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  #161  
Old 28-11-2015, 11:49 AM
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Stronger than it's ever been? Hmmm.
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Last edited by Woosie; 28-11-2015 at 12:04 PM.
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  #162  
Old 28-11-2015, 12:25 PM
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U18s are 1-0 up against QPR. U16 striker James Daly scored.

Pain; Jones, Tarique u16, Hosannah, Sturgess, Hogan, Bennett, Lumeka, Coker, Flanagan, Daly

Edit: make that 2-0, Daly again
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Last edited by Woosie; 28-11-2015 at 12:29 PM.
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  #163  
Old 28-11-2015, 12:59 PM
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Good article in the programme today by SP - shows he reads the fans sites and are looking at improving etc - perhaps he gets a bit fed up with all the negative stuff and work has gone on and will continue to do some work on the academy.
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  #164  
Old 28-11-2015, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Uswortheagle View Post
Good article in the programme today by SP - shows he reads the fans sites and are looking at improving etc - perhaps he gets a bit fed up with all the negative stuff and work has gone on and will continue to do some work on the academy.
Hardly.

Let's take a look:

"In recent weeks I’ve seen a number of fans online discussing the changes made to the academy over the summer. Having maintained our Premier League status and invested significant sums bringing the stadium up to the necessary requirements, we have now turned some of our investment toward the training ground.

"With three full size pitches and assorted training areas (such as goalkeeping and small sided pitches) the facility, whilst neat, isn’t big enough to also support the under-18 scholars and the academy side’s games. The pitches can’t take that amount of use and the offices and changing rooms were overcrowded."


OK, fair points there, don't think anyone would disagree. But this isn't new, it's not something they only just found out about.

"Over the summer, the manager and I decided that whilst we couldn’t find a suitable permanent home for the academy we had to improve things.


"In close proximity there was some land available where we felt we could improve the pitches, add some offices and give the academy their own playing site, whist still remaining connected to the first-team and development squad by sharing the catering facilities at the training ground."


OK, yeah you can't find a suitable permanent home but surely there's a better place than GOALS?

Improve the pitches? The pitches were barely Sunday league standard and are barely any better now. "Some land available" - why not just say GOALS? Add some offices? Sure the academy have their own playing site, but they don't have any connection with the first team, the manager cannot watch them and see what they're about. They share the catering facilities, hardly connected.

"This also enabled us to build a new secure, fit for purpose, office complex so Alan and his staff could always be around the players. We also upgraded and extended the medical facility and the gymnasium, adding new equipment that the doctor required including ultrasound scanning and a Zero G running machine (those on Twitter may have seen Brighty using it!).

Overall we invested nearly 2 million in the facilities for first-team and academy, doubling the amount of pitches and improving their quality."


Yep, no complaints that the training ground seems to be vastly improved, that's good. But why mention academy and first-team facilities in the same sentence? How much was invested in the academy? Doubling the amount of pitches? Two pitches at GOALS which are dreadful isn't really very good, don't see that improving their quality. TG pitches are better, and that's good, but this appears to me to just say that the academy pitches are better too, when they're not.

"Meanwhile Alan has put much more emphasis on looking after the youngsters currently at the club. He and I believe that getting the players experience of senior football as early as possible is the best way to develop their talents.

"Younger players are getting more exposure to the development squad earlier and we’ve seen Keshi Anderson, Jake Gray, Sullay Kaikai, Hiram Boateng and Luke Croll go on loan and excel. This will give them decent experience, and remember that Wilfried Zaha and Nathaniel Clyne played over a 100 times in the Championship before they made the step up to the top-flight."


No disagreement about this at all, they need to go out on loan.

"Mark Bright has been appointed in the role of looking after these players, overseeing their progress and staying in touch with them and their respective managers – including those more senior players who are also currently away from the club.
"

OK fine, good.

"This, as well as the close involvement from the manager and the ever-watchful eye and hard work of Gary Issott, means our academy is stronger than its ever been."

Stronger than it has ever been? Hmmm. No academy debut for three years. U18s playing week in week out on rubbish pitches, the U21s playing against Cat 2 sides when previously they have played against and beaten the likes of Man United and Man City in the Cat 1 League.
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'it would be boring if they won every time right?'

