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  #201  
Old 30-07-2013, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by tommyg1234 View Post
I disagree with you on this point. Tottenham have just rejected 100 million euros, thats quite a big difference to the amount we got for Wilf and they still didn't take it.

Also, why would Zaha have sulked and not got us through the play offs? He's been playing for us since he was a tiny kid, look how much promotion meant to him. Fair enough, if he'd handed in a transfer request, we wouldn't have had a lot of choice, but he didnt.

Big difference? Bale could be worth a lot more to Spurs if he stays and gets them in the Champions League and pushing for the title (which world class players do).

However. Spurs can keep turning it down - the end result. An unhappy player. He will either sign a ridiculous contract with Spurs (Cant see it), or he will be a Madrid player. Turning the offer down is irrelevant... They will have to start talking to them eventually when Bale turns round and says let me go. Spurs have the luxury of another 2.5 weeks - we were mid-season.

You saw how Zaha dipped when all the specualtion started - then boom back up again, culminating in the play-offs.
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  #202  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:00 PM
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No, you're just getting stressed because not everyone agrees with you.
Can you find me any example of something I've said that suggests I may be stressed?
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  #203  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by tommyg1234 View Post
Say we hadn't have sold Wilf and we'd been promoted, would you still accept it if we sold Zaha now for 15 million?
This sort of what if is pointless. We have no idea of the noises coming from the player and his agent about moving. We sold him when his stock was high. It then dipped. Here's another question for you. Do you think if we'd failed to reach the playoffs we'd be able to sell for 15 million + now?
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  #204  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by eagle mart View Post
Big difference? Bale could be worth a lot more to Spurs if he stays and gets them in the Champions League and pushing for the title (which world class players do).

However. Spurs can keep turning it down - the end result. An unhappy player. He will either sign a ridiculous contract with Spurs (Cant see it), or he will be a Madrid player. Turning the offer down is irrelevant... They will have to start talking to them eventually when Bale turns round and says let me go. Spurs have the luxury of another 2.5 weeks - we were mid-season.

You saw how Zaha dipped when all the specualtion started - then boom back up again, culminating in the play-offs.
Zaha could've been worth a lot more to us should we have been in our Premier League squad.

Zaha's form dipped after the transfer in my opinion. The fact that he knew he was going to be at United come the end of the season looked like it had a negative impact on his performances up until the Play-offs, where he was instrumental in getting us up, like you said.
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  #205  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by tommyg1234 View Post
Of course, he was always going to move on at some point, it just didn't have to be now. Wilf's said in countless interviews that he was happy at Palace and his future was in our hands. Like I said, I think we should've kept him until the end of the season, re-assessed the situation and then make a decision.

Say we hadn't have sold Wilf and we'd been promoted, would you still accept it if we sold Zaha now for 15 million?
The public message would have been related to what the board was telling him in private. You are mistaken if you think Wilf and his team would have said "sure boss, I'll stay, don't worry about my united offer - I'm sure they'll come back". You seize those opportunities with both hands.

I honestly still think 15 mill + add-ons is a good price for the selling club for someone as raw and young as Wilf, but I know I'm in the minority on that and most would say 20 + add-ons.

20-20 hindsight is a great thing. So I will ask you a question - if Wilf had broken his leg in March and we'd not got promoted, would you be happy the board didn't sell him for the reported 15 million?
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  #206  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by brighton_eagle View Post
This sort of what if is pointless. We have no idea of the noises coming from the player and his agent about moving. We sold him when his stock was high. It then dipped. Here's another question for you. Do you think if we'd failed to reach the playoffs we'd be able to sell for 15 million + now?
In that case, your question is equally as pointless. However, yes, I do think we could've sold him for 15 mil now, that's how good a player he is.
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  #207  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted by tommyg1234 View Post
In that case, your question is equally as pointless. However, yes, I do think we could've sold him for 15 mil now, that's how good a player he is.
I think without the playoffs, we'd struggle right now to get anywhere near that sort of money for a player with, as far as the big boys are concerned, half a season's good form.

My personal opinion of Wilf is that he is destined for the very top, but that's not the point. We got good money for him, with a nice sell on clause, so if he does a Bale, we stand to gain another 20 million or so.
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  #208  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:09 PM
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Originally Posted by CaterhamEagle View Post
The public message would have been related to what the board was telling him in private. You are mistaken if you think Wilf and his team would have said "sure boss, I'll stay, don't worry about my united offer - I'm sure they'll come back". You seize those opportunities with both hands.

I honestly still think 15 mill + add-ons is a good price for the selling club for someone as raw and young as Wilf, but I know I'm in the minority on that and most would say 20 + add-ons.

