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-   -   Jairo Riedewald (https://www.cpfc.org/forums/showthread.php?t=271278)

dannyboy1807 08-02-2020 02:27 PM

You just have to watch PVA constantly duck out of challenges and lose to ball to think the manager must hate him.

Glɑzier 08-02-2020 02:28 PM

Sure as hell like to know why Roy doesn't give him another go in midfield. It can't be solely down to work rate.

in-exile 08-02-2020 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannyboy1807 (Post 15098539)
You just have to watch PVA constantly duck out of challenges and lose to ball to think the manager must hate him.

PVA plays like a coward ... never puts it in on the challenges..

Malarkey 08-02-2020 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by in-exile (Post 15098571)
PVA plays like a coward ... never puts it in on the challenges..

And can't pass or defend

danpalace07 08-02-2020 04:16 PM

Imagine being dropped for PVA. You'd need counselling.

stinky 08-02-2020 05:42 PM

Imagine anyone defending PVA's defending. I genuinely don't care if he makes Wilf a better player (and means nothing when Wilf switches to the right). His prime job is to defend and he's awful at it. Misses challenges and lets crosses past him. Awful. I feel so so sorry for Jairo.

NorthPalace23 08-02-2020 05:49 PM

Player of the month not even getting off the bench-shocking!

Made even more so, with three defeats in a row, with just one cow pat of a goal from Benteke, in that time.

GB2506 08-02-2020 05:54 PM

Absolute joke. Feel for the bloke. Sums Roy and the club up at the moment though. We are all over the place and only heading in one direction.

David of Kent 08-02-2020 05:56 PM

2 years of no football then bought in as there was no other choices to play out of position, win player of the month, then immediately dropped for players that fail week in week out. Must be demoralising. Absolutely terrible man management

Glazier69 08-02-2020 06:13 PM

PVA has been shyt for two seasons apart from a couple of half decent games. Really feel sorry for Jairo. He’ll probably go to a rival on a free then come back to haunt us.

BillyTKid 08-02-2020 06:19 PM

I don’t have a problem with PVA coming back into the side but Jairo should now be playing central midfield. He has got himself into good shape and is probably the best passer at the club. If we are gonna play three defensive midfielders atleast stick Jairo in to play through balls to Wilf and Ayew.

Stavros 69 08-02-2020 06:20 PM

PvA bottling that cross was the last straw for me. He’s a playboy and we should cash in.

Jordan555x 08-02-2020 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David of Kent (Post 15099173)
2 years of no football then bought in as there was no other choices to play out of position, win player of the month, then immediately dropped for players that fail week in week out. Must be demoralising. Absolutely terrible man management

I brought this up against Sheffield United and got slated for it by the certain individuals who just love to disagree for the sake of disagreeing!

He's been borderline average for ages now! He was average against Sheffield United and piss poor today. Neither performance warranted dropping the POTM!!

When decisions are being made like that, we deserve what we get. Jairo isn't the messiah but he was coming into his own and did much better defensively while offering good link up with Wilf. Dropping him was absolutely criminal and out of order!

Happy Arthur 08-02-2020 06:34 PM

Jairo was like a new signing. There's a chance he won't play again : (

CP-RJW 08-02-2020 06:36 PM

PVA AND Jairo should be in the team. They’ve got more technical ability than anyone outside of Wilf, Ayew and Meyer (who barely counts as he just doesn’t fit in).

Either PVA and Jairo on the left, or Jairo partnering Luka/Kouyate in the middle for me. Not that Hodgson would ever do this, but it’s a nice thought.

Latvian Eagle 08-02-2020 06:39 PM

Not been his biggest fan down the years, but having come in, done a job and played well enough to win PotM, it is absolutely appalling man management from Roy to drop him, sends out all the wrong type of messages IMHO.

If anything Jairo should be LB and PVA LM if he wants to fit PVA in.

glenn.f 08-02-2020 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Latvian Eagle (Post 15099267)
Not been his biggest fan down the years, but having come in, done a job and played well enough to win PotM, it is absolutely appalling man management from Roy to drop him, sends out all the wrong type of messages IMHO.

If anything Jairo should be LB and PVA LM if he wants to fit PVA in.

Spot on with this fella. Disgraceful treatment of a player who has fought hard to win over everybody.
On current form you cannot see why he doesn't make it in as a left back or a midfielder and can't say that we've improved since Van Aanholt's return either.

SJ'sLoveMonkey 08-02-2020 06:49 PM

Shocking man management

Golf Boy 08-02-2020 07:10 PM

Jairo should be given a chance in midfield. It’s ok having three plodders against Liverpool etc....but we always have them. Jairo and two plodders against most teams.

philsick 08-02-2020 07:12 PM

shocking management

CP-RJW 08-02-2020 07:14 PM

Shocking management

PemboExpress 08-02-2020 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glazier69 (Post 15099214)
PVA has been shyt for two seasons apart from a couple of half decent games. Really feel sorry for Jairo. He’ll probably go to a rival on a free then come back to haunt us.

