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  #281  
Old 25-05-2019, 01:05 PM
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This thing about him being good in the air is a myth. He used to be but he isnít any more. Heís the most one dimensional striker Iíve ever seen that earns that sort of money. His contribution over the last two seasons is a joke.

He seems like a decent guy and nothing against him personally but he needs to leave.
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  #282  
Old 25-05-2019, 01:15 PM
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15 mill for a striker who's scored 2 or 3 goals in 2 seasons ,a dodgy pen and a couple of open goals is brilliant. Get rid he's absolutely shit and shows no signs of improvement.
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  #283  
Old 25-05-2019, 01:23 PM
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Excuse after Excuse easy money if you can get it!

Anyway maybe he fancies a return to Villa if they get promoted. Maybe they will put the right type of crosses in for him and maybe he won't continue to miss sitters?!
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  #284  
Old 25-05-2019, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by cpfcfan1 View Post
If he wants to stay make him an offer of a new contract, say a year on reduced wages of say 6ok take it or leave it
Makes no sense. Why would he take that when he can see out his current deal on double that wage and then sign where he wants on much higher wages than 60K (a club in China or the Middle East for instance)?
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  #285  
Old 25-05-2019, 01:43 PM
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He seems to win every defensive corner header but none offensively.
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  #286  
Old 25-05-2019, 01:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glaziers fan View Post
The thing is, whilst I agree he's not brilliant on the ground and that his movement is not good enough, and that he is not aggressive enough either, he is probably the best in the Premier League at heading the ball. So let's look at what he can do rather than what he can't. We should be providing him with 2 or 3 headed chances every game and we don't. For all these 2 dozen misses that some posters are talking about I'm afraid I don't remember them. Part of the reason for that is even more worrying: Benteke has been suffering from a lack of confidence so isn't even getting himself into the right areas. And of course the crossing in the air is woeful. It truly is dreadful. Milivojevic's dead balls are improving, and Townsend can cross well. Who else? The full backs cross accurately along the ground but that doesn't suit CB. Who else can whip in a decent cross? No-one.
We're at our best when Wilf is running at defenders from the left and Townsend is cutting inside and linking up with attackers from the right. Neither is a good crosser of the ball (Unless Townsend cuts back onto his left foot to deliver the cross, which is situation dependent) so that invariably means that we are and will probably continue to rely on crosses far less than in Benteke's first season. I don't see the sense in changing the way we play to accommodate one player when it will stifle the effectiveness of our best player in Wilf.
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  #287  
Old 25-05-2019, 02:00 PM
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Originally Posted by teesdale99 View Post
Hereís 5 misses in one game. 4 of them headers

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That was the moment I lost faith in him. The headed chance at the end was an embarrassing miss.

I wish him all the best but really hope he moves on and we can reinvest the fee in a better striker.
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  #288  
Old 25-05-2019, 02:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Jman View Post
If there really is an offer on the table that we accept and Ben rejects it just to run down his contract and get a big signing on fee next summer, I can see him becoming one of our most hated players of all time.
Why? Why should he move to China if he doesn't want to? Would you would want to? I certainly wouldn't even if I was offered double my wage.
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  #289  
Old 25-05-2019, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Golf Boy View Post
He seems to win every defensive corner header but none offensively.
This is strangely true. Sakho can also defend corners and read the flight of a ball. But in the opponents area...
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  #290  
Old 25-05-2019, 03:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Palace View Post
This thing about him being good in the air is a myth. He used to be but he isn’t any more. He’s the most one dimensional striker I’ve ever seen that earns that sort of money. His contribution over the last two seasons is a joke.
Odd thing is at Villa he mainly scored with the ball at his feet. Probably says something about how we play him too.

Can we have this Ben back please:

Check out 3:50 if you can't be arsed to watch the whole thing.
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  #291  
Old 25-05-2019, 03:35 PM
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  #292  
Old 25-05-2019, 03:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddie McGoldrick's tash View Post
This is strangely true. Sakho can also defend corners and read the flight of a ball. But in the opponents area...

Defending crosses is far easier than attacking crosses.
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  #293  
Old 25-05-2019, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TAK View Post
Odd thing is at Villa he mainly scored with the ball at his feet. Probably says something about how we play him too.

