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  #3881  
Old 19-09-2019, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrayP41ace View Post
Goals win games. Without goals, you go down.

Allardyce kept us up with what he did, so did the new signings, so did Bentekes 15 goals. Just as simply as saying ďwe would have been relegated regardless of how many goals he scoredĒ we would have been relegated if heíd not scored those 15 goals.

No heís not been worth the total outlay or his wages over the past 2 season for certain, but how much would you say those 15 goals were worth to us in season 1?
Football is a team game and requires the 11 players on the pitch to play well enough to not only prevent the opposition from scoring but also create and score goals to win. It also includes the manager making the right tactical decisions along with help from assistants.

Its way too simple to say "goals win games", you could score loads of goals and still lose if the team doesn't play well enough. AJ scored about 20 in 04-05 and we still got relegated.

Arguably Benteke earned his wages that season as he contributed towards our survival and we possibly may have got our money back if we sold him then. Since then he hasn't done so at all and his transfer value has plummeted.
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  #3882  
Old 19-09-2019, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by ee-ay-ee-ay-ee-ay-o View Post
Not sure this is accurate?

I don't think we have actually paid £16m...that's the value of the deal subject to appearances etc etc
And as he's out on loan his wages or a percentage of them will be paid by the Club he's been loaned too.
So in reality the investment is c.£8m ?
Not bad for potential these days.

The opinion is split on him a bit like Brexit and every other bleeding thing in this day an age.

Oh the joys of discussion and opinion.
The full £16M has been paid (Iím not speculating).
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  #3883  
Old 19-09-2019, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by addicted_eagle View Post
We didnít pay £16 mill. Where did you get that?
It was £6 mill with add-ons which rise to £9 million.Trabzonspor have taken over the contract and have repaid the £6 million.
Before people ask I work in support finance and I know someone in UEFA who deals with player transfers.
Sorry but youíre wrong mate
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  #3884  
Old 19-09-2019, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Rhino View Post
We stayed up that season for a variety of reasons, of which Benteke's goals were only a part. They key reason was sacking Pardew when we did and getting Allardyce, then the following reasons were the signings we made, especially Sakho who completely changed the dynamic of the team. We would have been relegated regardless of how many goals he scored.

Simply saying "Benteke's goals kept us up" is totally misleading and the total outlay on him of £55m, which it will be at the end of this season, was no way near worth it.
Key reason was Pardew going?
Then was the signings including Sakho who was brilliant?

Pardew was P17 W4 D3 F27 A30 GD-3 PPG 0.88
Allardyce no Sakho P13 W3 D1 L9 F12 A24 GD-12 PPG 0.77

If you acknowledge how important the Sakho signing was to our season, the sacking of Pardew is inconsequential. Evidence at the time suggested that Allardyce was not instrumental in signing Sakho.
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  #3885  
Old 19-09-2019, 01:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Rhino View Post
Football is a team game and requires the 11 players on the pitch to play well enough to not only prevent the opposition from scoring but also create and score goals to win. It also includes the manager making the right tactical decisions along with help from assistants.

Its way too simple to say "goals win games", you could score loads of goals and still lose if the team doesn't play well enough. AJ scored about 20 in 04-05 and we still got relegated.

Arguably Benteke earned his wages that season as he contributed towards our survival and we possibly may have got our money back if we sold him then. Since then he hasn't done so at all and his transfer value has plummeted.
But it really is that simple in the grand scheme of things surely? Goals win you games. Clean sheets stop you losing games.

Could is the key word. Of course you could score 4 and the opposition score 5.

But you could never score none and win.

It's one of the reasons goalscorers cost more than defenders. The top 30 transfers of all time has 4 defenders, none in the top 10, and one of those is Harry ******* Maquire

Of course everything plays a part, it's many things from the really small to the biggest. Those 15 goals were up there with the biggest of them.

Agreed on the comments since then, but to dismiss his contribution entirely, based on how little he has the following 2 seasons seems somewhat weird.
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  #3886  
Old 19-09-2019, 01:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcmean View Post
On the first point, I don't think it was ever realistic they look over his contract. They'd pay his wages, and/or a percentage of - and would ahve paid us a loan fee too - and/or plus a reported £6 million fee agreed in advance for his transfer.

