Home | Forums | Gallery | Twitter
 
CPFC BBS  

Go Back   CPFC BBS Off Topic The Politics Forum

Notices

The Politics Forum Discussions that are wholly or mainly concerned with UK politics

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1001  
Old 20-04-2020, 11:58 AM
Woosie's Avatar
Woosie Woosie is offline
Jolene Jolene Jolene...
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Age: 28
Posts: 15,981
Rep Power: 21474849
Woosie Sam the man is hereWoosie Sam the man is hereWoosie Sam the man is hereWoosie Sam the man is hereWoosie Sam the man is hereWoosie Sam the man is hereWoosie Sam the man is hereWoosie Sam the man is hereWoosie Sam the man is hereWoosie Sam the man is hereWoosie Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heb 7:4 View Post
Agree with you. No one with a -33% approval rating is going to win an election, unless their opponent is at -34% or more.

You'd have to be a fool, treating the electorate with contempt, to think you can go into an election being so personally unpopular and have people vote for you. It would be an act of unconscionable arrogance, and you would be responsible for the subsequent damage done to your party.

Edit: I can't even do basic maths. But still, no to a return to Blair.
For someone who claims not to care about factionalism, you peddle it far too frequently. Give you your dues though, you are remarkably persistent.
__________________
'it would be boring if they won every time right?'

If we can winter this one out, we can summer anywhere
Reply With Quote
  #1002  
Old 20-04-2020, 11:59 AM
ExiledStirling's Avatar
ExiledStirling ExiledStirling is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Thurso in the Highlands
Age: 60
Posts: 38,823
Rep Power: 21474848
ExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by weltklasse View Post
how on earth did you infer that?
I didn't infer anything I was asking a question.
Reply With Quote
  #1003  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:05 PM
ExiledStirling's Avatar
ExiledStirling ExiledStirling is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Thurso in the Highlands
Age: 60
Posts: 38,823
Rep Power: 21474848
ExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heb 7:4 View Post
Like anyone else I say what I think, others sometimes agree/disagree and I reply. That is it.

Lately you often come along thinking you're Sigmond Freud not to engage with anything I said, but to make up some bollocks about what I really believe or some underhand comment about what my posting style supposedly reveals about me or just to throw some unnecessary insults.

I have no idea why you do it. If my posts annoy you put me on ignore. But for love of God please stop with this tedious shit. Or maybe just reply agreeing/disagreeing with whatever bollocks I've written, like a normal person?
I long for the day you do not have to rely on your playbook and instead can simply reply with integrity, instead of twisting both your own words and that of others.
Reply With Quote
  #1004  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:10 PM
Stinger1 Stinger1 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 5,837
Rep Power: 21474844
Stinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
You dare say, but you have no idea if that is true. Blair's politics are now not popular.
Your love for Corbyn blinds you as to how low the bar actually is. All is needed is someone who isn't anti-business, who wants to invest more in public services and schools, cares a bit more for social justice and protection for workers. That's it. However early signs from Rishi Sunak suggest he could be a far more daunting political opponent than anything the Conservatives have ever put up and the bar will be raised and the opportunity will be missed.
Reply With Quote
  #1005  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:11 PM
meee meee is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 9,358
Rep Power: 21474845
meee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heb 7:4 View Post
I wasn't aware of Watson's connection to racists, what's the story there?
Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post

To view the link you have to Register or Login

And he ran a racist election campaign:

To view the link you have to Register or Login
.
Reply With Quote
  #1006  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:14 PM
cockneyrebel cockneyrebel is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Lewisham
Posts: 20,789
Rep Power: 21474853
cockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is herecockneyrebel Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinger1 View Post
Your love for Corbyn blinds you as to how low the bar actually is. All is needed is someone who isn't anti-business, who wants to invest more in public services and schools, cares a bit more for social justice and protection for workers. That's it. However early signs from Rishi Sunak suggest he could be a far more daunting political opponent than anything the Conservatives have ever put up and the bar will be raised and the opportunity will be missed.
Lol you do speak rubbish sometimes. I have no love for corbyn. I disagreed with him on Brexit, Syria, his advisors, anti Semitism and many other issues. Hes not even a socialist. But I hoped he would leader to a bigger left wing movement.

In terms of the above Brown and Miliband failed.

There is also much more to it than your glib suggestions.
Reply With Quote
  #1007  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:15 PM
meee meee is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 9,358
Rep Power: 21474845
meee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by weltklasse View Post
the opposite of centrism
How would you define centrism?
Reply With Quote
  #1008  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:19 PM
weltklasse's Avatar
weltklasse weltklasse is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Horsham, West Sussex
Posts: 38,835
Rep Power: 21474856
weltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by ExiledStirling View Post
I didn't infer anything I was asking a question.
with a clear inference...shame you cannot accept the obvious.
__________________
Don't worry, boys, we'll weather this storm of approval and come out as hated as ever.

