfield and down the left.

When this has happened I would push out players such as Derry, Shipperely, Powell.

andy m
15-11-2004, 03:52 PM
Assuming that the young players just breaking through are excluded from this, I think its only really the likes of Powell, Black and Derry who are really likely to go. Powell was injured, but none of the other two could hold down a place under Dowie in Div 1, and Powell isn't going to really move past Hudson, Hall, Sorondo and Popovic, which is a shame as far as Popovic is concerned imo.

As for Dougie he's clearly second choice at the club behind only AJ, albeit that Ventola is injured, and Shipps has only just come back properly and finally gave us an edge in the Carling Cup game at Man U so I think he'll be given a bit more time before he's off, although I think he'll be away in the Summer regarldless.

In terms of signings I would like to see Derry replaced with some real quality because if Hughes, Aki or Watson get injured then I worry. Apart from that Black has already been replaced by Lakis and Powell's already got four players ahead of him.

We do already have a squad of 32 players after all.

Malakite
15-11-2004, 03:56 PM
Originally posted by Lion
He is very unlikely to be on high wages due to his age/experience/nationality. Ventola and Kav are on loan, one of which is injury prone and one of which has had less playing minutes than Toghelle.

I'm glad you're not the manager!!!

Well lets see if we can find out what he is on then?

Malakite
15-11-2004, 03:56 PM
Originally posted by Lion

I'm glad you're not the manager!!!

Hehe tell you one thing I would do if I was in charge though mate, and thats get rid of G G G G Granville!

brighton_eagle
15-11-2004, 03:58 PM
Originally posted by Malakite
Because I expect he is on very high wages, and we also have Ventola and Kaviedes who both look better strikers than him IMHO!

We own Torghelle. We are loaning Ventola and Kav till the end of the season.

TonbridgeEagle
15-11-2004, 03:59 PM
I agree with Lion 110% :p

Malakite
15-11-2004, 04:00 PM
Originally posted by brighton_eagle
We own Torghelle. We are loaning Ventola and Kav till the end of the season.

Fair point...would like to sign them both though!

Malakite
15-11-2004, 04:00 PM
Originally posted by TonbridgeEagle
I agree with Lion 110% :p

Me too actually! :p

andy m
15-11-2004, 04:02 PM
Originally posted by adrenalin john
IMHO A first team squad should comprise 2 goalkeeprs and 20 out field players. 7 defenders, 5 midfielders, 3 wingers, 4 attackers 2 utility players (ie can play in midfield and defence or winger and forward etc)

Thus goalkeepers we have

Kiraly
Speroni 2

Defenders

Hall
Popovic
Granville
Boyce
Leigertwood
Hudson
Sorondo
Borrowdale 8

Midfielders

Aki
Hughes
Watson
Derry 4

Wingers

Koolka
Routledge
Laksis
Soares 4

Forwards

AJ
Freedman
Torghelle
Ventola
Shipps
Andrews
Kaviedes 7

Utility

Danny B
Tommy B 2

so by my reckoning we need to sign another midfileder but sell a few others (3 forwards, one winger and one defender)

Plus Danze, Berry, Cronin, Togwell and Powell. So actually we've got all the midfielders we need, one too many goalkeepers, FOUR too many forwards, TWO too many defenders and the odd winger going spare. Numerically at least.

brighton_eagle
15-11-2004, 04:06 PM
Originally posted by Malakite
Fair point...would like to sign them both though!

Not sure what you are basing this on, but it seems to me to be as premature as the people calling for us to get rid of them. I'm concerned about Ventola's fitness and injury proneness, and really haven't seen enough of Kav to make a judgement. I'm certain Dowie will know by the end of the season what he wants to do with them.

olreagle
15-11-2004, 04:19 PM
I have always liked Tommy Black - but agree he should go (for his benefit as much as ours).

Shipps ain't got it for the Prem, too slow these days so let him go.

BUT

Kaviedes? He's on loan so give him the season - if he don't make the grade send him back?

Speroni? Superb v the scum in the Carling Cup - but then makes sily mistakes. So coach him out of those and he makes a great back up to Gabor

Powell? Even tho' we just got him, Hudson looks like the one out of place.

