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  #81  
Old 11-09-2019, 01:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Reps AJ View Post
Interesting from David Allen Green...

Johnson forced to resign due to lying to the Queen... who gets to be the new PM?


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  #82  
Old 11-09-2019, 01:56 PM
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  #83  
Old 11-09-2019, 02:06 PM
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The government’s behaviour has been ‘egregious ‘!! This is the legal equivalent of saying properly out of order.
"Blimey mate - that's bang egregious."





No - doesn't have the same ring about it
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  #84  
Old 11-09-2019, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by dogstar721 View Post
And by a landslide too. The Tory party has done more damage to itself in the last few years, than Labour and the left managed in a centuary.
Difficult to say that this side of an election in which the polls still suggest they'll win.

Looked up the Treason Act to see if it's worth reserving a place in the Tower for Boris for being economical with the actualite with the Queen. Odd piece of old legislation. Telling porkies doesn't qualify although violating the monarch's consort would.

There's a thought.
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  #85  
Old 11-09-2019, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Reps AJ View Post
Interesting from David Allen Green...

Johnson forced to resign due to lying to the Queen... who gets to be the new PM? The Tories no longer have any sort of majority, with or without the DUP
Surely, whoever can get the support of the House?
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  #86  
Old 11-09-2019, 02:26 PM
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I've been considering joining the Lib Dems for ages; this tweet may just clinch it.
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  #87  
Old 11-09-2019, 02:45 PM
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Haven’t MP’s booked their holibobs?
Due to BA strike they are all still at home

(Joke)
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  #88  
Old 11-09-2019, 02:50 PM
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Question is which part of the recess is possibly unlawful ?

The (greater) part of the break which was agreed ages ago to allow for the party conferences or just the small extension to allow the government to finalise the queens speech for the state opening of parliament. ?

If the whole recess is unlawful then will they cancel the party conferences? If the conferences are cancelled will the MP's give up their paid week by the sea side to to rush back to the house to debate what? At this point in time unless Boris strikes a new deal before the 17th of October that's about all there is left to debate
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  #89  
Old 11-09-2019, 02:52 PM
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Hey Percy, Parliament is shut down (prorogue) not in recess.
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  #90  
Old 11-09-2019, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CJ PLUM View Post
Most political commentators expected Parliament to vote to not suspend the sitting for the conference season when it returned after the summer recess. Johnson invoked the prorogation before Parliament was able to vote to take control and thus negated any such potential agreement amongst the parties. However, tHey were hardly likely to announce their tactics well in advance. We can assume that all those who voted to take control of parliamentary business would also have voted for a continuation of Parliament.

The Conservative Conference finishes on 2nd October so they could have possibly then returned to Westminster on 3rd October.
Why can we assume that? If it was tactical not to announce it then it has truly backfired as Johnson has taken advantage of it. If anything announcing an agreement not to have a conference recess, especially when it became clear Johnson was going to ask for prorogation was the right tactical move.

The conference finished late on the Wednesday, Parliament doesn't often sit on Fridays so it is 'usual' for them to return the week after the final conference. The expectation i believe was the 8th.
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  #91  
Old 11-09-2019, 03:06 PM
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Originally Posted by CT_Palace View Post
One thing I read was that prorogation stops ALL parliamentary business. The conference season does not. i.e. that parliamentary committees etc can continue working during the conference season.
However, given the gravity of the situation you would think they might think about delaying the conferences until after Oct 31st. Although, I also heard that to cancel or delay the conferences requires all parties to agree and I guess it's unlikely the Tories will agree.
3 of the countries major conference centres have planned for the conferences and they usually have a pretty busy calendar. IF the recess did not happen either

a) the conferences would have continued without the presence of MPs.
b) the majority of any parties MPs would have been missing from Parliament for 1 of the weeks
c) there would be no party conferences this autumn (you can't just postpone)

You are right in that a major difference between prorogation and recess is that committees can sit and request government documents etc. No sure how often they do that though given many committee member each week would have their party conference.

As a question for those arguing the prorogation and using the fact committees cannot sit, how many times did they sit during the summer recess?

Lets take the big one, the Brexit committee, please correct me if i am wrong but it did not sit at all over the summer recess, 24 July until 4 September.
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  #92  
Old 11-09-2019, 03:12 PM
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Originally Posted by JDawg View Post
Difficult to say that this side of an election in which the polls still suggest they'll win.

Looked up the Treason Act to see if it's worth reserving a place in the Tower for Boris for being economical with the actualite with the Queen. Odd piece of old legislation. Telling porkies doesn't qualify although violating the monarch's consort would.

There's a thought.
There is a long time between now and an election, and it was supposed to be a landslide defeat of Labour last time, that would deliver a massive majority for May.

Given that parliments perogued, and it requires an act of parliment to get an election, thats likely to happen after Boris Johnson is rueing terms like Dead in a Ditch etc.

It depends on the situation with Brexit, and how campaigning goes. Corbyn has a good reputuation and ability to campaign and debate etc.

