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  #101  
Old 22-06-2019, 01:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Great Lombardi View Post
Blah blah rumours of bad attitude... yawn...

Belgium guy - prem appearances zero = gamble

James - prem experience zero = gamble

Clyne - 175 prem games, 28 (in his prime) = minimal gamble

Obsession with former Palace players or... obsession with untried youngsters and players from exotic leagues?

Spend the 12m and use the rest on a striker.
Clyne will be a gamble if the reports about his off the field behaviour are even remotely true. And an expensive one at that.

If we are going to plan for the longer term then we need younger players. Ward will be 30 next season; Sakho 30; PVA 29; Kelly 30; Dann 33; Tompkins 31.

They will all need replacing sooner rather than later, and surely it would be better to bring in younger players with more chance of a sell on fee.
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  #102  
Old 22-06-2019, 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Great Lombardi View Post
Lots of mental comments on this thread.

England international, who knows the club....

Vastly experienced and proven in the Premier League who can slot seamlessly into the side...

For a small slice of what we are getting for AWB...

And people DO NOT want him??

Ohhh but let's gamble our cash on a bloke from Belgium or a youngster from the Championship...
His wages will be more than Castagne, his value will also only go downwards given his age. Castagne's meanwhile will only grow, not developing enough sellable assets has restricted us in the market for a few years now.
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  #103  
Old 22-06-2019, 01:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Great Lombardi View Post
Blah blah rumours of bad attitude... yawn...

Belgium guy - prem appearances zero = gamble

James - prem experience zero = gamble

Clyne - 175 prem games, 28 (in his prime) = minimal gamble

Obsession with former Palace players or... obsession with untried youngsters and players from exotic leagues?

Spend the 12m and use the rest on a striker.
AWB had zero premier league experience, he did okay. Just move on from old players coming back to the club.
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  #104  
Old 22-06-2019, 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SOUTHGATE EAGLE View Post
Or...

Buy an emerging player who will cost less in wages.

Have more money left to buy that far more necessary, big ticket, striker.

Have Ward as a more than capable RB option, in case said new RB isn't ready this year, as opposed to buying Clyne and having less money to fund a new striker, a position in which we have no alternative options we can rely on.

Develop the new RB into an appreciating asset instead of depreciating.

Have a RB player who is young and hungry, as opposed to Clyne.

Have less chance of injuries with young RB as opposed to Clyne.

Actually, nah, f*ck it, let's blow £12M and massive wages on a player who has injury issues, an attitude problem, will be worth peanuts by contracts end and have less money to buy a striker or CAM, positions in which we lack quality far more. Makes way more sense.
Yeah let's sign a young 'emerging' player... bound to be a glittering success.

Let's check our recent record of 'acquisitions' under 24:

Rakip
Jach
Riedewald
Perri
Fonsu-Mensah
Campana
Bamford
Sanogo
Meyer (jurys out)
Sorloth (jurys out)
RLC - very good 'in spells'

Hardly covered ourselves in glory!

Ohhh and this attitude problem... I hope it's more than "footballer likes a drink and a few girlfriends..." or we could rule out half the registered pros.
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  #105  
Old 22-06-2019, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Great Lombardi View Post
Yeah let's sign a young 'emerging' player... bound to be a glittering success.

Let's check our recent record of 'acquisitions' under 24:

Rakip
Jach
Riedewald
Perri
Fonsu-Mensah
Campana
Bamford
Sanogo
Meyer (jurys out)
Sorloth (jurys out)
RLC - very good 'in spells'

Hardly covered ourselves in glory!

Ohhh and this attitude problem... I hope it's more than "footballer likes a drink and a few girlfriends..." or we could rule out half the registered pros.
Speculation and the failure it brings is part of football and the price to unearth the big winners required to prosper in the Prem. Sure, young and unproven is a risk but there is a potentially far bigger upside than getting in an aging player whose best physical years are behind him. With the aging player you generally have a ceiling to what you can hope for and you know for certain that you have purchased a player whose value has peaked. And that's without the wage demands an experienced player demands.

I could just as easily list older players who haven't set the world on fire here and cost higher wages too. Benteke is top of that list but even Sakho, with all his quality, misses a lot of games and the two of them, together, are a major reason for our spending issues right now. There's the fact we have an aging squad, which cannot be ignored. Do we want to go down the Sunderland, West Brom, QPR and Stoke route? Look how filling their squads with high earning journeymen worked out for them. Teams that stay up need a 'spark' that was conspicuously lacking from those teams and that spark comes from talent, youth and hunger, all of which require speculation to unearth and sometimes a waste of money. At least, by spinning the wheel, you give yourself a chance to win big.

The alternative is to fill up our squad with near 30-somethings and wait for the advance of age, concomitant injuries and inevitable zero resale value to catch up with us, all while massively increasing the wage bill. I'd rather we don't go down the road of those clubs.
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  #106  
Old 22-06-2019, 05:44 PM
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If AWB does leave i'd quite like Clyne as a replacement.
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  #107  
Old 22-06-2019, 05:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gyro1780 View Post
If AWB does leave i'd quite like Clyne as a replacement.
I really would not. Looked poor for Bournemouth and a spent player (even at 28). Think we can find better.
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  #108  
Old 22-06-2019, 05:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Great Lombardi View Post
Yeah let's sign a young 'emerging' player... bound to be a glittering success.

Let's check our recent record of 'acquisitions' under 24:

Rakip
Jach
Riedewald
Perri
Fonsu-Mensah
Campana
Bamford
Sanogo
Meyer (jurys out)
Sorloth (jurys out)
RLC - very good 'in spells'

Hardly covered ourselves in glory!

