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  #81  
Old 02-08-2016, 01:20 PM
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I point to the Bournemouth game away Boxing day there was something that had altered in the player's attitude. From that game we were not the same team. So I think there is little point discussing which midfield combination is best. But something was lost. New fresh players are needed now, but they need to buy in to what we are about. Otherwise I can see Pardew gone by Christmas.
  #82  
Old 02-08-2016, 01:22 PM
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He got the best out of Puncheon but sacrificed the man who had been keeping Rooney quiet. Net result was we lost. FWIW i thought McArthur should have gone off for Puncheon. However it was Jedi's man who both hit the bar and assisted the equaliser! McArthur slipped and missed Rooney and in teh process lost Mata and Puncheon well he was lost in terms of defensive contribution.

Overall our midfield fell apart as soon as our best player went off.
Punch should have started....we played 3 defensive midfielders which lead to a wingers being isolated and no threat through the middle.
With 3 defensive midfielders and isolated wingers we gave Man United territory and possession with Wayne Rooney having time and space to dominate us...
The way to win was attack....Punch not starting lost us the game...1-0 up but United had so dominated everything they were always going to come back at us with belief...
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  #83  
Old 02-08-2016, 01:22 PM
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That's 100% right he has not been the Superstar you might believe....Punch was the matchwinner the season before!
How long do you think we can get away with using a ridiculously deep defensive line baring in mind Jedinak is going to be 32 shortly, and is getting slower by the month? The poor home form last season has shown that what has worked so well for us is starting to become less and less effective, teams have worked out that when we play at home they can sit deep and watch us be unable to break them down, wait for our one dimensional play to make a mistake and nick a goal or two from us and then shut up shop.

I absolutely love Jedinak, he's one of my favourite ever players, he's a monster amongst men, however his uses are becoming redundant. We are into our 4th season in the premier league now, we can't continue to rely on counter attacking. Jedinak is so poor on the ball that he really cannot be trusted in any tactic other than in a really deep backs to the wall style. It's a shame for sure, but times move on. We need to be able to keep hold of the ball more than we have over the past few seasons, and in turn produce more chances for a striker that do not consist of hitting teams on the break and putting crosses in. Adapt or die.
  #84  
Old 02-08-2016, 01:25 PM
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How long do you think we can get away with using a ridiculously deep defensive line baring in mind Jedinak is going to be 32 shortly, and is getting slower by the month? The poor home form last season has shown that what has worked so well for us is starting to become less and less effective, teams have worked out that when we play at home they can sit deep and watch us be unable to break them down, wait for our one dimensional play to make a mistake and nick a goal or two from us and then shut up shop.

I absolutely love Jedinak, he's one of my favourite ever players, he's a monster amongst men, however his uses are becoming redundant. We are into our 4th season in the premier league now, we can't continue to rely on counter attacking. Jedinak is so poor on the ball that he really cannot be trusted in any tactic other than in a really deep backs to the wall style. It's a shame for sure, but times move on. We need to be able to keep hold of the ball more than we have over the past few seasons, and in turn produce more chances for a striker that do not consist of hitting teams on the break and putting crosses in. Adapt or die.
I'm on a slag Cabaye hit and pro Punch.....why ask me!
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  #85  
Old 02-08-2016, 01:27 PM
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Jedinak, McArthur, Punch would be my starting midfield so it's Cabaye I'm talking about.... carry on yourself off!
Thank **** you're not manager then! Clueless as ****!
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  #86  
Old 02-08-2016, 01:29 PM
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Of course we were better when we had our best defender, midfielder, creative player and striker playing. What team in the league wouldn't be? You talk about those five to justify stats then pin all the bad form on Jedi alone. Quite frankly that is ridiculous. You have an agenda so you seek to use the stats to provide the 'evidence'.
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I disagree that there is no causation.

The stats in themselves might not tell the whole story and yes other things affected those games but there is no doubt that in the games he played we had worse then relegation form. All other players who played in the similar role had FAR better records.
I have no agenda, i have not tried to pin all the bad form on Jedi alone, i was quite clear on that. It remains that when we played our most defensive midfielder who has the worst distribution we had poor form. There are many reasons for that, we had several players missing, however some of it was IMO caused by the way he plays.

People will say that Cabaye was poor in the cup final and why? Because his passing was bad, and it was. For a variety of reasons Cabayes ability to pick a pass to another Palace player was off that game. If it was Jedinak people would say it is just what he is and Mile's passing was just 0.7% better. However in 71 minutes he made the most number of tackles of a Palace player (4, joint with Delaney over 120mins) and only Ward intercepted the ball more (4 times in 120 compared to 3).

A 'poor' game for Cabaye, he was still defensively our best player in terms of stopping the opposition.

