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  #1  
Old 14-05-2019, 06:16 PM
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Premier League stats for Palace players

Taken from the Premier League site these are our top performers in various categories with a couple of honourable mentions. Starting with the General section:

Goals: Luka 12 - Wilf 10
Assists: Jimmy Mac 6 - Wilf 5
Appearances: Jimmy Mac, Luka and Andros all on 38 games
Minutes Played: Luka 3,420 - PvA 3,197 - AWB 3,135 (Jimmy Mac, Wilf and Andros all did over 3,000 minutes)
Yellow Cards: Luka 10 - Wilf 8
Red Cards AWB and Wilf 1 each
Substituted On: Max 14 - Schlupp and Sorloth 12 each
Substituted Off: Jimmy Mac 15 - Andros 13 - Max 12 - Ayew 11
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Last edited by dave_who_ru; 14-05-2019 at 06:22 PM.
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Old 14-05-2019, 06:25 PM
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So, Wilf doesn't get "assists" for the penalties he wins, I guess.
Cos five strikes me as miles off. How many goals did we score in which he wasn't instrumental, I wonder?
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Old 14-05-2019, 06:32 PM
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Now Attack:

Shots: Wilf 73 - Andros 63 (proper forwards out of sight!)
Shots on Target: Wilf 27 - Luka 25 - Andros 19 (then a big gap)
Hit Woodwork: Luka 4 - Andros 3 (even Bene got 2)
Goals from Header: Bene, Jimmy Mac, Schlupp, Tomkins and Ward all got 1
Goals from Penalty: Luka 10 (no contest)
Goals from Freekick: Luka 1
Offsides: Wilf 16 - Michy 12
Touches: Luka 2,718 - PvA 2,388 - AWB 2,286
Passes: Luka 1,986 - PvA 1,610
Through Balls: Wilf 6 - PvA 5 - Jimmy Mac 4
Crosses: Luka 185 - Andros 161 (the rest over 100 behind)
Corners Taken: Luka 143 - Andros 38
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Old 14-05-2019, 06:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave_who_ru View Post
Taken from the Premier League site these are our top performers in various categories with a couple of honourable mentions. Starting with the General section:

Goals: Luka 12 - Wilf 10
Assists: Jimmy Mac 6 - Wilf 5
Appearances: Jimmy Mac, Luka and Andros all on 38 games
Minutes Played: Luka 3,420 - PvA 3,197 - AWB 3,135 (Jimmy Mac, Wilf and Andros all did over 3,000 minutes)
Yellow Cards: Luka 10 - Wilf 8
Red Cards AWB and Wilf 1 each
Substituted On: Max 14 - Schlupp and Sorloth 12 each
Substituted Off: Jimmy Mac 15 - Andros 13 - Max 12 - Ayew 11
Surely Wilf got several assists on Saturday, so how come he only ends up with 5? Or does it depend on your definition of “assist”?
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Old 14-05-2019, 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by El Aguila View Post
So, Wilf doesn't get "assists" for the penalties he wins, I guess.
Cos five strikes me as miles off. How many goals did we score in which he wasn't instrumental, I wonder?
Yep, seems they don't get counted on most 'assist' lists which is a bit bizarre.
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Old 14-05-2019, 06:38 PM
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May have been only 5-10 minutes each, but Sorloth’s 12 sub appearances sure were forgettable.
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Old 14-05-2019, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Aguila View Post
So, Wilf doesn't get "assists" for the penalties he wins, I guess.
Cos five strikes me as miles off. How many goals did we score in which he wasn't instrumental, I wonder?
That would appear to be the case. TransferMarkt have him on 10 assists which definitely includes pens

Wilf had 2 assists on Sunday (PvA and Andros goals) so it is surprising that he only contributed 3 more from 'open play'.

Eden Hazard came top with 15 assists.
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Old 14-05-2019, 06:46 PM
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Luka totting up the points with only Defence and Goalkeeper to go.
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Old 14-05-2019, 06:53 PM
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I am deeply suspicious of football stats and people who wield them carelessly. They are the equivalent of business bores who hide behind marketing jargon and management speak, without ever contributing anything of any real value.

Luka, Macca and Andros all had very productive seasons. The stats back that up, but you don't need the stats to know that they performed well. Stats should corroborate what you see with the naked eye, not the other way around. Wilf is a sublime, electrifying footballer, but some people try to dismiss him based on stats. It's totally wrong-headed.

Don't get me wrong, they definitely play a role in scouting, performance etc, but too many fans and journalists get lost in the numbers.

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Old 14-05-2019, 06:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Hedgehog View Post
I am deeply suspicious of football stats and people who wield them carelessly. They are the equivalent of business bores who hide behind marketing jargon and management speak, without ever contributing anything of any real value.

Luka, Macca and Andros all had very productive seasons. The stats back that up, but you don't need the stats to know that they performed well. Stats should corroborate what you see with the naked eye, not the other way around. Wilf is a sublime, electrifying footballer, but some people try to dismiss him based on stats. It's totally wrong-headed.

Don't get me wrong, they definitely play a role in scouting, performance etc, but too many fans and journalists get lost in the numbers.

Football is an art, not a science.
Correct. But I see more people in the ‘stats are useless and meaningless’ camp than those who are lost in the numbers.
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Old 14-05-2019, 06:58 PM
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I will say that those who dismiss Wilf usually have a very limited understanding of stats though. In that they’ll only look at raw goals and assists, and not expected goals, expected assists, expected build up play, successful dribbles etc. Or they’ll use all time stats, which are completely irrelevant to how Wilf is as a footballer now. Since we can all admit that his end product has come on leaps and bounds in the past 3 years.

