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  #13821  
Old 23-12-2019, 07:05 PM
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Wouldn’t making food, medicine and other technologies provide even more jobs per dollar than bombs?
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  #13822  
Old 23-12-2019, 07:06 PM
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Or green technologies
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  #13823  
Old 23-12-2019, 07:06 PM
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Or education...
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  #13824  
Old 23-12-2019, 07:07 PM
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Surely there is someone calling for this instead of weapons?
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  #13825  
Old 23-12-2019, 09:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golf Boy View Post
Surely there is someone calling for this instead of weapons?
Ever since WW1 the US has been coining it on weapons production. And despite FDR and Lend Lease in WW2 Britain was virtually bled dry by payment for American arms (which we had to have) . So I don't see them closing that business down for some time.
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  #13826  
Old 23-12-2019, 09:58 PM
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Didn't the RAF just buy some F-35's? God knows what one of them cost!

To answer my own question, apparently £100 Million each and they got 9 of them.
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  #13827  
Old 23-12-2019, 10:20 PM
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The world is f ucked up
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  #13828  
Old 23-12-2019, 10:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golf Boy View Post
Surely there is someone calling for this instead of weapons?
The only massive spending he US voters will approve of apparently is for the military, everything else is socialism, apart from the subsidies given out to farmers, but that is OK.
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  #13829  
Old 23-12-2019, 10:40 PM
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Bring it on....
It gets worse. The UK lapdog is hot on his heels.
Check out page 53 of the conservative manifesto....
(Tiptop) search for the term "space command"
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  #13830  
Old 30-12-2019, 11:41 AM
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Just read on the BBC that Trump has retweeted the name of the whistleblower. Other than being an utter disgrace, is that legal?
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  #13831  
Old 30-12-2019, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Golf Boy View Post
Just read on the BBC that Trump has retweeted the name of the whistleblower. Other than being an utter disgrace, is that legal?
It shouldn't be but that doesn't appear to bother him, because he is above the law. How the US voters/politicians stomach this I don't know but they just ignore it. Over here the UK voters have no doubt swallowed (apt) a lot of concerns/questions to elect BJ but they aren't of the scale of Trump. Is it because the opposition are soooo bad in the US as TBH they have been over here? I don't get it - here or there.
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  #13832  
Old 30-12-2019, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golf Boy View Post
Just read on the BBC that Trump has retweeted the name of the whistleblower. Other than being an utter disgrace, is that legal?
Given that Adam Schiff's office had already released the name to the public several weeks ago (albeit indirectly), I wouldn't imagine Trump is that worried about any potential issues.
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  #13833  
Old 30-12-2019, 04:32 PM
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It should be noted that the tweet containing the name was removed pretty swiftly, whether by Trump or his staff nobody knows.

Also it was a re-tweet by him and not a direct tweet by him.

I can't believe I'm posting this... this is twice I've defended Trump recently - he must be getting to me!
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  #13834  
Old 30-12-2019, 05:47 PM
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I think Xmasape might be right in that the Democrats have skeletons in the closet that they don’t want out. It can be the only reason they are so soft on Trump. The guy has been a con man and a fraudster all his life and has broken several actual laws in his term. He should already have been up against the wall and yet they are pussyfooting around. The only time they seem to show any bollocks is when dealing with the progressive wing of their party - another sign of how crooked they must be.
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  #13835  
Old 03-01-2020, 09:49 AM
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FFS - surely someone in the ‘room’ must have said WTF are we doing and why?
If he was looking for a distraction from the impeachment proceedings he certainly has that.

I do wonder sometimes if the Don thinks ‘24’ is a Discovery Channel history series. So Keifer should expect a call or maybe Gerard? FFS this is going to hurt.
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  #13836  
Old 03-01-2020, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golf Boy View Post
Wouldn’t making food, medicine and other technologies provide even more jobs per dollar than bombs?
They don't make the kind of money and profit that arms and bombs make - although arguably technologies do tend to be quite profitable, in so much as they also drive defence / military spending.
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  #13837  
Old 03-01-2020, 10:20 AM
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FFS - surely someone in the ‘room’ must have said WTF are we doing and why?
If he was looking for a distraction from the impeachment proceedings he certainly has that.

