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  #141  
Old 04-09-2019, 12:57 PM
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Maybe Lam defied the CCP? Would she do this without their approval?


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  #142  
Old 04-09-2019, 03:26 PM
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HK, will the scrapping of the extradition bill make any material difference? Won't the party just continue to extradite/kidnap/imprison illegally as they have been doing for some time?
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  #143  
Old 04-09-2019, 05:41 PM
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Maybe Lam defied the CCP? Would she do this without their approval?

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The smart money is on Lam leaking the Reuters tape to gain leverage with Beijing (making it look like they've put her in a straitjacket), then agreeing with BJ to make this announcement today in exchange for her and her family's safety.

Either way it's clear the CCP has some deep fissures of which this is more evidence.

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HK, will the scrapping of the extradition bill make any material difference? Won't the party just continue to extradite/kidnap/imprison illegally as they have been doing for some time?
Don't be fooled this is actual withdrawal of the extradition bill. Lam's carefully chosen wording is "propose to withdraw" the bill with LegCo in October. So plenty of wiggle room to change her mind, or for LegCo to refuse to withdraw it etc.The SCcpMP broke the news (a clue in itself that it's not Lam acting independently) as "Lam withdraws extradition bill" which has been parroted by all western media as fact (as I say, it is not). Hong Kongers have quickly seen through this, and whilst cheering the weakness/concession of sorts shown by the gov/CCP are fully aware no such withdrawal has actually taken place.

The kidnapping & imprisonment you refer to has extended to the HK police force (HKPF) who have become increasingly lawless over the last 3 months, yesterday for example appearing to break a protester's neck, possibly killing him (awaiting news on this), as well as sexually assaulting and torturing detainees, battering press and bystanders, tear-gassing children and grannies, the list goes on and on. Hong Kong is presently under de facto martial law in all but name.

So will the withdrawal of the bill make a difference? Yes absolutely, firstly the cracks have appeared in the government/CCP that have been very hard won and now emboldening the protest movement to press for what this has now really become about, which is rejecting the CCP-isation of Hong Kong, with police violence as its figurehead. So expect protests to intensify, as an apparent concession on the original extradition bill in nobody's eyes other than the gov/CCP and their lackeys equates to justice for the crimes of the police.

The western press are mis-reading this as "victory", even the usually excellent Guardian on the protests as linked to above, which it catagorially is not. What they, and people outside HK generally don't fully grasp, is just how strong and united the sentiment of the people here is. So the CCP is in a huge bind - yes it can send in the PLA, it can kidnap and disappear who the **** they like, but there's a perfect storm of 80% of HKers united in their rejection of the CCP, worldwide condemnation of their behaviour and likely sanctions if they wade in, imminent recession in China, CCP party insiders revolting against Xi's hardline, and even the amendment to the US HK trade policy, which they seem particularly shit-scared about judging by the wave of panicked propaganda from CCP state media and wumao (army of social media bots).

The CCP is ****ed, with HK it's just a matter of how they'd like to lose.
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  #144  
Old 04-09-2019, 06:41 PM
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Many thanks for that, HK, and all of your insights. Most illuminating.
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  #145  
Old 04-09-2019, 07:04 PM
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CCP is a particularly malevolent turd in a bowl of global turds.

Abroad at moment on holiday and ignoring Brexit and papers and HK. I hope HKers get some respite from China and some breathing room. Am not hopeful long term though
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  #146  
Old 08-09-2019, 05:43 PM
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Pro-democracy protesters in Hong Kong are appealing to President Donald Trump for help as they march near the US consulate general in the city.

Some are carrying banners reading, "President Trump, please save Hong Kong" and "Make Hong Kong great again".

The protests, now in their 14th straight week, have continued despite Hong Kong's leadership finally meeting one of the protesters' key demands.
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Not too surprising I suppose. CCP under pressure, as HKH has been saying.
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  #147  
Old 08-09-2019, 06:00 PM
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Not too surprising I suppose. CCP under pressure, as HKH has been saying.
The headlines in most western media, BBC and Guardian included, are misleading, predictably. Whilst there were a small minority of people appealing directly to Trump, the To view the link you have to Register or Login, which enjoys cross-party support in Congress and the Senate.

Most HK people don't give a stuff about US politics, so whilst the visible support for Trump has to be tolerated, the Act, if passed, is seen as important leverage against the CCP. Furthermore the large number of US flags was designed expressly to embarrass the CCP - it's sovereign territory awash with its enemy's flags and not a single PRC flag in sight.

The march clearly has rattled the CCP/HK gov as before it had even finished HK gov issued a statement denouncing US "interference in China's internal affairs" (the standard China line on anything), claiming that "One country two systems has been fully implemented in accordance with the Basic Law" (a straightforward lie, as the Basic Law promises universal suffrage and is clear on the limits to police authority, which are being exceeded to a massive degree on a daily basis).
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  #148  
Old 08-09-2019, 06:06 PM
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Some more context To view the link you have to Register or Login. It's not just the content of the story, it's the fact there are leaks coming out of the China government where it has infamously been watertight for decades - signs of a serious leadership crisis in the CCP.

