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  #5421  
Old 02-12-2019, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Golf Boy View Post
The tories have it. Brexit.
Or, more accurately, 'Brexit, get 'em out!'
  #5422  
Old 02-12-2019, 05:44 PM
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Tories are clear leavers. LDs are clear remainers.

The only way Corbyn will live up to his promise is to re-state what he said earlier in the year. Easy to get a "better" deal done in three months if you agree to everything. So customs union, more FOM, ECJ etc. etc. If this is the case the question becomes do you want to stay in all but name and cough up €39bn or just stay and keep the €39bn and all the rebates to date.

This would make Labour a remain party. Why can't they just come out and say it?

The half truths and innuendo from all parties is depressing. Boris can't help but tell fibs. Corbyn can't help but hide things to try and appeal to everyone. Swinson………..All of them are more interested in slagging each other off. It is a bloody awful state of affairs.

Last edited by JDawg; 02-12-2019 at 05:47 PM.
  #5423  
Old 02-12-2019, 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by JDawg View Post
Tories are clear leavers. LDs are clear remainers.

…..
Corbyn is clear at confusing people
  #5424  
Old 02-12-2019, 07:48 PM
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Perhaps the most depressing thing I have seen and heard to date during this campaign was on Channel 4 News tonight. Someone thought it was a good idea to get a focus group together of around ten men and women from a selection of people who voted Labour last time.

They universally disliked Corbyn, and cited that he lies and is not to be trusted. However, they thought Johnson was a lovable buffoon and deserved their vote, and no mention of any of his lies. The were seemingly mainly Brexiteers, and I suspect this is why they all said without exception they they were going to vote Tory this time. They mainly came across as somewhat thick or more kindly, simply uniformed or misinformed, and had only a shallow knowledge of each subject as it arose. The questions however, were also mundane and did not probe to any depth as to why they held those strong opinions. It was notable that the group selected consisted of over weight and overtly uneducated women of around 40 something, and men over fifty. Surely, apart from finding individuals who who just voted Labour last time, they could have found a more representative demographic than this. The fact that they all said they would vote Tory just proves the point.
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  #5425  
Old 02-12-2019, 07:51 PM
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  #5426  
Old 02-12-2019, 09:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SE25 exile View Post
Perhaps the most depressing thing I have seen and heard to date during this campaign was on Channel 4 News tonight. Someone thought it was a good idea to get a focus group together of around ten men and women from a selection of people who voted Labour last time.

They universally disliked Corbyn, and cited that he lies and is not to be trusted. However, they thought Johnson was a lovable buffoon and deserved their vote, and no mention of any of his lies. The were seemingly mainly Brexiteers, and I suspect this is why they all said without exception they they were going to vote Tory this time. They mainly came across as somewhat thick or more kindly, simply uniformed or misinformed, and had only a shallow knowledge of each subject as it arose. The questions however, were also mundane and did not probe to any depth as to why they held those strong opinions. It was notable that the group selected consisted of over weight and overtly uneducated women of around 40 something, and men over fifty. Surely, apart from finding individuals who who just voted Labour last time, they could have found a more representative demographic than this. The fact that they all said they would vote Tory just proves the point.
I guess from your post above that you're more disappointed rather than surprised.

The problem with a referendum is that you're giving power to a population that ON THE WHOLE is uninformed about a lot of the issues. This is why we have elected MPs (whose job it SHOULD be to be informed) and at worst there should have been a threshold of say 60/40 for such a huge game changer.

I don't think that if there were any in depth questions to that group that it would have revealed much, their votes are cast on instinct and would be difficult to justify logically.
  #5427  
Old 02-12-2019, 09:38 PM
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Sums up that disgusting piece of shit quite nicely.
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  #5428  
Old 02-12-2019, 09:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SE25 exile View Post
Perhaps the most depressing thing I have seen and heard to date during this campaign was on Channel 4 News tonight. Someone thought it was a good idea to get a focus group together of around ten men and women from a selection of people who voted Labour last time.