I do wonder sometimes if the Don thinks ‘24’ is a Discovery Channel history series. So Keifer should expect a call or maybe Gerard? FFS this is going to hurt.
I'll go out on a limb and say they probably thought, "Well it worked for Clinton, Bush and Obama, so why not us'. The reality of politics of tyranny is that what serves the interest of the leader doesn't necessarily make wider sense.

Gaddaffi probably only remained in power in the 80s due to the US bombing in retaliation for Lockerbie. It fed into a sense of nationalism, in the same way the spirit of the Blitz did.

Trump is basically in a situation where as long as the Republican party don't turn on him, he can pretty much do what he wants and get away with it (at least while he's president).

The only positive is that many republicans felt the same way about protecting Nixon, by the end of the impeachment proceedings, more than enough had turned on him, for both ethical and political reasons. Once the white house tape recordings were published it was almost impossible for Republicans to stand with him, even the more cynical realised that protecting Nixon would result in political disaster for the party and he had to go.

The situation with trump is problematic, whilst the republicans hold the senete and are protecting him. There is a real risk for Democrats that they're seen as targetting trump for political reasons (even though the evidence is overwhelmingly bi-partisan) because thats how Trump and his allies are playing it - and it could definately play towards giving him a second term.

This is the danger that the UK faces with the idea of placing government and the legal system into the same sphere. It was remarkably easy for the law to hold Johnson to account over suspending parliment, because the UK has a very seperated judicary - and they made the right decision based on law and the perogation was deemed unlawful in its use.

That option isn't so applicable in the US, where the judicary are often political appointees or elected officals. Its a fundamental flaw in their supreme court that the President appoints Supreme Court judges, as it beholdens them to being 'party men/women' in order to be selected.

Its vital to a democracy that the judicary be firstly independent of political ownership, and that government is accountable to the judicary. It won't guarentee that you don't get the likes of Trump or Putin, but it makes it far harder for them, or people like them, to ride roughshot over the law and spirit of the law.

Probably the biggest threat the UK has under Johnson, is the 'acceptance that the judicary is partisan and serves a liberal elite agenda' as this potentially allows government to 'reign in' the only body that can actually place limits on the power of elected officals (and more worryingly utilise the law as a means to oppress rights and freedoms, rather than to protect rights and freedoms).

This was a big tenet for the UKIP - Brexiteers the idea that the ECHR and European court were forcing laws on the UK. Its a total misunderstanding of how those courts actually operate (very successfully) in that they actually force the UK (and other memberstates) to obey those countries own soverign laws.

and thats the real danger of popularism, and how it leads to fascism / communism etc it empowers self interested parties to eliminate the restrictions on them, by creating false narratives that gain popular support for things that essentially destroy the very fabric of the nation those people were elected to protect.

Whether its a reichstag fire or curtailing the right of the populace to challange government in court, its essentially a path to the same outcome, increasing the power of the state, whilst decrease the capacity of the population to hold the state accountable to the law.
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  #13838  
Old 03-01-2020, 10:39 AM
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Great post Dogstar
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  #13839  
Old 03-01-2020, 10:49 AM
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I agree with you dogstar but I think it would be more accurate to say that it is the power of entrenched privilege that is being increased rather than the state as the conservative forces are set upon weakening the state.
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  #13840  
Old 03-01-2020, 11:17 AM
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Seconded, and what a crap system the American one is.

Give unlimited power to one individual, commander in chief and even appointing supreme court judges.

Didn't even win the popular vote.

I thought the UK was a f****d up place, but Australia and USA take biscuit.

Both ruled by white right wing racists what a surprise, will include the UK in that one.
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