Harsh on PVA.

I am afraid that when you have a back 8 so devoid of goals and creativity as we do PVA is a must. Just don't understand Wilf switching to right today. Did **** all there.

Gregz41 08-02-2020 07:38 PM

Agree with most other comments that not only he shouldn't be dropped, but he should be played in his preferred position. It's grating to hear Roy say "What people don't realise is that we've got 4 very good centre midfield players in front of Jairo and Max." No, we don't Roy. We have 4 midfielders that you continue to persist with in some boring variation who can't create anything, don't score goals, can't beat a man, can't carry the ball and can't pass between the lines.

Neither Max or Jairo have ever been afforded the luxury of the extended games the likes of McArthur, McCarthy, Kouyate and Milivojevic have been afforded. In 6 games out of 26 we have registered an xG rating of more than 1.0. 6!

bodger 08-02-2020 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregz41 (Post 15099396)
Agree with most other comments that not only he shouldn't be dropped, but he should be played in his preferred position. It's grating to hear Roy say "What people don't realise is that we've got 4 very good centre midfield players in front of Jairo and Max." No, we don't Roy. We have 4 midfielders that you continue to persist with in some boring variation who can't create anything, don't score goals, can't beat a man, can't carry the ball and can't pass between the lines.

Neither Max or Jairo have ever been afforded the luxury of the extended games the likes of McArthur, McCarthy, Kouyate and Milivojevic have been afforded. In 6 games out of 26 we have registered an xG rating of more than 1.0. 6!

For me in most games its Luka or Kouyate McCarthy is a squad player and should not start Meyer or JR in his place AT and Wilf out wide Ayew and Tosun up front if we go 4.4.2.

Nostrils 08-02-2020 08:33 PM

It's a shame, a promising young player comes in with a point to prove, does very well out of position... and he gets dropped. Where's the incentive to continue pushing for a place? We've got a seriously aging squad already and won't be in the least bit surprised if he wants to move on in the summer. Add that to a load of contracts coming to the end and we have an awful lot of business to do.

CpfcLoz 08-02-2020 09:28 PM

whats more frustrating is that our midfield 3 know that they dont have perform because Roy wont drop them. mccarthy and luka we're shite again today, yet max and jairo still wont get a chance. in the past they have played well then dropped the next game. it just seems like some players aren't treated equally by Roy.

stinky 08-02-2020 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PemboExpress (Post 15099386)
Harsh on PVA.

I am afraid that when you have a back 8 so devoid of goals and creativity as we do PVA is a must. Just don't understand Wilf switching to right today. Did **** all there.

PVA is a defender. It's his job. And he's shocking at it.

PemboExpress 08-02-2020 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stinky (Post 15099522)
PVA is a defender. It's his job. And he's shocking at it.

Again somewhat harsh. Yes he has his switch off moments but he is generally reliable and actually offers an attacking threat whereas the rest of our back 4 and midfield 3 rarely do. Who else would you play at LB ? Please don't say Jairo - we would barely get out our own half.

Jordan555x 08-02-2020 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PemboExpress (Post 15099538)
Again somewhat harsh. Yes he has his switch off moments but he is generally reliable and actually offers an attacking threat whereas the rest of our back 4 and midfield 3 rarely do. Who else would you play at LB ? Please don't say Jairo - we would barely get out our own half.

Jairo really wasn't bad at all going forward. Quite good in his link ups with Wilf which many on here remarked. PVA is nowhere near good in attack as many on here like to make out. Good in fleeting moments but when was the last time he won a player of the month award? You just DON'T drop the POTM in any circumstances. It reflects very badly on the player morale as well as overall team morale. Piss poor man management.

Plenty on here were defending it and have now oddly gone silent now PVA has a really bad game as opposed to an average game vs Sheffield Utd.

I have been very defensive over Roy up until he did that and was one of the first to call him out on it.

PemboExpress 08-02-2020 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jordan555x (Post 15099556)
Jairo really wasn't bad at all going forward. Quite good in his link ups with Wilf which many on here remarked. PVA is nowhere near good in attack as many on here like to make out. Good in fleeting moments but when was the last time he won a player of the month award? You just DON'T drop the POTM in any circumstances. It reflects very badly on the player morale as well as overall team morale. Piss poor man management.

Plenty on here were defending it and have now oddly gone silent now PVA has a really bad game as opposed to an average game vs Sheffield Utd.

I have been very defensive over Roy up until he did that and was one of the first to call him out on it.

