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  #11681  
Old 15-01-2022, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Worksop Palace View Post
The issue with that, and I don’t necessarily disagree with your main point, is that if every voter like me who wanted to do everything possible to keep Corbyn out, would have spoilt their paper, it’s likely Corbyn would now be PM.

I don’t view me voting Tory to keep Corbyn out being any different to those who ‘held their nose’ voting for Corbyn.

Had there been a decent Labour leader in play (Starmer even, as an example), then I wouldn’t have felt the need to vote Tory, maybe would have even voted Labour (manifesto dependent).

It’s really as simple as that.
I was heavily coming from the idealist perspective in my post and obviously that does not take into account the reality of the electorate knowing that only one of two parties will triumph and if that happens with a majority, checks and balances can go out the window and we are in affect left powerless to stop the idiocy of certain policies being implemented.

When the leaders of those two parties are awful it is understandable that there is a hold your nose while putting your 'X' in the box mentality.

What being faced with Johnson or Corbyn has proved is that a voting system solely dependant on FPTP to elect our representatives is highly flawed.
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  #11682  
Old 15-01-2022, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by ExiledStirling View Post
I was heavily coming from the idealist perspective in my post and obviously that does not take into account the reality of the electorate knowing that only two parties will triumph and if that happens with a majority, checks and balances can go out the window and we are in affect left powerless to stop the idiocy of certain policies being implemented.

When the leaders of those two parties are awful it is understandable that there is a hold your nose while putting your 'X' in the box mentality.

What being faced with Johnson or Corbyn has proved is that a voting system solely dependant on FPTP to elect our representatives is highly flawed.
Certainly donít disagree with that.
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  #11683  
Old 15-01-2022, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by cpfc4evandeva View Post
Yep. Johnson is going to survive all of this for that very reason.
Hoisted by his own petard
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  #11684  
Old 15-01-2022, 11:02 AM
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Originally Posted by SE25 exile View Post
This was epitomised last night when Newsnight did some street interviews in the constituency of a Tory MP apologist for Johnson (the guy with the blonde wig, I can't remember his name). Most stopped in the street were disgusted with Johnson, but they came across a couple, a 40 year old or so man, who claimed that Johnson had "saved" him, but he didn't elaborate how. Then next to him was this woman who may have been his mum, looked a bit of a rough diamond, and said she had never voted before until the last election, and thought Johnson was a great friendly bloke, and just like she was (presumably fallible and flawed), implying not the usual politician.
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  #11685  
Old 15-01-2022, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by SE25 exile View Post
This was epitomised last night when Newsnight did some street interviews in the constituency of a Tory MP apologist for Johnson (the guy with the blonde wig, I can't remember his name). Most stopped in the street were disgusted with Johnson, but they came across a couple, a 40 year old or so man, who claimed that Johnson had "saved" him, but he didn't elaborate how. Then next to him was this woman who may have been his mum, looked a bit of a rough diamond, and said she had never voted before until the last election, and thought Johnson was a great friendly bloke, and just like she was (presumably fallible and flawed), implying not the usual politician.
What this describes is the problem all politicians face to some extent, you have to be relatable and statesmanlike all at the same time. Some people want one and some people want the other. And that’s often before you get close to policies.

Johnson doesn’t try statesmanlike at all, because he cannot, but he does do relatable for clearly enough people to win in 2019 and in London (twice)
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  #11686  
Old 15-01-2022, 11:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Adlerhorst View Post
What this describes is the problem all politicians face to some extent, you have to be relatable and statesmanlike all at the same time. Some people want one and some people want the other. And that’s often before you get close to policies.

Johnson doesn’t try statesmanlike at all, because he cannot, but he does do relatable for clearly enough people to win in 2019 and in London (twice)
I think he has that private school manner of carrying himself and speaking with such supreme confidence that he sounds like he knows what he's talking about, that makes him seem statesmanlike for long enough to fool a sufficient number of people. The problem (from his point of view) is that sooner or later enough people realise there's no substance behind the big words and the Latin asides.
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  #11687  
Old 15-01-2022, 11:53 AM
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I’m finding all this rewriting of history a little bit tedious. Yiou know what I mean, the whole “I wasn’t a happy Tory voter; I only voted for Johnson to keep Corbyn out” schtick.

So let’s remind ourselves what people said before Johnson was on the ropes. E.g. ;
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Originally Posted by Worksop Palace View Post
Apologist ?

Nah. Voted for them with a smile on my face mate.
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  #11688  
Old 15-01-2022, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by in-exile View Post
...and I was shocked to discover a large number of people in my garden drinking after I had invited them to drink in my garden, although I cannot recall if I was there..

Saw it on Facebook..

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  #11689  
Old 15-01-2022, 12:04 PM
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  #11690  
Old 15-01-2022, 12:08 PM
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  #11691  
Old 15-01-2022, 12:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 13thsasquatch View Post
I think he has that private school manner of carrying himself and speaking with such supreme confidence that he sounds like he knows what he's talking about, that makes him seem statesmanlike for long enough to fool a sufficient number of people. The problem (from his point of view) is that sooner or later enough people realise there's no substance behind the big words and the Latin asides.
Private school confidence is more Cameron, Johnson is simply supreme bluster. Along the lines of I believe this impossible thing will happen so much it will happpen.

Iíve worked in industries oversupplied with private school types for ever and you get Cameron types all the time, full on Johnson types are properly rare because in the real world they are found out an exposed early on. The only industries they succeed in is ones that are predicated on bullshit. Politics, journalism etc.
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  #11692  
Old 15-01-2022, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz View Post
I’m finding all this rewriting of history a little bit tedious. Yiou know what I mean, the whole “I wasn’t a happy Tory voter; I only voted for Johnson to keep Corbyn out” schtick.

So let’s remind ourselves what people said before Johnson was on the ropes. E.g. ;
Yes. And?

It kept Corbyn out of No 10, which was my one objective. So absolutely it put a smile on my face. Just as it would have put a smile on Corbyn voters faces that ‘held their nose’ if he’d have won. So what?

And btw way, you’ve got to be extremely sad to go trawling for a post made 2 years or so ago on a Saturday morning. To think how irrelevant the post is as well.

Silly Billy
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  #11693  
Old 15-01-2022, 01:01 PM
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  #11694  
Old 15-01-2022, 01:13 PM
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I think the damage is done and the killing blow will come from his own party, not the scummy DM
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  #11695  
Old 15-01-2022, 01:13 PM
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Rather have a piss up Boris than a prick like Stammer and his deputy who does a blinding impression of John Bishop.
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  #11696  
Old 15-01-2022, 01:49 PM
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Rather have a piss up Boris than a prick like Stammer and his deputy who does a blinding impression of John Bishop.
It's insights like this which keep me coming back to the Politics forum.
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Old 15-01-2022, 01:52 PM
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It's insights like this which keep me coming back to the Politics forum.
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  #11698  
Old 15-01-2022, 01:54 PM
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Rather have a piss up Boris than a prick like Stammer and his deputy who does a blinding impression of John Bishop.
No hope for some
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  #11699  
Old 15-01-2022, 01:55 PM
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Like Worksop, Little Al was also a happy Tory voter (although at least he has the integrity to admit to it, rather than hiding behind the 'stop Corbyn' nonsense) ; but he has gone strangely silent. Hope he's OK.
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  #11700  
Old 15-01-2022, 01:59 PM
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Rather have a piss up Boris than a prick like Stammer and his deputy who does a blinding impression of John Bishop.
Have to ask. Are you a Turkey who likes Christmas? Johnson is without doubt the worst PM this country has ever had.
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