Sussex Eagle
15-11-2004, 04:24 PM
Ok, I'm going to be fairly 'tough', but here goes -

(This is based on ID & SJ really being up for improving the squad in January, and bringing in 4 or 5 players)

SELL/RELEASE
Shipperley - I'm afraid I've felt he'd never be physically up to the challenge since before promotion. Should command a smallish fee to drop into the Championship.
Black - He wasn't clever enough for the 1st Division, let alone the Premiership. Because his contract is long he might be difficult to get rid of, but there seems to be a few Championship clubs out there fool enough to take him.
Derry - Clearly we'd need to get a new Centre Mid in before we got rid of him, as we lack depth there, but Shaun isn't really in contention for the first team.
Powell - Love him to death but will he ever play? There's a good 6 players ahead of him. Shame as he's probably better than Hudson at this very moment.
Andrews - May be controversial - I realise he deserves a chance to prove himself, but his record in the lower leagues isn't very good. I'm happy for ID to keep him if he reckons he's worth it though.

LOAN OUT
Speroni - stick in a recall clause in case we need him, and send him to Championship/League 1 to toughen him up. The talent's there, but we can't afford many more gaffes this season.
Torghelle - needs to (A) adjust to the a better standard of football than he's generally used to, and (B) grow up a bit - two reds speak for themselves. Loan him out to a tough-arse of a manager who'll whip him into shape.

brighton_eagle
15-11-2004, 04:38 PM
Originally posted by Sussex Eagle

SELL/RELEASE
Andrews - May be controversial - I realise he deserves a chance to prove himself, but his record in the lower leagues isn't very good. I'm happy for ID to keep him if he reckons he's worth it though.


Hmmm.....Dowie bought him in because he thinks he can do a job. I think we need to wait and see with this one. Just look at Boyce.

Webb
15-11-2004, 04:42 PM
Damn right, b_e. From what I've heard, Andrews is a better player than Williams, and could offer something along the lines of AJ, with pace, natural ability and has got a good cross on him, and so is likely to use the channels a lot.

Sussex Eagle
15-11-2004, 04:50 PM
Originally posted by brighton_eagle
Hmmm.....Dowie bought him in because he thinks he can do a job. I think we need to wait and see with this one. Just look at Boyce.

That was my initial instinct - but Boyce was a top League 1 player. Andrews has never had a good goal ratio, or been that highly rated, at any level from what I know. But you always need back-up, and if he's good, cheap back-up I'm glad to keep him. If he can be any better than that, then hats off to ID for his best 'rough diamond' yet!

Twiggy
15-11-2004, 05:02 PM
So......my guess is.....

Short term (January)
Black
Powell
Hudson (on loan though)
Routledge (?? like him to stay but think he will go??)
Shipps

Long Term (Summer 2005)
Granville
Butterfield
Freedman (Love him but will have to go)
Derry (good cover until get replacement)

AJ
15-11-2004, 05:07 PM
Gid rid of Ventola. We don't need to be paying big wages to a guy who seems to be injured all the time.

Benzhiyi
15-11-2004, 05:26 PM
Those who have said we should get rid of, or loan out, Speroni - who do you suggest we have as back-up? A young keeper who has never played a first team game?

Have to agree on Tommy, unlikely to ever play for us again so a move probably best for all parties.

Powelly is well down the pecking order, even with Sorondo and Hall out; I'll always love him for that goal at Sunderland, but probably time for him to move on too. :sob:

I'm one of the few on here who rates Derry, but if we do sign another centre midfielder in the transfer window than I can see him being let go. Probably the right decision if we're going to establish ourselves in the top flight.

Similarly, Dougie's and Shipps' futures are both questionable. From what I've seen this season Freedman can't cut it at this level, and Neil seems to have slunk below Andrews and Torghelle in the pecking order despite a decent cameo against Man Utd.

I've been impressed with both Kaviedes and Torghelle, and feel both could have a big role to play this season.

Granville needs replacing at some stage, but I wouldn't like to see him or Borrowdale sold until we've improved that position.

SA Eagle
15-11-2004, 06:29 PM
Originally posted by Benzhiyi
Those who have said we should get rid of, or loan out, Speroni - who do you suggest we have as back-up? A young keeper who has never played a first team game?


I was one that suggested this, although I did caveat that with being able to get an experienced keeper in as back up for Gabor.