Jairo may have been voted potm but we have not won a game in 2020 and it was little more than a vote for someone who exceeded low expectations. Let's not pretend he set the month on fire.

stinky 08-02-2020 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PemboExpress (Post 15099538)
Again somewhat harsh. Yes he has his switch off moments but he is generally reliable and actually offers an attacking threat whereas the rest of our back 4 and midfield 3 rarely do. Who else would you play at LB ? Please don't say Jairo - we would barely get out our own half.

Switch off moments? **** sake you can't defend him having switch off moments. I don't care how good he is going forward. His job is to tackle wingers and stop crosses going in. He did neither for the first goal.

And yes Jairo. Again, don't give a shit how good he is in attack. There's a reason he won player of the month. He was excellent at LB.

stinky 08-02-2020 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PemboExpress (Post 15099569)
Jairo may have been voted potm but we have not won a game in 2020 and it was little more than a vote for someone who exceeded low expectations. Let's not pretend he set the month on fire.

Oh do **** off you weirdo. He was superb.

Nostrils 08-02-2020 10:31 PM

As many have mentioned already, a left sided combination of PvA and Jairo should be both defensively sound and still have a good attacking threat with Jairo's passing linking the central midfield as well. I hope we get to see it someday soon.

PvA wasn't so effective today in defence, but he's been out for a while and was only a whisker away from scoring. We need him in the team.

PemboExpress 08-02-2020 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stinky (Post 15099572)
Oh do **** off you weirdo. He was superb.

No need for personal abuse pal. Disagree with me by all means but do not resort to personal insults when you do not even know me.

Gregz41 08-02-2020 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bodger (Post 15099441)
For me in most games its Luka or Kouyate McCarthy is a squad player and should not start Meyer or JR in his place AT and Wilf out wide Ayew and Tosun up front if we go 4.4.2.

Not opposed to this. If we’re not going to play our more technical midfielders then perhaps we should go for a target man in a 442.

palacemetros 08-02-2020 11:25 PM

He showed enough to keep a starting place.

Frank would have.

Eddie McGoldrick's tash 08-02-2020 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PemboExpress (Post 15099569)
Jairo may have been voted potm but we have not won a game in 2020 and it was little more than a vote for someone who exceeded low expectations. Let's not pretend he set the month on fire.

This.

chateauferret 09-02-2020 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PemboExpress (Post 15099569)
Jairo may have been voted potm but we have not won a game in 2020 and it was little more than a vote for someone who exceeded low expectations. Let's not pretend he set the month on fire.

I don't see how you can say Riedewald hasn't shown enough to get a go in his proper position when you look at how shocking Milivojevic and McCarthy have been lately. Yesterday they were both absolute toilet. Same goes for Meyer whose impact yesterday was bugger all.

What's more Milivojevic is going to get another ban soon.

Is Riedewald carrying some sort of knock?

Sharkba1t 09-02-2020 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PemboExpress (Post 15099569)
Jairo may have been voted potm but we have not won a game in 2020 and it was little more than a vote for someone who exceeded low expectations. Let's not pretend he set the month on fire.

No, he didn’t but he was more than good enough. There are lots of things Roy does that are spot on, but this is very poor. Where is the incentive for players when this happens? Why do some players just walk in to the team, whatever their form?

Ardent Eagle Forever 09-02-2020 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PemboExpress (Post 15099569)
Jairo may have been voted potm but we have not won a game in 2020 and it was little more than a vote for someone who exceeded low expectations. Let's not pretend he set the month on fire.

That's hardly his fault is it? He played well and was getting into his stride when Roy dropped him. Shocking action by the manager.

stinky 09-02-2020 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PemboExpress (Post 15099582)
No need for personal abuse pal. Disagree with me by all means but do not resort to personal insults when you do not even know me.

Yep, agreed and I apologise

Johnsonpen 09-02-2020 09:56 AM

PVA mistakes are costing us goals. Simple. Hope Kelley is back soon because at CH he always makes a couple of stand out stops that probably save us goals and Cahill is also making mistakes. Jairo will get better at LB as will Kelley at CH

PemboExpress 09-02-2020 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stinky (Post 15099844)
Yep, agreed and I apologise

OK cool. Apology accepted.

Excowboy 09-02-2020 05:16 PM

I like the idea of bringing Jairo in for McCarthy next game and play him on the left of a three.

As tenacious as McCarthy is, he seems to go all over the field without keeping shape. His passing was awful last game, too - 57% completion and gave the ball away for the second goal.

Having a clear left of a three midfielder might help with shape, plus his passing would help with transition from defence to attack and provide PVA and Wilf with balls to chase.

Won't happen, though.

The Vicar 09-02-2020 09:47 PM

^

Hazbaz 09-02-2020 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excowboy (Post 15100390)
I like the idea of bringing Jairo in for McCarthy next game and play him on the left of a three.

