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View Poll Results: How did you vote?
Conservative 0 0%
Labour 11 7.69%
Liberal Democrats 52 36.36%
Green 31 21.68%
SNP (or other regional remain party) 1 0.70%
DUP (or other regional leave Party) 0 0%
Brexit Party 26 18.18%
Change UK 15 10.49%
Other 7 4.90%
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  #81  
Old 09-05-2019, 09:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Aguila View Post
Itís weird, isnít it? Not what is portrayed on JC, at all - but climate scientists have a high opinion of his grasp of the science and commitment to leading on this. I found this for you, if it helps: To view the link you have to Register or Login


"the socialisation of our energy supply"

Oh dear.

Its a waffle piece, more about posturing and socialism than energy.
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  #82  
Old 09-05-2019, 09:32 AM
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It's not that astonishing given it will be Labour party policy if they can't break the impasse.
I spot a flaw in your plan
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  #83  
Old 09-05-2019, 09:35 AM
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I was listening to an interview with Sir David King the other day - he felt the best, and probably only, chance of genuine leadership from the UK on climate change, was a Corbyn government.
He was very clear that this is vitally necessary - he's far from a Corbynite but he was equally clear that the statist approach is the planet's best hope.
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  #84  
Old 09-05-2019, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by FourtyTwo View Post
Led by a man who is anti-EU. If they were for a referendum, they would have come out for it months ago, and driven the campaign to have one. The fact we are still where we are, and they are pushing for their different shade of unicorn, rather than having put the whole fiasco to bed, shows that a Labour government would have been no more competent through Brexit than the Tories have been.

Sadly this is the case.

Comparing notes with another long time Labour Party member (I joined in '63, he a few years later) we don't see how a vote for Labour on the 23rd will see the UK staying in the EU.

Ramsay MacCorbyn is letting down all the younger people who backed him in the leadership campaign.
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  #85  
Old 09-05-2019, 09:45 AM
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Perhaps it is different with climate change but for most subjects , Corbyn's grasp is rather shabby so it's either the intellect or a laziness with the brief.
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  #86  
Old 09-05-2019, 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Ruskin Old Boy View Post
Sadly this is the case.

Comparing notes with another long time Labour Party member (I joined in '63, he a few years later) we don't see how a vote for Labour on the 23rd will see the UK staying in the EU.

Ramsay MacCorbyn is letting down all the younger people who backed him in the leadership campaign.
Apparently he is going to launch their campaign saying that the party will back a public vote IF a sensible deal cannot be agreed and there is not a GE.

It's quite clear neither of those options are going to happen, so he needs to stop putting himself first and actually follow through. He won't though.
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  #87  
Old 09-05-2019, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Aguila View Post
I was listening to an interview with Sir David King the other day - he felt the best, and probably only, chance of genuine leadership from the UK on climate change, was a Corbyn government.
He was very clear that this is vitally necessary - he's far from a Corbynite but he was equally clear that the statist approach is the planet's best hope.
One of the problems I see is the amount of energy we use, it simply can't be produced by windmills and solar. It will need nukes to produce it and you simply can't have local government in charge of nukes. It may have been the way in 1947 but all governments since went national, it can only be more efficient.
I'm also very suspicious of the claims being made on energy storage. I suspect that except for niche applications it will be far too expensive.

Added to that I'm very sceptical on anything Corbyn comes up with.
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  #88  
Old 09-05-2019, 10:01 AM
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Nuclear (end to end, inc. decommissioning costs) is a very expensive form of energy isn't it? I suppose it counts as domestically produced so good for stability, as long as the Chinese don't remotely switch it off. It's projected to only be 10% of our supply in the next decade?