Last edited by CP-RJW; 14-05-2019 at 07:00 PM.
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Old 14-05-2019, 07:08 PM
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Now Defence:

Blocks: Jimmy Mac 22 - Sakho and AWB 16 - Luka 15
Interceptions: AWB 84 - Luka 73 (the rest 41 and under)
Tackles: AWB 129 - Luka 89 - Jimmy Mac 84 (Andros next on 62)
Last Man Tackles: Tomkins and PvA 1 each (strange stat given best in the league only achieved 2)
Clearances: Tomkins 182 - Sakho 132 - AWB 129
Headed Clearances: Tomkins 98 - Sakho 82 - AWB 59
Aerial Battles Won: Tomkins 91 - Bene 90 (Sakho down at 51 confirming what I thought - he is weak in the air)
Own Goals: Step forward Kelly with 1
Errors leading to Goal: Tomkins 2 - Wayne, Luka and Jules all score 1 (Ward is shown as 0 which I don't understand)
Penalties Conceded: Sakho 2 - Guaita, Jimmy Mac and AWB all 1 each (again Sorloth shown as 0)
Fouls: Jimmy Mac 61 - Luka 60 - Wilf 44 (and he complains!). Jimmy Mac and Luka are 2 and 4 overall in the league for fouls with Glenn Murray way out in front on 80.
Aerial Battles Lost: Tomkins 91 - Ayew 90 (he only won 32)
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Old 14-05-2019, 07:21 PM
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Finally Goalkeeper. To put it into context Guaita played 20 times. Wayne 18 including 1 sub appearance and Jules once:

Clean Sheets: Guaita 7 - Wayne 5
Goals Conceded: Wayne 26 - Guaita 23 - Jules 4
Saves: Guaita 64 - Wayne 44 - Jules 5
Penalties Saved: Wayne 1
Punches: Guaita 14 - Wayne 11
High Claims: Wayne 14 - Guaita 13 - Jules 1
Sweeper Clearances : Wayne 5 - Guaita 3 (don't ask what one is)
Throw Outs: Guaita 90 - Wayne 66 -Jules 3
Goal Kicks: Guaita 191 - Wayne 143 -Jules 13
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Old 14-05-2019, 07:27 PM
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Some more popped up:

Big Chances Missed: Bene and Andros with 6 each
Dispossessed: Wilf 141 - Andros 75
Clearances off Line : Jimmy Mac with 1
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Old 14-05-2019, 10:21 PM
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What about the stats for the player or players in your team who each game regularly occupies the most opposition attention, poses them the most problems and draws the most fouls?
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Old 14-05-2019, 10:31 PM
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the official premiership Fantasy premier has Wilf on 10 goals 11 assists and hazard on 16 goals and 15 assists on about the same amount of minutes played in the season so almost as good as hazard.
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Old 15-05-2019, 06:09 AM
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the official premiership Fantasy premier has Wilf on 10 goals 11 assists and hazard on 16 goals and 15 assists on about the same amount of minutes played in the season so almost as good as hazard.
I'm not sure 60% more goals from Hazard and overall third more assists really means Wilf's stats are 'almost as good'.
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Old 15-05-2019, 06:24 AM
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Originally Posted by CP-RJW View Post
I will say that those who dismiss Wilf usually have a very limited understanding of stats though. In that they’ll only look at raw goals and assists, and not expected goals, expected assists, expected build up play, successful dribbles etc. Or they’ll use all time stats, which are completely irrelevant to how Wilf is as a footballer now. Since we can all admit that his end product has come on leaps and bounds in the past 3 years.
I was going to post something saying it is not the use of stats that is wrong but the stats themselves, but this post is better.

My favourite recent one was about Guaita and crosses. I like Guaita a lot but I had in my head that he was a bit ropey on crosses and Hennessey was better on crosses, because my eyes and memory put more weight on that one game (forget who it was against) when he clapped a few times. Then a few weeks ago someone put up a load of stats about crosses based on the season dataset, and it turns out he’s really good on crosses. Far more assertive on crosses than Hennessey and with better outcomes as well. Stats that make you reassess and make you think, I like that.
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Old 15-05-2019, 06:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave_who_ru View Post
Now Attack:

Shots: Wilf 73 - Andros 63 (proper forwards out of sight!)
Shots on Target: Wilf 27 - Luka 25 - Andros 19 (then a big gap)
Hit Woodwork: Luka 4 - Andros 3 (even Bene got 2)
Goals from Header: Bene, Jimmy Mac, Schlupp, Tomkins and Ward all got 1
Goals from Penalty: Luka 10 (no contest)
Goals from Freekick: Luka 1
Offsides: Wilf 16 - Michy 12
Touches: Luka 2,718 - PvA 2,388 - AWB 2,286
Passes: Luka 1,986 - PvA 1,610
Through Balls: Wilf 6 - PvA 5 - Jimmy Mac 4
Crosses: Luka 185 - Andros 161 (the rest over 100 behind)
Corners Taken: Luka 143 - Andros 38
'Bene' is Benteke?

Anyway, 'assists' are the biggest non-thing in football. Why anyone even mentions them is beyond me.
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Old 15-05-2019, 08:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave_who_ru View Post
Now Attack:...
Crosses: Luka 185 - Andros 161 (the rest over 100 behind)
...
Reinforces the view that Wilf never crosses the ball - too much running into blind alleyways or stopping before crossing.
Perhaps there was noone to cross to?
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