As tenacious as McCarthy is, he seems to go all over the field without keeping shape. His passing was awful last game, too - 57% completion and gave the ball away for the second goal.

Having a clear left of a three midfielder might help with shape, plus his passing would help with transition from defence to attack and provide PVA and Wilf with balls to chase.

Won't happen, though.

You may get your wish if McArthur has to cover RB maybe Jairo will get a shot because we need to keep Kouyate as cover for the Central defence

SussexRed&Blue 09-02-2020 09:54 PM

Maybe we could play 4-4-2 against Newcastle with Wilf up front in a free role off of Benteke.

Ayew wide Right, Jairo wide left and Jimmy Mac and Luka/Kouyate in the middle if not required at CB.

Excowboy 09-02-2020 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SussexRed&Blue (Post 15100673)
Maybe we could play 4-4-2 against Newcastle with Wilf up front in a free role off of Benteke.

Ayew wide Right, Jairo wide left and Jimmy Mac and Luka/Kouyate in the middle if not required at CB.

I quite like that too, but with Townsend wide and Ayew up front with Wilf.

SussexRed&Blue 09-02-2020 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excowboy (Post 15100678)
I quite like that too, but with Townsend wide and Ayew up front with Wilf.

Yes i suppose it depends if Andros is properly fit again he should be 100% but could be an option from the bench.

Think Jairo would be good in Midfield on the Left to support the attack as he seems good at getting forward and his pass selection is very good with creativity to spot an opening.

Would like to see wheher Wilf can cause them problems from a central attacking area.

Sick Bucket 09-02-2020 10:48 PM

I keep saying this and I know its a dodgy theory but personally I'd like to see PVA play in front of Jairo. I think Jairo is a better defender but PVA is better going forward. Seems to be just me though!

Hazbaz 09-02-2020 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sick Bucket (Post 15100737)
I keep saying this and I know its a dodgy theory but personally I'd like to see PVA play in front of Jairo. I think Jairo is a better defender but PVA is better going forward. Seems to be just me though!

No I like the idea of that too, but once Schlupp is fit that would be the dilemma

Crunchie 09-02-2020 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jordan555x (Post 15099556)
Jairo really wasn't bad at all going forward. Quite good in his link ups with Wilf which many on here remarked. PVA is nowhere near good in attack as many on here like to make out. Good in fleeting moments but when was the last time he won a player of the month award? You just DON'T drop the POTM in any circumstances. It reflects very badly on the player morale as well as overall team morale. Piss poor man management.

Plenty on here were defending it and have now oddly gone silent now PVA has a really bad game as opposed to an average game vs Sheffield Utd.

I have been very defensive over Roy up until he did that and was one of the first to call him out on it.

Yep agreed.

I personally would like a Sheff Utd set up.

They dont have many flair player in midfield and I am sure Townsend can do a job at Right Wing Back. JAiro could come in midfield. too, or Max

Playing 3 defensive midfielder week in wek out and telling Ayew and Zaha to run back all the time clearly isnt working.

Zaha is the best striker we have at the club. End off. Should be a front two of Zaha and Ayew with PVA and Townsend as wing backs.

3-5-2. Clearly thinking outside of Roy's box.

orp pisshead1 10-02-2020 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excowboy (Post 15100390)
I like the idea of bringing Jairo in for McCarthy next game and play him on the left of a three.

As tenacious as McCarthy is, he seems to go all over the field without keeping shape. His passing was awful last game, too - 57% completion and gave the ball away for the second goal.

Having a clear left of a three midfielder might help with shape, plus his passing would help with transition from defence to attack and provide PVA and Wilf with balls to chase.

Won't happen, though.

Good teams tend to have good balance and putting Jairo in midfield would give us that :p

the drexciyan 10-02-2020 06:11 AM

You cannot blame him if he goes and never looks back. POTM dropped for a bang out of form PvA, he must be wondering wtf he has to do to win this manager over.

GB2506 10-02-2020 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the drexciyan (Post 15100923)
You cannot blame him if he goes and never looks back. POTM dropped for a bang out of form PvA, he must be wondering wtf he has to do to win this manager over.

He needs to age by about 5 or 6 years to win him over. Maybe even change his name to Jairo MacRiedewald. Might get some game time then.

Timbo 10-02-2020 07:58 AM

JR is ok, and deserves game time over others, but long term he is not the answer and is not presently an automatic pick

philsick 10-02-2020 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Timbo (Post 15101045)
JR is ok, and deserves game time over others, but long term he is not the answer and is not presently an automatic pick

I totally disagree with this, jairo and players of his age and potential are the long term answer, not ageing seasoned pro's the first team consist of. Jairo has put in better performances than luka and mccarthy lately yet they walk into the team every week.

