Home | Forums | Gallery | Twitter
 
CPFC BBS  

Go Back   CPFC BBS » Off Topic » The Politics Forum

Notices

The Politics Forum Discussions that are wholly or mainly concerned with UK politics

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #41  
Old 08-09-2019, 05:03 PM
Reps AJ's Avatar
Reps AJ Reps AJ is online now
Climbing for dollars
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Somewhere you're not
Posts: 13,571
Rep Power: 21474855
Reps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is here
Have we worked out yet whether I'm getting an extra day off or taking a 20% pay cut?

It's really got an influence on my view of this
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 08-09-2019, 05:20 PM
Hal Low Hal Low is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 642
Rep Power: 7823882
Hal Low came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietHal Low came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietHal Low came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietHal Low came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietHal Low came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietHal Low came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietHal Low came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietHal Low came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietHal Low came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietHal Low came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietHal Low came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy diet
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz View Post
Same problem with many businesses. Fixed costs would make a four day week completely unviable ; effectively losing a fifth of output/income.

What would be the compelling reason to think this is a good idea?
If you focus a little more on values and a little less on costs you might then be able to answer your question.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 08-09-2019, 05:24 PM
Max_Power's Avatar
Max_Power Max_Power is offline
'What's for dinner?'
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: CR0
Age: 32
Posts: 957
Rep Power: 18883441
Max_Power came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietMax_Power came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietMax_Power came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietMax_Power came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietMax_Power came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietMax_Power came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietMax_Power came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietMax_Power came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietMax_Power came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietMax_Power came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietMax_Power came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy diet
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reps AJ View Post
Have we worked out yet whether I'm getting an extra day off or taking a 20% pay cut?

It's really got an influence on my view of this
You’d still receive the same wage but essentially complete the same amount of work in four days that you do five.

If we’re being realistic how much time do most people spend at work making tea, talking bollocks and looking at pictures of cats on the Internet?

If you’re expected to complete the same amount of work in less time you just crack on and get it done.

I’m not sure why we, as a culture, have gotten more and more obsessed with people spending as much time as work at possible. Technology reducing workload is supposed to be a good thing, not a cause for concern about needing less human beings to waste their time doing shit robots can do.
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 08-09-2019, 07:16 PM
Jonboy's Avatar
Jonboy Jonboy is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Vancouver
Age: 61
Posts: 3,710
Rep Power: 19282633
Jonboy came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietJonboy came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietJonboy came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietJonboy came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietJonboy came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietJonboy came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietJonboy came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietJonboy came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietJonboy came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietJonboy came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietJonboy came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy diet
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsunamiman View Post
There’s been a lot of studies which show a 4 day working week in a lot of office project based jobs is as if not more productive than a 5 day week as the increased rest and ability to do other things allows you to work harder.

Only works in some industries but I am sure in Mine (banking risk) it definitely would.
I have an acquaintance in a similar job to you. They have to attend the office 3 days a week. The other stipulation is that they complete the files assigned to them. If they work hard on the first WFH day they can take the second one off. Their employer is perfectly happy with this.

