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  #601  
Old 25-06-2019, 10:07 AM
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So Boris has invaded his own privacy with an old picture that he's trying to pass off as new.

Marvellous fare
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  #602  
Old 25-06-2019, 10:36 AM
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Originally Posted by adrenalin john View Post
But I want, really want to be Prime Minister.

Having gone through his various non-answers and unicornic comments this is what his strategy boils down to.

I heard one MP supporter of his give the 'new technology' answer to the Irish border question, the presenter then pointed out that the EU have said that they studied every single possible border and technology and there is no such system that would work. The presenter then went on to cite the example of Norway and Sweden, friends, neighbours, efficient modern countries with great tech. Every lorry passing between the two (3,500 per day) averages 20 minutes to get passed and past.

The MP was crestfallen but soon rallied by saying the people has heard enough of what we can't do they want to listen to can do.

Emu technology it is then.

Seriously an MP, how ******* irresponsible are these people.
The problem is politically it works. People I know and had previously thought of reasonable intelligence believe it. When you point out that the tech doesn't exist, no one is seriously trying to invent it and even if it were inventable it would be impossible to invent it, test it and implement it by October, (Sure it might be possible by the end of implementation (of course it isnt - this kind of shit takes years and years) but that simply re-inforces the need for the back-stop - in case it isn't invented, tested and implemented.) they look at you blankly.

People believe in brexit. It's as simple as that and the politicians are just storing up a time bomb as to when this belief system will crumble. Of course it might not crumble - as it will be sold as all the EU's fault.

I can't really see the UK re-uniting properly for a long time. It will always be split between non-believers and believers.

Last edited by Hpalace; 25-06-2019 at 10:44 AM.
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  #603  
Old 25-06-2019, 11:19 AM
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I don't disagree. My point is how irresponsible it is to peddle this as if possible.

Farage let the unicorns loose into a public fairy story and a percentage of the electorate have consistently voted for happy endings ever since.

It is high irresponsible of politicians and the media to give these fantasies credence and 'equal weight'

It is like giving Genesis equal standing with science because a whole host of Christians believe God created the world in 6 days before having a little lie down.

I know the media, and the BBC in particular, are under pressure to report even-handedly which is only correct. However their first duty is to report the factual truth
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  #604  
Old 25-06-2019, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by adrenalin john View Post
I don't disagree. My point is how irresponsible it is to peddle this as if possible.

Farage let the unicorns loose into a public fairy story and a percentage of the electorate have consistently voted for happy endings ever since.

It is high irresponsible of politicians and the media to give these fantasies credence and 'equal weight'

It is like giving Genesis equal standing with science because a whole host of Christians believe God created the world in 6 days before having a little lie down.

I know the media, and the BBC in particular, are under pressure to report even-handedly which is only correct. However their first duty is to report the factual truth
With regards to the media the vast majority are there to sell clicks, adds and papers rather than report the factual truth. It is a business and frankly most people would get very bored very quickly if a daily mail article entitled “the border and phytosanitary checks” was published. Hardly anyone would read it, it doesn’t sell papers or adds. It is beyond most people’s comprehension.

I agree re the MPs and I also don’t understand why so many are showing a total lack of responsibility with total impunity.

Ultimately the electorate get what they deserve. The lack of will to engage in facts, the general gullibility and the desire to get easy answers to complicated problems stems from the electorate. They have become incredibly easy to manipulate via social media and basic propaganda and they have earned the broken democracy they now enjoy.

If the public wanted facts, hard truths and complicated answers to complicated questions we wouldn’t have Jeremy hunt, BJ and Jeremy Corbyn holding power and potential power over us.
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  #605  
Old 25-06-2019, 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Hpalace View Post
With regards to the media the vast majority are there to sell clicks, adds and papers rather than report the factual truth. It is a business and frankly most people would get very bored very quickly if a daily mail article entitled “the border and phytosanitary checks” was published. Hardly anyone would read it, it doesn’t sell papers or adds. It is beyond most people’s comprehension.

I agree re the MPs and I also don’t understand why so many are showing a total lack of responsibility with total impunity.