Agree about Corbyn but disagree on storage. Will be massive game changer over the next couple of decades. And who knows what else? But it has to be better than something we need to keep buried and worry about for 100s of years like nuclear waste.
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  #89  
Old 09-05-2019, 10:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Aguila View Post
I was listening to an interview with Sir David King the other day - he felt the best, and probably only, chance of genuine leadership from the UK on climate change, was a Corbyn government.
He was very clear that this is vitally necessary - he's far from a Corbynite but he was equally clear that the statist approach is the planet's best hope.
Would be interesting to see his rationale. Labour claim to be more supportive of manufacturing, are dominant in the areas of the UK that use the most CO2 per person, opposed the closure of coal mines and want to build vastly more houses than now?
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  #90  
Old 09-05-2019, 10:41 AM
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King’s angle is that the immediate and urgent problem is getting carbon neutral and then carbon negative, and there being a western power prepared to advocate and lead on it. He’s not hopeful about the US doing so.
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  #91  
Old 09-05-2019, 10:47 AM
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I think Sweden or one of the Scandinavian countries have but crucially that involves carbon offset. They will pay for clean energy in developing countries. Britain's proposal is to do it by 2050 without offset but it will involve carbon storage under the North Sea. I'm far from convinced by the carbon storage but it is worth a trial.
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  #92  
Old 09-05-2019, 11:02 AM
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King is talking about 2030, worst case.
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  #93  
Old 09-05-2019, 12:00 PM
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The Labour EU manifesto.

The Labour leadership are still committed to leaving.
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  #94  
Old 09-05-2019, 12:04 PM
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Shambolic performance from a blinkered old fool selling out the future to those who voted him in for leader. Getting into bed with the Tories akin to Blair getting into bed with Bush.
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  #95  
Old 09-05-2019, 12:05 PM
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Apologies for the giant picture
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  #96  
Old 09-05-2019, 12:10 PM
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The Labour EU manifesto.

The Labour leadership are still committed to leaving.
Tory, Labour, DUP, Brexit, UKIP, UUP are all pro Brexit parties.
Lib Dem, Green, ChangeUK, SNP, PC, Sinn Fein are all anti Brexit.

It is a policy on which every party being voted for has a clear preferred position.

Whilst the EU Parliament discusses a full range of things this for the majority of votes will largely come down to the single issue.
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  #97  
Old 09-05-2019, 12:11 PM
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Lords Eagle came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietLords Eagle came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietLords Eagle came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietLords Eagle came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietLords Eagle came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietLords Eagle came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietLords Eagle came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietLords Eagle came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietLords Eagle came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietLords Eagle came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietLords Eagle came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy diet
Just been to the Labour European Manifesto launch, very impressed with JC's speech, was sitting 3 rows from the front (my daughter saw me on BBC News!)
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  #98  
Old 09-05-2019, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Reps AJ View Post

The Labour EU manifesto.

The Labour leadership are still committed to leaving.
Slightly ironically, they are committed to leaving in the way that they want to leave. Which, clearly is not the same for other people.

Leave never did, and never could, mean leave, and a second referendum on a defined "leave" outcome is the only way to sort this out.
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  #99  
Old 09-05-2019, 12:22 PM
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legaleagle2 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietlegaleagle2 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietlegaleagle2 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietlegaleagle2 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietlegaleagle2 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietlegaleagle2 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietlegaleagle2 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietlegaleagle2 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietlegaleagle2 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietlegaleagle2 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy dietlegaleagle2 came here looking for the peace and quiet; the healthy air and the healthy diet
So,the party line appears to be:

Preference 1:Leave the EU by agreeing a deal in alliance with the Tories

Preference 2,have a general election (and then presumably negotiating a leave deal if elected )

Preference 3 (and then and only then if 1 and 2 don't happen) have a people's vote.

No thank you Mr McDonald in waiting.A wasted opportunity for the party I've voted for all my adult life to lead from the front.
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  #100  
Old 09-05-2019, 12:59 PM
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Just been to the Labour European Manifesto launch, very impressed with JC's speech, was sitting 3 rows from the front (my daughter saw me on BBC News!)
From the extracts I've read I think he did OK, and in the absence of brexit labour would certainly get my vote. I'll still be voting green on the 23rd though.
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