Can we have this Ben back please:

Check out 3:50 if you can't be arsed to watch the whole thing.
It's like watching a different player. He was lean and lithe too, he has bulked up a bit since.
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  #294  
Old 25-05-2019, 04:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glaziers fan View Post
The thing is, whilst I agree he's not brilliant on the ground and that his movement is not good enough, and that he is not aggressive enough either, he is probably the best in the Premier League at heading the ball. So let's look at what he can do rather than what he can't. We should be providing him with 2 or 3 headed chances every game and we don't. For all these 2 dozen misses that some posters are talking about I'm afraid I don't remember them. Part of the reason for that is even more worrying: Benteke has been suffering from a lack of confidence so isn't even getting himself into the right areas. And of course the crossing in the air is woeful. It truly is dreadful. Milivojevic's dead balls are improving, and Townsend can cross well. Who else? The full backs cross accurately along the ground but that doesn't suit CB. Who else can whip in a decent cross? No-one.
It's just an extension of what I felt was obvious back in 2016; that the supply to striker's feet was almost non-existent and with one decent cross, per game, at best. The solution should have been to improve supply through the middle to Murray and Gayle, who could actually score, given a shot-chance, instead of the maniac idea that a target man striker could score goals with barely one decent cross a game.

Wilf improved dramatically the season Benteke arrived and, once he was slotted into a central strike partnership with him, Benteke began to enjoy the benefits and scored the majority of his fifteen league goals. But this was basically a bastardized way of structuring more efficient attacks that could have been found by buying quality ball-playing CBs and AMs, which could have allowed us to keep Murray and Gayle, get the best out of them, keep Wilf on the wing and buy two top midfielders for probably the same cost as the white elephant Benteke has become.

We'll have to eat the cost of that mistake and flaw in the culture of our club. The good news is Meyer might develop into a cultured creative player in his second season and we at least didn't pay for the expensive albatross Benteke has become with relegation. But, assuming Benteke stays, we will likely be left with less midfield creativity than we should have by now, in our seventh Prem season, because I expect us to do what we always do; be linked with a serious investment in central midfield only to chuck money anywhere but there.

Assuming Wilf stays, we can use him as striker partner with Benteke next season to create a facsimile of the penetration and guile we could have gotten by investing in a single, quality attacking midfielder over the past six seasons but we then lose Wilf on the wing. If Wilf does go, then that creativity issue becomes even greater and Benteke will be even less effective. We'll probably do the usual and buy another winger and an even bigger target man.
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  #295  
Old 25-05-2019, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchyAndalou View Post
We're at our best when Wilf is running at defenders from the left and Townsend is cutting inside and linking up with attackers from the right. Neither is a good crosser of the ball (Unless Townsend cuts back onto his left foot to deliver the cross, which is situation dependent) so that invariably means that we are and will probably continue to rely on crosses far less than in Benteke's first season. I don't see the sense in changing the way we play to accommodate one player when it will stifle the effectiveness of our best player in Wilf.
Why canít you play with Wilf on the left/up front and someone who can cross on the right for Benteke? Itís not either/or. Townsend should be a squad player imho. He doesnít produce enough. Love his work rate but for someone who wants to cut in and shoot, 5 or 6 goals is not enough. Totally different if he was crossing for Benteke with his stronger foot the majority of the time.
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  #296  
Old 25-05-2019, 04:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SOUTHGATE EAGLE View Post
It's just an extension of what I felt was obvious back in 2016; that the supply to striker's feet was almost non-existent and with one decent cross, per game, at best. The solution should have been to improve supply through the middle to Murray and Gayle, who could actually score, given a shot-chance, instead of the maniac idea that a target man striker could score goals with barely one decent cross a game.

Wilf improved dramatically the season Benteke arrived and, once he was slotted into a central strike partnership with him, Benteke began to enjoy the benefits and scored the majority of his fifteen league goals. But this was basically a bastardized way of structuring more efficient attacks that could have been found by buying quality ball-playing CBs and AMs, which could have allowed us to keep Murray and Gayle, get the best out of them, keep Wilf on the wing and buy two top midfielders for probably the same cost as the white elephant Benteke has become.