Ideally we send Speroni out on loan to a decent championship side to get a run in a side and play a few games, then have him back next season ready to go again. In the meantime, we get someone in on loan for the rest of the season as cover for Gabor.

Obviously, this strategy depends on a few things, not least the right replacement being available and willing to come to us to sit on the bench but if we could get it done, it would undoubtedly benefit us in the long term. As for the right replacement, I don't know but off the top of my head Birmingham have both Vaesen & Bennett sitting round not getting a look in and Spurs didn't seem to care about letting Keller go out on loan (i'm not necessarily saying any of these would be willing to come here before the abuse starts, but you catch the drift)

RDSdaEAGLE
15-11-2004, 06:36 PM
What would make teams want to sign Speroni though, considering he's suffering from a lack of confidence?

TN16_Eagle
15-11-2004, 06:40 PM
Originally posted by Whitney


Then when we stay up we need to improve our first team. To me Granville and Popovic need replacing. We also need stronger back-up especially for central midfield and down the left.

When this has happened I would push out players such as Derry, Shipperely, Powell.

SA Eagle
15-11-2004, 06:46 PM
Originally posted by RDSdaEAGLE
What would make teams want to sign Speroni though, considering he's suffering from a lack of confidence?

There's always some desperate lower division team somewhere. Grimsby took Beasant on loan from Chelsea a few years back after those two cock ups against Norwich.

Super-Ste-Cious
15-11-2004, 06:57 PM
agree with most of the original list - apart from definatly not Kaviedes - we aint seen enough of him - i think there sum talent to discover there

as 4 the rest - probably agree - although im not 100% sure bout Powell - maybe not even Speroni -

cmon give the guy a chance. lol - just kidding

xmasape
15-11-2004, 07:25 PM
West Brom announce player clearout, plan to go private

LONDON, Nov 15 (Reuters) - West Bromwich Albion plan to sell a quarter of their first-team squad to cut costs, chairman Jeremy Peace said on Monday.

The Premier League club also announced it was planning to de-list from the London Stock Exchange and revert to being a private company.

Announcing financial results for the year ending June 2004, Peace said squad cuts were necessary following the arrival of 10 new signings in the close season.

"With 31 players in the senior squad the club will now endeavour to reduce this number by approximately 25 percent over the coming months to a more manageable number," Peace said.

West Brom, who won promotion from division two last season, announced a reduced turnover of 20.6 million pounds ($38.17 million) for the year to June, down from 28.4 million in the previous 12 months when the club was in the Premier League.

Operating profit excluding player transfer costs was down to 1.4 million pounds from 9.8 million.

West Brom appointed Bryan Robson as their manager last Tuesday. They lie third from bottom of the Premier League.

Might find somebody useful here.

Mong!
15-11-2004, 07:35 PM
Originally posted by RDSdaEAGLE
Mike Kelly asked Dowie to sign Speroni for a reason. He was class up in Scotland, and if the only thing he really lacks is confidence, then there's no way we'll offload him.



Well played. I remember Portsmouth were interested in him aswell. I doubt he'd be in the Dundee side if he was playing like this at the mo. He'll come good. :p

kezza
15-11-2004, 09:11 PM
Well peeps,

I have to say that for me it is :

Granville - is average, I am sure we can get a much better replacement.

Black - No chance to get into the team and with a few first division clubs sniffing, may aswell tell him to pack the bags.

Powell - although integral to ourselves being here, no chance for him to make the team and not suited to dowies game plan.

Derry - Good 1st division, won't offer enough in speed or tackling department for to be of use.

Loan out - Andrews, good to get him some game time

Loan out - Soares, is breaking through however would be better giving him more game time with a 1st division team.

That is my picks, still unsure about shipps .:D :p :p

KennyB
16-11-2004, 08:05 AM
Originally posted by SA Eagle
I was one that suggested this, although I did caveat that with being able to get an experienced keeper in as back up for Gabor.

Ideally we send Speroni out on loan to a decent championship side to get a run in a side and play a few games, then have him back next season ready to go again. In the meantime, we get someone in on loan for the rest of the season as cover for Gabor.