20-20 hindsight is a great thing. So I will ask you a question - if Wilf had broken his leg in March and we'd not got promoted, would you be happy the board didn't sell him for the reported 15 million?
It depends on how likely he was to recover from it. We took the safe option, in my eyes we should've gambled, and based on where we find ourselves now, it looks as though it would've paid off.
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  #209  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:10 PM
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I disagree with you on this point. Tottenham have just rejected 100 million euros, thats quite a big difference to the amount we got for Wilf and they still didn't take it.

Also, why would Zaha have sulked and not got us through the play offs? He's been playing for us since he was a tiny kid, look how much promotion meant to him. Fair enough, if he'd handed in a transfer request, we wouldn't have had a lot of choice, but he didnt.
I'm getting fed up with all these people who think they know better than our owners/manager do, if you do go buy a club and show us how it is done, Have people been asleep for the last few years?? Have they had their head in the sand? The owners have always said that CPFC have run on loses since they took over, every season they've had to put their hand their pockets to fund the club, they don't want make a profit, but they shouldn't have to keep funding the club. So yes there may be occasions that a player is sold/realised to make funds available for other players to come in. Did we sell Zaha to allow us to take Dobbie and Phillips, have CPFC 2010 said they did, I don't think they have and I'm not sure that is the case, if it is, then so be it. The fact is we've got to be realistic of the situation of palace.

The ground needs improving, one to allow us more seats (this only really matters if we are in the Premier league), to improve the match day experience (which hopefully drives up what is spent on a match day) and to allow CPFC to do things outside of the football world i.e. conferences/training courses as this all increases revenue for the club. CPFC 2010 have always been trying to increase the number of fans at matches, but while we've been in the Championship that has been difficult, attendances should increase this season which in turn increases revenue for the club.

The Zaha situation, yes I'd rather have Zaha still here, could we've kept him, yes we could. Is it right to keep him from going to a bigger club playing for the Premiership every season and playing in the Champions league in my view no it wouldn't. I doubt he would have sulked, but we would have stood in his way of developing and risk him missing out on a chance. What we did with Zaha is a fantastic advert for the Academy. It shows that young players can develop and get chances in the first team, but we won't hold them back if the right offer came in for us and them.

People need to get over the selling of Zaha; whether or not we are stronger what has happened has happened. We move on and we carry on supporting the team, we support the players that come in and support them and hope we manage to stay up, if we don't, well in my view that is normal for palace, Id rather we did stay up though. Hopefully though the club will be in a much better shape than the previous times and can build to try and go up again, but also have the chance of rebuilding Selhurst.
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  #210  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by brighton_eagle View Post
I think without the playoffs, we'd struggle right now to get anywhere near that sort of money for a player with, as far as the big boys are concerned, half a season's good form.

My personal opinion of Wilf is that he is destined for the very top, but that's not the point. We got good money for him, with a nice sell on clause, so if he does a Bale, we stand to gain another 20 million or so.
Well that sort of thing comes down to opinion. In my eyes, by keeping hold of him, taking a gamble and getting promoted, we'd be in a better position than we're in now. Surely you can't deny that
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  #211  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:12 PM
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What a hypocritical post
Not quite sure how you get that one - presume you suggesting I take a year or so between posting bursts........... I must be very old then
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  #212  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by tommyg1234 View Post
Zaha could've been worth a lot more to us should we have been in our Premier League squad.

Zaha's form dipped after the transfer in my opinion. The fact that he knew he was going to be at United come the end of the season looked like it had a negative impact on his performances up until the Play-offs, where he was instrumental in getting us up, like you said.
His formed dipped after the transfer but so did the rest of the teams , Not sure you can blame the transfer for this or say he wouldn't of got us Promoted without the Transfer as others are saying.
To much conjecture from both sides of the Argument as to what would have happened if Zaha had not been sold in January but he is clearly world class and was worth the risk of keeping to at least the end of the season IMO .
The owners are quids in either way and Palace have 120 million pledged in future payments so I suspect they are not too sad

Last edited by racehorse-80s; 30-07-2013 at 12:24 PM.
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  #213  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:13 PM
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Zaha could've been worth a lot more to us should we have been in our Premier League squad.
He definately wouldnt be here now.

But you are comparing our squad with a month of the window left. Rememebr last summer.

You can only judge our squad on 1st September - not before. And if you think we are going to sign another wilf, and if we dont we wont be as good, you'll need to have a rethink.

We played to Wilfs strengths, much like we played to Ambrose's. When Ambrose left, we were all devastated. But we didnt play with ten men. We adjusted our approach, got in a different type of player - and moved the team on. It will happen again. I imagine Wilf in this team, in the Prem, would see the ball not even half as much as he did in the Championship. We will have a different approach, to a certain extent.

