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  #141  
Old 13-01-2021, 08:13 AM
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trading off past potential and champ manager
clearly can play football but not right for us
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  #142  
Old 13-01-2021, 08:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eagle's Nest View Post
Benteke was at least useful for a year. You could also argue that not long after that first season we stopped playing to his strengths.

So while Benteke, Sakho and Meyer have been a terrible waste of money, at least two of them played well for a short while.
Benteke has been played time and time again despite being terribly out of form. Meyer has never been afforded the same opportunities. Hodgson clearly never wanted him from the start.
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  #143  
Old 13-01-2021, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by aashman12 View Post
17 goals 1st season kept us up.
Not necessarily. That implies that no one else would have scored those goals. We've stayed up in some subsequent seasons without someone scoring anywhere that number of goals. There's no counter factual so we'll never know.
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  #144  
Old 13-01-2021, 08:20 AM
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Originally Posted by palace_burger View Post
Players run down their contracts. You then don’t have to pay the club for the player. The agents agreed a signing on fee. The higher the fee the more likely the player signs. Agent knows you’ve not had to pay a fee to a club so asks for 10m

Simples!! Signing on fees have been around for decades even prior to Bosman ruling. Post bosman they have got out of control

From a cash flow POV instead of paying it in one hit we agreed to pay it monthly

So max takes home 80k in wages and 60k in signing on fee repayment equalling £140k cash flows leaving our accounts each month
I understand how it works. I was just questioning the assumption that it was £10m when it could easily have been half that. The truth is that none of us knows.
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  #145  
Old 13-01-2021, 08:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Mr Palace View Post
Why would he get a £10m signing on fee? Surely not.
Very likely in this instance. All these fans on here who constantly spout "no brainer on a free" when we are linked with (good) free agent players have totally failed to understand the concept they are not free at all
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  #146  
Old 13-01-2021, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Jim Cannon View Post
Very likely in this instance. All these fans on here who constantly spout "no brainer on a free" when we are linked with (good) free agent players have totally failed to understand the concept they are not free at all
If Roy had played the game more, played him in his preferred position, given him some more appearances etc we’d be getting our money back.
The fact that he just ignores cups, only plays his favs etc means our fringe players are totally worthless in the transfer market.
He’s got luck with Jario, had to rotate the defence and we have such limited attacking players. Townsend for example has somehow managed to play at a much higher level than last season, but could now leave on a free if he doesn’t fancy being a back up player.
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  #147  
Old 13-01-2021, 09:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Mr Palace View Post
He’s not on that money by all accounts and he was a Bosman.

Good player, wrong fit.

It’s not as bad as paying £32m for a striker who has scored 8/9 goals in the best part of four seasons. Not to pick on Benteke but Meyer has competition to win this award.
I cant disagree with any of what you state, only to say that you have a real deep rooted "dislike" for Benteke and always state it but again it is hard to disagree as the facts speak for themselves.
But what is amusing is hearing people stating they are ITK through another source about Meyer's wages, figures stated of 140k to 172k p.w seriously. I just cant see him letting it be known what he earns, would any of us? regardless, there is a lot for the club to answer when we look at the wasted money on several players wages we can mention, especially when on huge basic salaries regardless of performances/apperances.
Sadly it is down to the state of modern football where players and agents rule as clearly shown in the case of Mesut Ozil as a prime example.
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  #148  
Old 13-01-2021, 10:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eagle's Nest View Post
When you think about it, if you consider Benteke, Sakho, Meyer, Mutch and Wickham's performances, we should be asking for an explanation from our recruitment team.
Wickham performed well when fit.
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  #149  
Old 13-01-2021, 10:23 AM
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Every player on a free will have a salary plus an additional amount to reflect the fact they’re free. I thought that was obvious? I have no idea of the numbers but £80k pw salary and a £9m signing fee isn’t impossible (he’d have cost us more if he’d been under contract at Schalke) so both the £80k pw salary and the rumour he’s being paid 140k pw (80+60) is entirely possible.

The term ‘free transfer’ is the issue here. There is no such thing.
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  #150  
Old 13-01-2021, 10:27 AM
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  #151  
Old 13-01-2021, 11:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frisky View Post
Every player on a free will have a salary plus an additional amount to reflect the fact they’re free. I thought that was obvious? I have no idea of the numbers but £80k pw salary and a £9m signing fee isn’t impossible (he’d have cost us more if he’d been under contract at Schalke) so both the £80k pw salary and the rumour he’s being paid 140k pw (80+60) is entirely possible.