And on the basis point, I'm afraid not. Case in point - Lukaku went from Man U to Inter for £73/74 million, Transfermarkt have the fee as £58 million

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And that is why I try to look at several websites for my information. Most of it will be generated from the same source but there will be the odd one like your example which warrants further investigation.
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  #3887  
Old 19-09-2019, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Eagle96 View Post
The full £16M has been paid (Iím not speculating).
Not saying you dont, but can you confirm where you got your information?
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  #3888  
Old 19-09-2019, 05:22 PM
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Most of the info is here:

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While he has only played 20 games for us who knows whether playing for another club on loan counts or not. If the figures are to be believed we have paid at least £14.4m.
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  #3889  
Old 19-09-2019, 06:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by firesign View Post
Iíve stuck £1 on Sorloth to be first goal scorer in tonightís Europa league game - 11/1
Only a £1

Club spent far more than that when we gambled on him
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  #3890  
Old 19-09-2019, 07:57 PM
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They lost 1-0
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  #3891  
Old 19-09-2019, 09:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eagle96 View Post
Sorry but youíre wrong mate
Iím not. If i am prove it.

Also transfermarkt was set up in the front room of some German guys house. If you go through the site itís filled with inaccuracies and most are speculations, assumptions or what the press have stated.

Sorloths contract has been taken over but it wonít get full clearance till later. This is often the case with deals like this. When Ryan Woods went from Brentford to Stoke they paid a loan fee till January and then signed him permanently in January. The Sorloth deal is similar to that. Itís basically a finance regulation to stay within FFP over a financial year.
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  #3892  
Old 19-09-2019, 10:50 PM
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You are the guy with the proof via your mate in UEFA so up to you to provide the evidence.

Looking at the Palace accounts for 2017/18 the increase in intangible fixed assets is in line with the reported sums we paid for Riedewald, Sakho, Jach and Sorloth, so I am happy with the higher figure.
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  #3893  
Old 19-09-2019, 11:55 PM
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Originally Posted by addicted_eagle View Post
Iím not. If i am prove it.

Also transfermarkt was set up in the front room of some German guys house. If you go through the site itís filled with inaccuracies and most are speculations, assumptions or what the press have stated.

Sorloths contract has been taken over but it wonít get full clearance till later. This is often the case with deals like this. When Ryan Woods went from Brentford to Stoke they paid a loan fee till January and then signed him permanently in January. The Sorloth deal is similar to that. Itís basically a finance regulation to stay within FFP over a financial year.
Transfermarkt?

This isnít a debate mate, we have already paid the full £16M for Sorloth. Go back into my post history if you really want to know how I know.
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  #3894  
Old 20-09-2019, 12:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MFBias View Post
Not saying you dont, but can you confirm where you got your information?
Eagle 96 will have inside info
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  #3895  
Old 20-09-2019, 08:01 AM
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No wonder Parish is so keen to bring players through the academy. It’s the only way to make money from transfers.

Wickham, Riedewald, Sorloth and Benteke! Nearly £60 mil spent with little or no return!
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  #3896  
Old 20-09-2019, 08:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim View Post
No wonder Parish is so keen to bring players through the academy. Itís the only way to make money from transfers.

Wickham, Riedewald, Sorloth and Benteke! Nearly £60 mil spent with little or no return!
Not sure about that, Bentekes goals in his first season arguably kept us up and Wickham got us to an FA Cup Final

Riedewald and Sorloth are still young enough to come good and were relatively cheap additions
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  #3897  
Old 20-09-2019, 08:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Harry Holmesdale View Post
Not sure about that, Bentekes goals in his first season arguably kept us up and Wickham got us to an FA Cup Final

Riedewald and Sorloth are still young enough to come good and were relatively cheap additions
I wouldnít say £25 mil combined is cheap!
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  #3898  
Old 20-09-2019, 12:55 PM
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I donít think I can request UEFA paperwork just to prove something on here. If someone whose job it is is to look at the transactions of cross country transfers says that the fee was £12 million then iím Taking their word. If someone can prove otherwise then go ahead.
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  #3899  
Old 20-09-2019, 01:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim View Post
I wouldnít say £25 mil combined is cheap!
Exactly, Sorloth Fee should be investigated .
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Old 20-09-2019, 01:45 PM
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I donít think I can request UEFA paperwork just to prove something on here. If someone whose job it is is to look at the transactions of cross country transfers says that the fee was £12 million then iím Taking their word. If someone can prove otherwise then go ahead.
Thatís fair enough but equally Eagle96 source will be good.
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