In my business I sell hours. If someone wants to work their hours over four days rather than five more power to them.
__________________
pɐǝɥ ʎɯ oʇ ƃuıɥsnɹ sı poolq ǝɥʇ puɐ uʍop ǝpısdn ǝq oʇ ɯǝǝs ı 'dlǝɥ
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 08-09-2019, 07:38 PM
Nth Kent Eagle Nth Kent Eagle is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 20,644
Rep Power: 21474849
Nth Kent Eagle Sam the man is hereNth Kent Eagle Sam the man is hereNth Kent Eagle Sam the man is hereNth Kent Eagle Sam the man is hereNth Kent Eagle Sam the man is hereNth Kent Eagle Sam the man is hereNth Kent Eagle Sam the man is hereNth Kent Eagle Sam the man is hereNth Kent Eagle Sam the man is hereNth Kent Eagle Sam the man is hereNth Kent Eagle Sam the man is here
Slight issue that I've found is that all those on four days weeks want Friday off but the customers want service equally across Monday to Friday. So the full time staff have to cover colleagues work and are discouraged from asking for holiday days off on Friday. If we all had a 4 day week them the day off would have to spread out.
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 08-09-2019, 07:39 PM
Salad_Burnet's Avatar
Salad_Burnet Salad_Burnet is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Age: 41
Posts: 2,297
Rep Power: 21474841
Salad_Burnet Sam the man is hereSalad_Burnet Sam the man is hereSalad_Burnet Sam the man is hereSalad_Burnet Sam the man is hereSalad_Burnet Sam the man is hereSalad_Burnet Sam the man is hereSalad_Burnet Sam the man is hereSalad_Burnet Sam the man is hereSalad_Burnet Sam the man is hereSalad_Burnet Sam the man is hereSalad_Burnet Sam the man is here
No-one actually does work anymore. I look around me and people are mostly just pissing about with their poxy smart-phones.
__________________
"Pardew and that s**** little London cornershop club are irrelevant and can f*** off."
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 08-09-2019, 07:46 PM
Maz's Avatar
Maz Maz is offline
Semper Idem
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: A place where nothing ever happens.
Posts: 156,516
Rep Power: 21474854
Maz has disabled reputation
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hal Low View Post
If you focus a little more on values and a little less on costs you might then be able to answer your question.

I have no idea if you know what you are talking about : I rather suspect not.
__________________
..
..G
abba Gabba Hey

.פɐppɐ פɐppɐ Hǝʎ


Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 08-09-2019, 07:53 PM
Neil 154's Avatar
Neil 154 Neil 154 is offline
Señor Coconut
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: East London
Posts: 1,765
Rep Power: 4772417
Neil 154 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietNeil 154 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietNeil 154 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietNeil 154 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietNeil 154 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietNeil 154 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietNeil 154 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietNeil 154 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietNeil 154 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietNeil 154 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietNeil 154 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy diet
Considering that not so long ago it was usual to work every day except sabbath and religious holidays, we've come a long way to 5 days and having statuary leave. Seems like a logical development.
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 08-09-2019, 08:19 PM
Skintagain's Avatar
Skintagain Skintagain is online now
Don't call me Dave
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Just outside the EU
Posts: 13,504
Rep Power: 21474845
Skintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
75% of people support having a four day week. Labour is considering it as a policy.

I think it would be fantastic.

I assume here you also mean 20% less hours. It shouldn't be too much of a problem for companies it's largely a question of scheduling although it may also mean a slight increase in overall fixed costs. Many companies rely on staff that have less than 5 day contracts.
It also means a reduction in pay, were they also asked that question that may not be so popular. It would be a bit pointless if everyone decided to get another part time job to make up their money.
Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old 08-09-2019, 08:25 PM
Skintagain's Avatar
Skintagain Skintagain is online now
Don't call me Dave
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Just outside the EU
Posts: 13,504
Rep Power: 21474845
Skintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is hereSkintagain Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
They will have to pay more.

But what I’m saying is that lots of business operate on a 7 day week basis as does the NHS. But you can still give people five day weeks, so why not 4.
How is it I'm not surprised. Would you like to have your cake and eat it, is always an attractive offer.
Reply With Quote
  #51  
Old 08-09-2019, 08:30 PM
CarlosTheFinger's Avatar
CarlosTheFinger CarlosTheFinger is offline
A gift
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Thornton Heath
Age: 36
Posts: 5,161
Rep Power: 21474852
CarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by MFBias View Post
What follows is just my philosophical thought so I understand that people may take issue with it:

I completely for this the shorter working week. Work is an invented social construct. There is working for surviving or growing as a person but to spend most of your life doing a job that in the grand scheme of things isn't living. 3/4s of people’s days are spend travelling and working. Add in emails etc out of work, people are effectively chained around the ankle to their jobs. Is this the best way to live for the human race?