The term ‘free transfer’ is the issue here. There is no such thing.
Plus it was only a 3 year deal so the signing on fee was squeezed into 36 months making the eye watering amount.
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  #152  
Old 13-01-2021, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Palace View Post
Not necessarily. That implies that no one else would have scored those goals. We've stayed up in some subsequent seasons without someone scoring anywhere that number of goals. There's no counter factual so we'll never know.
Who's even come close to scoring that amount of goals for us then?
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  #153  
Old 13-01-2021, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aashman12 View Post
Who's even come close to scoring that amount of goals for us then?
Ayew closest.

Goals have been more spread around, with Zaha in particular stepping up.

More generally, it's a striker's graveyard here at the moment.
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  #154  
Old 13-01-2021, 12:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LuieJack View Post
I cant disagree with any of what you state, only to say that you have a real deep rooted "dislike" for Benteke and always state it but again it is hard to disagree as the facts speak for themselves.
But what is amusing is hearing people stating they are ITK through another source about Meyer's wages, figures stated of 140k to 172k p.w seriously. I just cant see him letting it be known what he earns, would any of us? regardless, there is a lot for the club to answer when we look at the wasted money on several players wages we can mention, especially when on huge basic salaries regardless of performances/apperances.
Sadly it is down to the state of modern football where players and agents rule as clearly shown in the case of Mesut Ozil as a prime example.
Exactly, none of us know.

As for Benteke, I don't know what you mean - I love him
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  #155  
Old 13-01-2021, 01:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eagle's Nest View Post
When you think about it, if you consider Benteke, Sakho, Meyer, Mutch and Wickham's performances, we should be asking for an explanation from our recruitment team.
I think the club has already asked those questions and changed strategy, led by Dougie as skinflint-in-chief. Doubt you'll see many more £30m+ signings with Dougie involved. The recent signings and the names we're linked with all suggest a change in tack is already underway. Which is nice.

Also worth bearing in mind that Palace's wastage on transfers is way below a lot of other clubs around us. Two wrongs don't make a right, but there is inevitably waste and risk in transfers, it's about minimising that as much as possible.

If you look at points per mill spent or points per wage bill over five years, we're about average:
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So yes there has been wastage but I get the impression the club are focused on cutting it out - and we are already more efficient than sides around us. Although we still need to get the wage bill down.

Even with Benteke and Sakho, they have still both contributed in a way that has kept us in the league at various points and that has a huge, long-term cash value to the club way above their fees and wages.

Compare those players to Slimani at Leicester (did absolutely nothing), Haller at West Ham (lost 50% on him), Anderson at West Ham (expensive flop, no resale value on the contract), recently Fabio Silva at Wolves looks like a huge risk.

We don't often make those kinds of mistakes, and we're still squeezing 'value' out of a player like Benteke.
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  #156  
Old 13-01-2021, 01:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Palace View Post
Benteke has been played time and time again despite being terribly out of form. Meyer has never been afforded the same opportunities. Hodgson clearly never wanted him from the start.
Meyer has been given much more opportunity than people give credit for. Hes just been afforded every excuse under the sun by some of the bed wetters. Roy, tactics, plays around him, formation etc. Its always someone elses fault hes not pulling up trees.

The fact is the likes of Eze have done far more in far less time. Look at RLC even and the impact he had.
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  #157  
Old 13-01-2021, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by palace_burger View Post
So max takes home 80k in wages and 60k in signing on fee repayment equalling £140k cash flows leaving our accounts each month
Week, unfortunately.
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  #158  
Old 13-01-2021, 02:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Palace View Post
Benteke has been played time and time again despite being terribly out of form. Meyer has never been afforded the same opportunities. Hodgson clearly never wanted him from the start.
Poor comparison affording nothing "clear" about Hodgson wanting him, or otherwise, at all
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  #159  
Old 13-01-2021, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Eddie McGoldrick's tash View Post
Because there was no transfer I would guess (if its true).
There would also be no transfer fee if i signed.
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  #160  
Old 13-01-2021, 02:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TWELLSEagle View Post
Wickham performed well when fit.
Wickham performed well when fit and played in the position that best suits him.

He has also cost us £25-28m over the course of his contract.

Meyer has cost around £22m, and has very rarely played in the position he did before joining us.

Edgar Davids was widely regarded as a bit of a flop for us, we scored just 4 points in the 6 games he played but one of those points came in the draw one evening in Cardiff where he played in DM and looked brilliant.

Rightly or wrongly Meyer has never played in that CM role.
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