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  #221  
Old 13-06-2019, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted by stevek View Post
Why would grammars being everywhere stop people using private tutors?

I'm still waiting for some actual evidence that grammar schools improve social mobility.
Because when there were plenty of grammars no one did.

You're looking at the wrong studies, what they should compare is kids that go to public school and those in the state system.

Grammars aren't an answer to everything if the parents aren't pushing their kids they'll be hard pushed to get on whatever the system. It's just lazy blaming grammars.
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  #222  
Old 13-06-2019, 05:59 PM
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  #223  
Old 13-06-2019, 06:01 PM
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Well that's reassuring.

Don't have nightmares...
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  #224  
Old 13-06-2019, 06:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Skintagain View Post
Because when there were plenty of grammars no one did.

You're looking at the wrong studies, what they should compare is kids that go to public school and those in the state system.

Grammars aren't an answer to everything if the parents aren't pushing their kids they'll be hard pushed to get on whatever the system. It's just lazy blaming grammars.
Lots of things have changed since we had a national grammar school system. To suggest that if it was re-introduced no-one would use private tutors is ridiculous.

You undoubtedly have a valid point about looking at private Vs state schools - but that doesn't mean that grammar schools are drivers of social mobility. The evidence just doesn't show that.
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  #225  
Old 13-06-2019, 06:12 PM
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Originally Posted by stevek View Post
Lots of things have changed since we had a national grammar school system. To suggest that if it was re-introduced no-one would use private tutors is ridiculous.

You undoubtedly have a valid point about looking at private Vs state schools - but that doesn't mean that grammar schools are drivers of social mobility. The evidence just doesn't show that.
With enough grammars the bar isn't so high so tutoring wasn't so necessary.

Evidence? well we've had a number of grammar school kids make it to PM, not so a comprehensive kid. It shows grammars can match public schools that in itself shows some social mobility.

I'm gonna to leave it there as we're now just repeating.
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  #226  
Old 13-06-2019, 06:16 PM
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Originally Posted by bubbs11 View Post
Well that's reassuring.

Don't have nightmares...
Blimey - And Hastings is a full on proper right-wing Thatcherite Tory so would not be saying those words lightly about someone politically similar.
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  #227  
Old 13-06-2019, 06:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Skintagain View Post
With enough grammars the bar isn't so high so tutoring wasn't so necessary.

Evidence? well we've had a number of grammar school kids make it to PM, not so a comprehensive kid. It shows grammars can match public schools that in itself shows some social mobility.

I'm gonna to leave it there as we're now just repeating.
Thank Christ for that.

You’re so far out of your depth it’s laughable.
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  #228  
Old 13-06-2019, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by bubbs11 View Post
Well that's reassuring.

Don't have nightmares...
The only thing I disagree with is the idea that such characters wouldn't have prospered in the 20th, 19th, 18th etc centuries.

They always have got on and probably always will.
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  #229  
Old 13-06-2019, 06:33 PM
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Johnson’s seat is far from safe by the way.

Has a sitting PM ever lost his seat in a general election?
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  #230  
Old 13-06-2019, 06:37 PM
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Johnson’s seat is far from safe by the way.

Has a sitting PM ever lost his seat in a general election?
He will be standing in Sevenoaks ... Put a tenner on it!
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  #231  
Old 13-06-2019, 06:45 PM
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He will be standing in Sevenoaks ... Put a tenner on it!
******* hope not. The rancid, fat ******.
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  #232  
Old 13-06-2019, 06:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skintagain View Post
With enough grammars the bar isn't so high so tutoring wasn't so necessary.

Evidence? well we've had a number of grammar school kids make it to PM, not so a comprehensive kid. It shows grammars can match public schools that in itself shows some social mobility.

I'm gonna to leave it there as we're now just repeating.
I may be wrong but I don't think Jim Callaghan went to a grammar school. Out of the last 10 prime minister's only 3 went to public schools.

Not a PM but Mayor of London which is a big gig Ken Livingstone went to Tulse Hill Secondary Modern.
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  #233  
Old 13-06-2019, 06:57 PM
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******* hope not. The rancid, fat ******.
Why are you local?
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  #234  
Old 13-06-2019, 07:01 PM
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Not really evidence as such but my two best mates from (grammar) school and I are the sons of a builder, postman and oil rig worker and ended up an accountant, actuary and solicitor. We were all a bit lazy and it was the school that pushed us on, there is no doubt about that.

I can understand people's gripes about grammar schools but I tend to find that a lot of the people who really dislike them are private school types. Many of the Labour bigwigs who pushed the abolition of the grammar schools in the 70's were highly privileged faux socialists such as the execrable Shirley Williams. I always wonder what their real motives are.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevek View Post
Why would grammars being everywhere stop people using private tutors?

I'm still waiting for some actual evidence that grammar schools improve social mobility.
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  #235  
Old 13-06-2019, 07:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Skintagain View Post
You are Michael Gove and I claim my £5.

N.B. everybody hates you for suggesting things can be improved.
You don't give the impression that you believe comprehensive schools can be improved.
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  #236  
Old 13-06-2019, 07:39 PM
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Was listening on 5Live to the guy who wrote Johnson's biography. He seemed to suggest Johnson had two advantages - that expectations of him were low and that he's used to making screwups (so is more resilient and used to dealing with pressure).
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  #237  
Old 13-06-2019, 07:53 PM
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Bo JO is a farcical joke which should signal the end of the Tory party imho
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  #238  
Old 13-06-2019, 08:01 PM
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Sick of having a PM we don’t vote for. How is this allowed to happen?!
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  #239  
Old 13-06-2019, 08:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Percy Dalton View Post
I may be wrong but I don't think Jim Callaghan went to a grammar school. Out of the last 10 prime minister's only 3 went to public schools.

Not a PM but Mayor of London which is a big gig Ken Livingstone went to Tulse Hill Secondary Modern.
Portsmouth northern grammar
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  #240  
Old 13-06-2019, 08:39 PM
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Sick of having a PM we don’t vote for. How is this allowed to happen?!
We have never voted for PM.

Next election you will get to vote for someone to represent you, or for a party and their leader might or might not have an affect on your decision.
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