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  #29941  
Old 22-03-2019, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by smileysmith View Post
I dunno. I think history will judge Cameron pretty harshly.
Can we all agree to not buy his long awaited "Memoirs" book if he ever has the gall to publish it?

(Unless he gives all profits to good causes - highly unlikely)
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  #29942  
Old 22-03-2019, 10:24 AM
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Good to see Labour focusing on our country's key priorities as ever:

Today, three urgent questions in the Commons:

1) @mtpennycook – Extending Article 50
2) @EmilyThornberry – UNHRC inquiry into deaths in Gaza
3) @LouHaigh – Prime Minister’s emergency knife crime summit
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  #29943  
Old 22-03-2019, 11:33 AM
Johnybegood Johnybegood is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NickP View Post
From guardian comments: What happened yesterday.


Corbyn reported to have WALKED OUT OF MEETING, reported being the operative word. Thanks to Jenny Bennett for this response.

1. Keir Starmer advised Corbyn to not go.
2. Caroline Lucas, leader of the Greens. said he stayed long enough to realise they were being lectured on how bad they were as MPs and it was her deal or no deal.
3. May broke the meeting agreement.
4. Chukka gatecrashed the meeting instead of attending the one he was supposed to.
5. May wound up every MP that went as well as her own.
7 JC spoke to May on the phone where she confirmed again nothing had changed.
8 Labour are trying to arrange a proper meeting which won't be today as both are in Brussels. Only Corbyn is meeting Barnier before May much to her annoyance. Barnier is very interested in what JC has to say.

IN SUMMARY - JC did not refuse to take part in crucial Brexit talks. there werent any. it was a dressing down of parliament, he was right to walk.
I am normally with you Nick and have a more favourable view of Corbyn than most but I think he has messed up here. If he had sat through the meeting / dressing down he could have easily explained that May didn't reach out like she claimed but rather tried to bulldoze her deal through knowing it will bring pain to most in the UK. He would have won the PR war.
Actually it reminded of when TM refused to debate at the last GE - a big mistake.
He has to be be statesmanlike if he wants to be a statesman. He must listen to his membership, he must lead/define the debate and he must be proactive/dynamic ....else he must stand down and let someone else do it....I give you Yvette Cooper
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  #29944  
Old 22-03-2019, 11:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Johnybegood View Post
....I give you Yvette Cooper
Need a vote first.
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  #29945  
Old 22-03-2019, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by NickP View Post
Need a vote first.
If he stepped aside first that would help.
My concern isn't so much Corbyn, it's his electability which lets the Tories in again. Being perceived as unstatesmanlike, lacking leadership and dynamism is difficult to vote for
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  #29946  
Old 22-03-2019, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Johnybegood View Post
If he stepped aside first that would help.
My concern isn't so much Corbyn, it's his electability which lets the Tories in again. Being perceived as unstatesmanlike, lacking leadership and dynamism is difficult to vote for
It's possible that Corbyn is too divisive a figure. But then there's Thatcher, which the right pushed upon the 60% of us who didn't ever vote for her.
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  #29947  
Old 22-03-2019, 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted by NickP View Post
It's possible that Corbyn is too divisive a figure. But then there's Thatcher, which the right pushed upon the 60% of us who didn't ever vote for her.
Sadly, I think you are focusing on the wrong part of the comparison to Thatcher's time. Labour are unelectable at the moment for the same reasons they were then.
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  #29948  
Old 22-03-2019, 04:22 PM
Johnybegood Johnybegood is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NickP View Post
It's possible that Corbyn is too divisive a figure. But then there's Thatcher, which the right pushed upon the 60% of us who didn't ever vote for her.
In some ways Thatcher got elected/re-elected because the opposition leader was unelectable - whatever the rights and wrongs of their policies, a leader has to win the PR war. E.g. Michael Foot, most people you ask say 'oh yeah the donkey jacket' and cannot name a single policy he stood for, apart from leftie/commie insults....frankly most people are too thick or uninterested to read too much and the right wing press feeds them soundbites