We'll have to eat the cost of that mistake and flaw in the culture of our club. The good news is Meyer might develop into a cultured creative player in his second season and we at least didn't pay for the expensive albatross Benteke has become with relegation. But, assuming Benteke stays, we will likely be left with less midfield creativity than we should have by now, in our seventh Prem season, because I expect us to do what we always do; be linked with a serious investment in central midfield only to chuck money anywhere but there.

Assuming Wilf stays, we can use him as striker partner with Benteke next season to create a facsimile of the penetration and guile we could have gotten by investing in a single, quality attacking midfielder over the past six seasons but we then lose Wilf on the wing. If Wilf does go, then that creativity issue becomes even greater and Benteke will be even less effective. We'll probably do the usual and buy another winger and an even bigger target man.
Buy a winger who can cross and play Zaha and Benteke up front. Itís not rocket science and that would be win win.
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  #297  
Old 25-05-2019, 05:18 PM
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Originally Posted by glaziers fan View Post
Buy a winger who can cross and play Zaha and Benteke up front. It’s not rocket science and that would be win win.
I'd be up for that, if it happens. But that assumes we keep Wilf and we will still be left with the reality that an injured Wilf equals minimal creativity. We would still be without that extra bowstring of a midfield able to piece together direct, decisive attacks and the issue of how we will be able to fashion goals outside of wing play, especially at home, will be shelved for yet another season. Plus, paying Benteke £120K pw to give him away in twelve months still looms, because he has looked so ineffectual here. What you propose is better than nothing but still feels like another sticking plaster response to me, instead of the improvement of what has been our Achilles Heel in midfield, as part of any real forward planning.

I've always thought improving midfield supply to strikers shouldn't be 'rocket science' but seem the last thing on the 'drawing board' here. The fact that it hasn't been a priority has been a major anchor on this club's ability to advance towards at least a Europa slot, IMHO. The pressure it also emplaces almost solely on Wilf to win us games may also be a factor in his eventual choice to leave us. And with the current level of creativity we have, God help us when he does.
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  #298  
Old 25-05-2019, 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by TAK View Post
Odd thing is at Villa he mainly scored with the ball at his feet. Probably says something about how we play him too.

Can we have this Ben back please:

Check out 3:50 if you can't be arsed to watch the whole thing.
He was a good player back then but heís lost it in recent years. It happens to some players. This isnít a temporary dip in form - itís two years of abject failure.
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  #299  
Old 25-05-2019, 05:39 PM
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Originally Posted by TAK View Post
Odd thing is at Villa he mainly scored with the ball at his feet. Probably says something about how we play him too.

Can we have this Ben back please:

Check out 3:50 if you can't be arsed to watch the whole thing.
At Villa he was great , we all remember him robbing Scott Dann then charging towards goal and bending it round Speroni , his decline is just bizarre , he has now gone over 2 YEARS since he scored a goal with his feet from open play , it's just the oddest thing , we've seen plenty of crap strikers at Palace but I've never seen one that was so good become so bad , I mean the guy can Bearley kick the ball ,he has been mentally effected by something , for a long period he wouldn't even take part in the pre-match shooting practice , what the hell happened to him ? Totally bizarre .
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  #300  
Old 25-05-2019, 06:12 PM
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At Villa he was great , we all remember him robbing Scott Dann then charging towards goal and bending it round Speroni , his decline is just bizarre , he has now gone over 2 YEARS since he scored a goal with his feet from open play , it's just the oddest thing , we've seen plenty of crap strikers at Palace but I've never seen one that was so good become so bad , I mean the guy can Bearley kick the ball ,he has been mentally effected by something , for a long period he wouldn't even take part in the pre-match shooting practice , what the hell happened to him ? Totally bizarre .
He seems to have lost that 'instinct.' Much of it is down to confidence. It would be interesting to see what a string of goals might do for his confidence. I still hope we offload and have a chance to go again with someone new but the only way I see Benteke flourishing here is if we keep Wilf and play him alongside. Even then, I think most of the success of that Partnership is down to Wilf. I don't see Benteke flourishing in a team without Wilfred Zaha as a strike partner.
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