I don't think that Treason is still an offence in the UK that you can be prosecuted for. Given that you couldn't get a prosecution of spies under treason laws its pretty much a dead end. Mostly treasonable offences tend to be covered either by Military law (applicable to military personnel) or the Offical Secrets act.
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  #93  
Old 11-09-2019, 03:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Percy Dalton View Post
Question is which part of the recess is possibly unlawful ?

The (greater) part of the break which was agreed ages ago to allow for the party conferences or just the small extension to allow the government to finalise the queens speech for the state opening of parliament. ?

If the whole recess is unlawful then will they cancel the party conferences? If the conferences are cancelled will the MP's give up their paid week by the sea side to to rush back to the house to debate what? At this point in time unless Boris strikes a new deal before the 17th of October that's about all there is left to debate
The bit where the PM says to the Queen its for setting out domestic policy when the otherside can show that you'd decided to do this to stifle parlimentary process... That would be extremely unlawful.

Abuse of power and malfiesence in public office are very serious offences for a Minister, let alone a prime minister.

Which is exactly what everyone knows the Perogation of Parliment was actually for, even those who are pro-Boris. Its a question of what you can prove (and if you can prove it beyond reasonable doubt there is every chance our PM will be finishing his political career in prison).
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  #94  
Old 11-09-2019, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by foetus eagle View Post
.
So same old tory approach, hard on crimes (committed by the poor) light touch to the causes of crime (caused by disparity).
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  #95  
Old 11-09-2019, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by foetus eagle View Post
The new home secretary, Priti Patel, has said she wants criminals to "literally feel terror" at the thought of breaking the law.
Ha ha Boris

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  #96  
Old 11-09-2019, 03:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Percy Dalton View Post
Question is which part of the recess is possibly unlawful ?

The (greater) part of the break which was agreed ages ago to allow for the party conferences or just the small extension to allow the government to finalise the queens speech for the state opening of parliament. ?

If the whole recess is unlawful then will they cancel the party conferences? If the conferences are cancelled will the MP's give up their paid week by the sea side to to rush back to the house to debate what? At this point in time unless Boris strikes a new deal before the 17th of October that's about all there is left to debate
How many more times do people have to say that the RECESS for the conferences is a) totally different to prorogation since things like committees, questions to ministers etc still continue, and b) the recess had not yet been voted on anyway, that was still to happen. It was not “agreed ages ago”.
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  #97  
Old 11-09-2019, 03:35 PM
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Ah, the people who want to leave the EU to protect and enhance Parliamentary sovereignty don't actually want to protect and enhance Parliamentary sovereignty. There's a surprise.
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  #98  
Old 11-09-2019, 03:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Percy Dalton View Post
Question is which part of the recess is possibly unlawful ?

The (greater) part of the break which was agreed ages ago to allow for the party conferences or just the small extension to allow the government to finalise the queens speech for the state opening of parliament. ?

If the whole recess is unlawful then will they cancel the party conferences? If the conferences are cancelled will the MP's give up their paid week by the sea side to to rush back to the house to debate what? At this point in time unless Boris strikes a new deal before the 17th of October that's about all there is left to debate
Of course it's the whole "recess" as the reason it was called was to avoid parliamentary scrutiny and the government misled the monarch.

Boris and govt ministers now avoid parliamentary committees and any scrutiny. MPs cannot hold the government to account and make them provide updates on things like no deal planning or the progress of talks. They also have shit loads of legislation that is required to get through in advance of leaving.

Usually parliament has to vote to break up for conferences. The prorogation avoided this vote and there was a real possibility that they would have cancelled or delayed conferences so parliament could continue to sit in the run up to 31 October.

It's pretty clear the prorogation was to avoid any scrutiny and no wonder given how shambolic (even by recent standards) Johnson and his government have been just in one week back in the commons. If he has misled the Queen (which he has) and is found to have done so by the supreme court I can't see how he can continue as PM. I mean I can see how he would try but it would be morally bankrupt to do so and set a very dangerous precedent.

Last edited by Cambridge Eagle; 11-09-2019 at 03:44 PM.
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  #99  
Old 11-09-2019, 03:45 PM
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Ah, the people who want to leave the EU to protect and enhance Parliamentary sovereignty don't actually want to protect and enhance Parliamentary sovereignty. There's a surprise.
They just want to ruin the country so they can impose swingeing cuts to the state and regulation and pretend it's necessary in a time of crisis to "boost" the economy.
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  #100  
Old 11-09-2019, 03:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Percy Dalton View Post
Question is which part of the recess is possibly unlawful ?

The (greater) part of the break which was agreed ages ago to allow for the party conferences or just the small extension to allow the government to finalise the queens speech for the state opening of parliament. ?

If the whole recess is unlawful then will they cancel the party conferences? If the conferences are cancelled will the MP's give up their paid week by the sea side to to rush back to the house to debate what? At this point in time unless Boris strikes a new deal before the 17th of October that's about all there is left to debate
You’ve had your answers... now go and play in the sand like a good boy.
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