Obviously, this strategy depends on a few things, not least the right replacement being available and willing to come to us to sit on the bench but if we could get it done, it would undoubtedly benefit us in the long term. As for the right replacement, I don't know but off the top of my head Birmingham have both Vaesen & Bennett sitting round not getting a look in and Spurs didn't seem to care about letting Keller go out on loan (i'm not necessarily saying any of these would be willing to come here before the abuse starts, but you catch the drift)

I do honestly believe that he would benefit by playing constant first team football rather than keeping a bench warm. So we (and him) would be better off loaning him out. He has the talent, but makes cock-ups. And consistency is what we must have for a keeper. A striker might miss a few chances, but if a keeper "misses a few" we are in deep $h1t.

Our only fear would be if GK (at least he has the right initials as well !!) got injured. But if it is just match-to-match bench warming, we should find a youngster to cover for that.

So loan Julian out, for both our sakes.

Maidstoned Eagle
16-11-2004, 12:09 PM
Originally posted by Shipp Ahoy!
Replace Popovic for a start, I am sorry but I have known it for a VERY long time that the lad is simply not Premiership material, I dread to think of the fast thinking quick movements of Shearer compared to the slow witted clumsy footed oaf of an Australian on Saturday!



:lux:

higham_eagle
16-11-2004, 12:28 PM
OK...here's my two penneth, to add some fuel to this fire

1. Dougie - sorry, we need someone who's prepare to work harder and Dougie gives up on a ball to quickly.
2. Shipps - not good enough and no room for sentiment
3. Derry - not good enough other than as a sub and isn't a good enough replacement for either Ben, Aki or Hughesy should they get injured.
4. Black - form to erratic but generally not good enough
5. Speroni - it's like having Perry Suckling back in goal...get rid of asap and get some decent cover for Gabor.

higham_eagle
16-11-2004, 12:30 PM
Originally posted by higham_eagle
5. Speroni - it's like having Perry Suckling back in goal...get rid of asap and get some decent cover for Gabor.


Hmmmm, actually thinking about it I might have done Suckling a dis-service!

Justy C
16-11-2004, 01:02 PM
Not the nicest of threads this is it? Who do we think is crap and we should get rid of!? However, its a business and all that...

Powell - Reading rumours won't go away, I think he'll be tempted by working for Sir Steve again. And we do have enough centre backs.
Black - Dowie has never really given him a chance, I think the Prem maybe a step too high for him
Derry - did a sound job for us second half of last season, I think that he may lack the pace for the Prem
Shipperley and Freedman - tough one for sentimental reasons. Both are great for spirit in the dressing room I'm sure, but I can't see either having the cutting edge required for the Prem. Dougie has the touch but not the pace, especially if we are playing one up front.
Ventola - has looked promising, and like he has the right attitude, but history suggests he is prone to injuries...and is probably on a decent wage which would be better spent elsewhere.

However, getting rid of 3 forwards is too much...unless we signed Harewood and Ashton :p

On loan deals, I'd like to see Borrowdale and Soares getting more playing time (as long as they can be quickly recalled) as well as Danze and Andrews. I can't believe that some people are suggesting we get rid of him before he has had a game!

And as for Speroni, Torghelle and Kaviedes, I really do think that these fellas are worth persevering with. They have the raw quality, but can they elimiate the mistakes from their game? Lets give them time and a chance.

Beanie
16-11-2004, 01:37 PM
Originally posted by xmasape
West Brom announce player clearout, plan to go private

LONDON, Nov 15 (Reuters) - West Bromwich Albion plan to sell a quarter of their first-team squad to cut costs, chairman Jeremy Peace said on Monday.

The Premier League club also announced it was planning to de-list from the London Stock Exchange and revert to being a private company.

Announcing financial results for the year ending June 2004, Peace said squad cuts were necessary following the arrival of 10 new signings in the close season.

"With 31 players in the senior squad the club will now endeavour to reduce this number by approximately 25 percent over the coming months to a more manageable number," Peace said.

West Brom, who won promotion from division two last season, announced a reduced turnover of 20.6 million pounds ($38.17 million) for the year to June, down from 28.4 million in the previous 12 months when the club was in the Premier League.

Operating profit excluding player transfer costs was down to 1.4 million pounds from 9.8 million.

West Brom appointed Bryan Robson as their manager last Tuesday. They lie third from bottom of the Premier League.

Might find somebody useful here.

somebody useful???

