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General Palace Discussion General Palace talk - please keep transfer talk in the transfer forum.

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  #121  
Old 05-06-2014, 07:43 AM
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This item was up for auction recently at Sotheby's . I didn't win it (didn't bid) but thought people interested in this thread might like to see the item

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A very early presentation relating to the original Crystal Palace (1861) Football Club,
in the form of a silver-plated tankard glass-bottom pint tankard inscribed CRYSTAL PALACE FOOTBALL CLUB, BIG-SIDE-MATCHES SEASON 1873-4, CAPTAINS, ALLPORT & NEAME

The original Crystal Palace Amateur Football Club were formed in 1861, playing their matches on the east side of the Palace grounds near Penge Common. The club was represented at the famous meeting at the Freemasons' Tavern on Long Acre, London, in 1863 , where the Football Association was formed with the objective of codifying the game with a universal set of rules. The club continued to have influence at the F.A. in its formative years and Palace's James Turner was the Association's Treasurer from 1864 to 1868.

Crystal Palace were one of the 15 clubs who entered a side for the inaugural F.A. Cup competition of 1871-72. It is recorded that Palace's Mr D. Allport, presumably the same individual who is inscribed on this tankard, was of three Football Association members who were delegated with the task to purchase the first F.A. Cup trophy for £20 which became known as the 'Little Tin Idol' and was competed for between 1872 and 1895, after which it was stolen from a shop window exhibition in Birmingham and never recovered.

Crystal Palace made it to the semi-final of the first F.A. Cup competition. They also had representation in the world's first ever international match when their forward Charles Chenery was selected to play for England v Scotland in Glasgow in November 1872. Three other Palace players won England caps shortly after, goalkeepers Alexander Morten and Arthur Savage, and centre-forward Charles Smith. Morten and Smith both served on the F.A. Committee in the 1870s.

The football club disappears without trace after their last recorded match v Wanderers on 11th December 1876. The best theory is that they were forced to leave their ground and had nowhere else to play.

The name Crystal Palace re-emerged in English football in 1905 when the General Manager of the Crystal Palace Company formed a new and professional outfit, the club that still play at Selhurst Park today.

Sold for £550


22nd & 23rd May Sporting Memorabilia
Sotheby's New Bond Street
22 May 2014
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"Well, as I said before, we are only 6 points behind 4th from bottom with the prize of an additional £65 million (minimum) if we stay up. So, we'd be bonkers if that wasn't the top priority. Nobody's giving up on staying in this league." CPFC2010, 5-11-2013
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  #122  
Old 05-06-2014, 08:15 AM
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Interesting stuff DE. nice find.
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  #123  
Old 05-06-2014, 09:10 AM
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The football club disappears without trace after their last recorded match v Wanderers on 11th December 1876. The best theory is that they were forced to leave their ground and had nowhere else to play.
What has been said is that until 1876, people would have been able to get onto the land at places like the Crystal Palace and be able to roam around just as you would do in a public park or common.

After then, an act of Parliament effectively meant that the land would have been fenced off, and the Crystal Palace Company would be able to hold events inside the grounds and charge entrance fees, which probably put an end to the football matches.

It would be fascinating to prove if the Crystal Palace Company who formed our professional C.P.F.C. in 1905 - were also responsible for folding the amateur one in 1876, because of money!
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  #124  
Old 05-06-2014, 10:25 AM
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I think that kit would work as an away kit in a 90/91 style with a similar red version for trips to Chelsea and Everton. We'd need an alternative for the Champions league though.
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  #125  
Old 07-07-2014, 09:49 PM
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That old tankard is being re-auctioned in the USA. I had hoped it was bought by a Palace fan

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"Well, as I said before, we are only 6 points behind 4th from bottom with the prize of an additional £65 million (minimum) if we stay up. So, we'd be bonkers if that wasn't the top priority. Nobody's giving up on staying in this league." CPFC2010, 5-11-2013
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  #126  
Old 08-07-2014, 12:49 PM
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That old tankard is being re-auctioned in the USA. I had hoped it was bought by a Palace fan

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That should clearly be bought back by the club and put on display instead of it vanishing somewhere in America
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  #127  
Old 08-07-2014, 01:13 PM
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That should clearly be bought back by the club and put on display instead of it vanishing somewhere in America
^
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  #128  
Old 08-07-2014, 04:47 PM
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Somebody should bring this Trophy back to Norwood (where Pickles found it!) too:

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  #129  
Old 12-07-2014, 04:32 PM
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Somebody should bring this Trophy back to Norwood (where Pickles found it!) too:

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I told my old man to ditch it in the pond at Beulah Hill but he was pissed up having shown it off in the Conquering Hero Pub he walked straight past it and slung it in some tosser's garden. What a nob. I originally asked him to give it to me because the Subbuteo version was small and shit. No chance.
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  #130  
Old 19-11-2016, 08:13 PM
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There was an incredibly thick and heavy book in the main club shop today (£50! and apparently only 'volume 1'!) all about this club, the setting up of the FA and so on. Was amazed at how thick the book was and how any pages considering how little is previously known about the club and the founders of the FA, laws, first England team and so on.