SaulAlinsky
Reply With Quote
  #1009  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:20 PM
weltklasse's Avatar
weltklasse weltklasse is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Horsham, West Sussex
Posts: 38,835
Rep Power: 21474856
weltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is hereweltklasse Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by meee View Post
How would you define centrism?
its a cheap label used by CR alot?
__________________
Don't worry, boys, we'll weather this storm of approval and come out as hated as ever.

SaulAlinsky
Reply With Quote
  #1010  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:25 PM
meee meee is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 9,358
Rep Power: 21474845
meee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by weltklasse View Post
its a cheap label used by CR alot?
Well yes. And I use it too but I try to be clear what I mean by it. But what does it mean to you? Which opinions would you put at the extreme end of a political spectrum and which opinions fit into the centre? I don't believe my opinions are remotely extreme but I would find it hard to argue the fact that I sit on the left of the UK's spectrum.
Reply With Quote
  #1011  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:27 PM
meee meee is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 9,358
Rep Power: 21474845
meee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinger1 View Post
Despised by some for being a war criminal, despised by others for being Tory-lite but most associate him with a positive period in our history. I'd dare to say with a cabinet of moderates he'd wipe the floor with Bojo and the Tories.
I can't say this for certain, as the evidence I have is sketchy, but I'm 99% sure that you cannot possibly be Prime Minister in this country right now if you supported Remain in the referendum. There is absolutely no way you could win a majority in an election unless every other party put up a candidate in favour of Remain. So I don't agree.
Reply With Quote
  #1012  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:34 PM
meee meee is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 9,358
Rep Power: 21474845
meee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Baffled Bob 2 View Post
Which ones? Work out which are not popular and ditch them. Work out which ones are popular and keep them. Or is that too obvious?
It's not that simple. People are not that engaged.

I tried to make the case for Labour up here last year amongst my friends. I was trying to convince apathetic voters to vote and also had several Brexit voters who enjoyed debating with me because they hadn't actually heard the Remain side of the argument!

The theme was the same throughout. "Labour did this in 2008" "Labour did this in 2009" "Labour introduced x policy that I didn't like" "Labour supported immigrants" "Corbyn is a Remainer trying to block us from leaving the EU."

When I suggested that the whole point of electing Corbyn as leader was to change the direction of the Labour party from that era, and that actually he had mostly been a Eurosceptic in his political career the response was "Even if that's true he supported the IRA so he hates the British".

The electorate is not what you think anymore.
Reply With Quote
  #1013  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:35 PM
adrenalin john's Avatar
adrenalin john adrenalin john is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: out between inns
Age: 55
Posts: 37,381
Rep Power: 21474855
adrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by meee View Post
I can't say this for certain, as the evidence I have is sketchy, but I'm 99% sure that you cannot possibly be Prime Minister in this country right now if you supported Remain in the referendum. There is absolutely no way you could win a majority in an election unless every other party put up a candidate in favour of Remain. So I don't agree.
Interesting point. One I need to think through. Mainly because I fervently hope you are wrong, but am not at all sure that you are.
__________________
please see above or if you want less words am SlaithwaitePalace on twitter
Reply With Quote
  #1014  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:42 PM
meee meee is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 9,358
Rep Power: 21474845
meee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinger1 View Post
Your love for Corbyn blinds you as to how low the bar actually is. All is needed is someone who isn't anti-business, who wants to invest more in public services and schools, cares a bit more for social justice and protection for workers. That's it. However early signs from Rishi Sunak suggest he could be a far more daunting political opponent than anything the Conservatives have ever put up and the bar will be raised and the opportunity will be missed.
Most voters I know are not anti business.

Most voters I know would be reluctant to invest in public services and would rather pay less tax.

Most voters I know don't care about social justice and they would want workers' protections but wouldn't trust a policy on it unless it came from someone right wing.

I live in a traditional Labour area. These are normal and widely shared views now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by adrenalin john View Post
Interesting point. One I need to think through. Mainly because I fervently hope you are wrong, but am not at all sure that you are.
I wish I was wrong too. I spent the whole election campaign telling anyone that asked that the Tories would win a huge majority on the issue of Brexit alone. I said it many times on here and me and eddieskyclad both agreed (for different reasons) that the Tories would sweep the north east. We couldn't have been more right and even I underestimated some of the margins that they did it with. Remainers voted for Brexit supporting parties here too.
Reply With Quote
  #1015  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:42 PM
adrenalin john's Avatar
adrenalin john adrenalin john is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: out between inns
Age: 55
Posts: 37,381
Rep Power: 21474855
adrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is hereadrenalin john Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by meee View Post
It's not that simple. People are not that engaged.