Without a credible and electable leader of the opposition we are destined to suffer the same Thatcherite fate of a decade of Tory rule, which given the current shower includes TM, Boris, Gove, Williamson, Leadsome, Mordant, Grayling, Patel, Hunt etc....I fund this truly daunting
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  #29949  
Old 22-03-2019, 04:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnybegood View Post
In some ways Thatcher got elected/re-elected because the opposition leader was unelectable - whatever the rights and wrongs of their policies, a leader has to win the PR war. E.g. Michael Foot, most people you ask say 'oh yeah the donkey jacket' and cannot name a single policy he stood for, apart from leftie/commie insults....frankly most people are too thick or uninterested to read too much and the right wing press feeds them soundbites

Without a credible and electable leader of the opposition we are destined to suffer the same Thatcherite fate of a decade of Tory rule, which given the current shower includes TM, Boris, Gove, Williamson, Leadsome, Mordant, Grayling, Patel, Hunt etc....I fund this truly daunting
Chin up. I can make you feel worse. Our options for likely governemnt are that, which is dreadful, or Corbyn, McDonnell, Rayner, Abbott, Thornberry, Trickett, and Garndiner with Seamus Milne, Andrew Murray and Andrew Fisher types in support. Which is dreadful.

We’re utterly ****ed or if the other lot win, we’re utterly ****ed.
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  #29950  
Old 22-03-2019, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Adlerhorst View Post
Chin up. I can make you feel worse. Our options for likely governemnt are that, which is dreadful, or Corbyn, McDonnell, Rayner, Abbott, Thornberry, Trickett, and Garndiner with Seamus Milne, Andrew Murray and Andrew Fisher types in support. Which is dreadful.

We’re utterly ****ed or if the other lot win, we’re utterly ****ed.
I suspect that the Tory party could well end up in two parts over the next few weeks judging by the ERG's reactions to the idea of holding indicative votes next week. If the DUP pulls the plug and May goes as well then there will need to be a General Election before the end of this year and I can see Labour winning that fairly comfortably as things currently stand. Scary times.
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  #29951  
Old 22-03-2019, 05:44 PM
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JC favourite to be next PM.

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  #29952  
Old 22-03-2019, 05:54 PM
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JC favourite to be next PM.

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To be fair, at the moment (as always) the options are (a) the leader of Labour or (b) the leader of the Tories

I wouldn't read to much into bookies odds at the moment
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  #29953  
Old 22-03-2019, 06:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adlerhorst View Post
Chin up. I can make you feel worse. Our options for likely governemnt are that, which is dreadful, or Corbyn, McDonnell, Rayner, Abbott, Thornberry, Trickett, and Garndiner with Seamus Milne, Andrew Murray and Andrew Fisher types in support. Which is dreadful.

We’re utterly ****ed or if the other lot win, we’re utterly ****ed.
Im still holding out for a rainbow coalition of labour/libs/tigger/snp/green....right now it seems like a dream ticket compared to tory/ukip/dup
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  #29954  
Old 22-03-2019, 06:12 PM
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The DUP involvement was, and is, disgusting.
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  #29955  
Old 22-03-2019, 06:32 PM
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The DUP involvement was, and is, disgusting.
If only they were fine upstanding men and women of peace like the Shinners. OTF.
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  #29956  
Old 22-03-2019, 06:39 PM
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I'd say the same if they were at the table (in masks, with guns & Declan Rice).
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  #29957  
Old 22-03-2019, 07:44 PM
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The DUP involvement was, and is, disgusting.
A shameful act, especially given their current mps bloodied hands....the very same as the IRA, Hamas, ISIS I.e. terrorists
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  #29958  
Old Yesterday, 01:54 AM
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A shameful act, especially given their current mps bloodied hands....the very same as the IRA, Hamas, ISIS I.e. terrorists
So are you saying that Sinn Fein and the DUP should not be legitimate parties who are both connected to terrorism as in ISIS and Hamas?
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  #29959  
Old Yesterday, 06:15 AM
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Old Yesterday, 07:45 AM
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So are you saying that Sinn Fein and the DUP should not be legitimate parties who are both connected to terrorism as in ISIS and Hamas?
They can ofcourse set up a political party, but I regard them the same as Abu Hamsa, a hate preacher - imagine him being in government.....and there are some e.g. Sammy Wilson who have known links to Ulster Resistance and the UDA who should really never be anywhere near a civilised government. Tribal Tories prattle on about Corbyn's meeting with the IRA and Hamas but fail to see the utter hypocrisy of being in government with the DUP
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