Wish I'd paid more attention to it, but it was heavily shrink wrapped and covered in protective polystyrene packaging. Anyone else got any idea about it???
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"Well, as I said before, we are only 6 points behind 4th from bottom with the prize of an additional £65 million (minimum) if we stay up. So, we'd be bonkers if that wasn't the top priority. Nobody's giving up on staying in this league." CPFC2010, 5-11-2013
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  #131  
Old 20-11-2016, 01:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Dorking .Eagle View Post
There was an incredibly thick and heavy book in the main club shop today (£50! and apparently only 'volume 1'!) all about this club, the setting up of the FA and so on. Was amazed at how thick the book was and how any pages considering how little is previously known about the club and the founders of the FA, laws, first England team and so on.

Wish I'd paid more attention to it, but it was heavily shrink wrapped and covered in protective polystyrene packaging. Anyone else got any idea about it???

I wonder if our old friend Alan Russell was involved in any research in this book, I know he has spent plenty of time looking through various archives on the subject.

I have to admit, it has always fascinated me how far back the sporting legacy of 'Crystal Palace' actually goes.

The earliest recorded match we have for a 'Crystal Palace FC' is 1861, but in a series of fascinating of newspaper cuttings kindly uploaded by a BBS user named 'plumey1969' on Memory Lane, we find this intriguing clip, dating from September 1853, nearly a year before the Palace had been re-built in at what is now Crystal Palace Park - and not even two years after it was dismantled in Hyde Park for the original Great Exhibition of 1851, which gave us our splendid name!



(Cutting from 'The Era' Sunday 18 September 1853)

Probably my favourite piece of Crystal Palace related nostalgia, linking these players (who, I can only guess, were involved in re-building the Hyde Park Crystal Palace in Norwood) and how strangely curious that the first ever recorded fixture is against a team from South Norwood, a full 71 years before Palace moved into Selhurst Park in 1924!
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  #132  
Old 20-11-2016, 02:09 PM
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It looked like a book right up my street, but at £50 I'd want to have a quick flick through to be sure it was worth the money, get an idea of it etc. Most off it was so protectively packaged you couldn't even read all the blurb on the back cover

Can't find any trace of it on amazon etc to investigate further, should have paid more attention an made a note of the title
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"Crystal Palace is cult viewing, like a late night TV show that only a few people know about, like a precious record that was never number one but makes everybody who knows it want to dance and sing… and sometimes cry." Tony, 3-7-2001

"Well, as I said before, we are only 6 points behind 4th from bottom with the prize of an additional £65 million (minimum) if we stay up. So, we'd be bonkers if that wasn't the top priority. Nobody's giving up on staying in this league." CPFC2010, 5-11-2013
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  #133  
Old 20-11-2016, 09:50 PM
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Given our current defensive frailties it was fortunate that the original football club didn't succeed in increasing the goal size from 8 yards to 12 yards in 1869.
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  #134  
Old 20-11-2016, 10:06 PM
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The book is 'The origin of Crystal Palace FC' vol 1 by Steve Martyniuk. Look at ISBN services.
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  #135  
Old 20-11-2016, 10:07 PM
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Newspaper extract regarding rule change:

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Also Michael Hughes a f*****g 87 year old journeyman showed Garcia, Pongolle, Potter, Kewell and Cisse how to play in a wide position, he took the p**s out of us tonight. (LFC fansite)

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  #136  
Old 20-11-2016, 10:14 PM
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The book is 'The origin of Crystal Palace FC' vol 1 by Steve Martyniuk. Look at ISBN services.
Thanks Tony

Found its own website at To view the link you have to Register or Login

which has excepts of a few pages, including 'page 356' (told you it was a whopper!)

It looked very professionally pubished, a proper quality hardback, and I doubt if the print run is very big at all, probably no profit in it at all with what it will sell. One for Crimbo methinks.
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"Well, as I said before, we are only 6 points behind 4th from bottom with the prize of an additional £65 million (minimum) if we stay up. So, we'd be bonkers if that wasn't the top priority. Nobody's giving up on staying in this league." CPFC2010, 5-11-2013

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  #137  
Old 20-11-2016, 10:47 PM
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Well Found Dorking . Eagle. I met Steve quite by chance at The Croydon 'Local Studies' Library in Croydon, where he was doing some research on Vol 2.
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  #138  
Old 20-11-2016, 11:01 PM
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This is my uncles book!

I have asked the club shop to remove the packaging so that people can check out the contents.
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  #139  
Old 20-11-2016, 11:02 PM
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The sample pages look ridiculously crammed with meticulously researched info. It will certainly be eye-opening to read everything that the author has learned. For so long there has been different 'theories' of what might have happened, so it will be good to be able to see loads of accumulated first-hand source info, particularly if some sort of connection between the early and current clubs can be made (we shall see!)

BTW 4 years!!!!!!
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"Well, as I said before, we are only 6 points behind 4th from bottom with the prize of an additional £65 million (minimum) if we stay up. So, we'd be bonkers if that wasn't the top priority. Nobody's giving up on staying in this league." CPFC2010, 5-11-2013
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  #140  
Old 20-11-2016, 11:05 PM
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Sounds very interesting
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