Ultimately the electorate get what they deserve. The lack of will to engage in facts, the general gullibility and the desire to get easy answers to complicated problems stems from the electorate. They have become incredibly easy to manipulate via social media and basic propaganda and they have earned the broken democracy they now enjoy.

If the public wanted facts, hard truths and complicated answers to complicated questions we wouldn’t have Jeremy hunt, BJ and Jeremy Corbyn holding power and potential power over us.
I agree but part of the problem is the complete lack of education about politics, which I think should be mandatory at school. I managed to get a politics degree without ever being formally taught about concepts such as parliamentary sovereignty or the difference between an EU regulation and an EU directive and how they apply to English law. When people are so uninformed then it becomes much easier for snake oil salesman such as Johnson or Farage to be believed and face minimal challenge.

And yes that does sound elitist but a functioning democracy needs informed voters. Our education system has utterly failed in that respect.
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  #606  
Old 25-06-2019, 12:32 PM
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Ferrari's interview with Johnson was interesting. He started off with the aggressive personal life stuff and carried on for a bit long but the callers got interesting. The first guy had been a deputy police constable in the north of Yorkshire and started asking about plans to increase police numbers. That was interesting and got to the heart of what the debate should be about. I want to see Johnson pressurised about his policies not his rows with his partner.
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  #607  
Old 25-06-2019, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Hpalace View Post
With regards to the media the vast majority are there to sell clicks, adds and papers rather than report the factual truth. It is a business and frankly most people would get very bored very quickly if a daily mail article entitled “the border and phytosanitary checks” was published. Hardly anyone would read it, it doesn’t sell papers or adds. It is beyond most people’s comprehension.

I agree re the MPs and I also don’t understand why so many are showing a total lack of responsibility with total impunity.

Ultimately the electorate get what they deserve. The lack of will to engage in facts, the general gullibility and the desire to get easy answers to complicated problems stems from the electorate. They have become incredibly easy to manipulate via social media and basic propaganda and they have earned the broken democracy they now enjoy.

If the public wanted facts, hard truths and complicated answers to complicated questions we wouldn’t have Jeremy hunt, BJ and Jeremy Corbyn holding power and potential power over us.
I like your last 2 paragraphs basically cos it aligns with my feeling that basically the electorate are getting 'thicker' and 'thicker'. There is too much emotion around and not enough deep thought, culminating in the odd support for Corbyn and co for instance. I fear the under 30s not only need political education but also lessons on life.
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  #608  
Old 25-06-2019, 01:00 PM
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I like your last 2 paragraphs basically cos it aligns with my feeling that basically the electorate are getting 'thicker' and 'thicker'. There is too much emotion around and not enough deep thought, culminating in the odd support for Corbyn and co for instance. I fear the under 30s not only need political education but also lessons on life.


It was the over 45’s that voted en masse for Brexit. Start your education with that shower of shite first.
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  #609  
Old 25-06-2019, 01:07 PM
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It was the over 45’s that voted en masse for Brexit. Start your education with that shower of shite first.
Yup.
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  #610  
Old 25-06-2019, 01:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Nth Kent Eagle View Post
Ferrari's interview with Johnson was interesting. He started off with the aggressive personal life stuff and carried on for a bit long but the callers got interesting. The first guy had been a deputy police constable in the north of Yorkshire and started asking about plans to increase police numbers. That was interesting and got to the heart of what the debate should be about. I want to see Johnson pressurised about his policies not his rows with his partner.
The thing is NKE, he is just spouting populist rubbish when giving answers. He has 'nearly' promised although he wouldn't commit to 20,000 new police officers, a significant boost to education spending, a huge new investment in adult social care, a tax cut to high earners and cuts to NI contributions for the lower paid...he hasn't got a single magic money tree (so loathed by tories at the last GE) rather an orchard.

He then is factually incorrect about using section 24 of the GATT agreement to carry on trading without tarriffs with the EU only later on conceding that it would need the EU to agree (I.E. back to the WA)..

