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World of Football All non Palace football talk - includes latest scores on Internationals and matches that affect palace.

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  #41  
Old 17-12-2019, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by MFBias View Post
When fans make monkey chants at players in Italy, an image of a Monkey is bloody stupid no matter how you look at it.
I agree, but I still think that the criticism is a bit unfair.

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Originally Posted by MasterYoda View Post
Symbolism isn't it - rightly or wrongly it's been adopted as a symbol for racism. The swastika never used to have the symbolism it now does but you'd think twice about using it........
You don't think twice at all - you just don't use it. I don't think that is in anyway a good comparison to what Serie A have done with this work.
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  #42  
Old 17-12-2019, 11:49 AM
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Think as a stand alone piece of art I really like it. But it isn’t Its the most I’ll conceived bit of anti racist stuff I have ever seen and simply will compound the problem in idiots eyes who just see monkeys. The Italian FA must be on some kind of drugs but of course we are talking a football association and look what the guys at the top have done in choosing Qatar. So no surprise really.
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  #43  
Old 17-12-2019, 03:42 PM
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....another place you went to with your dad's work?
Family holiday in 2014.

You seem a bit obsessed
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  #44  
Old 17-12-2019, 08:37 PM
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Serie A admits mistake: To view the link you have to Register or Login
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  #45  
Old 23-12-2019, 02:54 AM
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Why is the presenter, Dave Jones (at about 5:00), being presumably told through his earpiece, to say Neville’s views are his own and not that of Sky’s?

Gary mentioning our Government and racism clearly had Murdoch furiously pressing his red buzzer direct connection to the producers.
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  #46  
Old 23-12-2019, 03:20 AM
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NeVille made some telling points during the match about how sanctimonious we were in Bulgaria when perhaps we should sort our own problems out first before preaching from on high.

His co commentator was desperately yeah buting
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  #47  
Old 23-12-2019, 06:01 AM
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Serie A admits mistake: To view the link you have to Register or Login
That is incredible. Next Serie A tackles anti semitism with images of yellow stars.
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  #48  
Old 23-12-2019, 07:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bubbs11 View Post



Why is the presenter, Dave Jones (at about 5:00), being presumably told through his earpiece, to say Neville’s views are his own and not that of Sky’s?

Gary mentioning our Government and racism clearly had Murdoch furiously pressing his red buzzer direct connection to the producers.
Why is an interesting point happens on other programs as well on Sky in particular for example when reviewing the papers on Sky News. I assume it's some guideline on impartially being in this case wrongly applied. Interesting as well listening to Neville he had been involved in a Twitter spat over racism within Labour and his support for Corbyn.
To my mind football has played a major role in addressing racism. Not as he said by the Kick it Out campaigns. The racism evident and often highlighted by the Cannonville incident of the 70s 80s has changed attitudes.. Fans supporting teams with more and more black players were suddenly faced with the reality of the prejudice. Similarly in sport in general even earlier in cricket and the Dolivera debate.
With regard to Palace one game still sticks out for me Portsmouth away in the Championship season under Smith. Richard Shaw was I think sub that day warming up he took so much racist abuse to a level I had not seen so close before yet when Palace fans in the stand complained the stewards did nothing threatened to throw Palace fans out.
Let's also be clear as fans of Palace we are not entirely innocent you explain to your young son why some were making the sound of hissing gas as I had to when playing Spurs early 2000s.
But all that said it's a long long way from where it was. Which reflects society as well. What that does not mean is it's been eradicated. It has not at football and certainly has not in society.
Where in my opinion football has helped in changing views it now has to go further in stepping up to the challenge of eradicating it the stadiums. That's not just down to clubs it's down to the fans as well. Not one or two prepared to face it down but as a whole clear and loud no form of racist abuse is acceptable in the stadium ever. Not Kick it Out.. but Call it Out to get it and the fans Kicked Out.
It means football will at least lead the way because as been debated on here and as Neville said it's not being lead by politicians. Whilst we are at it LGBT abuse can be tackled as well.
Football in the 70s 80s was seen as some bastions of all that was wrong in society. Football and the fans can now lead the way on this.
MLK I have a dream like maybe I am I am not sure I will see racism eradicated from stadiums in my lifetime. But enough forget the FA the t shirts the flags as fans we are the ones that have to lead the way and acting together we can show a far greater example on how to act than politicians and others in society.
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  #49  
Old 23-12-2019, 07:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bubbs11 View Post



Why is the presenter, Dave Jones (at about 5:00), being presumably told through his earpiece, to say Neville’s views are his own and not that of Sky’s?

Gary mentioning our Government and racism clearly had Murdoch furiously pressing his red buzzer direct connection to the producers.
Yeah he was reportedly being told through his earpiece. They shut him down because they knew what Gary is saying is true, but they know their overlords Murdoch/press would not want the obvious racism from the political party they promote to be broadcast live on air.
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  #50  
Old 23-12-2019, 09:06 AM
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Originally Posted by 1905 View Post
Yeah he was reportedly being told through his earpiece. They shut him down because they knew what Gary is saying is true, but they know their overlords Murdoch/press would not want the obvious racism from the political party they promote to be broadcast live on air.
Grovelling apology from Sky presenter

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  #51  
Old 23-12-2019, 09:17 AM
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Lol. They are racist because their wives have the trousers on at home. Souness knew half way through the sentence he shouldn’t have started it.
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  #52  
Old 23-12-2019, 10:22 AM
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With CCTV especially in the Premier League and sold out stadiums it should be easy to identify the culprits and ban them.

