Home | Forums | Gallery | Twitter
 
CPFC BBS  

Go Back   CPFC BBS Ľ Off Topic Ľ The Politics Forum

Notices

The Politics Forum Discussions that are wholly or mainly concerned with UK politics

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1401  
Old 26-04-2020, 12:17 PM
cockneyrebel cockneyrebel is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 22,878
Rep Power: 21474853
cockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinger1 View Post
China is far more socialist than capitalist, the state still owns large swathes of the economy. I am well versed in socialism but I'd be interested to know how you think the usual pitfalls of socialism can be avoided.
ROFL. China is the driving force of the global capitalist economy. It’s entirely capitalist, an authoritarian version, but capitalist nonetheless. It’s not uncommon to have some state ownership under capitalism.

Last edited by cockneyrebel; 26-04-2020 at 12:21 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #1402  
Old 26-04-2020, 12:30 PM
N Herts Eagle N Herts Eagle is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Poole Dorset
Age: 66
Posts: 12,417
Rep Power: 21474856
N Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
No people are incentivised to make profit. Look around the world. Is the war, dictatorships, inequality, poverty, needless disease, environmental destruction all for human good? Seriously?

The idea that only profit can motivate is another grim outlook on humanity. You must have a fairly depressing view of human beings and humanity.
You miss a point if socialism was successfully introduced in part of the world. Would it end dictatorships poverty etc elsewhere.
Reply With Quote
  #1403  
Old 26-04-2020, 12:31 PM
Stinger1 Stinger1 is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 9,395
Rep Power: 21474844
Stinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
ROFL. China is the driving force of the global capitalist economy. Itís entirely capitalist, an authoritarian version, but capitalist nonetheless. Itís not uncommon to have some state ownership under capitalism.
State-capitalism is just another form of socialism to me but perhaps it doesn't meet your criteria. There really isn't much difference between state-capitalism and socialism although I'm sure you'll point out a few semantics.
Reply With Quote
  #1404  
Old 26-04-2020, 12:34 PM
cockneyrebel cockneyrebel is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 22,878
Rep Power: 21474853
cockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinger1 View Post
State-capitalism is just another form of socialism to me but perhaps it doesn't meet your criteria. There really isn't much difference between state-capitalism and socialism although I'm sure you'll point out a few semantics.
A few semantics lol? China is now the world engine of global capitalism with profit maximisation at the core.

There isnít a single capitalist country without the state having a significant role.

You really seem to have no idea of what socialism is.
Reply With Quote
  #1405  
Old 26-04-2020, 12:35 PM
cockneyrebel cockneyrebel is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 22,878
Rep Power: 21474853
cockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by N Herts Eagle View Post
You miss a point if socialism was successfully introduced in part of the world. Would it end dictatorships poverty etc elsewhere.
Socialism in one country is a bankrupt Stalinist idea. It would never work.
Reply With Quote
  #1406  
Old 26-04-2020, 12:40 PM
N Herts Eagle N Herts Eagle is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Poole Dorset
Age: 66
Posts: 12,417
Rep Power: 21474856
N Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is hereN Herts Eagle Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
Socialism in one country is a bankrupt Stalinist idea. It would never work.
Which brings me to the point I made at the end of the other post. To move to your ideal there has to be some major shift not in one or two 10 20 countrues but the world.
You arguement that Capitlism causes the world ills is applicable if you only have a partial socialist world.
Reply With Quote
  #1407  
Old 26-04-2020, 12:44 PM
cockneyrebel cockneyrebel is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 22,878
Rep Power: 21474853
cockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by N Herts Eagle View Post
Which brings me to the point I made at the end of the other post. To move to your ideal there has to be some major shift not in one or two 10 20 countrues but the world.
You arguement that Capitlism causes the world ills is applicable if you only have a partial socialist world.
I actually agree on that is the scale of the change that would be needed.
Reply With Quote
  #1408  
Old 26-04-2020, 01:06 PM
Stinger1 Stinger1 is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 9,395
Rep Power: 21474844
Stinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
A few semantics lol? China is now the world engine of global capitalism with profit maximisation at the core.

