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View Poll Results: How will VAR impact on your watching of Palace games?
It will make it less enjoyable 156 82.54%
It will have no real impact 21 11.11%
It will make it more enjoyable 14 7.41%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 189. You may not vote on this poll

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  #81  
Old 01-07-2019, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by GreatGonzo View Post
Part of teh body in line is a bit like 'Umpire's Call' but then i have heard that some are trying to remove that from cricket too, either hitting or not hitting.
I just don't think offside was ever really designed for such scrutiny. The rule is there so you don't just stand well beyond the last man forcing the defence to cover you. In my opinion and many will disagree with this, if you are going to use VAR for offsides then the rule needs to be something like daylight between the striker and the defender to be deemed offside. Not some forensic examination to see if the strikers big toe was beyond the defenders heel.
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  #82  
Old 01-07-2019, 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted by scro View Post
I just don't think offside was ever really designed for such scrutiny. The rule is there so you don't just stand well beyond the last man forcing the defence to cover you. In my opinion and many will disagree with this, if you are going to use VAR for offsides then the rule needs to be something like daylight between the striker and the defender to be deemed offside. Not some forensic examination to see if the strikers big toe was beyond the defenders heel.
I would agree with that especially for a VAR review. Is a toe beyond part of the heel and the time it takes to get down to that detail is too long. Its where a soft signal comes in for cricket catches, my view is this, is there evidence to show that is clearly wrong?

So the linesman can stand where he is and delay the flag to see is a goal is scored, then flags to either show the offside if no goal, or that he thinks it was offside. The question is then not about whether a fraction of something is on/offside but is the linesman decision clearly wrong, was he clearly beyond or clearly onside etc. That decision should be relatively quick.

VAR was not meant to re-referee games but to correct decisions, affecting results that are clearly wrong.
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  #83  
Old 01-07-2019, 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted by GreatGonzo View Post
Part of teh body in line is a bit like 'Umpire's Call' but then i have heard that some are trying to remove that from cricket too, either hitting or not hitting.
Umpire's call - for hitting or not hitting the stumps on an LBW - is different, though. Hawk-eye is projecting where the ball will travel after it hits the pads; it cannot be certain; eg the ball might swing more than projected. But other uses of technology (eg line calls in tennis) are matters of fact.

Having said that, some of the VAR offside calls are getting ridiculous - and I agree with your general point.
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  #84  
Old 01-07-2019, 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by GreatGonzo View Post
I would agree with that especially for a VAR review. Is a toe beyond part of the heel and the time it takes to get down to that detail is too long. Its where a soft signal comes in for cricket catches, my view is this, is there evidence to show that is clearly wrong?

So the linesman can stand where he is and delay the flag to see is a goal is scored, then flags to either show the offside if no goal, or that he thinks it was offside. The question is then not about whether a fraction of something is on/offside but is the linesman decision clearly wrong, was he clearly beyond or clearly onside etc. That decision should be relatively quick.

VAR was not meant to re-referee games but to correct decisions, affecting results that are clearly wrong.
Agreed. Not least because the point at which the picture is frozen is too arbitrary. In the time between the point at which the player passing the ball first makes contact with the ball and the point at which the ball leaves his foot the receiving player may move from being onside to offside or vice versa. If someone's toe is offside, they are effectively level (if being judged by a human) and that is onside. Personally I agree that the linesman's decision should stand unless clearly wrong - and clearly wrong means you should be able to look at the picture with the naked eye (i.e. without lines drawn across the pitch) and immediately see that the linesman has made a mistake.
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  #85  
Old 01-07-2019, 02:30 PM
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That sounds right. In la Liga last season, linesmen stopped calling offside altogether, leaving it to the VAR. The reason presumably being that if you call it offside and it isn't, it can't be remedied by VAR, obviously - but if you fail to call an offside that turns out to have been so, you can just put the game back to where it was. Of course, it will only ever be checked of a goal is scored.
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  #86  
Old 01-07-2019, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevek View Post
Umpire's call - for hitting or not hitting the stumps on an LBW - is different, though. Hawk-eye is projecting where the ball will travel after it hits the pads; it cannot be certain; eg the ball might swing more than projected. But other uses of technology (eg line calls in tennis) are matters of fact.

Having said that, some of the VAR offside calls are getting ridiculous - and I agree with your general point.
Generally I agree that VAR is not being used in the way it should - to correct clear and obvious mistakes. The simple fact that it takes them 5 minutes to look at it means it can't be clear and obvious to begin with!

As an aside there was a ball in the cricket over the weekend (can't remember which game) that was missed by the batsman and went through to the wk. In the last 3 feet before it got to the wk it veered about 6 inches. There's no way any hawkeye system would have predicted that!
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