GB2506 10-02-2020 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philsick (Post 15101072)
I totally disagree with this, jairo and players of his age and potential are the long term answer, not ageing seasoned pro's the first team consist of. Jairo has put in better performances than luka and mccarthy lately yet they walk into the team every week.

Fully agree. Luka has been absolutely shocking all season. I don’t actually know what he is good at anymore? He doesn’t protect the back 4, doesn’t win tackles, his passing is woeful, set pieces even worse....

SA Eagle 10-02-2020 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crunchie (Post 15100765)
Yep agreed.

I personally would like a Sheff Utd set up.

They dont have many flair player in midfield and I am sure Townsend can do a job at Right Wing Back. JAiro could come in midfield. too, or Max

Playing 3 defensive midfielder week in wek out and telling Ayew and Zaha to run back all the time clearly isnt working.

Zaha is the best striker we have at the club. End off. Should be a front two of Zaha and Ayew with PVA and Townsend as wing backs.

3-5-2. Clearly thinking outside of Roy's box.

3-5-2 is outside of any sensible thinking with the players we've got. The fact that you have to shoe-horn Townsend into RWB is evidence enough.

LuieJack 10-02-2020 09:37 AM

Yes Riedewald has done reasonably well since coming back in, but we must never forget his lack of pace especially when playing LB is always going to be a hinderance as we have seen, the modern game demands Full Backs to have pace with the ability to overlap. And its something we must never forget he lacks, so when we see this clamour for him to be our LB to bear that in mind, can people seriously suggest he would be the better left back to PVA? yes we know defensively he is suspect but at least it is Not playing square pegs in round holes situ. Get the Left sided midfielder to work more closely defensively with PVA and crucially we will see a more "solid" balanced Left side but without losing the attacking side he offers.
I have always felt JR best position would be as what used to be the old fashioned "sweeper" role, he can read situations well has strength and good balance also crucially in that role speed is not vital, so maybe whilst Luka is struggling for form JR slots into his role where his passing would be more crisper than Luka also he will be a lot more comfortable in that role, then who knows.

GrayP41ace 10-02-2020 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philsick (Post 15101072)
I totally disagree with this, jairo and players of his age and potential are the long term answer, not ageing seasoned pro's the first team consist of. Jairo has put in better performances than luka and mccarthy lately yet they walk into the team every week.

But you've spent 6 months moaning about how defensive we are?

So when our 1st choice left back comes back, who is more attacking and certainly offers us more going forward, he shouldn't play because a central player out of position (which is credit to him, but largely why he has been praised as much as he had) played better than anyone else (which wasn't difficult) for a month? When your fullbacks offer the attacking threat the midfielders need to offer the cover. We play 3 CM's in the same way Liverpool do, only theirs are infinitely better than ours, along with their full backs and forwards obviously.

The problem we are having this year is that our RB is dreadful past the half way line. There is zero threat from that side.
By having no threat on the right and nothing on the left side bar Wilf, teams are doubling up and taking him completely out the game.
It's not a surprise that Wilf had more impact in the Sheff Utd game with PVA back, than the previous 4/5 games without him.

The way we approach games is due to the personnel we have:
An attacking LB, that can't defend - PVA
A RW that is very defensive - AT
A defensive RB that cannot offer any threat going forward - JW, and he was replaced with an even less offensive RB for large parts!
A pair of strikers that can't finish or stay fit for any length of time CB and CW.

Our offensive play consists of PVA, Wilf and Ayew, and people want PVA dropped, with Wilf double or triple marked!

Gregz41 10-02-2020 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrayP41ace (Post 15101120)
But you've spent 6 months moaning about how defensive we are?

So when our 1st choice left back comes back, who is more attacking and certainly offers us more going forward, he shouldn't play because a central player out of position (which is credit to him, but largely why he has been praised as much as he had) played better than anyone else (which wasn't difficult) for a month? When your fullbacks offer the attacking threat the midfielders need to offer the cover. We play 3 CM's in the same way Liverpool do, only theirs are infinitely better than ours, along with their full backs and forwards obviously.

The problem we are having this year is that our RB is dreadful past the half way line. There is zero threat from that side.
By having no threat on the right and nothing on the left side bar Wilf, teams are doubling up and taking him completely out the game.
It's not a surprise that Wilf had more impact in the Sheff Utd game with PVA back, than the previous 4/5 games without him.

The way we approach games is due to the personnel we have:
An attacking LB, that can't defend - PVA
A RW that is very defensive - AT
A defensive RB that cannot offer any threat going forward - JW, and he was replaced with an even less offensive RB for large parts!
A pair of strikers that can't finish or stay fit for any length of time CB and CW.

Our offensive play consists of PVA, Wilf and Ayew, and people want PVA dropped, with Wilf double or triple marked!