A team that is below us in the table sheds the worst 25% of their squad - who is likely to be "useful"? We might as well hold onto Shipps, Tommy Black etc - at least we know them.!

NZsparky
16-11-2004, 10:26 PM
Originally posted by Justy C
Not the nicest of threads this is it? Who do we think is crap and we should get rid of!? However, its a business and all that...

Powell - Reading rumours won't go away, I think he'll be tempted by working for Sir Steve again. And we do have enough centre backs.
Black - Dowie has never really given him a chance, I think the Prem maybe a step too high for him
Derry - did a sound job for us second half of last season, I think that he may lack the pace for the Prem
Shipperley and Freedman - tough one for sentimental reasons. Both are great for spirit in the dressing room I'm sure, but I can't see either having the cutting edge required for the Prem. Dougie has the touch but not the pace, especially if we are playing one up front.
Ventola - has looked promising, and like he has the right attitude, but history suggests he is prone to injuries...and is probably on a decent wage which would be better spent elsewhere.

However, getting rid of 3 forwards is too much...unless we signed Harewood and Ashton :p

On loan deals, I'd like to see Borrowdale and Soares getting more playing time (as long as they can be quickly recalled) as well as Danze and Andrews. I can't believe that some people are suggesting we get rid of him before he has had a game!

And as for Speroni, Torghelle and Kaviedes, I really do think that these fellas are worth persevering with. They have the raw quality, but can they elimiate the mistakes from their game? Lets give them time and a chance.
Pretty much have to agree with all of that, except I am not keen on Harewood for some reason.

Tomo
16-11-2004, 10:39 PM
Originally posted by Shipp Ahoy!
Replace Popovic for a start, I am sorry but I have known it for a VERY long time that the lad is simply not Premiership material, I dread to think of the fast thinking quick movements of Shearer compared to the slow witted clumsy footed oaf of an Australian on Saturday!

.

SImon after playing football with you today you are in no position to pass judgement on any bodys defending abilities. Actually for that matter any football abilities full stop :o :p

B the Bad
16-11-2004, 11:52 PM
Originally posted by Eric the Ginga
1. Kaviedes (He comes from Ecuador, he's never gonna score). Seen enough already, not a hope in the Prem.
2. Speroni. Help!! Not enough of a presence.
3. Powell. (probably gone anyway)

I'll reserve judgement on Torghelle, I think there's potential...............

Thoughts??


This is hilarious. You'll reserve judgement on the woeful Torghelle, yet Kav should DEFINITELY leave the club because of a stupid chant that appeals against his South American status that was made by a bunch of fat old men who LOVE their players to run more, yet can't even run themselves (hypocrites)...??? Seen enough already..? What, 10 minutes, oh yeah, sure, all legends are made in 10 minutes, I forgot about that.

Speroni is a good back-up keeper.

As is Powell is a great back-up Centre Back.

B the Bad
16-11-2004, 11:57 PM
I don't think Palace should "kick out" any half competent players, it's just totally illogical and goes against everything they are trying to achieve (IE, build a squad).
Black, Danze & Torghelle are the only players I'd force out.

Tommy Pickle
17-11-2004, 02:50 PM
Providing we are still in the prem next year. I can see all of the following moving on at some point. Prob not in Jan.

Pops
Powell
Black
Dougie
Shipps

Ventola and Kav and Sorondo have until the end of the season to impress.

Also depends how much Granville and Hughes want when we come to renew their contracts.

Tommy Pickle
17-11-2004, 02:51 PM
Originally posted by B the Bad
I don't think Palace should "kick out" any half competent players, it's just totally illogical and goes against everything they are trying to achieve (IE, build a squad).
Black, Danze & Torghelle are the only players I'd force out.

Why force out Danze and Torghelle?

Eagle in Japan
17-11-2004, 03:58 PM
As someone said forcing out competent but not paticular bad players out is a mistake,I think the likes of derry and powell shouldbe let go and also black and shipps but all the new signings should stay as they are here to play and havent had chance to yet so lets reserve judgement for the moment.