Jedi has been huge for us but last summer was probably his time to go and leave at the top. He is on his way down now.
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Old 02-08-2016, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by in-exile View Post
Punch should have started....we played 3 defensive midfielders which lead to a wingers being isolated and no threat through the middle.
With 3 defensive midfielders and isolated wingers we gave Man United territory and possession with Wayne Rooney having time and space to dominate us...
The way to win was attack....Punch not starting lost us the game...1-0 up but United had so dominated everything they were always going to come back at us with belief...
Yup i would have started him. Alongside McArthur and Cabaye. We will never know what that might have resulted in though.
  #88  
Old 02-08-2016, 01:32 PM
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Thank **** you're not manager then! Clueless as ****!
Like who the **** are you and what have you added to the thread? It's a board to discuss and debate...so my view is Cabaye has done **** all so far!
Shit freekicks and shit corners! Give the ball to Punch!
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  #89  
Old 02-08-2016, 01:34 PM
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Yup i would have started him. Alongside McArthur and Cabaye. We will never know what that might have resulted in though.
I had the line up on Saturday for the Final the next day I could not believe AP would try to win the game with such a negative shape....your best team wins a cup final!
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  #90  
Old 02-08-2016, 01:35 PM
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Here we go.. Any thread with Jedi involved massive over reactions and arguments.


We all know he is a legend. Nobody disputes that.


However he is now 4th choice.. On big wages.. 31 years old and no longer suits how we try and play. Sometimes it's time to move on.. And now is the time (remember ambrose!)


Love Jedi.. But he is surplus.
  #91  
Old 02-08-2016, 01:39 PM
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"Respect a player and force him to sit on our bench until the end of his career, dont let him leave for first team football and for the sake of his career" is the usual argument I hear round about this time.
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  #92  
Old 02-08-2016, 01:49 PM
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Jedanik clearly isn't 4th choice. Ledley is nowhere near the player he is. The only reason behind the sale would be financial. As for Mutch we need better but unlikely to get better at this stage of the transfer window being Palace
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  #93  
Old 02-08-2016, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GreatGonzo View Post
I have no agenda, i have not tried to pin all the bad form on Jedi alone, i was quite clear on that. It remains that when we played our most defensive midfielder who has the worst distribution we had poor form. There are many reasons for that, we had several players missing, however some of it was IMO caused by the way he plays.

People will say that Cabaye was poor in the cup final and why? Because his passing was bad, and it was. For a variety of reasons Cabayes ability to pick a pass to another Palace player was off that game. If it was Jedinak people would say it is just what he is and Mile's passing was just 0.7% better. However in 71 minutes he made the most number of tackles of a Palace player (4, joint with Delaney over 120mins) and only Ward intercepted the ball more (4 times in 120 compared to 3).

A 'poor' game for Cabaye, he was still defensively our best player in terms of stopping the opposition.

Jedi has been huge for us but last summer was probably his time to go and leave at the top. He is on his way down now.
That is a more measured view than the one you offered earlier. I don't think Jedi should be a guaranteed starter either, but I think he's still an important squad player. I think Cabaye was overrated by many posters on here, while McCarthur is probably the most effective imo although his form dipped along with many other players.

I can see us selling Mutch, Jedi and Ledley and bringing in two new midfielders - not necessarily this window but over the next two.
  #94  
Old 02-08-2016, 01:57 PM
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Seriously lacking quality in the middle, but who's available and you won't get much change out of 15 Million ? so not sure this is true, Mutch has looked good from the highlights on Eagles Player.
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Old 02-08-2016, 01:57 PM
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Fvck all this bickering, how much do we think we can get for them?

I'm gonna go:

Jedinak - 2m
Mutch - 5m
  #96  
Old 02-08-2016, 02:04 PM
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Fvck all this bickering, how much do we think we can get for them?

I'm gonna go:

Jedinak - 2m
Mutch - 5m
To the right club, Jedi could be worth 6m. Who knows with Mutch.

Edit. How much did Stoke offer for him last year?
  #97  
Old 02-08-2016, 02:07 PM
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Jedinak 3.5 million
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  #98  
Old 02-08-2016, 02:07 PM
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The only reason behind the sale would be financial.
Clearly you haven't seen preseason. Both players imo have looked poor and Jedi's give away at Fulham was so lack luster that it shocked even me. If we want to improve the team we have to get some better players and sadly that means getting rid of a few favorites.
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Old 02-08-2016, 02:08 PM
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Clearly you haven't seen preseason. Both players imo have looked poor and Jedi's give away at Fulham was so lack luster that it shocked even me. If we want to improve the team we have to get some better players and sadly that means getting rid of a few favorites.
I thought Mutch was pretty decent.
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Old 02-08-2016, 02:15 PM
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Fvck all this bickering, how much do we think we can get for them?

I'm gonna go:

Jedinak - 2m
Mutch - 5m
If we get that for Mutch we'll be laughing. QPR stitched us up - again. No more purchases from them please.
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