Agree with this, especially about the shambles our right hand side has become. PVA, for all his faults is good going forward. We desperately need more attacking outlets in the team.

aj4england 10-02-2020 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrayP41ace (Post 15101120)
But you've spent 6 months moaning about how defensive we are?

So when our 1st choice left back comes back, who is more attacking and certainly offers us more going forward, he shouldn't play because a central player out of position (which is credit to him, but largely why he has been praised as much as he had) played better than anyone else (which wasn't difficult) for a month? When your fullbacks offer the attacking threat the midfielders need to offer the cover. We play 3 CM's in the same way Liverpool do, only theirs are infinitely better than ours, along with their full backs and forwards obviously.

The problem we are having this year is that our RB is dreadful past the half way line. There is zero threat from that side.
By having no threat on the right and nothing on the left side bar Wilf, teams are doubling up and taking him completely out the game.
It's not a surprise that Wilf had more impact in the Sheff Utd game with PVA back, than the previous 4/5 games without him.

The way we approach games is due to the personnel we have:
An attacking LB, that can't defend - PVA
A RW that is very defensive - AT
A defensive RB that cannot offer any threat going forward - JW, and he was replaced with an even less offensive RB for large parts!
A pair of strikers that can't finish or stay fit for any length of time CB and CW.

Our offensive play consists of PVA, Wilf and Ayew, and people want PVA dropped, with Wilf double or triple marked!

Good post this. The flip side however could be said that a Pulis approach of play your best defenders and work around a clean sheet is the starting point that we need to survive. With that in mind would Ridewald be better than PVA for that focus? Probably.

In terms of Jairo, we really don't know how good he can be in midfield. There surely is also a case that Ridewald plays at LB and PVA infront of him. PVA has the extra burst of pace that perhaps Jairo or Macca or Mcarthy do not have to cause defence trouble. Or that Jairo comes in to centre midfield in place of any of the 3 that started on Sat.

We have however looked a far worse team with Kouyate out of the side than we did when he was in it and Luka over him has made us far worse, rather than Ridewald abscence.

For me we should have Kouyate and Ridewald in midfield, then you can choose to have any of the other 3 or Meyer. Play your best technical midfielders, particularly at home when we know a few wins could see us home and dry. You can always go more defensive if it doesn't work.

In relation to your point about lack of attacking force down the right, would Kouyate at RB be worse than Ward?

AJ 10-02-2020 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnsonpen (Post 15099858)
PVA mistakes are costing us goals. Simple. Hope Kelley is back soon because at CH he always makes a couple of stand out stops that probably save us goals and Cahill is also making mistakes. Jairo will get better at LB as will Kelley at CH

Never thought I would see that in print, but I agree.

sbds18 10-02-2020 11:18 AM

With current form, I'd want to see Jairo playing instead of Luka. I'm a big fan of Luka, but we haven't seen anything resembling his best form this season. Together with Kouyate and one of the James McArth's that seems a more balanced midfield to me, in the short term, and when Schlupp is back he can take the McArth spot, gives more energy and forward momentum.

(This is all assumed Roy won't change the formation to have 2 strikers).

Spindle 10-02-2020 11:51 AM

PVA is a terrible passer of the ball and he often gives it away when our entire side is up the pitch. His best quality is his pace, it certainly isn't tackling. I prefer Riedewald, just a better passer and tackler.

philsick 10-02-2020 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrayP41ace (Post 15101120)
But you've spent 6 months moaning about how defensive we are?

So when our 1st choice left back comes back, who is more attacking and certainly offers us more going forward, he shouldn't play because a central player out of position (which is credit to him, but largely why he has been praised as much as he had) played better than anyone else (which wasn't difficult) for a month? When your fullbacks offer the attacking threat the midfielders need to offer the cover. We play 3 CM's in the same way Liverpool do, only theirs are infinitely better than ours, along with their full backs and forwards obviously.

The problem we are having this year is that our RB is dreadful past the half way line. There is zero threat from that side.
By having no threat on the right and nothing on the left side bar Wilf, teams are doubling up and taking him completely out the game.
It's not a surprise that Wilf had more impact in the Sheff Utd game with PVA back, than the previous 4/5 games without him.

The way we approach games is due to the personnel we have:
An attacking LB, that can't defend - PVA
A RW that is very defensive - AT
A defensive RB that cannot offer any threat going forward - JW, and he was replaced with an even less offensive RB for large parts!
A pair of strikers that can't finish or stay fit for any length of time CB and CW.

Our offensive play consists of PVA, Wilf and Ayew, and people want PVA dropped, with Wilf double or triple marked!

I didn't say dont play pva I said jairo deserved a place in the team over luka or McCarthy in midfield especially if we're thinking long term.

