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  #241  
Old 16-09-2021, 09:43 AM
BillyTKid BillyTKid is offline
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Doh!

I thought they finished 6th last season.
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  #242  
Old 16-09-2021, 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by JackTheBiscuit View Post
We've just comfortably beaten a top 6 team
Well other than the fact we didn’t, yeah I guess so.

The point is that we’ll have to be able to get results against top teams who will dominate possession.
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  #243  
Old 16-09-2021, 09:48 AM
JackTheBiscuit JackTheBiscuit is offline
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Originally Posted by GrayP41ace View Post
You mean aside from 4 months ago when they finished outside the top 6 The team that played Saturday was not the team they have had the last decade either.

Of course their overall squad is better than the 13 that played Saturday, but that side Saturday is not a top 6 side is it? The defence of Reguillon, Rodon, Tanganga and Emerson, with Winks, Skipp and Hojberg ahead of them is not screaming out top 6.

I'd be mildly surprised if they actually finish 6th with their best side, let alone with Saturday's side.
Yes the first time in 12 seasons. Beaten to 6th by a team we have also got a point away from home.

They had one of the best strikers in the world who didn't get a sniff, a world cup winner in goal, a £25m right back signed from Barcelona (Reguillon is a £25m Spanish international) as well as the likes of Moura and Alli. They hadn't conceded a goal in their first three matches and remain a top 6 team
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  #244  
Old 16-09-2021, 09:48 AM
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Originally Posted by GrayP41ace View Post
You mean aside from 4 months ago when they finished outside the top 6 The team that played Saturday was not the team they have had the last decade either.

Of course their overall squad is better than the 13 that played Saturday, but that side Saturday is not a top 6 side is it? The defence of Reguillon, Rodon, Tanganga and Emerson, with Winks, Skipp and Hojberg ahead of them is not screaming out top 6.

I'd be mildly surprised if they actually finish 6th with their best side, let alone with Saturday's side.
I think they will still be around the top 6. I mean they won their first 3 games. That included beating Man City with 8 players starting that game that started against us but crucially they didn't have Kane against City.

I think Man City, Chelsea, Liverpool, Utd are top four. Then you have Spurs and Leicester for 5th or 6th. Who else is going to finish above them? West Ham....maybe Everton. Arsenal look crap. Id say Tottenham are better than them.
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  #245  
Old 16-09-2021, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by ms21 View Post
Well other than the fact we didn’t, yeah I guess so.

The point is that we’ll have to be able to get results against top teams who will dominate possession.
So tell me what is a top 6 team??? Brighton?
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  #246  
Old 16-09-2021, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by JackTheBiscuit View Post
So tell me what is a top 6 team??? Brighton?
Rather than "top 6", perhaps Liverpool, Chelsea, United & City is more appropriate.
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  #247  
Old 16-09-2021, 09:56 AM
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Originally Posted by ms21 View Post
Rather than "top 6", perhaps Liverpool, Chelsea, United & City is more appropriate.
Ok fair enough
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  #248  
Old 16-09-2021, 10:07 AM
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Originally Posted by ms21 View Post
Rather than "top 6", perhaps Liverpool, Chelsea, United & City is more appropriate.
Not really sure that's like for like measuring stick though. This is comfortably the strongest top 4 we've ever seen where all 4 teams all have a legitimate argument to be title contenders.
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  #249  
Old 16-09-2021, 10:13 AM
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Originally Posted by GB2506 View Post
How does 4-4-2 keep things tighter?? Take a man out of midfield??

4-1-4-1 would be keeping it tight.
All depends on how narrow your wide players are and how attacking your two in the middle are.

Personnel is as important as formation
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  #250  
Old 16-09-2021, 10:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Norwich_Eagle View Post
I thought I'd saw articles on The Athletic and other websites saying that bar the top 6 sides where it was much lower that's how they played.
Last year only Man City averaged 60%.

Wolves were 12 with 49.7%

Same as the year before although they only had 48.7% in 12 place.
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  #251  
Old 16-09-2021, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by BillyTKid View Post
Doh!

I thought they finished 6th last season.
To be fair, prior to last seasons 7th place they had been top 6 for the previous 12 years.

They will be in a group of teams fighting for Europa League places this year IMO. Chelsea, Man Utd, Liverpool and Man City likely to take the CL spots. Lots of teams aiming for the places just below them. Which i see others have already said! Doh!
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  #252  
Old 16-09-2021, 10:51 AM
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Is he genuinely two footed? Played on the right V Spurs and then left in the U 23's.
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  #253  
Old 16-09-2021, 10:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyTKid View Post
I think they will still be around the top 6. I mean they won their first 3 games. That included beating Man City with 8 players starting that game that started against us but crucially they didn't have Kane against City.