To be, or not to be, that is the question:
Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them? To die, to sleep,
No more; and by a sleep to say we end

Last edited by Woosie; 28-11-2015 at 07:10 PM.
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  #165  
Old 28-11-2015, 07:42 PM
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Good post.
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  #166  
Old 29-11-2015, 10:51 AM
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Good post Matt.
Palace, like most clubs, have decided that U21 league is waste of time in preparing lads for 1st team football and are instead sending them all out on loan. A consequence being that U21 side is featuring lads who in previous years would have been playing in U18 side at same stage of their careers.
Not sure if Parish mentioned that the Academy are using what is effectively a public facility. The Academy may have exclusive use of some of the facilities at the site but you get every other Tom, Dick and Harry using the other facilities there - gym, 5-a-side, children's soft play area, bar, other grass rugby, football, etc pitches. Good luck if you are trying to park there on a Saturday.
The pitches are poor to average. I played there for 20 years and still go there to use the gym. They have done some work and improved them a bit but they are still the worst I've ever seen in my travel around various academies over the years to watch and report on academy football.
I don't wish to be ultra critical of our owners as perfectly understand need to invest elsewhere in club was much higher priority. And it's good to see Parish mention the investments made in medical facilities etc. Only gripe is other clubs with less money like Charlton, Brighton, Ipswich, Brentford are making faster strides in improving their academies.
I'm sure we will get there in the end. And we did have fairly unique situation of very small training ground which has no room for expansion to give the Academy the pitches and facilities they need to get Cat 1. So it is the case of trying to buy a site which is not easy or cheap to do in the locality.
It's just a shame that until we do there will be a crop of lads "making do".
It does show how far we've come in that I'm moaning about the Academy lads having to be one of many sub-tennants at Goals, when for a season under Coppell when Morrison and Forsell were still playing, the 1st team trained there.

Last edited by Gazza2; 29-11-2015 at 10:54 AM.
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  #167  
Old 29-11-2015, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Woosie View Post
Hardly.

Let's take a look:

"In recent weeks I’ve seen a number of fans online discussing the changes made to the academy over the summer. Having maintained our Premier League status and invested significant sums bringing the stadium up to the necessary requirements, we have now turned some of our investment toward the training ground.

"With three full size pitches and assorted training areas (such as goalkeeping and small sided pitches) the facility, whilst neat, isn’t big enough to also support the under-18 scholars and the academy side’s games. The pitches can’t take that amount of use and the offices and changing rooms were overcrowded."


OK, fair points there, don't think anyone would disagree. But this isn't new, it's not something they only just found out about.

"Over the summer, the manager and I decided that whilst we couldn’t find a suitable permanent home for the academy we had to improve things.


"In close proximity there was some land available where we felt we could improve the pitches, add some offices and give the academy their own playing site, whist still remaining connected to the first-team and development squad by sharing the catering facilities at the training ground."


OK, yeah you can't find a suitable permanent home but surely there's a better place than GOALS?

Improve the pitches? The pitches were barely Sunday league standard and are barely any better now. "Some land available" - why not just say GOALS? Add some offices? Sure the academy have their own playing site, but they don't have any connection with the first team, the manager cannot watch them and see what they're about. They share the catering facilities, hardly connected.

"This also enabled us to build a new secure, fit for purpose, office complex so Alan and his staff could always be around the players. We also upgraded and extended the medical facility and the gymnasium, adding new equipment that the doctor required including ultrasound scanning and a Zero G running machine (those on Twitter may have seen Brighty using it!).

Overall we invested nearly 2 million in the facilities for first-team and academy, doubling the amount of pitches and improving their quality."


Yep, no complaints that the training ground seems to be vastly improved, that's good. But why mention academy and first-team facilities in the same sentence? How much was invested in the academy? Doubling the amount of pitches? Two pitches at GOALS which are dreadful isn't really very good, don't see that improving their quality. TG pitches are better, and that's good, but this appears to me to just say that the academy pitches are better too, when they're not.

"Meanwhile Alan has put much more emphasis on looking after the youngsters currently at the club. He and I believe that getting the players experience of senior football as early as possible is the best way to develop their talents.

"Younger players are getting more exposure to the development squad earlier and we’ve seen Keshi Anderson, Jake Gray, Sullay Kaikai, Hiram Boateng and Luke Croll go on loan and excel. This will give them decent experience, and remember that Wilfried Zaha and Nathaniel Clyne played over a 100 times in the Championship before they made the step up to the top-flight."


No disagreement about this at all, they need to go out on loan.

"Mark Bright has been appointed in the role of looking after these players, overseeing their progress and staying in touch with them and their respective managers – including those more senior players who are also currently away from the club.
"

OK fine, good.