Crozzy71 10-02-2020 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spindle (Post 15101223)
PVA is a terrible passer of the ball and he often gives it away when our entire side is up the pitch. His best quality is his pace, it certainly isn't tackling. I prefer Riedewald, just a better passer and tackler.

Yep, this.

Timbo 10-02-2020 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PemboExpress (Post 15099569)
Jairo may have been voted potm but we have not won a game in 2020 and it was little more than a vote for someone who exceeded low expectations. Let's not pretend he set the month on fire.

This is the way I see it too. JR did much better than I thought but did not make himself undroppable, although that said I would have had no problem if he had continued in place of Luka or McCarthy

TennesseeKing 10-02-2020 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Timbo (Post 15101255)
This is the way I see it too. JR did much better than I thought but did not make himself undroppable, although that said I would have had no problem if he had continued in place of Luka or McCarthy

There were definitely players far more deserving of being dropped (the two you mention are two of the better examples). One of my worries with our extended poor form is that Hodgson when he first joined us wasn't afraid of dropping underperforming players. It kept players on their toes and removed any complacency that may have existed. He dropped Puncheon, Hennessey and I think a couple of others early on I believe?

That is quite clearly not happening now, and when he brings players back in that aren't performing for players that whilst maybe not "undroppable" form wise probably didn't deserve to be replaced immediately. It's likely to cause resentment within the squad from players who feel like they haven't been given the same opportunities as underperforming favourites.

As a result, is our form actually like to pick up again any time soon? It's certainly a worrying trend.

Timbo 10-02-2020 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TennesseeKing (Post 15101264)
There were definitely players far more deserving of being dropped (the two you mention are two of the better examples). One of my worries with our extended poor form is that Hodgson when he first joined us wasn't afraid of dropping underperforming players. It kept players on their toes and removed any complacency that may have existed. He dropped Puncheon, Hennessey and I think a couple of others early on I believe?

That is quite clearly not happening now, and when he brings players back in that aren't performing for players that whilst maybe not "undroppable" form wise probably didn't deserve to be replaced immediately. It's likely to cause resentment within the squad from players who feel like they haven't been given the same opportunities as underperforming favourites.

As a result, is our form actually like to pick up again any time soon? It's certainly a worrying trend.

Good point

CharlieCPFC 29-02-2020 03:50 PM

Needs a run of games in the middle, so good in possession and reads the game so well. Fair play to Hodgson for giving him a run, the easy option would've been to bring Luka on. Good to see Jairo getting involved with the fans at the end too.

917L 29-02-2020 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlieCPFC (Post 15119817)
Needs a run of games in the middle, so good in possession and reads the game so well. Fair play to Hodgson for giving him a run, the easy option would've been to bring Luka on. Good to see Jairo getting involved with the fans at the end too.

However he very poor in comparison to McCarthy, and opart of the reason we gave up midfield in the second half

Showed nothing to suggest he would be the answer to our lack of a play maker

Stellavista 29-02-2020 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlieCPFC (Post 15119817)
Needs a run of games in the middle, so good in possession and reads the game so well. Fair play to Hodgson for giving him a run, the easy option would've been to bring Luka on. Good to see Jairo getting involved with the fans at the end too.

Yes. He just needs to impose himself a bit more in midfield. He's young, and it will come. He has the potential to be an important player for us. Pleased for him.

carter 29-02-2020 03:53 PM

I love the sliding interceptions he makes

CharlieCPFC 29-02-2020 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 917L (Post 15119821)
However he very poor in comparison to McCarthy, and opart of the reason we gave up midfield in the second half

Showed nothing to suggest he would be the answer to our lack of a play maker

Seriously?

He did a good job in my eyes and recycles possession well. Give him a run of games in the middle like McCarthy has and you'll see what he's capable of in his more natural position.

biggus mickus 29-02-2020 03:58 PM

So many managers, so many know better.

How many manage a Premier football team?

CP-RJW 29-02-2020 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biggus mickus (Post 15119840)
So many managers, so many know better.

How many manage a Premier football team?

Not ‘so many’ in Jairo’s case to be fair, just Roy and 4 games of FDB.

917L 29-02-2020 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CharlieCPFC (Post 15119836)
Seriously?

You don't think he was poor compared to McCarthy?

CharlieCPFC 29-02-2020 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 917L (Post 15119854)
You don't think he was poor compared to McCarthy?

I rate McCarthy and thought he was excellent today so comparing the two for me is pointless. Compare Jairo's performances to Lukas for example who gets gametime every week, that would be a better comparison.

Gregz41 29-02-2020 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 917L (Post 15119821)
However he very poor in comparison to McCarthy, and opart of the reason we gave up midfield in the second half

Showed nothing to suggest he would be the answer to our lack of a play maker

What on earth? Composure and made lots of great interceptions. Unlucky his tackle put Maupay in, but that's just one of those things.