I think Man City, Chelsea, Liverpool, Utd are top four. Then you have Spurs and Leicester for 5th or 6th. Who else is going to finish above them? West Ham....maybe Everton. Arsenal look crap. Id say Tottenham are better than them.
Yes they won their first 3 games, but they had faced 52 shots in those 3 games, 25 against Wolves! They've now given up 70 attempts in 4 games and have the highest xGA differencial in the league. The 13 that played us on Saturday is not their best side, nor would that 13 finish 6th. That was my sole point. Arguing whether a different side, that didn't finish 6th last season would finish top 6 is kind of pointless isn't it?

Would be like suggesting we are a top 10 squad based on the line-up we put out against Chelsea.
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  #254  
Old 16-09-2021, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Dave McGregor View Post
Is he genuinely two footed? Played on the right V Spurs and then left in the U 23's.
His right foot is mostly for standing on.

He played as a No.10 for the U23s.
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  #255  
Old 16-09-2021, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Dave McGregor View Post
Is he genuinely two footed? Played on the right V Spurs and then left in the U 23's.
By look highlights played central maybe free role u23s.
But yes he’s left footed play all across front, but better off the right coming on his left seems.
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  #256  
Old 16-09-2021, 11:03 AM
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Originally Posted by LuieJack View Post
That is precisely how i saw his introduction, i also liked what i saw in those few minutes he seems to have a swagger to his play, yes he looked impressive and it bodes well for the future. But i can see Vieira showing patience (as should our fans) in the weeks ahead in how he uses Olise and most likely off the bench and rightly so, as we need to introduce him gradually to feel his way with say 10 minutes at Anfield and then 15/20 minutes against Brighton, then see how it goes.
This is very sensible and probably the best thing to do but I want to see more of him now!

I'd start Ayew again v Liverpool but IF/When we go 1-0 down I'd be tempted to stick him on.
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  #257  
Old 16-09-2021, 11:04 AM
Dave McGregor Dave McGregor is offline
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Originally Posted by 16eagles View Post
By look highlights played central maybe free role u23s.
But yes he’s left footed play all across front, but better off the right coming on his left seems.
Thanks. Anyway we have a potentially great player on our hands here. So exicting.
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  #258  
Old 16-09-2021, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by GrayP41ace View Post
The 13 that played us on Saturday is not their best side, nor would that 13 finish 6th. That was my sole point. Arguing whether a different side, that didn't finish 6th last season would finish top 6 is kind of pointless isn't it?

Would be like suggesting we are a top 10 squad based on the line-up we put out against Chelsea.
But you can discredit a lot of previous results on that basis.

A couple of results spring to mind:

We beat Man City 3-2 in the 2018/19 season and they were missing Mendy, De Bruyne, Fernandinho and Aguero.

We beat Arsenal 3-0 in the 2016/17 season and they were missing Giroud, Ramsey, Mertesacker and Koscielny.

But we were also missing players from those games like we did on Saturday against Spurs.
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  #259  
Old 16-09-2021, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Stinger1 View Post
But you can discredit a lot of previous results on that basis.

A couple of results spring to mind:

We beat Man City 3-2 in the 2018/19 season and they were missing Mendy, De Bruyne, Fernandinho and Aguero.

We beat Arsenal 3-0 in the 2016/17 season and they were missing Giroud, Ramsey, Mertesacker and Koscielny.

But we were also missing players from those games like we did on Saturday against Spurs.
Agreed. Spurs had their 1st choice available in the following positions:
GK, LB, RB, all 3 CM positions and Striker. CB is interesting a Dier has been starting there and would he or Sanchez partner Romero?

They were second best for the whole game with 7 or 8 of their best XI available.
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  #260  
Old 16-09-2021, 11:21 AM
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Not really sure that's like for like measuring stick though. This is comfortably the strongest top 4 we've ever seen where all 4 teams all have a legitimate argument to be title contenders.
But that’s kinda my point. Every manager that has kept us up has got results against teams like that. Roy beat City away and Chelsea at home. Got a few draws against Liverpool too. Under Sam, we beat Chelsea away. More examples of this under Pardew & Pulis too. Often these matches are written off as bonuses but its quite clear that teams who survive in the PL get results in them
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