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View Poll Results: Who do you want as Labour leader?
Rebecca Long Bailey 31 8.24%
Angela Rayner 23 6.12%
Jess Phillips 95 25.27%
Keir Starmer 140 37.23%
Emily Thornberry 23 6.12%
Other (name them in thread) 64 17.02%
Voters: 376. You may not vote on this poll

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  #2001  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:00 PM
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Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
It’s irrelevant anyway she’s got zero chance.

It’s Starmer or RLB and I’m over 95% sure it’s Starmer.
You're probably right and that'll Labour out for at least a decade. Perhaps I can start the Nandy for 24 campaign
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Are you going to pay the 25 quid in order to vote in order to vote in the leadership contest, Eddie?
I honestly don't know. I've been a card carrying Labour member most of my adult life but I left the party at some point after the 17 GE when I couldn't bring myself to vote Labour (I drove 100 miles each way to go back to Redcar to spoil my ballot in protest at my then Labour MP) and I don't feel like there's any easy route back. I want a strong Labour Party who can reunite the party and incorporate people with diverse views finding a place for people like me, CR, Heb and Exiled but too many are too quick to be divisive and I might just sit it out and see what happens. I really don't know.
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  #2002  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:06 PM
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Bad news - Barry Gardiner is not standing!!! Apparently he spent the day ringing MPs and couldn't get the nominations.

Looks like there will be 4 on the ballot. With Thornberry and Lewis likely to withdraw as they struggle to get he 22 nominations.

Kier Starmer; Rebecca Long-Bailey; Jess Phillips; Lisa Nandy
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  #2003  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:06 PM
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Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
Les persuaded me not to quit.

That aside if centrism couldnít stop that and couldnít provide any other alternative they shouldnít keep blaming others. Those politics must have been crap.
Have a word with yourself - you have been blaming centrism repeatedly
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  #2004  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:11 PM
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Originally Posted by eddieskyclad View Post
I disagree with your reality on this one. Starmer will be death in many of the 52 Leave leaning seats that Labour lost last month.
Seeing as you don't even know what his policies are going to be i would suggest your certitude is more to convince yourself then anyone else.
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  #2005  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by eddieskyclad View Post
I disagree with your reality on this one. Starmer will be death in many of the 52 Leave leaning seats that Labour lost last month.
Then again, we may be surprised, and not being Corbyn might be enough for many. Starmer is the potential leader who would most concern Johnson. He's erudite, has held a significant position as Head of the CPS, is calm and logical. Boris's flannel will be exposed. Nandy as deputy. She's young, and has plenty of time to grow into the leadership. Keeping Rebecca Long-Bailey At arms length is the name of the game here. I can't shake the image of Sarah Millican out of my head when I think of her. Barry Gardiner, if he can get the nominations, could well split the Corbyn-inclined membership. But it's a toss up between him and Lavery as to who would have been the least capable candidate. Comedy value, though.
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  #2006  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:13 PM
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Originally Posted by weltklasse View Post
Seeing as you don't even know what his policies are going to be i would suggest your certitude is more to convince yourself then anyone else.
It's because he's toxic in the areas the areas that voted Leave and then voted the Tories in for the first time ever, last month. It's kind of like Labour saying we're listening, we understand you don't want Corbyn but we're ignoring anything you tell us about our Brexit strategy. He just isn't going to be a winner in the Blyth Valley or Durham North West.

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Then again, we may be surprised, and not being Corbyn might be enough for many. Starmer is the potential leader who would most concern Johnson. He's erudite, has held a significant position as Head of the CPS, is calm and logical. Boris's flannel will be exposed. Nandy as deputy. She's young, and has plenty of time to grow into the leadership. Keeping Rebecca Long-Bailey At arms length is the name of the game here. I can't shake the image of Sarah Millican out of my head when I think of her. Barry Gardiner, if he can get the nominations, could well split the Corbyn-inclined membership. But it's a toss up between him and Lavery as to who would have been the least capable candidate. Comedy value, though.
I don't disagree with your Starmer analysis and perhaps I'm overplaying his toxicity but again living in Redcar I wasn't surprised when the country voted leave and when they returned a massive Tory majority last month. In areas like Redcar there's underlying feeling that seems to be playing out in many towns across the North East, North West, Midlands and Wales. I'm not trying to be dramatic about it but I genuinely believe that Starmer is part of that problem regardless of what the polling said it was all about Corbyn. If Labour was serious about listening to the 52 leave voting areas that they have just lost they would not jump straight to Starmer.
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  #2007  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:16 PM
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Originally Posted by eddieskyclad View Post
It's because he's toxic in the areas the areas that voted Leave and then voted the Tories in for the first time ever, last month. It's kind of like Labour saying we're listening, we understand you don't want Corbyn but we're ignoring anything you tell us about our Brexit strategy. He just isn't going to be a winner in the Blyth Valley or Durham North West.
Some of those voters would be happier with Colin Crompton, Charley Chuck or Nora Batty.
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  #2008  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:16 PM
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Originally Posted by eddieskyclad View Post
Bad news - Barry Gardiner is not standing!!! Apparently he spent the day ringing MPs and couldn't get the nominations.

Looks like there will be 4 on the ballot. With Thornberry and Lewis likely to withdraw as they struggle to get he 22 nominations.

Kier Starmer; Rebecca Long-Bailey; Jess Phillips; Lisa Nandy
This is a tragedy.