I tried to make the case for Labour up here last year amongst my friends. I was trying to convince apathetic voters to vote and also had several Brexit voters who enjoyed debating with me because they hadn't actually heard the Remain side of the argument!

The theme was the same throughout. "Labour did this in 2008" "Labour did this in 2009" "Labour introduced x policy that I didn't like" "Labour supported immigrants" "Corbyn is a Remainer trying to block us from leaving the EU."

When I suggested that the whole point of electing Corbyn as leader was to change the direction of the Labour party from that era, and that actually he had mostly been a Eurosceptic in his political career the response was "Even if that's true he supported the IRA so he hates the British".

The electorate is not what you think anymore.
The withdrawal of mainstream media and the rise of fact-free social media that can be manipulated to place emotion over reason has been quite the changing of the guard.

Not only that, because we are atomised into our social groups on and offline, most of us haven't even noticed, or at least realised the extent of the change.

London needs to leave the UK, let Redcar be BrexitBluecar, Let London choose its own culture and destiny.
__________________
please see above or if you want less words am SlaithwaitePalace on twitter
Reply With Quote
  #1016  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:45 PM
meee meee is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 9,358
Rep Power: 21474845
meee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by adrenalin john View Post
The withdrawal of mainstream media and the rise of fact-free social media that can be manipulated to place emotion over reason has been quite the changing of the guard.

Not only that, because we are atomised into our social groups on and offline, most of us haven't even noticed, or at least realised the extent of the change.

London needs to leave the UK, let Redcar be BrexitBluecar, Let London choose its own culture and destiny.
You are selling this Londependence thing well! Only one small question, would I be allowed a visa to watch Palace?
Reply With Quote
  #1017  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:54 PM
Stinger1 Stinger1 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 5,837
Rep Power: 21474844
Stinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is hereStinger1 Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by meee View Post
I can't say this for certain, as the evidence I have is sketchy, but I'm 99% sure that you cannot possibly be Prime Minister in this country right now if you supported Remain in the referendum. There is absolutely no way you could win a majority in an election unless every other party put up a candidate in favour of Remain. So I don't agree.
As long as they accepted and respected the result and wouldn't pursue a change in the relationship with the EU I don't believe that's true. It would take a certain amount of skill to no be defined on their Brexit stance I would agree with that.

But if that is the case does Labour have anyone who was staunchly in the leave camp?
Reply With Quote
  #1018  
Old 20-04-2020, 12:54 PM
ExiledStirling's Avatar
ExiledStirling ExiledStirling is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Thurso in the Highlands
Age: 60
Posts: 38,823
Rep Power: 21474848
ExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is hereExiledStirling Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by weltklasse View Post
with a clear inference...shame you cannot accept the obvious.
Now I know you think you are being clever here but you really are not. I could have asked three questions to Stamford's post so I could understand what his post was driving at, but deciding on just the one and depending his answer I could then have asked the other two.

The other two would have been Do you not attach much importance to what is in the report? Do you think Antisemitism is of greater significance to what is alleged in the report?

So what obvious am I not accepting?
Reply With Quote
  #1019  
Old 20-04-2020, 01:14 PM
meee meee is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 9,358
Rep Power: 21474845
meee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is heremeee Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinger1 View Post
As long as they accepted and respected the result and wouldn't pursue a change in the relationship with the EU I don't believe that's true. It would take a certain amount of skill to no be defined on their Brexit stance I would agree with that.

But if that is the case does Labour have anyone who was staunchly in the leave camp?
There's people like John Mann yes but they would still have hurdles to overcome to move Labour away from being seen as a pro EU party. And the membership massively supported Remain, so it's a bit of a non starter. It's certainly not something I'm advocating for but that is part of the direction that Labour would have to take for any of its leaders to now be considered electable. My general point is that Corbyn only represents part of the problem and his political ideology an even smaller part. Any potential Labour leader would face all of the same issues. The whole middle ground idea has gone, the middle ground is further right. In order to win elections we have to win the argument and first that means deciding as a broad coalition exactly what we are all willing to rally around.
Reply With Quote
  #1020  
Old 20-04-2020, 01:24 PM
Joe85's Avatar
Joe85 Joe85 is online now
Once More Into The Fray
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Republic of Britain & Northern Ireland
Posts: 14,573
Rep Power: 21474843
Joe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is hereJoe85 Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
Lol you do speak rubbish sometimes. I have no love for corbyn. I disagreed with him on Brexit, Syria, his advisors, anti Semitism and many other issues. Hes not even a socialist. But I hoped he would leader to a bigger left wing movement.

In terms of the above Brown and Miliband failed.

There is also much more to it than your glib suggestions.
Sunak. His suit fits and he can read from a script. Absolute powerhouse of a political operator, apparently.
__________________
A truce... Bruce
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 02:22 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.