As I left for a beer on 40mins against Millwall at home (we know what happened), I turned to my right, and said this team is going up. This team last season was probably the best side I have seen at Palace since the mid-late nineties. Utter domination of games at times... We have a proper team here, and had a luxury of a player like Wilf - it was fantastic. We were certainly not a one man team and wont be again this season.
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  #214  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:17 PM
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It depends on how likely he was to recover from it. We took the safe option, in my eyes we should've gambled, and based on where we find ourselves now, it looks as though it would've paid off.
Then we are fundamentally going to disagree and I'll leave it with this. Palace have gambled and lost too many times in recent history. Selling him when he was on fire meant we achieved a record fee that really helped our club, and I honestly think we got a really fair price for him. Taking the money when we did offered a security that we haven't had for some time, and guaranteed us the funds to push the club forward when there was certainly no guarantee of promotion at the time. The safety of the club was the most important thing, and on the side I am glad and proud Wilf has the opportunity to make his name.
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  #215  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:19 PM
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Funny how a thread questioning the sale of Zaha and the lack of replacements has been moved to a general thread about Zaha in the General Football Chat bit. This site would put Pravda to shame sometimes.
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  #216  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by brighton_eagle View Post
I think without the playoffs, we'd struggle right now to get anywhere near that sort of money for a player with, as far as the big boys are concerned, half a season's good form.

My personal opinion of Wolf is that he is destined for the very top, but that's not the point. We got good money for him, with a nice sell on clause, so if he does a Bale, we stand to gain another 20 million or so.
This is all very debatable.

Wilf may have played better after being sold or he might not.
We might have made more money in January or we might have made more in June.
He might have stayed with Palace in the Prem, he might not.

It's all about attitudes. I woud have kept him for the sake of football being that he was under contract but clearly the board saw the money as more important. I believe that was a mistake. They would argue no doubt that it was good business for the club and player.
I would say that staying in the Premier league would be better business. We will now struggle to sign quality players as you could predict and will probably go back down. This should demonstrate clearly that you can't sell your best players and replace them on the cheap and expect to win games.
Zaha aside, if the board don't realise soon that you can't do the Prem on the cheap, we will be back in the Championship for another decade. I know this sort of talk is unpopular but it is realistic. We only need to compete with the bottom six.

Last edited by TheJudge; 30-07-2013 at 12:22 PM.
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  #217  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:32 PM
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This is all very debatable.


It's all about attitudes. I woud have kept him for the sake of football being that he was under contract but clearly the board saw the money as more important. I believe that was a mistake. .
Look at our youth system, how has it got to this stage? Not by stitching up our young players. What message would it have sent out? Think. Look at the bigger picture.

It was sensible on all counts. Money, timing and a message to all of our youngsters.

Allasani would never sign another Pro-deal at Palace if we suddenly stitched Wilf up. We sorted ourselves and him out when he signed that deal. We guaranteed ourselves a payday, and Wilf knew he would never see out that contract - it was a mutual understanding. He signed it knowing if a big club came in, at the right time he would move on.

Please dont get all moral about 'contracts' etc. If you were the decision maker we'd lose all our youngsters at 15.

It's all common sense.
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  #218  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:32 PM
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Zaha aside, if the board don't realise soon that you can't do the Prem on the cheap, we will be back in the Championship for another decade. I know this sort of talk is unpopular but it is realistic. We only need to compete with the bottom six.
It's a fair point. I would also point out that because someone feels that we maybe could of realistically got 2-3 capable Premier League players in by now that doesn't mean that they;

a) want to risk administration again.

b) want to do a QPR

c) don't realise that the club is a business and that the owners have personally lost money.

d) think we should be signing Bale, Messi and Ronaldo.
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  #219  
Old 30-07-2013, 12:50 PM
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TheJudge knocked on the bar and pointed to a bottle on the shelfTheJudge knocked on the bar and pointed to a bottle on the shelfTheJudge knocked on the bar and pointed to a bottle on the shelfTheJudge knocked on the bar and pointed to a bottle on the shelfTheJudge knocked on the bar and pointed to a bottle on the shelfTheJudge knocked on the bar and pointed to a bottle on the shelfTheJudge knocked on the bar and pointed to a bottle on the shelfTheJudge knocked on the bar and pointed to a bottle on the shelfTheJudge knocked on the bar and pointed to a bottle on the shelfTheJudge knocked on the bar and pointed to a bottle on the shelfTheJudge knocked on the bar and pointed to a bottle on the shelf
Quote:
Originally Posted by New LP View Post
It's a fair point. I would also point out that because someone feels that we maybe could of realistically got 2-3 capable Premier League players in by now that doesn't mean that they;

a) want to risk administration again.

b) want to do a QPR

c) don't realise that the club is a business and that the owners have personally lost money.

d) think we should be signing Bale, Messi and Ronaldo.
Spot on.
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Old 30-07-2013, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by TheJudge View Post
Spot on.
Transfer window is not over.... Judge (pun intended) them on sept 1st. It's equal to calling Holloway a "**** who messed things up" two months before he got us promoted.
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