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  #381  
Old 14-11-2019, 07:39 AM
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Originally Posted by GrayP41ace View Post
You're biased because he's played for us in fairness.

But Mahrez would offer more overall than Zaha (he'd still struggle with whats around him mind)
Having £60m+ to spend 18 months ago, Pep went for Mahrez, and that isn't going to be solely down to his movement, as that as reasonably coachable.

His finishing, passing and vision are all above Zaha's, as well as his final decision making, set pieces, temperament etc. though fair to include his options are better too.
Wilfs shooting, finishing is poor. Has he scored from out side the box like a winger he is should do.
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  #382  
Old 14-11-2019, 09:19 PM
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Originally Posted by CP-RJW View Post
Easily. As opposed to saying that Mahrez is only better at finishing like GF said, I think heís better than Wilf at everything except for beating players and winning fouls. Touch, passing, vision, movement, finishing etc
Nope , more inconsistent than Wilf , opposition never put 3 or 4 on him like Wilf . Better shooting granted.
Roy probably wouldn't even play him lol , poor tackling and off the ball tracking usually
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  #383  
Old 14-11-2019, 10:52 PM
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Originally Posted by CP-RJW View Post
Yep, I would describe that as pretty far in front of us (and I donít see much logic in removing the fact that they won the league from the equation). Particularly when you consider the current circumstances too. We have the joint oldest squad in the league with Burnley, will hobble along to mid table, and will likely go the way of Stoke in the next two or three years if we donít adjust our transfer policy. Leicester have one of the most exciting young squads in all of Europe, and look a great bet for top 6.
Iím holding my hands up, I was wrong.

Chilwell being the perfect example of your last paragraph.
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  #384  
Old 14-11-2019, 11:15 PM
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Originally Posted by chrisophiex View Post
The one thing you don't recognise is that he wants to go. We're not talking about selling a house or a valuable painting. Wilf wants to go, so we can't keep him.
What he wants couldn't be more irrelevant. Under contract and greatly assisting us to one of our best ever Prem starts. All despite us yet again planning and organising for roughly no support whatsoever in the last third. Astonishing really.
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  #385  
Old 15-11-2019, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by aj4england View Post
Nope , more inconsistent than Wilf , opposition never put 3 or 4 on him like Wilf . Better shooting granted.
Roy probably wouldn't even play him lol , poor tackling and off the ball tracking usually
Think you might need to take off the old red and blue specs mate
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  #386  
Old 15-11-2019, 09:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Sleeping Giant View Post
What he wants couldn't be more irrelevant. Under contract and greatly assisting us to one of our best ever Prem starts. All despite us yet again planning and organising for roughly no support whatsoever in the last third. Astonishing really.

Totally see where you are coming from....but as you know, players have all the power, and as you say, he's under contract....so as long as he plays he is keeping his end of the deal.

So it is all about what he wants. He wants to go, and there's no point having someone that doesn't want to be here. It helps no one.
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  #387  
Old 15-11-2019, 09:50 AM
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Wilfs new agent will have a club and salary sorted out before Wilf signs up with them . It might be January but more than likely at the end of the season . Make the most of him now but I hope he doesn’t leave on a sour note .
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  #388  
Old 15-11-2019, 12:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aj4england View Post
Nope , more inconsistent than Wilf , opposition never put 3 or 4 on him like Wilf . Better shooting granted.
Roy probably wouldn't even play him lol , poor tackling and off the ball tracking usually
How are you going to put 3 or 4 players on any City player?

Both Mane and Mahrez are more rounded players than Wilf, and I believe either would be more effective for us than he is (though a *lot* less fun).

That doesn't make Wilf a poor player, as these are top level players we're discussing. It's also not too late for him to continue to develop his game, something he seems to work very hard at doing generally.

I actually thought Pulisic against us showed how effective you can be with about 50% of the skill level of Wilf, but 200% more directness and nous. He was pretty terrifying whenever they were on the attack.
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  #389  
Old 16-11-2019, 04:24 PM
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Originally Posted by aj4england View Post
Nope , more inconsistent than Wilf , opposition never put 3 or 4 on him like Wilf . Better shooting granted.
Roy probably wouldn't even play him lol , poor tackling and off the ball tracking usually
Teams playing Man City cannot afford to put 3-4 players on one player, too many other top quality City players to worry about..
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  #390  
Old 17-11-2019, 10:07 PM
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Originally Posted by eastend eagle View Post
I actually thought Pulisic against us showed how effective you can be with about 50% of the skill level of Wilf, but 200% more directness and nous. He was pretty terrifying whenever they were on the attack.

Agreed.

The top players move the ball quickly up the pitch with the primary aim of scoring. They can do it individually and with the team and have no preference on which option will get them to that aim.

Zaha on the other hand wants to beat 3 or 4 players on his own before he involves the team in any attacking play. This is fine in the Championship when the standard of defenders are poorer and he has more space to exploit. He was doing this for 3 seasons and became our star player and talisman. This was the reason we grew to love him as he was a joy to watch.