Not sure what the full protocol is but the players should go off the pitch after the 3rd announcement to stop the racism? Is the game in danger of being abandoned at this stage?

It makes you wonder if Spurs "fans" we're trying to get the game abandoned and replayed?

Think with CCTV and match stewards the Premier League should be able to keep things under control and use strong banning orders. The real problem though is when you go down to the lower league clubs who have less CCTV and Stewarding.

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  #53  
Old 23-12-2019, 11:06 AM
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Sky were probably covering their arses because of advertisers who they fear would get antsy at anything "political" and the advertisers base are your facebook meme sharing uncles who whilst not racist themselves would be overly defensive towards any indication that their opinions might be a slipperly slope. This is why the NFL got so blustered over the black players kneeing, it wasn't anger at their views it was panic at how KFC, Walmart, Ford ect the advertising companies that rely on middle white America as their base would react.

As for the racism, its a terrible shame as British football has made such great strides since the 80s (although I feared us looking down our noses at the Bulgarian fans the other month would backfire on us as we were being a bit too smug given our problems were in fairly recent history) got to ask why football? You don't see this in cricket or rugby. Before people could point to a lack of education as football was the sport of blue collar lads but with tickets now 50-80 quid a pop that holds less water.

Is it football has more of a boozy culture? Is it that the fast nature of the game means people lose their heads more? A match between two London teams would have had many BAME people in the crowd so you can't use the ignorance excuse like if it was say Sunderland v Ipswich.
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Old 23-12-2019, 01:06 PM
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Not totally convinced that English football has a race problem per se.

Ultimately there were probably about 30k+ people in that stadium calling Rudiger a f***ing w@nker or worse. The fact that one or a couple of idiots then defaulted to expressing this via monkey chants or other race slurs isn't really the core issue that needs to be tackled. That's on those people and the sanctions already exist to deal with them.

The bigger issue is why its considered ok for 30k people to call Rudiger a f***ing w@nker in the first place.
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Old 23-12-2019, 01:14 PM
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Is everyone avoiding the simple fact that Brexit and its enablers in the Tories and other right wing parties has encouraged the previously defeated and marginalised racists?
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Old 23-12-2019, 01:43 PM
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Not totally convinced that English football has a race problem per se.

Ultimately there were probably about 30k+ people in that stadium calling Rudiger a f***ing w@nker or worse. The fact that one or a couple of idiots then defaulted to expressing this via monkey chants or other race slurs isn't really the core issue that needs to be tackled. That's on those people and the sanctions already exist to deal with them.

The bigger issue is why its considered ok for 30k people to call Rudiger a f***ing w@nker in the first place.
i get the societal point but this is still crap!
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Old 23-12-2019, 02:36 PM
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Is everyone avoiding the simple fact that Brexit and its enablers in the Tories and other right wing parties has encouraged the previously defeated and marginalised racists?
Fact ?

No as if you go back racism in English football was a thousand times worse,it's really come a long way,trying to politicise this is a bit naff and you except it for the norm with Millwall but it's down to a minimal bunch of ignorant Neanderthal that populate society as a whole...You do not see whole groups of supporters dressing up in T-shirts with banners like in Bulgaria...Its brilliant it was called out in the Spurs game to remind these ignorant racist bastards that the millions that go to football all round the UK do not want them of this shit in their football grounds.
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  #58  
Old 23-12-2019, 02:47 PM
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Go into any Hospital or health centre and you will find people with a different skin colour working their socks off to help you.

Go into a football stadium and watch your team with black players included, yet the opposition fans perhaps with a similar numbers of black players will make racist chants to your players and cheer their own of identical colour.

Difficulty here is that they are so thick that any form of logic will not get through.
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Old 23-12-2019, 02:47 PM
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Quote:
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Is everyone avoiding the simple fact that Brexit and its enablers in the Tories and other right wing parties has encouraged the previously defeated and marginalised racists?
Not me... Trump, Brexit and UK politicians have created a divisive world where peoples views that would have previously been kept under wraps are almost given a platform to vent their revolting racist views
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Old 23-12-2019, 04:24 PM
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Is everyone avoiding the simple fact that Brexit and its enablers in the Tories and other right wing parties has encouraged the previously defeated and marginalised racists?
This is very much true.

There is no doubt overt racism and racist attacks have all increased since the Brexit referendum - markedly.

There is racism in english football crowds but I would say less there than in general society, but as you say Brexit has empowered and emboldened the racists to resurface everywhere, even it seems when watching multi-cultural teams in uber-controlled modern Premier League Stadiums.


And Lesbu, with all due respect, you need to live here to comment on this issue in regards recent changes.
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