There isnít a single capitalist country without the state having a significant role.

You really seem to have no idea of what socialism is.
What you're talking about sounds more like communism to me. But perhaps point me in the direction of what your favoured brand of socialism and I can offer a more nuanced critique. At the moment it seems you are being deliberately evasive.
Reply With Quote
  #1409  
Old 26-04-2020, 01:14 PM
Golf Boy's Avatar
Golf Boy Golf Boy is online now
I'm not divorced
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: The Baltic Sea
Age: 52
Posts: 44,358
Rep Power: 21474854
Golf Boy Sam the man is hereGolf Boy Sam the man is hereGolf Boy Sam the man is hereGolf Boy Sam the man is hereGolf Boy Sam the man is hereGolf Boy Sam the man is hereGolf Boy Sam the man is hereGolf Boy Sam the man is hereGolf Boy Sam the man is hereGolf Boy Sam the man is hereGolf Boy Sam the man is here
In fairness to the Soviet Union they went from a fuedal backwater to a world superpower without capitalism. Does anyone know if the lot of the average Joe in what was the USSR better now than before?
Reply With Quote
  #1410  
Old 26-04-2020, 01:16 PM
DaveTuttles's Avatar
DaveTuttles DaveTuttles is offline
Banned by Moderators
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Croydon
Posts: 3,644
Rep Power: 8726794
DaveTuttles came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietDaveTuttles came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietDaveTuttles came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietDaveTuttles came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietDaveTuttles came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietDaveTuttles came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietDaveTuttles came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietDaveTuttles came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietDaveTuttles came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietDaveTuttles came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietDaveTuttles came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy diet
Who cares?
__________________
I was 100% correct regarding BLM and have been banned from talking about how correct I was - now endorsed officially by CPFC - July 2nd 2020.
Reply With Quote
  #1411  
Old 26-04-2020, 01:23 PM
Heb 7:4's Avatar
Heb 7:4 Heb 7:4 is offline
Its gonna be a lovely day
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 49,955
Rep Power: 21474855
Heb 7:4 Sam the man is hereHeb 7:4 Sam the man is hereHeb 7:4 Sam the man is hereHeb 7:4 Sam the man is hereHeb 7:4 Sam the man is hereHeb 7:4 Sam the man is hereHeb 7:4 Sam the man is hereHeb 7:4 Sam the man is hereHeb 7:4 Sam the man is hereHeb 7:4 Sam the man is hereHeb 7:4 Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Golf Boy View Post
In fairness to the Soviet Union they went from a fuedal backwater to a world superpower without capitalism. Does anyone know if the lot of the average Joe in what was the USSR better now than before?
I hear it was smashing in Ukraine.
Reply With Quote
  #1412  
Old 26-04-2020, 01:32 PM
Joe85's Avatar
Joe85 Joe85 is offline
Once More Into The Fray
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Republic of Britain & Northern Ireland
Posts: 15,892
Rep Power: 21474844
Joe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveTuttles View Post
Who cares?
Whoa! What a zinger.
__________________
A truce... Bruce

Breathin deep, breathin easy...

Didnít vote for a Brexit.
Reply With Quote
  #1413  
Old 26-04-2020, 01:33 PM
Adlerhorst's Avatar
Adlerhorst Adlerhorst is offline
Ichiro!
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Hertfordshire
Age: 43
Posts: 74,126
Rep Power: 21474854
Adlerhorst Sam the man is hereAdlerhorst Sam the man is hereAdlerhorst Sam the man is hereAdlerhorst Sam the man is hereAdlerhorst Sam the man is hereAdlerhorst Sam the man is hereAdlerhorst Sam the man is hereAdlerhorst Sam the man is hereAdlerhorst Sam the man is hereAdlerhorst Sam the man is hereAdlerhorst Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Golf Boy View Post
In fairness to the Soviet Union they went from a fuedal backwater to a world superpower without capitalism. Does anyone know if the lot of the average Joe in what was the USSR better now than before?
Russia had 8.6% of the world’s GDP in 1913. That’s not exactly a backwater.