The problem now is we have spent over 6 seasons in the top league and the defenders are considerably better with almost no amount of space on the pitch to exploit. Zaha hasnít progressed or adapted his game to the league heís playing in. The frustration on his part is clear to see but by now he should have become a bigger team player. His off the ball work and positioning is terrible and his passing and crossing capabilities are still poor compared to his dribbling and close control skills.

Lastly, as Palace fans we have become accustomed to watching top flight football live in the flesh for several seasons now and we have seen first hand that there are many more rounded and accomplished footballers than Zaha. The bubble has burst.
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  #391  
Old 18-11-2019, 08:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timbo View Post
I agree. I reckon nobody will be prepared to pay big money for WZ. There will be some chancers offering £20-30m and I reckon he will go for that kind of money if he goes at all
Agreed, we are stuck with each other so both sides need to make the best of it.
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  #392  
Old 18-11-2019, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Skiddo View Post
Agreed.

The top players move the ball quickly up the pitch with the primary aim of scoring. They can do it individually and with the team and have no preference on which option will get them to that aim.

Zaha on the other hand wants to beat 3 or 4 players on his own before he involves the team in any attacking play. This is fine in the Championship when the standard of defenders are poorer and he has more space to exploit. He was doing this for 3 seasons and became our star player and talisman. This was the reason we grew to love him as he was a joy to watch.

The problem now is we have spent over 6 seasons in the top league and the defenders are considerably better with almost no amount of space on the pitch to exploit. Zaha hasnít progressed or adapted his game to the league heís playing in. The frustration on his part is clear to see but by now he should have become a bigger team player. His off the ball work and positioning is terrible and his passing and crossing capabilities are still poor compared to his dribbling and close control skills.

Lastly, as Palace fans we have become accustomed to watching top flight football live in the flesh for several seasons now and we have seen first hand that there are many more rounded and accomplished footballers than Zaha. The bubble has burst.

Without wanting to get on his case I do think there are good points in the first para. The very best players can beat a man at will but they take different decisions as they develop. Sterling is a good example. Wilf hasn't really grasped that and as a result he often slows things down and doesn't make the runs, instead wanting it in space on the edge of the area.

It's wrong i think to say he hasn't developed. I think he has worked on different aspects of his game each year Nd improved. Back to your first point. Wilfs ability to open things up from a standing start is valuable when the top teams just can't break open a defence. But the worry for Wilf us that is a supersub role. Also how much do they want to pay for that?

He is special, and especially so for us but I doubt he has done enough to break into the very biggest clubs. Ironically the summer and this season likely clinch that. So mid money love to a second tier club at best is a reality. I would be excited if he stayed but not this distracted/underpowered version that we risk right now. He is not daft, perhaps he can work it out but his advisors?
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  #393  
Old 18-11-2019, 06:42 PM
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Not sure of the comparative ages of Zaha and Leicesters Damari Gray but last season Grays career seemed to have stagnated somewhat mostly down to him not releasing the ball to a teamate at the right time....this season he's playing more as a team player and not trying to do too much on his own....must be down to manager Rodgers......
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  #394  
Old 18-11-2019, 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Skiddo View Post
Agreed.


Lastly, as Palace fans we have become accustomed to watching top flight football live in the flesh for several seasons now and we have seen first hand that there are many more rounded and accomplished footballers than Zaha. The bubble has burst.

Like who??? Wilf clearly cannot get his head together and we have to sell him, but I can't think of anyone better when he is playing well.
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  #395  
Old 18-11-2019, 07:03 PM
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Like who??? Wilf clearly cannot get his head together and we have to sell him, but I can't think of anyone better when he is playing well.
Agree
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  #396  
Old 18-11-2019, 09:04 PM
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Wilfs new agent will have a club and salary sorted out before Wilf signs up with them . It might be January but more than likely at the end of the season . Make the most of him now but I hope he doesnít leave on a sour note .
Too late
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  #397  
Old 20-11-2019, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by eastend eagle View Post
How are you going to put 3 or 4 players on any City player?

Both Mane and Mahrez are more rounded players than Wilf, and I believe either would be more effective for us than he is (though a *lot* less fun).

That doesn't make Wilf a poor player, as these are top level players we're discussing. It's also not too late for him to continue to develop his game, something he seems to work very hard at doing generally.

I actually thought Pulisic against us showed how effective you can be with about 50% of the skill level of Wilf, but 200% more directness and nous. He was pretty terrifying whenever they were on the attack.
Mahrez is not more of a rounded player than Wilf , even with his best season at Leicester he was inconsistent and had vardy drawing a lot of attention . All a matter of opinion of course
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  #398  
Old 20-11-2019, 10:51 AM
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Honestly do not see a top club coming in for him and the rest cannot afford him.
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Old 20-11-2019, 11:37 AM
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Old 20-11-2019, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by aj4england View Post
Mahrez is not more of a rounded player than Wilf , even with his best season at Leicester he was inconsistent and had vardy drawing a lot of attention . All a matter of opinion of course
you just need to look at their relative stats to see Mahrez is a better all round player in terms of goals and assists
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