As regards you dismissing possible domestic violence as 'rows with his partner', that's just straight out of the Priti Patel/ Nadine Dorries excuses handbook. Nobody gives a shit about him splitting up with his wife after having an affair, or about the number of kids he has out of wedlock but they do care if he could have been involved with a domestic violence incident and he should be answerable for it,

It can't be right that he refuses to answer anything about it when the police were called and havnt said that the neighbour was wasting their time, then citing he doesn't talk about family issues on the same day his campaign released a loving photo of him holding hands in a beer garden with his true love... but people like you who dont know what happened are saying he has nothing to answer, unless we get to a situation where the screams of 'get off me' are now acceptable when arguing with a woman, just like his homophobic 'bumboys' or racist 'letterboxes' spread division and hate....

.......not to mention the Darius Guppy hired assault gang, the garden bridge, the false promises on Heathrow and hospitals, the clumsy talk about Nazarin Zardawi, the lies of the leave campaign etc

He has to be answerable for all these character issues before he goes into bullshit splaffing electioneering mode.

I'd give him a spot on live from the Appollo but as PM FFS! Someone is having a giraffe
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  #611  
Old 25-06-2019, 01:18 PM
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It was the over 45’s that voted en masse for Brexit. Start your education with that shower of shite first.
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  #612  
Old 25-06-2019, 01:21 PM
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I fear the under 30s not only need political education but also lessons on life.
I fear that they are too integrated already and can't be turned. Work needs to start on their kids. At least that school in Birmingham was a start.
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Old 25-06-2019, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Nth Kent Eagle View Post
Ferrari's interview with Johnson was interesting. He started off with the aggressive personal life stuff and carried on for a bit long but the callers got interesting. The first guy had been a deputy police constable in the north of Yorkshire and started asking about plans to increase police numbers. That was interesting and got to the heart of what the debate should be about. I want to see Johnson pressurised about his policies not his rows with his partner.
I want the a potential future PM to be held to account for their lies.
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  #614  
Old 25-06-2019, 01:55 PM
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I like your last 2 paragraphs basically cos it aligns with my feeling that basically the electorate are getting 'thicker' and 'thicker'. There is too much emotion around and not enough deep thought, culminating in the odd support for Corbyn and co for instance. I fear the under 30s not only need political education but also lessons on life.
You're very kind.
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  #615  
Old 25-06-2019, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Joe85 View Post
It was the over 45’s that voted en masse for Brexit. Start your education with that shower of shite first.
And said over 45’s who voted Brexit are on average less educated than remainers.
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  #616  
Old 25-06-2019, 02:34 PM
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I fear that they are too integrated already and can't be turned. Work needs to start on their kids. At least that school in Birmingham was a start.

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  #617  
Old 25-06-2019, 02:47 PM
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That's a shame. Boris hasn't even become PM yet and the EU have already dismissed his plans as bullshit.

"A senior EU diplomat told The Sun the Tory frontrunner's idea of filleting the bits of the Withdrawal Agreeement acceptable to MPs "isn't going to fly".
They said: "This is an old UK idea, to secure the parts you like and forget the rest. But it's a package.
"What is missing is finances and the backstop, so he would get all he wants. And you'd need our agreement for that. It's nonsense."
Dismissing Mr Johnson's plan, one EU source said: "I hope Boris understands what he's on about because no one else does."
A second source added: "Boris can bull**** all he likes. We've been here before.
"If we didn't make concessions for a Remainer like May why would we make them for a populist architect of Brexit?""
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  #618  
Old 25-06-2019, 03:14 PM
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A 'senior eu diplomat' is a bit vague. Did the paper say who said it?
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Old 25-06-2019, 03:17 PM
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A 'senior eu diplomat' is a bit vague. Did the paper say who said it?
I think they're on a rota as they have to repeat it so often
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  #620  
Old 25-06-2019, 03:19 PM
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I agree but part of the problem is the complete lack of education about politics, which I think should be mandatory at school. I managed to get a politics degree without ever being formally taught about concepts such as parliamentary sovereignty or the difference between an EU regulation and an EU directive and how they apply to English law. When people are so uninformed then it becomes much easier for snake oil salesman such as Johnson or Farage to be believed and face minimal challenge.

And yes that does sound elitist but a functioning democracy needs informed voters. Our education system has utterly failed in that respect.
That is absolutely mind boggling. It also explains a lot, you're right.
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