They universally disliked Corbyn, and cited that he lies and is not to be trusted. However, they thought Johnson was a lovable buffoon and deserved their vote, and no mention of any of his lies. The were seemingly mainly Brexiteers, and I suspect this is why they all said without exception they they were going to vote Tory this time. They mainly came across as somewhat thick or more kindly, simply uniformed or misinformed, and had only a shallow knowledge of each subject as it arose. The questions however, were also mundane and did not probe to any depth as to why they held those strong opinions. It was notable that the group selected consisted of over weight and overtly uneducated women of around 40 something, and men over fifty. Surely, apart from finding individuals who who just voted Labour last time, they could have found a more representative demographic than this. The fact that they all said they would vote Tory just proves the point.
Frankly they deserve everything coming to them.
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  #5429  
Old 02-12-2019, 10:08 PM
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Frankly they deserve everything coming to them.
Weltklasse will be after you.
  #5430  
Old 02-12-2019, 11:01 PM
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It was obvious that a low life like Johnson would make political capital out of the tragedy at London Bridge and blame it on a lefty government, what a pathetic ignorant claim even by him. the father of one of the victims has rightly decried the vile human being who somehow has the title of prime minister and purports to be the the next one as vile and odious
Thant is putting it mildly.
  #5431  
Old 02-12-2019, 11:10 PM
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  #5432  
Old 03-12-2019, 06:25 AM
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Absolutely classic short sightedness here. ‘Taking control of our borders!’ they say. ‘Make this bastards pay to come in!’ they say. Forgetting to mention that we’ll face similar charges every time we want to go to Europe and that we’re opting out of similar intelligence as the EU is introducing electronic checks to entrants anyway.

Still. I guarantee people will simultaneously praise this policy and think the EU bastards for charging us to go there.
  #5433  
Old 03-12-2019, 06:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skintagain View Post
I'd argue the opposite for the railways, government investment will always fall short simply as other things will always have greater priority, NHS, handouts etc. This means a decaying industry, also you cannot put fares up as this directly impacts on the party in power. Also there is little incentive to work hard in a nationalised industry. British Rail is already a long time ago and people have forgotten how poor the rolling stock was and how filthy the whole thing was.
Since privatisation rolling stock has improved dramatically and the number of passengers is nearly 3 times as much. Despite the constant whinging the service is far better today than when it was British Rail. Any objective measure makes privatisation of the railways a roaring success.
As for profit, I don't think huge amounts are made.
Have you actually got figures to back this up because if not, I would suggest you (as usual) are coming out with a complete load of shite ! In a previous post, I did agree with you about the rolling stock but trains are still constantly cancelled and run late and if passenger rates are up, as much as you say, then there is not enough 'improved rolling stock' to cope and lots of people have to do without a seat. And it is far from cheap to travel on the train, in this Country, as you well know (but probably not, in your one eyed world).
  #5434  
Old 03-12-2019, 07:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Golf Boy View Post
Weltklasse will be after you.
wrong again...who knew.
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  #5435  
Old 03-12-2019, 07:17 AM
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Originally Posted by weltklasse View Post
wrong again...who knew.
But surely he’s a smug expat for suggesting Britains deserve everything that’s coming to them.
  #5436  
Old 03-12-2019, 07:36 AM
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But surely he’s a smug expat for suggesting Britains deserve everything that’s coming to them.
Not smug mate more like despairing that a whole raft of people are going to vote for the tories who will do nothing substantial for them, they never have and never will.
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  #5437  
Old 03-12-2019, 08:00 AM
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An article written by Jack Merrit’s father. I’ve put this in here as his words could have political implications.

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He would be seething at his death, and his life, being used to perpetuate an agenda of hate that he gave his everything fighting against. We should never forget that. What Jack would want from this is for all of us to walk through the door he has booted down, in his black Doc Martens.
That door opens up a world where we do not lock up and throw away the key. Where we do not give indeterminate sentences, or convict people on joint enterprise. Where we do not slash prison budgets, and where we focus on rehabilitation not revenge. Where we do not consistently undermine our public services, the lifeline of our nation. Jack believed in the inherent goodness of humanity, and felt a deep social responsibility to protect that. Through us all, Jack marches on
.
Piers Morgan said this morning that he disagreed with this so in light of that we know that Jack's father is bang on
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  #5438  
Old 03-12-2019, 08:36 AM
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Piers Morgan said this morning that he disagreed with this so in light of that we know that Jack's father is bang on
Yes but who cares what that pathetic creep of an excuse for a human, thinks?
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  #5439  
Old 03-12-2019, 08:47 AM
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Have you actually got figures to back this up because if not, I would suggest you (as usual) are coming out with a complete load of shite ! In a previous post, I did agree with you about the rolling stock but trains are still constantly cancelled and run late and if passenger rates are up, as much as you say, then there is not enough 'improved rolling stock' to cope and lots of people have to do without a seat. And it is far from cheap to travel on the train, in this Country, as you well know (but probably not, in your one eyed world).
Subsidies and fares have both gone up significantly since privatisation.

People using the railways has also gone up hugely. Not sure what the reason for that but I doubt it’s anything to do with privatisation.

There don’t seem to be any meaningful customer service comparisons.
  #5440  
Old 03-12-2019, 08:47 AM
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A bizarre article in the Standard last night from the former Chairman of Natural England. This was a statutory organisation savaged by cuts and largely ignored by this government. His article laughably claimed that the Tories are the natural party of the environment because Gove has said so and Boris Johnson’s girlfriend likes animals. You really couldn’t make this stuff up.
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