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  #1  
Old 15-05-2005, 08:44 PM
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Dowie & Harbin. Heroes?

Dowie:
Well everybody still seems to love Iain Dowie despite or relegation today, but what has he really achieved in the past 18 months?
He took an average team out of the bottom half of Division One and got us promoted via the play-offs, in my opinion using a lifetimes worth of luck in the closing weeks. Lucky rebound from a penalty .v. Walsall, losing at Highfield Road only to be saved by another team scoring, winning a penalty shoot out in the semi which could have gone either way and finally being triumphant at Cardiff in a dour game against a piss poor West Ham side (but thats forgotten because we won).
Since then the squad has been strenghtened. We have International players that don't get a game, we play a 5'8" forward alone and play hoofball to him most of the season (to his credit the small bloke has done really well considering). We have seen strange team selections and substituations (including today), we have not attacked teams when we have needed a goal, the 4-5-1 system hasn't been changed quickly enough when we have been chasing the game. We have seen Mr Routledge play every game despite him flattering to decieve in every match, instead of the international players who were bought in to strengthen the squad and have given a better return. We have recently seen Leigertwood getting into the side before Aki Riihilahti who was our second highest scorer this season. We have seen far too much of Dougie Freedman (despite today) and not enough of Sandor Torghelle. I could go on about Hall's passing, Popo's hoofs, etc, etc.
After (almost) every game that we lost this season Iain Dowie has came on the TV and said 'We'll learn from this defeat' ' We'll take the positives from this' What exactly did you learn Iain? We never learned to win games against poor opponents (Norwich & Saints recently), we never learned how to defend our own goal for a full 90 minutes. We never learned that picking your favourite players gets results.
Today Iain Dowie is the manager of an (old) division one club. Which is where we were when he took over about 18 months ago. The squad on paper are stronger, but does Dowie have the knowledge, experence or skill to take Palace back into the Premier Division in 12 months time? I seriously doubt it. He has been naive in so many ways this season. I think that Iain Dowie is not the saviour of Crystal Palace FC that many of you seem to think. He could well be just another manager that spends time at the club and moves along to less glamourous things in the future.
Before you slag me off, tell me. What tactical strenghts does Dowie have? In what ways does Dowie make you think he is a winner? Do you honestly, in your heart, believe that Dowie is a good manager?

Harbin:
What does he do? He takes the players out onto the pitch before games to warm them up, he seems to be the one who comes up with these 'One more round' poems, but other than that. What does he contribute to the squad?
Is he the fitness coach? If he is than may I be so bold to suggest that he isn't a very good one? Palace have conceded 25% of goals in the last 15 minutes of games. That doesn't strike me as being fit. Is it his job to get the players mentally ready? If it is, may I suggest that he's not very good at this either as the players always seem to lose concentration and focus towards the end of games.
Again, before you slag me. What do you think Harbin contributes to the team? Do you think he's a good fitness coach?

I await to be shot down, but my arguement is a good one.
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Old 15-05-2005, 08:46 PM
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Bang bang bang. Pobody's nerfect, including those two, but you can feck off with that kind of talk. I'm wagging my finger as I type.
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Old 15-05-2005, 08:48 PM
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You have a fair point. But...we have been written off for everything all of the way. How come we acheived so much when we weren't supposed too?

Also, you must look at what the players say. ID and JH have been more than inspiration for them.
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Old 15-05-2005, 08:48 PM
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Bang bang bang. Pobody's nerfect, including those two, but you can feck off with that kind of talk. I'm wagging my finger as I type.
Me too
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Old 15-05-2005, 08:48 PM
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Here's one for you daughter Nelson,

have you noticed how many times we've conceded goals when Aki has been substitued????
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Old 15-05-2005, 08:48 PM
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Don't shoot the messenger, but someone tried telling me in the pub last week that we're close to administration again. I wouldn't have it, but he reckoned he had a 'source' and insisted it was true. I don't believe a word of it, but just hearing the 'a' word is enough to send a shiver down my spine.


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Ha ha, complete and utter bollocks.
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Old 15-05-2005, 08:51 PM
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Old 15-05-2005, 08:52 PM
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Quality thread.

I Don't agree about Popovic's distribution, which I think on the whole is top notch.

And I don't agree about Harbin, but the rest of the points you raised were great observations.
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Old 15-05-2005, 08:55 PM
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They got the players fitter, which in effect keep us in the relegation battle all the way through until today. Based on our skill we would have been out of it and relegated a long long time ago.
Iain brought us team spirit and belief 80% of contact sport is in the mind.
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Old 15-05-2005, 08:56 PM
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Re: Dowie & Harbin. Heroes?

Quote:
Originally posted by Nelson Muntz

I await to be shot down, but my arguement is a good one.
Quite possibly and I can understand the upset, but is now the time? Its all very well slagging, but in theabsence of better alternatives......

I recall I time when Aki was slagged, but yet he overcame the doubters and made the team. Perhaps we should have got someone better and sent him of to 'wall?
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Old 15-05-2005, 08:56 PM
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18 months ago we were 2nd bottom in Division 1. Then Dowie took over. Says it all for me.