"This, as well as the close involvement from the manager and the ever-watchful eye and hard work of Gary Issott, means our academy is stronger than its ever been."

Stronger than it has ever been? Hmmm. No academy debut for three years. U18s playing week in week out on rubbish pitches, the U21s playing against Cat 2 sides when previously they have played against and beaten the likes of Man United and Man City in the Cat 1 League.
Perhaps it's something to do with the fact we are in the Prem now ( you mention 3 years) as against the Championship and unfortunately it goes for alot of the other Prem clubs that Academy youngsters are not making it through to the First team- my point was that at least SP is looking at fans comments and not living in a rosy bubble - agree re Goals but is it the closest to the training ground that was available,my knowledge of green spaces in that area is perhaps not as good as your local knowledge
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  #168  
Old 29-11-2015, 02:26 PM
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Perhaps it's something to do with the fact we are in the Prem now ( you mention 3 years) as against the Championship and unfortunately it goes for alot of the other Prem clubs that Academy youngsters are not making it through to the First team- my point was that at least SP is looking at fans comments and not living in a rosy bubble - agree re Goals but is it the closest to the training ground that was available,my knowledge of green spaces in that area is perhaps not as good as your local knowledge
SP's programme notes make out the situation that currently faces the academy is better than it is IMO.

Goals is closest to the TG but what's the point in that when the players rarely mix and the manager cannot see them in action during training, or call them over for one session and say can you help make up the numbers as you've done well. Or something like that. You might as well get a better temporary option further away from the current TG because it would make no difference.

Yes it is partially to do with us being in the Prem that no-one has been given a debut for three (almost four now) years in the league. But that directly contradicts the claim that the academy is the best it has ever been - how can it be when we are not producing PL quality players yet? At best it is on par with when we had the likes of Zaha, Cadogan, Djilali, Hills et al coming through. Because the current players we have out on loan are at that standard, that if we were in the Championship, they'd be playing the no of games that those lads played, a few here and there. That is not at all a criticism of the players, who I love watching and think have potential. I'm not expecting us to have several players in the team, as I said above, I think we need to get them out on loan and I think the club is doing a good job there.

Yes, it's good that SP is looking at fans' comments, but in my above post I have made several points - valid ones IMO - which suggest that what he is saying is more positive than it necessarily is - which IMO is a pretty poor situation.

On the few occasions he has been asked about the academy in interviews, he has yet to mention the word GOALS IIRC, always referring to it as "additional green space" or such like. Almost as if saying the word is forbidden because it makes it sound a lot worse than the club would like to admit - and I don't blame them because you want the academy to have a good reputation - but the way to ensure that reputation is upheld is to make sure they have good facilities, excellent coaching, feel valued, and to have a happy, confident, positive, productive environment. I don't personally think all of those criteria are currently met. In my opinion, few of those are met.

One thing CPFC2010 have done very well in the past five years is listen to fans' concerns, and by and large they have acted and rectified them. Lately that seems to have slipped a little, and as we have become a more established Premier League club, we appear to have fallen into the trap of being a more 'typical' PL club, without as much to differentiate us from other clubs IMO - I don't think that is intentional at all, it is a by-product of trying to raise the club's income and profile, as well as being in the Premier League. That's not to say we are no different, because we are.

But with regards to the academy in that sense, it feels like the club are putting their hands over their eyes and fingers in their ears until such a time as we have more money - presumably from this investment - when hopefully we will invest in the academy as well as the first team. Again, I'm not suggesting we should be spending tens of millions of pounds on the academy when we have a run-down stadium, when we have a large wage bill and the first team facilities still need improvement too. What I am saying, is that there is a need to accept that there is a problem, that things are not good enough, not to ignore it and try to claim that things are better than they are.

Like I said in the summer, I do think the owners care about the academy, and I appreciate that it's not black and white, and I don't know the exact ins and outs, or the state of the club's finances, but one thing is for sure: there must be a better temporary solution than GOALS.

One member of the club (I won't name them) was very rude to me in person recently with something related to the academy and had a total disregard for the efforts I've gone to in terms of covering the academy/youth teams and getting updates from the managers - something both fans, players and parents all appreciate.
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To be, or not to be, that is the question:
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Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them? To die, to sleep,
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Last edited by Woosie; 29-11-2015 at 02:43 PM.
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  #169  
Old 29-11-2015, 02:39 PM
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Away from that, and onto matters on the pitch:

It finished 2-0 to the U18s vs QPR yesterday.