It has less than 2% today.
__________________
The Defector looks like no other breaking pitch in the game. It is well-supinated, leaving the right hand of Fernandez at a fastball trajectory before the laws of physics cease to apply and the laws of awesome take over.
Reply With Quote
  #1414  
Old 26-04-2020, 01:37 PM
CP-RJW's Avatar
CP-RJW CP-RJW is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Sheffield
Age: 21
Posts: 21,264
Rep Power: 21474843
CP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is here
I’m shocked by Russia’s gdp today. How the hell is it lower than Italy?
Reply With Quote
  #1415  
Old 26-04-2020, 01:56 PM
fang's Avatar
fang fang is offline
Up On The Triangle
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 9,850
Rep Power: 21474852
fang Sam the man is herefang Sam the man is herefang Sam the man is herefang Sam the man is herefang Sam the man is herefang Sam the man is herefang Sam the man is herefang Sam the man is herefang Sam the man is herefang Sam the man is herefang Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by CP-RJW View Post
Iím shocked by Russiaís gdp today. How the hell is it lower than Italy?
When was the last time you purchased a Russian car, pharmaceuticals, clothes booze, food, shoes, motor bike, manufacturing robots or domestic appliance?
__________________
"This is what we find, This is what we find, the hope that springs eternal, springs right up your behind"
Reply With Quote
  #1416  
Old 26-04-2020, 02:00 PM
CP-RJW's Avatar
CP-RJW CP-RJW is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Sheffield
Age: 21
Posts: 21,264
Rep Power: 21474843
CP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by fang View Post
When was the last time you purchased a Russian car, pharmaceuticals, clothes booze, food, shoes, motor bike, manufacturing robots or domestic appliance?
I’ve had plenty of Russian booze in my time

What about half of Europe’s oil? That’s what comes to my mind about Russia’s economy.
Reply With Quote
  #1417  
Old 26-04-2020, 02:02 PM
cockneyrebel cockneyrebel is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 22,878
Rep Power: 21474853
cockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinger1 View Post
What you're talking about sounds more like communism to me. But perhaps point me in the direction of what your favoured brand of socialism and I can offer a more nuanced critique. At the moment it seems you are being deliberately evasive.
Not at all. I made the point that itís grim that you think this barbaric system is the pinnacle of human development with all the horrors that go with a system that puts profit maximisation at its core. You then deflected by talking about other systems. If thatís how you feel so be it, I just think itís grim.

You also seem to have little idea of what socialism entails. But thatís for another topic.
Reply With Quote
  #1418  
Old 26-04-2020, 02:03 PM
cockneyrebel cockneyrebel is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 22,878
Rep Power: 21474853
cockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by CP-RJW View Post
Iím shocked by Russiaís gdp today. How the hell is it lower than Italy?
Capitalism.
Reply With Quote
  #1419  
Old 26-04-2020, 02:04 PM
CP-RJW's Avatar
CP-RJW CP-RJW is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Sheffield
Age: 21
Posts: 21,264
Rep Power: 21474843
CP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is hereCP-RJW Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
Capitalism.
Yeah, I was under the (false) assumption that Putin was one of its most successful proponents.
Reply With Quote
  #1420  
Old 26-04-2020, 02:12 PM
nicky nicky is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,853
Rep Power: 21474857
nicky Sam the man is herenicky Sam the man is herenicky Sam the man is herenicky Sam the man is herenicky Sam the man is herenicky Sam the man is herenicky Sam the man is herenicky Sam the man is herenicky Sam the man is herenicky Sam the man is herenicky Sam the man is here
Depends what you mean by “capitalism”. To some people it means “Western democracy” and some it means “anything that isnt Good socialism”.
__________________
It is far easier to be wise for others than to be so for oneself
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 07:38 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.