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  #2009  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Stellavista View Post
Some of those voters would be happier with Colin Crompton, Charley Chuck or Nora Batty.
I don't disagree with this, Nora Batty would probably get more Labour voters in Bishop Auckland than Starmer would (and I edited my response to reply to you too) but seriously what is the path to overturning a Tory majority without voters from Sedgefield voting Labour again?
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  #2010  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:19 PM
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It's because he's toxic in the areas the areas that voted Leave and then voted the Tories in for the first time ever, last month. It's kind of like Labour saying we're listening, we understand you don't want Corbyn but we're ignoring anything you tell us about our Brexit strategy. He just isn't going to be a winner in the Blyth Valley or Durham North West.
The next election will be 2024.

I expect circumstances to be very different.

Think how different the landscape was on December 12 2014 compared to December 12 2019.
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  #2011  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:21 PM
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Possibly but I can't win with you - you use the word progressive to describe your policies and then when I use it you think I'm trying to use it as an insult. You've said I've patronised the city working classes when I'm just trying to differentiate between cities who stayed with Labour and towns who deserted them. There's something about your approach that encourages conflict.

Serious question - how do I refer to you and your politics (and no I don't accept Socialist as Lisa Nandy is a Socialist and yours is a different type of socialism) and how do we define the red wall Labour Towns without you getting your knickers in a twist about me patronising the working class from the cities? And no it isn't about race regardless of what you want to think.
If Iíve got the wrong end of the stick at times I can only apologise. I thought you spoke about progressive politics in a disparaging way, if not fair enough. The same with working class people in cities calling us metropolitans. But again I apologise if not the case.

Iím a socialist in the sense of wanting to get rid of capitalism, I doubt thatís the case with Nandy. I think sheís a social democrat not a socialist.

I think with towns there was a smashing of industry and with it community. I think this has had led to despair and a shift to the right. Not for all but for some. I think to shift that I donít think we should start using nationalism or scale back on fighting for minorities. I think through the GND we should offer new factories and spell out how many jobs that would mean. And building leisure centres, libraries etc
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  #2012  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:21 PM
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Have a word with yourself - you have been blaming centrism repeatedly
I have are times and people said I shouldnít so they canít have it both ways.
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  #2013  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:22 PM
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Keir Starmer's a man, you sick, evil misogynstic pigs.

No chance.

Labour will diversity hire their way into another electoral disaster, thankfully.
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  #2014  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:22 PM
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Originally Posted by adrenalin john View Post
The next election will be 2024.

I expect circumstances to be very different.

Think how different the landscape was on December 12 2014 compared to December 12 2019.
Indeed but round here it will play as a big slap in the face for many and it won't encourage them back to the Labour party. It's dangerous to think those who voted Tory will come running in back with their tail between our legs in 2024.
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  #2015  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:29 PM
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Keir Starmer's a man, you sick, evil misogynstic pigs.

No chance.

Labour will diversity hire their way into another electoral disaster, thankfully.
I'd be very surprised if it's not Starmer.
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  #2016  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:29 PM
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If Iíve got the wrong end of the stick at times I can only apologise. I thought you spoke about progressive politics in a disparaging way, if not fair enough. The same with working class people in cities calling us metropolitans. But again I apologise if not the case.

Iím a socialist in the sense of wanting to get rid of capitalism, I doubt thatís the case with Nandy. I think sheís a social democrat not a socialist.

I think with towns there was a smashing of industry and with it community. I think this has had led to despair and a shift to the right. Not for all but for some. I think to shift that I donít think we should start using nationalism or scale back on fighting for minorities. I think through the GND we should offer new factories and spell out how many jobs that would mean. And building leisure centres, libraries etc
I'm pretty certain the first time I mentioned progressive was only after you defined your policies as progressive so I thought it was a fair description. I used the word metropolitan in it's literal sense (elating to or denoting a metropolis or large city) to attempt to differentiate Labour voters in cities who stayed with Labour in 2019 from Labour voters in towns who didn't vote Labour in 2019. Every word I've used to specifically to differentiate what happened last months in the towns from what happened in the cities has been criticised by you and you've labelled me alt-right. It's clear we're different and have different values but it's also true that we were in the same party and if we don't find common ground the Labour party will struggle.
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  #2017  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:30 PM
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Indeed but round here it will play as a big slap in the face for many and it won't encourage them back to the Labour party. It's dangerous to think those who voted Tory will come running in back with their tail between our legs in 2024.
When they've been completely and utterly f*cked over by them they might.
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  #2018  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:32 PM
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When they've been completely and utterly f*cked over by them they might.
You might be right - but I think this fails to take into account we've been completely f*cked over by Labour too. It's a dangerous strategy and while it might work there's a chance that if Boris plays his cards right he'll win an ever bigger majority in 2024.

It's also an extension of the strategy that failed so badly last month. How many people were saying that people in Blyth Valley or Bolsover could never bring themselves to elect a Tory?
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  #2019  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:52 PM
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Indeed but round here it will play as a big slap in the face for many and it won't encourage them back to the Labour party. It's dangerous to think those who voted Tory will come running in back with their tail between our legs in 2024.
It may indeed be a big slap in the face, today. However all I am saying is circumstances are likely to be very different in 2024 and it is reckless to think today's mood on issues such as Brexit will be the same colour then as they are now.

Your Northern towns maybe thriving paradigms of full employment, global-exporters par excellence with wonderful schools and world class hospitals and not a foreigner in sight.

Or they may be realising the circus might be good for shouting in, but you still have no bread.

Who knows
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  #2020  
Old 09-01-2020, 08:59 PM
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Good to see you buying into the capitalist system Comrade
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