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"Put simply, the Chinese economy is one giant Ponzi scheme that depends on new investors to cover the bad debt, mask its weakness, and con the rest of the world. The revenues derived from the Ponzi are used to launder money for the nation’s leaders and well-connected elite."
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  #149  
Old 08-09-2019, 06:36 PM
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Yes, I have also been listening to what Kyle Bass has to say on it. So much stuff I had missed. Just one example was how Jack Ma must have been "Given an offer he could not refuse", and stripped of all his BABA VIE holdings.

I think the Trump banners were designed to attract most attention, and troll the CCP to best effect.
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  #150  
Old 08-09-2019, 06:49 PM
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A few dumbells like Bernie Saunders have totally lost my support with idiotic statements in support of the CCP where their ideology blinds them.
I've not read this thread for about a week so thanks once again for your updates, h_k. I hadn't seen anything about Sanders supporting the CCP but he has certainly gone down in my estimation.
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  #151  
Old 08-09-2019, 11:59 PM
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I hadn't seen anything about Sanders supporting the CCP but he has certainly gone down in my estimation.
See for example from the other day To view the link you have to Register or Login. Astonishingly and dangerously one-eyed. Many on left and right think that CCP = communist and they align their thinking on China gormlessly to their ideology. China is as communist as the Nazis were socialist.
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  #152  
Old 09-09-2019, 12:45 AM
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"Beijing right now, I think, is in real trouble. They have not only the friction with the U.S., but they have a crumbling economy, and of course they have Hong Kong. And that is really an indication of a political system that is now facing multiple crises."
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  #153  
Old 09-09-2019, 03:32 AM
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Originally Posted by hong_kong_hg View Post
See for example from the other day To view the link you have to Register or Login. Astonishingly and dangerously one-eyed. Many on left and right think that CCP = communist and they align their thinking on China gormlessly to their ideology. China is as communist as the Nazis were socialist.
haha that's laughable. When was the last time Sanders was in China to see this action against extreme poverty? I really wonder what he basis this claim on?
Probably skewed and massaged official Chinese statistics.
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  #154  
Old 09-09-2019, 03:51 AM
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Originally Posted by hong_kong_hg View Post
See for example from the other day To view the link you have to Register or Login. Astonishingly and dangerously one-eyed. Many on left and right think that CCP = communist and they align their thinking on China gormlessly to their ideology. China is as communist as the Nazis were socialist.
Tbf the statement is not untrue. In numbers China has done more to address extreme poverty than any country in the history of civilisation. And in about 30 years. But it was down to Deng.
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  #155  
Old 09-09-2019, 04:45 AM
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It is not the veracity of the headline as an isolated fact that bothers me, but the fact it is the headline, which Bernie uses it to justify a litany of bad things that really ought to bother him, and Americans, a whole lot more, whilst pushing a narrative that "CCP is good". Trump's policy is, intended or not, starting to reduce US dependency on and kowtowing to China whilst putting pressure on the CCP, which are good things. From an HK perspective it's vital whomever is elected in 2020 recognises the importance of keeping these goals front and centre of China policy. Bernie's revolting kowtow is not the ticket, and I am listening keenly to what other candidates have to say.
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  #156  
Old 09-09-2019, 05:55 AM
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Meanwhile the use of clear communication, art and humour have been hallmarks of the "leaderless" protest movement.

This powerful video today:



And a few artistic examples:

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  #157  
Old 10-09-2019, 05:01 PM
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I urge you to watch this through. Warning: graphic violence and NSFW.

Most western media are seriously under-reporting just how violent and criminal the HK police force has become. We are subjected to daily HKPF, HK gov and CCP propaganda telling us force is proportionate, and that all the violence is from pro-democracy protesters.

Many of the spots you see on this video - Tsuen Wan, Taikoo, Yuen Long - I either live now, have lived before or have relatives living now

I stand with Hong Kong, and I hope you will too. This is my home.


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  #158  
Old 10-09-2019, 05:24 PM
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We are subjected to daily ... CCP propaganda telling us ... all the violence is from pro-democracy protesters
Like this disgusting shit.

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  #159  
Old 10-09-2019, 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted by hong_kong_hg View Post
I urge you to watch this through. Warning: graphic violence and NSFW.

Most western media are seriously under-reporting just how violent and criminal the HK police force has become. We are subjected to daily HKPF, HK gov and CCP propaganda telling us force is proportionate, and that all the violence is from pro-democracy protesters.

Many of the spots you see on this video - Tsuen Wan, Taikoo, Yuen Long - I either live now, have lived before or have relatives living now

I stand with Hong Kong, and I hope you will too. This is my home.

That is brutal. Jesus.
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Old 10-09-2019, 06:31 PM
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That is brutal. Jesus.
It is. And this is how HK people react to this. It is not some small-time movement, but penetrates from the eldest to the youngest.

School kids form human chains (every Mon/Tue for past 2 weeks)



And here's 8 shopping malls this evening singing "glory to hong kong", the new de facto national anthem. See whole thread:

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Whilst earlier tonight in So Kon Po at HK stadium folks weren't too keen on the China national anthem as Hong Kong lost 0-2 to Iran in a WC qualifier:

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