Part of the reason this country has an alcohol problem is that people work too hard which leads to a living for the weekend mentality. The extra day off would be great if it was spend on developing yourself or spending time with your family. We already lost Sunday as a day of rest in this country (due to shops being open etc the shift from Sunday being a day off rest with the family has been reduced to another potential working day. Shops open for business etc)

We have to be realistic. Population is on the increase and jobs will be come more and more automated. Simply humans wont need to work asmuch and there will be a massive over saturation of workers. It make take a hundred years or longer but we are still living in an industrial age, maybe future generations will look at us almost like the middle ages in our approach to work and how we develop ourselves.
Very much my view on this. Especially the supposed philosophical stuff. I enjoy my job and have the privilege of being able to work from home but I've still spent the last few years wondering why a 71% work - 29% life ratio is so readily accepted. And that's even as a single bloke with no kids yet, so I've got more free time than a lot of people. For a species that has a relatively short period of time on earth and an even shorter period where we're physically and mentally at our peak, that does seem wrong to me and I'd be all for a 4:3 ratio, if it could become the norm.

Totally agree on the alcoholism/mental health angle too and I can see why many people would be defensive on that point. One of the reasons I took myself out of the office environment was to get away from exactly the kind of situation you describe. As a non-drinker, I couldn't relate to the work-stress/desperation-fuelled drinking culture prevalent in my office.
Reply With Quote
  #52  
Old 08-09-2019, 08:35 PM
Maz's Avatar
Maz Maz is offline
Semper Idem
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: A place where nothing ever happens.
Posts: 156,516
Rep Power: 21474854
Maz has disabled reputation
Assuming you work a 40 hour week, your ratios are wildly wrong.
__________________
..
..G
abba Gabba Hey

.פɐppɐ פɐppɐ Hǝʎ


Reply With Quote
  #53  
Old 08-09-2019, 08:35 PM
palacelad197o's Avatar
palacelad197o palacelad197o is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 3,019
Rep Power: 13337449
palacelad197o came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietpalacelad197o came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietpalacelad197o came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietpalacelad197o came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietpalacelad197o came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietpalacelad197o came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietpalacelad197o came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietpalacelad197o came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietpalacelad197o came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietpalacelad197o came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietpalacelad197o came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy diet
Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
75% of people support having a four day week. Labour is considering it as a policy.

I think it would be fantastic.
This is the party that wanted a election every week until they got asked for a election and then said ohhh ohhh no
Reply With Quote
  #54  
Old 08-09-2019, 08:37 PM
Reps AJ's Avatar
Reps AJ Reps AJ is online now
Climbing for dollars
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Somewhere you're not
Posts: 13,571
Rep Power: 21474855
Reps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is hereReps AJ Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz View Post
Assuming you work a 40 hour week, your ratios are wildly wrong.
I think it was 37.5 hours per day... 5 working, 2 non-working
Reply With Quote
  #55  
Old 08-09-2019, 08:45 PM
Kipungu's Avatar
Kipungu Kipungu is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,090
Rep Power: 21474846
Kipungu Sam the man is hereKipungu Sam the man is hereKipungu Sam the man is hereKipungu Sam the man is hereKipungu Sam the man is hereKipungu Sam the man is hereKipungu Sam the man is hereKipungu Sam the man is hereKipungu Sam the man is hereKipungu Sam the man is hereKipungu Sam the man is here
Went from a 5 day week to condensed hours 4 day week (including one of them being WFH)

Never looked back. Feel much better and more productive. I do more at home than I ever do in the office. I don't get harassed as much.
Reply With Quote
  #56  
Old 08-09-2019, 08:47 PM
Yoda Yoda is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 10,470
Rep Power: 21474843
Yoda Sam the man is hereYoda Sam the man is hereYoda Sam the man is hereYoda Sam the man is hereYoda Sam the man is hereYoda Sam the man is hereYoda Sam the man is hereYoda Sam the man is hereYoda Sam the man is hereYoda Sam the man is hereYoda Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neil 154 View Post
Considering that not so long ago it was usual to work every day except sabbath and religious holidays, we've come a long way to 5 days and having statuary leave. Seems like a logical development.
Or maybe we’re lucky enough to live in the peak and it’s going to get worse again from now on?