Henfield Eagle
17-11-2004, 04:11 PM
Originally posted by Maidstoned Eagle
:lux: Always thought you had a brain,now I'm not sure.
I hope you pressed the wrong button chap.:eek:

GSG cpfc
17-11-2004, 07:05 PM
I think that Derry, Black, Shipps, Powell and maybe Freedman will go in January. Jordan has said he wants to bring in more players, so in order to do that we need to get rid of some. All of these players must be on good wages and are not even playing. We may also loan out a few players for experience. Maybe Andrews, Berry, Danze even Hudson. Does anyone no how Togwell is doing at Oxford? Need to cut the squad down IMHO.

Ardent Eagle Forever
17-11-2004, 07:09 PM
Could do with losing Popovic as well, what with numerous own goals this year, and giving away penalties, he's also a liability at this level. Excellent Championship player though.

I'd like to see a central defence quartet of Hall, Sorondo, Powell, and another.

Not sure Hudson's up to it.

Leigertwood or Boyce can always fill in in emergencies.

daz_eagle
17-11-2004, 07:11 PM
Originally posted by KungFuCharlie
It never ceases to amaze me how quickly some Palace fans are to stick the knife in.
Get rid of Speroni and Kaviedes? What a bloody stupid thing to say.

agreed

SARN
17-11-2004, 07:13 PM
i say we get rid of derry, black, shipperley, routledge cos der prob on decent wages n day aint doin n e ting

DocSavage
17-11-2004, 09:45 PM
Originally posted by Eric the Ginga
Plenty of threads re who we should buy, but I guess our wage bill won't take too many more players. So who should we offload to make room. For what it's worth here's my selection.
1. Kaviedes (He comes from Ecuador, he's never gonna score). Seen enough already, not a hope in the Prem.
2. Speroni. Help!! Not enough of a presence.
3. Powell. (probably gone anyway)
4. Black. 1st Div player
5. Shipps. Won't cut it in the Prem.

I'll reserve judgement on Torghelle, I think there's potential...............

Thoughts??
pretty perfect summary but hate to lose Black and Shipps, jsut like them but you're quie right and I'll pay Kaviedas' air fare if he's not already gone!!!!

Tommy Pickle
18-11-2004, 03:27 PM
Originally posted by SARN
i say we get rid of derry, black, shipperley, routledge cos der prob on decent wages n day aint doin n e ting

Cept for Routledge, who currently is not on very high wages.

Tripod 10
20-11-2004, 09:23 AM
IMHO we should allow Black,Derry and Shipperley to leave as soon as a decent bid comes in and loan out Soares and Borrodale.Dont think Freedman should stay next season(despite everything he has done for Palace:sob: )as we need to be looking forward,also think Popovic should be replaced come next season.

As for Ventola and Kaviedes,what little we have seen of them has been very good and both I feel will play a part later in the season.Keep them both.

cpfc_spc1982
20-11-2004, 09:34 AM
loans for soares, danze, borrowdale, torghelle, hudson depending on cover.
get rid off black, shipps and possibly powell. derry and freedman are useful cover still i feel.
see if anyone would like speroni, tout around scotland if he has a good rep there.
sell wayne if he doesnt sign.
unless kaviedes makes a useful contribution in the next month and a bit let him go home. same with ventola if he cant find consistant fitness.

ANDYEAGLE
20-11-2004, 09:36 AM
Black,Derry and Shipperley will not command decent bids from anyone in the first Division,they earn too much money at Palace and it will be difficult to get any transfer fees for them. Freebies maybe or very small fees. Soares maybe on loan but Borrowdale is a probably better than Granville now,we cant let him go anywhere.
Ventola if fit I think will be an asset to us, Kaviedes from what I have seen can only play a forward role and appears too lightweight for me to hack it in the Premier, I would love to be wrong because he has obvious crowd pleasing ability.

Ade55
20-11-2004, 09:57 AM
nicky rizzo signed for mk dons

Isle of Wight
25-11-2004, 06:46 AM
What a negative title this paper has come up with. It makes it seem as if these guys have done something wrong. As far as I'm concerned anyone that played for us last season that got us to this position earn't my gratitude. This is sneering sports journalism at its worse.:veryangry

bigee
25-11-2004, 07:49 AM
No worse than some of the threads on here,'worst signing' 'worst player' etc,and yes i agree very negative and no need for it.

andy m
25-11-2004, 07:49 AM
It calls them stars. Its hardly suggesting they've done something wrong. What it is saying is that the players who've performed so well and "earnt our gratitude" are on their way. Which is true.