Ohhh and this attitude problem... I hope it's more than "footballer likes a drink and a few girlfriends..." or we could rule out half the registered pros.
You do realize that six of those were loans?

As for his attitude, there have been repeated problems rumoured and not just drinking. If they are true, why would we want him?

Of course, you ignored:

Bolasie
Gayle
Zaha
Kelly

And if we allow for under 26:

Milivojevic
Townsend
PVA
Schlupp

What that says is the overall record is mixed, albeit with some pretty good buys. The advantage of a younger player is that they at least usually have a reasonable chance of a sell on fee, and or lower wages. And no, they donít have to be under 21.

But donít let that get in the way of an older ex-Palace player who looked frightful when he played for Bournemouth, and has been heavily rumoured to have off the field issues.
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  #109  
Old 22-06-2019, 06:05 PM
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could do worse
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  #110  
Old 22-06-2019, 06:23 PM
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could do worse
Could do better
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  #111  
Old 22-06-2019, 07:27 PM
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shocked how bad he was for bournemouth - but, there again, was an (almost) meaningless game
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  #112  
Old 22-06-2019, 07:50 PM
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Must admit it is tempting as he does have a superb pedigree, but then so did Benteke. I agree with those saying we need to get younger players in, even though our recent track record has been poor.
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  #113  
Old 22-06-2019, 07:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Great Lombardi View Post
Yeah let's sign a young 'emerging' player... bound to be a glittering success.

Let's check our recent record of 'acquisitions' under 24:

Rakip
Jach
Riedewald
Perri
Fonsu-Mensah
Campana
Bamford
Sanogo
Meyer (jurys out)
Sorloth (jurys out)
RLC - very good 'in spells'

Hardly covered ourselves in glory!

Ohhh and this attitude problem... I hope it's more than "footballer likes a drink and a few girlfriends..." or we could rule out half the registered pros.

A bit harsh 4 of those were loans a few were reaches and gambles and Perri is clearly not here to start straight away. What about PVA, guitta Tomkins Townsend mcarthur cabaye Luka. PVA(although gone of the boil)
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  #114  
Old 22-06-2019, 08:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Great Lombardi View Post
Lots of mental comments on this thread.

England international, who knows the club....

Vastly experienced and proven in the Premier League who can slot seamlessly into the side...

For a small slice of what we are getting for AWB...

And people DO NOT want him??

Ohhh but let's gamble our cash on a bloke from Belgium or a youngster from the Championship...
Yep, thatís exactly what I hope we do. Iíd rather have a young, hungry up & coming player than one that should be in his prime but for some reason heís on the declyne!
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  #115  
Old 22-06-2019, 08:41 PM
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Been out all day with a mate who has managed at a good level and is a highly qualified coach. He reckons we should buy Clyne because he's still a good player and better than AWB.
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  #116  
Old 22-06-2019, 09:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NickinOx View Post
You do realize that six of those were loans?

As for his attitude, there have been repeated problems rumoured and not just drinking. If they are true, why would we want him?

Of course, you ignored:

Bolasie
Gayle
Zaha
Kelly

And if we allow for under 26:

Milivojevic
Townsend
PVA
Schlupp

What that says is the overall record is mixed, albeit with some pretty good buys. The advantage of a younger player is that they at least usually have a reasonable chance of a sell on fee, and or lower wages. And no, they donít have to be under 21.

But donít let that get in the way of an older ex-Palace player who looked frightful when he played for Bournemouth, and has been heavily rumoured to have off the field issues.
Rumours eh.... anything concrete... nah did not think so.

Our former captain was drunkingly swinging round a belt after a night out and got a standing ovation during the last game?

As for ignoring players under 26... yeah a whole two years younger than Clyne...

I have never said do NOT sign young promising players... just do not assume they will be better deals than an England full-back who probably still has five good years in him.
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  #117  
Old 22-06-2019, 09:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Great Lombardi View Post
Yeah let's sign a young 'emerging' player... bound to be a glittering success.

Let's check our recent record of 'acquisitions' under 24:

Rakip
Jach
Riedewald
Perri
Fonsu-Mensah
Campana
Bamford
Sanogo
Meyer (jurys out)
Sorloth (jurys out)
RLC - very good 'in spells'

Hardly covered ourselves in glory!

Ohhh and this attitude problem... I hope it's more than "footballer likes a drink and a few girlfriends..." or we could rule out half the registered pros.
could set out a similar list of older/injury prone players who we have signed on the way down.
Clyne is not the player he was
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  #118  
Old 22-06-2019, 09:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philipw View Post
shocked how bad he was for bournemouth - but, there again, was an (almost) meaningless game
According to Bournemouth fans he was good for the first 5 games and bad for the last 9. They certainly do not want him.
Would have loved this 2 years ago,but at 15m and a large salary I think I will pass.
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  #119  
Old 22-06-2019, 09:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Great Lombardi View Post
Rumours eh.... anything concrete... nah did not think so.

Our former captain was drunkingly swinging round a belt after a night out and got a standing ovation during the last game?

As for ignoring players under 26... yeah a whole two years younger than Clyne...

I have never said do NOT sign young promising players... just do not assume they will be better deals than an England full-back who probably still has five good years in him.
And our captain has been poor for two seasons. Do you really want to sign someone like that? Poor recent record, off the field problems, and shite for the last half of the season. No thanks. But if you think that is good enough, good for you.

Nowhere have I said any old youngster. I just think there is better value and younger available, and without the likely baggage.

That two years to include 26 and under means we would be looking at a possible sell on fee in 3-4 years. But letís ignore that too.
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Old 22-06-2019, 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Philipw View Post
shocked how bad he was for bournemouth - but, there again, was an (almost) meaningless game
How many times. He played left back in the first half and was much better in the second on the right
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I still think Adebola was a good signing...
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