Of couse he lacks experience being in charge at this level. But he has to start somewhere, he's only young.
Id rather Dowie in charge than someone like Steve Wigley or Trevor Francis, cos thats the best were gonna get if he goes.

As for Harbin, he's not a football man, he came from a rugby league background, and yes he is a fitness coach. Palace were one of the fittest teams in the league, we lacked concentration not the ability to tirelessly run for 90 minutes (something we did in every game)
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Old 15-05-2005, 08:56 PM
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So the knives are out. I suppose I shouldn't be surprised.
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Old 15-05-2005, 08:57 PM
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Quote:
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Also, you must look at what the players say. ID and JH have been more than inspiration for them.
They are hardly going to turn around publicly and say that ID makes some poor decisions
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Old 15-05-2005, 09:01 PM
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Dowie's got a lot to prove next season. But I think he can get us up as the Championship doesn't have the tactical demands of the Premiership. Let's face it, Dowie struggles when it comes to tactical decisions in key matches in the top flight. Even if we had signed Cahill or Ashton, that wouldn't be a guarantee that Dowie would have played them. But when all is said and done, Dowie is a young manager, not the finished article. I really hope he learns from his mistakes when he takes us up in a year's time.
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Old 15-05-2005, 09:03 PM
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I agree with the general jist of your points, but I still think he's a great manager. I think all of us would agree that tactically, he's been pretty poor this season etc.
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Old 15-05-2005, 09:04 PM
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Quote:
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They are hardly going to turn around publicly and say that ID makes some poor decisions
some of them already have.
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Old 15-05-2005, 09:04 PM
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I will be honest and say I have not read the opening post on this thread all the way through because it seemed to be heading in a negative direction and I do not think that is helpful at the present time. So what I am about to say might or might not have been included.

I think "Team Dowie" have done wonders in the 18 months at the club, firstly getting out of the 1st Division and nearly keeping the club in the Premiership with basically the same group of players. My concern is that the "magic" might now have worn off. All the motivational stuff which has served us so well - fight one more round; sometimes beaten, never conquered etc - is great when things are going well BUT will they have the same affect in the future after they have ultimately failed to keep us up?
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Old 15-05-2005, 09:11 PM
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Have you already forgotten last season? He took over a squad that were in danger of being relegated and got them promoted. He had the same group of players and he took them up! That in my book is a great manager.
He has turned AJ into one of the best strikers in the country. He has given Soares and Watson a chance and they have proved to be brilliant prospects. He has reinvented Hughes' game.
When you look at our squad objectively, it is quite probably the weakest in the prem. It is young and pretty inexperienced. That we went to the last day and only just missed out on staying up is testament to Dowie's ability.
He also has the total respect of the players. They fight for everything and where we up, it can't be blamed solely on ID an JH. The players have played above themselves for much of the season and Dowie is the reason for this.
I have every faith in Dowie and more importantly, so do the players. AJ only signed a 5 yr deal when he heard ID was staying. He will take us back to the Premiership and he will only get better.
I would not want anyone else in charge and think Dowie has done a fantastic job with limited resources.
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Old 15-05-2005, 09:40 PM
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All this talk of 'Bouncebackability'! We were mainly the victims of this Dowie Copyrighted term. For a team that prides itself on battling qualities we gave up numerous points this season. Everton - we lost 3 points after being in front, Norwich - 2 points lost, Southampton - 2 points lost, Liverpool - 1 point lost are the obvious examples that spring to mind.

I hope Dowie stays as manager but it disturbs me that he is very stubborn and doesn't seem to learn from errors. He also places a lot of emphasis on the 'mental' side of the game yet this is the area that has appeared to let down the team in a lot of games.
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Old 15-05-2005, 09:46 PM
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PoolKing : if all you've got to do today is find peace of mind, come round, you can take a piece of minePoolKing : if all you've got to do today is find peace of mind, come round, you can take a piece of minePoolKing : if all you've got to do today is find peace of mind, come round, you can take a piece of minePoolKing : if all you've got to do today is find peace of mind, come round, you can take a piece of minePoolKing : if all you've got to do today is find peace of mind, come round, you can take a piece of minePoolKing : if all you've got to do today is find peace of mind, come round, you can take a piece of minePoolKing : if all you've got to do today is find peace of mind, come round, you can take a piece of minePoolKing : if all you've got to do today is find peace of mind, come round, you can take a piece of minePoolKing : if all you've got to do today is find peace of mind, come round, you can take a piece of minePoolKing : if all you've got to do today is find peace of mind, come round, you can take a piece of minePoolKing : if all you've got to do today is find peace of mind, come round, you can take a piece of mine
Quote:
Originally posted by EagleSE24
He has given Soares and Watson a chance and they have proved to be brilliant prospects.
I agree that they are great prospects but by playing such inexperienced players, particularly Soares, it may have cost us Premiership survival.
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