Hosannah, Daly, Flanagan, Sturgess and Tarique [don't know his surname] are all 16 still, with Daly scoring twice on what I think was his U18 debut. They are doing OK, W6 D5 L4
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To be, or not to be, that is the question:
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Old 29-11-2015, 07:41 PM
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.....the efforts I've gone to in terms of covering the academy/youth teams and getting updates from the managers - something both fans, players and parents all appreciate.
Tis true, many of us fans are very interested in the progress of the 'yoof' as we would all undoubtedly love to see a few of 'our own' make it through to the first team. I am equally sure the players families also struggle to understand where their offspring are, in the scheme of things and appreciate the updates from an informed, impartial source. I am sure most of the people you speak to appreciate your efforts but there will always be some that fail to see the wood for the trees. So keep it up Woosie.
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Old 29-11-2015, 08:18 PM
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I appreciate the updates and share some frustrations even from afar as like many Palace fans this aspect of the club has always been something I'm proud of.

I'd like to say it sounds like you are trying to be very objective and fair, not just having a pop for the sake of it. You've given credit where it's due, clearly are passionate and a big fan of the club and 2010, but I think it's great you don't shirk calling them out where appropriate as that's exactly how it should be if we want to get better as a club. That's SP's mantra after all.

I've not read through everything, and appreciate what I'm about to ask is potentially unrealistic, but maybe it would all be better received if you had solutions as well as the points made? Might need some help though.

To be from afar, it's a shame HSBC didn't come off. Am sure 2010 feel as frustrated too on that.
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  #172  
Old 05-12-2015, 10:39 AM
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U18s are at home to Ipswich this morning, updates on Twitter @PalaceYouth. Looks like a young side again.
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'it would be boring if they won every time right?'

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  #173  
Old 05-12-2015, 12:05 PM
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Line-up: Pain, Tarique (u16) Jones, Omrore, Sturgess, Hogan (c), Bennett, Coker, Flanagan, Lumeka, Daly (u16).

0-0 at HT, the wind has made it a pretty uneventful game
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'it would be boring if they won every time right?'

To be, or not to be, that is the question:
Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them? To die, to sleep,
No more; and by a sleep to say we end

Last edited by Woosie; 05-12-2015 at 06:09 PM.
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  #174  
Old 05-12-2015, 01:10 PM
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[QUOTE=Woosie;12693251]Line-up: Pain, Tarique (u16) Jones, Omrore (u16), Sturgess, Hogan (c), Bennett, Coker, Flanagan, Lumeka, Daly (u16).

0-0 at HT, the wind has made it a pretty uneventful game[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the update Woosie, any of our youngsters attempting to turn it into an eventful game?
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  #175  
Old 05-12-2015, 01:15 PM
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Matt, we all appreciate your updates!
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Old 05-12-2015, 01:39 PM
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Won 1-0 thanks to a superb left footed volley from Joseph Hungbo an u16. I'll try to write something more detailed later but my God that wind was ridiculous.
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'it would be boring if they won every time right?'

To be, or not to be, that is the question:
Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them? To die, to sleep,
No more; and by a sleep to say we end
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  #177  
Old 15-12-2015, 09:59 PM
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Not that you'd know because there's no updates from Palace but it is currently 3-2 to us in ET in the FA Youth Cup third round
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'it would be boring if they won every time right?'

To be, or not to be, that is the question:
Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them? To die, to sleep,
No more; and by a sleep to say we end

Last edited by Woosie; 15-12-2015 at 10:51 PM.
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Old 15-12-2015, 10:10 PM
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FT Palace win 3-2 AET. Andrews, Dreher and Lumeka the scorers. First time in five years we have reached the fourth round. Home match with Villa in the next round. Usually played at the main stadium, so Selhurst should host it.
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'it would be boring if they won every time right?'

To be, or not to be, that is the question:
Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them? To die, to sleep,
No more; and by a sleep to say we end

Last edited by Woosie; 15-12-2015 at 11:04 PM.
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  #179  
Old 15-12-2015, 10:43 PM
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Wow can't believe the club is ignoring the FA youth cup after our history. For shame.
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  #180  
Old 15-12-2015, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woosie View Post
FT Palace win 3-2 AET. Andrews, Dreher and Lumeka the scorers. First time in five years we have reached the fourth round.
Thanks Matt. Goalscorer highlighted must be related to the lad tearing it up for the toffees....oh wait..
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