When I was young it wasn’t that rare for people to work 2 jobs, usually until their circumstances improved (eg a promotion in their main job). I also knew people studying at night to gain qualifications along side their apprenticeships.

It wouldn’t surprise me if that returned, especially if people continue to want to acquire so much stuff.

I don’t think we should assume working hours will definitely shorten...look at what’s happened to the pension age, for example.
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Old 08-09-2019, 08:55 PM
dogstar721 dogstar721 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,655
Rep Power: 21474844
dogstar721 Sam the man is heredogstar721 Sam the man is heredogstar721 Sam the man is heredogstar721 Sam the man is heredogstar721 Sam the man is heredogstar721 Sam the man is heredogstar721 Sam the man is heredogstar721 Sam the man is heredogstar721 Sam the man is heredogstar721 Sam the man is heredogstar721 Sam the man is here
I'd be preferable to a 4 day 37.5 hour week - But then I don't have kids and all the associated difficulties that go with that.

Actually I'd love to work 3 12 hour shifts a week (ok slightly more) and have the four days off. Maybe a national identification of something like a flexi-time scheme would be better than four day weeks (so you can bank extra holiday or work hours around life more).
Reply With Quote
  #58  
Old 08-09-2019, 09:25 PM
CarlosTheFinger's Avatar
CarlosTheFinger CarlosTheFinger is offline
A gift
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Thornton Heath
Age: 36
Posts: 5,161
Rep Power: 21474852
CarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is hereCarlosTheFinger Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by dogstar721 View Post
I'd be preferable to a 4 day 37.5 hour week - But then I don't have kids and all the associated difficulties that go with that.

Actually I'd love to work 3 12 hour shifts a week (ok slightly more) and have the four days off. Maybe a national identification of something like a flexi-time scheme would be better than four day weeks (so you can bank extra holiday or work hours around life more).
This is heading in the same direction as my mate's hair-brained flexitime scheme that would see him fulfill a year's worth of working hours by April, so he could take the rest of the year off...as long as he worked 24/7 from 1 January. And he would've gotten away with it if it wasn't got those pesky HR kids.

Last edited by CarlosTheFinger; 08-09-2019 at 09:39 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #59  
Old 09-09-2019, 05:20 AM
little al's Avatar
little al little al is offline
XXVII
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Aberdeen
Age: 50
Posts: 42,834
Rep Power: 21474857
little al Sam the man is herelittle al Sam the man is herelittle al Sam the man is herelittle al Sam the man is herelittle al Sam the man is herelittle al Sam the man is herelittle al Sam the man is herelittle al Sam the man is herelittle al Sam the man is herelittle al Sam the man is herelittle al Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by cockneyrebel View Post
75% of people support having a four day week. Labour is considering it as a policy.

I think it would be fantastic.
If it means getting overtime rates for 3 days a week as oppose of the 2, I am all for it.
__________________
ACAE
Reply With Quote
  #60  
Old 09-09-2019, 07:40 AM
Gilbo's Avatar
Gilbo Gilbo is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Paddock Wood
Age: 39
Posts: 957
Rep Power: 21474849
Gilbo Sam the man is hereGilbo Sam the man is hereGilbo Sam the man is hereGilbo Sam the man is hereGilbo Sam the man is hereGilbo Sam the man is hereGilbo Sam the man is hereGilbo Sam the man is hereGilbo Sam the man is hereGilbo Sam the man is hereGilbo Sam the man is here
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz View Post
Same problem with many businesses. Fixed costs would make a four day week completely unviable ; effectively losing a fifth of output/income.

What would be the compelling reason to think this is a good idea?
Presnteeism, being in work and not being effective is well documented.

Studies (albeit limited at this point, but well regarded) demonstrate that productivity in 4 days was fairly consistent with a 5 day week due to increased output in those 4 days.

I acknowledge it's early days in terms of the understanding of the effects and it's not necessarily transferable to all indistries, but there's some indication it's workable.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 05:37 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.