Max_Power 29-02-2020 04:35 PM

Think it’s worth remembering he’s just come in at central midfield when he’s basically not played for two years, had a great run at left back and been dropped again.

Think there’s a lot to be said for his attitude since he’s been here - always been keen to stick around and earn a place in the team.

Think we’d have a real Sorloth situation on our hands if we let him go without giving it some serious thought. Think he’s got a real part to play for us as the rest of our team literally retires around him.

Stavros 69 29-02-2020 04:36 PM

He looked totally lost to me in MF.
This is why he needs game time.

Old Joe Paxton 29-02-2020 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 917L (Post 15119821)
However he very poor in comparison to McCarthy, and opart of the reason we gave up midfield in the second half

Showed nothing to suggest he would be the answer to our lack of a play maker

Awful, showy, presumptive analysis lacking in any Intellectual with a prior agenda.
Are you a Telegraph journalist?

GB2506 29-02-2020 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 917L (Post 15119821)
However he very poor in comparison to McCarthy, and opart of the reason we gave up midfield in the second half

Showed nothing to suggest he would be the answer to our lack of a play maker

No idea what you watched. He won so many interceptions and some nice touches/passes. It’s his first game in midfield for years and looked comfortable.

CP-RJW 29-02-2020 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Max_Power (Post 15119911)
Think it’s worth remembering he’s just come in at central midfield when he’s basically not played for two years, had a great run at left back and been dropped again.

Think there’s a lot to be said for his attitude since he’s been here - always been keen to stick around and earn a place in the team.

Think we’d have a real Sorloth situation on our hands if we let him go without giving it some serious thought. Think he’s got a real part to play for us as the rest of our team literally retires around him.

He’s 23, that’s the key point. Need to hang onto him for when our 30+ year old midfielders aren’t up to ou anymore.

TennesseeKing 29-02-2020 04:41 PM

He looks like he's going to fit seamlessly into midfield as one or two of the others are phased out in the next year or two. Vitally important we don't lose him.

chateauferret 29-02-2020 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GB2506 (Post 15119917)
No idea what you watched. He won so many interceptions and some nice touches/passes. It’s his first game in midfield for years and looked comfortable.

I think the first quarter of an hour he looked a bit out of it and the team was struugling to play differently, with weed getting a good spell. Settled in well though afyrt that and the goal raised everything about a major third.

917L 29-02-2020 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old Joe Paxton (Post 15119916)
Awful, showy, presumptive analysis lacking in any Intellectual with a prior agenda.
Are you a Telegraph journalist?

Or an opinion based on watching the game.

Are you a smart arsed twat? (Rhetorical)

OneSize 29-02-2020 04:52 PM

Thought he struggled to get in the game for the first 15mins but was very good after that.

NickinOx 29-02-2020 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneSize (Post 15119950)
Thought he struggled to get in the game for the first 15mins but was very good after that.

Roy did say he’d had the same virus as Luka, so that might have played a role.

NickinOx 29-02-2020 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 917L (Post 15119821)
However he very poor in comparison to McCarthy, and opart of the reason we gave up midfield in the second half

Showed nothing to suggest he would be the answer to our lack of a play maker

He did look poorer than McCarthy, however, Roy did say that he’d had a virus like Luka.

Nostrils 29-02-2020 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NickinOx (Post 15119994)
He did look poorer than McCarthy, however, Roy did say that he’d had a virus like Luka.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NickinOx (Post 15119992)
Roy did say he’d had the same virus as Luka, so that might have played a role.

I'm not sure which one's my favourite, maybe the second :D

NickinOx 29-02-2020 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nostrils (Post 15120009)
I'm not sure which one's my favourite, maybe the second :D

:supergrin:

Golf Boy 29-02-2020 05:36 PM

I’d like to see him further up the pitch

st albans 29-02-2020 05:44 PM

As someone that was there, thought he did very well. Seemed to fly in to a few tackles and looked good on the ball

gilesy14 29-02-2020 05:45 PM

He was f*cking exceptional today. His reading of the game & ball retention a breath of fresh air. Anyone saying otherwise just doesn’t understand the modern game.

gilesy14 29-02-2020 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GB2506 (Post 15119917)
No idea what you watched. He won so many interceptions and some nice touches/passes. It’s his first game in midfield for years and looked comfortable.

Exactly this.

palaceboy1 29-02-2020 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gilesy14 (Post 15120030)
He was f*cking exceptional today. His reading of the game & ball retention a breath of fresh air. Anyone saying otherwise just doesn’t understand the modern game.

Well said that man !!!

GRAND UNION 29-02-2020 06:11 PM

Had a good game, should keep Luka out next week but you know uncle Roy will put a stop to that.


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